CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #10

[absentia]

that doesn't make sense to me either. sorry! If he hiked in and the remains were not in the culvert, maybe they were intended to be but there was a possibility of being discovered so he dropped them and ran.
If they were in the culvert, it was only steps away from where the crime scene is centered, so either hiking or driving in and placing them there is still a possibility.

If the body was initially placed in the culvert, I would be less inclined to stick with my theory that both the backpack and body may have been transported to their drop locations via foot, as opposed to by vehicle. Based on the information we have so far, I theorize that this person was intimately familiar with these Open Space areas and felt confident and comfortable navigating them at night - at least more so than he would have if he were in a vehicle. If something goes awry and you're in a car, there is very little you can do...you're confined to the roads. By foot, you can effectively disappear by simply running in any direction at the first flash of headlights. However, if the body was initially placed in the culvert that runs under the road, I would probably re-think that theory.

 

[Sleuths4Me]

I know that there has been someone hear who voiced a strong opinion about DNA testing babies at birth....can't rememeber who that was. To that person, and anyone else who wants to comment....

Why are you opposed to this? I respect right to privacy, but can there be grave errors in this matching? Personally, if I'm not guilty of a crime, I can't imagine why I would ever care that I had given my DNA at birth. I also think that this could cause people to think twice before commiting crimes.

My son is pursuing a career with the FBI. He did a research paper on a city which I beleive was in Canada. They took a video of every license plate entering and leaving town. His paper was about our right to privacy. I guess I don't understand how that infringes on my privacy, if I didn't do anything wrong? It's not an inconvenience to me. Now, I can understand if people want to just randomly come in and check my computer and read every private e-mail, or follow me all over town with a video camera where I may do something legal, but yet embarrasing (like being a man, which I'm not, going to an adult bookstore or something)....but general videos and/or testing babies' DNA? I don't understand why that's a problem. Please enlighten me and I truly ask that respectfully b/c I'm curious. TIA

Government control...and government should not have that type of control over it's citizens...have you ever watched Gataca? Sure I believe that if you are arrested and found guilty you should have DNA taken but I believe you gave up your right to that privacy when you committed that crime.

So let's play what if....Like anything there can be technical issues/mistakes happen when running DNA...so say you have your child's DNA taken at birth...even though you are the parent, at 18 they are their own person and you infringed on that right to privacy they would have had...so now your child is in the system and something horrible happens to another person..they find some DNA and test for it but there is a glitch (which might not be discovered for days, weeks, months, years, decades) and your child comes up as the "match" and although they are innocent they are a match and are arrested and unfortunately they can't afford a great defense and there is a ton on circumstantial evidence and that one smoking gun..DNA...but again there was a technical issue in that system but that is unknown so the jury finds your child guilty and now your child is in jail for life or worse the death penalty....So now tell me how that is ok?

 

[Ghostwheel]

I know that there has been someone hear who voiced a strong opinion about DNA testing babies at birth....can't rememeber who that was. To that person, and anyone else who wants to comment....

Why are you opposed to this? I respect right to privacy, but can there be grave errors in this matching? Personally, if I'm not guilty of a crime, I can't imagine why I would ever care that I had given my DNA at birth. I also think that this could cause people to think twice before commiting crimes.

My son is pursuing a career with the FBI. He did a research paper on a city which I beleive was in Canada. They took a video of every license plate entering and leaving town. His paper was about our right to privacy. I guess I don't understand how that infringes on my privacy, if I didn't do anything wrong? It's not an inconvenience to me. Now, I can understand if people want to just randomly come in and check my computer and read every private e-mail, or follow me all over town with a video camera where I may do something legal, but yet embarrasing (like being a man, which I'm not, going to an adult bookstore or something)....but general videos and/or testing babies' DNA? I don't understand why that's a problem. Please enlighten me and I truly ask that respectfully b/c I'm curious. TIA

I can speak from the computer side of that. No database is 100% safe, meaning that someone who shouldn't, might access it or that normal maintenance could contaminate it. If your DNA is in a database, that means they (most likely) have your name, birthdate, SSN, last know address, all relatives and who knows what else someone feels necessary to the identification of X person with X DNA. These records can get mixed up, especially when porting them to a new system (moving the records from one database to another). Over the course of a lifetime, some kind of update to the system will happen several times, each opening an opportunity for something to go wrong. (I know of an update of an RSO database that almost went severely wrong, except it was caught-barely-in time. I don't know if it ever got updated due to the problems with it.) From that point alone, I am wary.

