YM: About, well about Casey stealing from the family.
SP: Yeah (affirmative).
YM: And taking so much that they had to go into their 401K.
SP: Oh. Well shes telling me now really that uh, she did the 401K because three, a few years ago she had a problem with George.
YM: Well we know about the problem with George too.
SP: Okay.
SB: We know about the problem with George.
YM: Yeah (affirmative).
SB: And it didnt have anything to do with the 401K at this point.
SP: No. But I mean she said she had to you know, pay a lot of those bills back (inaudible).
YM: Yeah (affirmative), but what, what was the first reason she told you she needed to get into the 401K? Was that it, or was it because Casey was stealing a lot of money that they were, they were going to lost their home again.
SP: Oh, well see she never told me any of that stuff because shed known I had my hands full worrying about Dad.
YM: True. True.
SP: So uh . . .
SB: She first, she first told you, what you told us a minute ago, she first told you it was about trying to pay the bills off that Caseyd run up, right?
SP: Yeah (affirmative).
SB: And then she told you later it was about George?
SP: Well, yeah (affirmative). Well first I knew she had all the problems with George because I know he was hundreds of dollars or thousands of dollars into debt.
YM: Uh-hum (affirmative).
SB: Un-hum (affirmative).
SP: That she even had to pay back the IRS because he cashed in his saving, or you know, whatever they had at the, when he was guard over to the . . .
SB: Yeah (affirmative).
SB: Was it his business, what he, what he did for work?
SP: Yeah (affirmative).
YM: Yeah (affirmative).
SB: His retirement stuff?
SP: Yeah (affirmative), his retirement fund. Uh, and he didnt tell her that, tell Cindy so she could include it in their . . .
YM: uh-hum (affirmative).
SP: . . . (inaudible). And she gets the big, you know, they keep half of her check or something. So she, she just tells me stuff a little bit at a time because she dont want to worry me. Now if . . .
SB: When, when did she change, when did she tell you recently that she was doing it to pay off Georges stuff? Was it, was it just since all this has happened?
SP: Yeah (affirmative), since it, since Rick was telling all of this.
YM: But, but before Rick was telling all this it was because of what? What did she tell you before?
SP: She told me before that the, she had to refinance the house and stuff because of I think, I thought she said it was because of George. I dont know.
YM: Okay. But you dont remember her mentioning that Casey was, was out there spending a whole bunch of their money . .
SP: Oh.
YM: . . . and . . .
SP: Yeah (affirmative). The last, yeah (affirmative).
SB: How much money did she say that Casey took? Do you remember?
SP: Well, she said, uh, you know, they said something about it being like forty-five thousand.
SB: Forty-five thousand?
YM: What did she tell you?
SP: Well she said I would, I couldnt have a, a credit card with that much. And I said Well Cindy, she could have made up other cards with your names on them. I mean George was doing that.
<snip>
YM: Uh-huh (Affirmative). Did she ever say, did she ever say how much that Ci . . that Casey actually stole, or, or used without them knowing? She ever give a dollar figure?
SP: No. I just assumed it was a forty-five thousand myself. Thats what I assumed. She never mentioned a figure.