As to it infringing on my privacy, it is nobody's business what my blood type, dna, ssn, phone number (if I don't want to give it), mother's maiden name, family status, or anything else is if it does not directly affect them at that time. Period. Just isn't. Will you tell me your real name and address and phone number here on line? No, because you have no idea who is looking at this. Same is true of any information you give to anyone. Just because someone works for a government agency doesn't make them trustworthy. There have been Govt people and LE who were not good people, how do I know if one of them might be looking at my DNA profile? Sure, some of that information is out there already, but I am more judicious than most about giving out my info, and I have a pretty good knowledge of which databases talk to each other, which ones don't, and which ones dump information on a regular basis.

Some would call it paranoid, some would call it safety conscious, but generally speaking, since I live in the USA and Freedom is supposed to be the cornerstone of what what the USA is all about, what is mine belongs to me, unless I choose to give it to someone else. Same with my DNA.

 

[threecrazykids]

As you, I feel there needs to be categories.

Fifteen years ago my DH and I traveled thru the U.S. upgrading the computer systems in a major nationwide department store. We had two young men (20 and 21) who worked and traveled with us.

At dinner in the hotel, two young girls began flirting with the guys. (I was present and they appeared to be in early 20's). Later at the hotel pool the girls showed up again and I had the opportunity to talk to them. Having two daughters of my own (23 & 25), I was concerned about their behavior with these young men and asked them their age. One stated she was 19 and the other 20, showed me their DL for ID and the DL's reflected those ages. My DH and I left for bed at approx 8:30 pm.

The next morning at 4 am we were awakened by the P.D. wanting info on our 20 yo employee. It appears that he had taken the 19 yo girl to his room. Her father, a Police Chief in that City, had tracked his 16 yo daughter to the hotel and thru surveillance cameras caught her with our employee.

Long story shortened, the employee was arrested, served 2 years, is now on the RSO list, and his life has been ruined. He is a very nice young man and we have known him and his parents for 30+ years.

What he did is wrong; however, I believe the circumstances should control who is placed on the RSO list.

Apologies for this long sob story. Just saying.....

OMG these infuriate me!:banghead:

And the "innocent 16 year old" got in no trouble because her dad was a cop??

First off...the girls should be charged for the fact that they were carrying fake ID's, and how did that just get "overlooked" when his case went to trial? Did those fake id's disappear as evidence? I would have thought they could have called you in to testify that you saw the DL and what ages it showed. But then again...you gotta have $$$$$ to fight charges and a lawyer willing to put the time in to get you cleared.

How is it that people are so blind to their own kids behaviors? If that were my daughter and I found out she was carrying a fake and sleeping with 19 and 20 year olds I'd be kicking HER *advertiser censored*, not the guy who happened to take her to the hotel room! Why would you ever charge someone under those circumstances? Wake up...she's not your 5 year old innocent little girl anymore. :banghead:

 

[Ari]

People keep mentioning dissecting. The sort of people I think of that would be familiar with that are doctors, college medical professors, high school science/biology teachers, taxidermists?, hunters, and students in the medical field.

 

[Shelby2]

Not sure if this was posted
http://www.wisconsinrapidstribune.c.../Inside-the-mind-of-Jessica-Ridgeway-s-killer

 

[Shelby2]

I hope they have some solid leads and we just don't know yet.

 

[Ghostwheel]

I guess the fear would be - could the government follow us around all day? I can see why some would have a beef with that. Me personally? Not really. If they want to watch me do laundry, scrub carpets, do dishes, and clean up dog vomit, they can go right ahead. I'm sure that by nightfall, when I undress to get into the whirlpool with a glass of wine, they'll likely never want to watch again! LOL

Yeah, but how would you like it if your hubby could see you went to Home Depot right before his birthday, thereby ruining the surprise bandsaw you were buying for him?

 

[nursebeeme]

memorial set for tomorrow

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_21776696/memorial-jessica-ridgeway-set-tuesday-oct-16

 

[cluciano63]

I hope they have some solid leads and we just don't know yet.

They may have some and they don't even know yet...they have to check out all of the hundreds or more tips. I get the feeling they do not have any particular POI's. But there may be a lot of DNA tests in progress right now. If they have taken a lot of samples, it is unlikely they would have been able to rush them all through.

 

[manzana]

Not sure if this was posted
http://www.wisconsinrapidstribune.c.../Inside-the-mind-of-Jessica-Ridgeway-s-killer

no video showed for me here is the same video

http://www.digtriad.com/video/default.aspx?bctid=1902087055001

 

[otto]

During decent weather, police will patrol on bike. Occasionally I've seen a patrol car driving on the trail but I'm pretty sure they're actually looking for someone if that happens. Seeing a car is a very rare occurrence (maybe 3x in 11 years).


There are no video cameras at parks in Westy to the best of my knowledge. I've never seen one at any that I've been at.


True, but I doubt that it was visible enough that it could be read from a few feet away. My daughter's name is on her water bottle--on the bottom. If someone picks up her water bottle and looks at the bottom her name is visible. But no can see that when it's in her backpack.


They're abandoned buildings from when that area was full of coal mines. The coal mines in Leyden powered the trains going west, among other things.

No, there was no Japanese internment camp in the Arvada area.


There was a heavier than usual police presence in the mountains when we headed up this weekend. I wouldn't be surprised if they're thinking the same thing.

BTW, I would be surprised if the perp actually hiked in to the 82nd area, unless he parked his car a little further down the road at a different trailhead. It would be a really long hike over a good-sized ridge if he'd parked on 72 (the road to the north) or even along the basically empty Candelas Parkway. (For that matter, why not just go north? Candelas is supposedly under development, but it's basically empty except for coyotes.) I don't really see anyone deciding to hike over that ridge and all the way down just to leave a body that close to the road.

It seems to me that someone could have used the road that circles around behind the two shacks. The larger of the two shacks looks suitable for hiding a vehicle.

It's only a short walk from the larger shack to the smaller shack, and a shorter walk from the smaller shack to the location of the culvert.

 

[Celt1997]

OMG these infuriate me!:banghead:

And the "innocent 16 year old" got in no trouble because her dad was a cop??

First off...the girls should be charged for the fact that they were carrying fake ID's, and how did that just get "overlooked" when his case went to trial? Did those fake id's disappear as evidence? I would have thought they could have called you in to testify that you saw the DL and what ages it showed. But then again...you gotta have $$$$$ to fight charges and a lawyer willing to put the time in to get you cleared.

How is it that people are so blind to their own kids behaviors? If that were my daughter and I found out she was carrying a fake and sleeping with 19 and 20 year olds I'd be kicking HER *advertiser censored*, not the guy who happened to take her to the hotel room! Why would you ever charge someone under those circumstances? Wake up...she's not your 5 year old innocent little girl anymore. :banghead:

Not sure about other State's but in Pennsylvania it would seem the possession of the Fake ID would not matter:

(E.1) MISTAKE AS TO AGE.-- Under subsection (b) only, it is no defense that the defendant did not know the age of the child. Neither a misrepresentation of age by the child nor a bona fide belief that the person is over the specified age shall be a defense.

 

[absentia]

if you live in Superior, you'd just hike down McCaslin to Indiana and voila, you're there. a long walk but I think it's all pretty flat out here. Coloradans really hike and bike a lot. very outdoorsy and in shape mostly. that would not be a big deal. It's abt 10 miles. 3 hours. maybe bused or cabbed it back?

During decent weather, police will patrol on bike. Occasionally I've seen a patrol car driving on the trail but I'm pretty sure they're actually looking for someone if that happens. Seeing a car is a very rare occurrence (maybe 3x in 11 years).


There are no video cameras at parks in Westy to the best of my knowledge. I've never seen one at any that I've been at.


True, but I doubt that it was visible enough that it could be read from a few feet away. My daughter's name is on her water bottle--on the bottom. If someone picks up her water bottle and looks at the bottom her name is visible. But no can see that when it's in her backpack.


They're abandoned buildings from when that area was full of coal mines. The coal mines in Leyden powered the trains going west, among other things.

No, there was no Japanese internment camp in the Arvada area.


There was a heavier than usual police presence in the mountains when we headed up this weekend. I wouldn't be surprised if they're thinking the same thing.

BTW, I would be surprised if the perp actually hiked in to the 82nd area, unless he parked his car a little further down the road at a different trailhead. It would be a really long hike over a good-sized ridge if he'd parked on 72 (the road to the north) or even along the basically empty Candelas Parkway. (For that matter, why not just go north? Candelas is supposedly under development, but it's basically empty except for coyotes.) I don't really see anyone deciding to hike over that ridge and all the way down just to leave a body that close to the road.[/QUOTE]

 

[Flutterby80]

I hope they have some solid leads and we just don't know yet.

I always think they must, but then I am sometimes so wrong. Lisa Irwin comes to mind.

I hope this goes a different way, for Jessica and for all the children still in danger if this perp is not brought in.

 

[scorekeeper]

I would like to go back to the day Jessica went missing.

1. The alleged perp had her without anyone looking for her for approximately 8 hours (8:30am - 4:30pm). She could have been taken to a remote area or kept near the immediate area.
2. I believe the backpack was left in Superior to move the investigation or to add more "suspects" for LE to look for. Wherever they were searching until the backpack was dropped off to me is a possible "hot spot" for the suspect(s).
3. Was the road still closed to cars where her body was found? I probably don't have this right but I thought the roads leading to the body location was recently closed. Was it reopened to general public before Jessica was found? If so, how long? If closed, was in still open to those on foot?
4. Possible someone knew Mom didn't take her phone upstairs with her because of the phone calls she had been receiving from some of the colleges (per family interview). Did she say something at work? Did someone suggest she turn her phone Off???

Or do we have a very lucky suspect??? Because if he didn't know that Mom slept during the day, he was operating very quickly and hopefully one of thos 1500 tips will lead LE to him/her.

 

[FWNana]

OMG these infuriate me!:banghead:

And the "innocent 16 year old" got in no trouble because her dad was a cop??

First off...the girls should be charged for the fact that they were carrying fake ID's, and how did that just get "overlooked" when his case went to trial? Did those fake id's disappear as evidence? I would have thought they could have called you in to testify that you saw the DL and what ages it showed. But then again...you gotta have $$$$$ to fight charges and a lawyer willing to put the time in to get you cleared.

How is it that people are so blind to their own kids behaviors? If that were my daughter and I found out she was carrying a fake and sleeping with 19 and 20 year olds I'd be kicking HER *advertiser censored*, not the guy who happened to take her to the hotel room! Why would you ever charge someone under those circumstances? Wake up...she's not your 5 year old innocent little girl anymore. :banghead:

The ID's were presented as evidence and my DH and I testified. Nothing happened to the Chief's daughter. The other girl was placed on probation for having fake ID. Our insurance company had to pay for the defense since it occurred while the employee was "on a company job assignment".

I agree about kicking her ***. That is exactly what would have happened if it had been one of our daughters.

 

[JaimeInLA]

I know that there has been someone hear who voiced a strong opinion about DNA testing babies at birth....can't rememeber who that was. To that person, and anyone else who wants to comment....

Why are you opposed to this? I respect right to privacy, but can there be grave errors in this matching? Personally, if I'm not guilty of a crime, I can't imagine why I would ever care that I had given my DNA at birth. I also think that this could cause people to think twice before commiting crimes.

My son is pursuing a career with the FBI. He did a research paper on a city which I beleive was in Canada. They took a video of every license plate entering and leaving town. His paper was about our right to privacy. I guess I don't understand how that infringes on my privacy, if I didn't do anything wrong? It's not an inconvenience to me. Now, I can understand if people want to just randomly come in and check my computer and read every private e-mail, or follow me all over town with a video camera where I may do something legal, but yet embarrasing (like being a man, which I'm not, going to an adult bookstore or something)....but general videos and/or testing babies' DNA? I don't understand why that's a problem. Please enlighten me and I truly ask that respectfully b/c I'm curious. TIA

You are very trusting in government! I'll give just a few examples of how it could go wrong.

1) What if your baby's DNA is in a database somewhere, and someone with access to that database has a kid that needs a kidney, and determines your kid is the perfect match. So they track you down, steal your kid, and take his kidney.

2) Your ex brother in law works in the station that monitors all license plates coming into town. He hates you. He sees your license plate drive into town, so he finds you, and shoots you.

3) You are having an affair. Your license plate is recorded coming into town. One of the dispatchers knows your husband and tells him. You committed no crime, but your secrets have been revealed without your permission.

4) Your baby's DNA is on record. Your baby grows up with a genetic mental illness and commits a crime at age 16, leaving DNA behind. It is a minor crime, and you would do anything to protect your child. You want to get him the help he needs. But because he's in the database, he is located, tried as an adult, and sent to prison.

See? There are many, many ways that it invades privacy and could work against you more than it works for you.

 

[cluciano63]

Not sure about other State's but in Pennsylvania it would seem the possession of the Fake ID would not matter:

Just wondering, how is the age of a female to be determined by the prospective partner, if even her ID is not enough? Trying to think of this from a 19-year old guy's POV, lol...not that they would be likely to ask for ID anyway.

 

[absentia]

thanks. pretty brief, but good.
this guy is conflicted. he wants to show off what he's done, but is also trying to protect himself, and possibly toy with LE/the family.
he wants recognition but not to be caught (not consciously anyway).
this is why I think he has an inferiority complex. he NEEDS the recognition and to show off. it's maybe more about that than the killing, only by a few degrees though. to be seen as important, powerful, smart and TO HAVE A BIG DEAL MADE ABOUT HIM.

no video showed for me here is the same video

http://www.digtriad.com/video/default.aspx?bctid=1902087055001