CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #10

[oviedo]

It always amazes me the role that chance plays in cases like this. For instance, the neighbor that reported seeing PF's truck at KB's home on Thanksgiving. Had she just happened to look out her window at little later moment, she could have seen PF leaving been able to tell us who was with him. If it is indeed PF's story that he picked up the baby then and left KB, but in reality KB when with them, he took a big chance that no one saw him.

and if any of the neighbors had cameras we would see exactly what took place when LE released the video. so sad how chance sometimes works against you.

 

[Medstudies]

People want to develop a theory in which KB is still alive. I understand and respect that. So here it is: It is remotely possible that someone is holding her against her will.

I agree. It is possible, right?

except that for ME, it still does not address his apparent aloofness. Which I find “troubling”.

Not all families are especially close. Some may be the types where both sides are mutually there in times of need and joy. They have a balanced reciprocal support system. I know some people that have complete jack holes for in laws, but even they have enough common decency to show a little civility and support when crap happens.

For me it is just odd that there seems to be such a huge chasm between the F and B families. So I come back to “this is weird AF.”

It sure seems like there is some major distrust between the families - and maybe a solid reason for it.

There are just so many sticking points. Like the ping. The oddly timed texts. The ambiguities of who, what, where, when and whys.

And I think PF is the only person who knows all the answers.

And all of it could also be benign...

Just my two cents.

 

[stx722]

Here's the thing. If I am going for a walk or run, my car and my purse are at my house, but my cell phone and keys are with me. If I am going on a trip lasting, say a week, I pack a suitcase with clothes, toiletries, makeup, and vitamins, and don't leave fresh baked goods out on the counter. If my car is at my house, but my purse and I are not, then I left my house in someone else's vehicle.

Knock, knock. Who's there? Occam...

 

[oviedo]

I wonder if his google searches show he followed that case?
Curious, if he got any ideas from it.

If so, that would surely show planning in advance rather than a "in the moment" confrontation if he is guilty. IMO

 

[susiQ]

I'm not even sure who the 5% unknown is. I know who raises my hinky meter, not as much as PF but enough to go "hrmm...."

But ok.
11/22 - PF and KB swap the baby. Maybe they squabble, maybe not, whatever.
11/23-24 - unknown. May just have been too long to ping her cell, people go on radio silence for a day or two all the time if they want, maybe she has a second phone we haven't had reported yet, too many other things.
11/25 - Unknown tells Kelsey something. Who knows what. It's enough to get her to grab at minimum her purse and phone and leave. At some point, she texts PF and her employer. Around 5 pm, they are near the Gooding Idaho tower that pings.

She's killed at some point after that. Why, don't know. Who, don't know.

It's an unknown to us, it's a known person to her. Work excuse, family excuse, whatever reason that had her willingly get in a vehicle with another person.

95% likely it's PF. But 5% could be someone else, who knows full well that everyone will look at PF hardcore because that's the statistical normal. And they got dang lucky by having an extended gap before anything was reported to the police.

Too many "unknowns". Perhaps HE had a burner phone for communications he didn't want KB to know about since he was so willing to give up his phone? Giving his DNA is giving them very little in essence since they were a couple and intimate. So, in my mind what his lawyer called "cooperation" is nothing more than trying to make himself look good, intially. Although he hasn't done a good job since then. LE seem focused in PF's direction and I'm sure there is a credible reason for that. I don't think it's "tunnel" vision. There is SOMETHING they know that we don't.

 

[Lhughessk]

I was so surprised that Safeway had video of Nov 22. We don’t know when LE obtained the video, but assuming it was shortly after the Dec 2 well-check, then that’s almost 2 weeks after KB went to the store! The video was released to the media on Dec 11, so it could’ve been kept even longer than 2 weeks!.

Since surveillance videos no longer record to a physical media such as tape, it’s not surprising that the Safeway video was available. The video exists as individual files on a hard drive. As long as there is storage on the hard drive (plentiful and cheap), it will just keep creating file after file until the hard drive is full.

 

[PrairieWind]

I was so surprised that Safeway had video of Nov 22. We don’t know when LE obtained the video, but assuming it was shortly after the Dec 2 well-check, then that’s almost 2 weeks after KB went to the store! The video was released to the media on Dec 11, so it could’ve been kept even longer than 2 weeks!

Unfortunately, if PF picked KB and baby up at her townhouse and drove to Florissant on US 24 for a meal with CB’s recipe and ingredients KB bought, that’s in the opposite direction of Safeway. But maybe there are other businesses that keep their cam records as long and maybe one could see if PF had KB in his vehicle.

LE must have something in order to get the search warrant. Whether it’s business/highway cams, Safeway products which are not in KB’s house, PF and/or KB phones pinging along US 24 and other areas on Nov 22 - we don’t know much right now.

But I’m convinced this case will be solved in short order by electronics.

Many businesses (Walmart, Lowes for example) keep video surveillance for 30 days. I am sure Safeway has some similar policy.

 

[Kapua]

If a stranger attacked her inside her residence there likely would be signs that a struggle occurred. I have not seen any reporting of such evidence. If PF was the perpetrator, and planned this out rather than acting in a fit of rage, he could have avoided creating such an obvious evidence trail. A couple of people responding to an earlier post commented that they were 90/9/1 or 95/5 — leaving the door open for the very reasonable possibility that PF is innocent and something else has befallen KB. I agree and might even go to 80/20 assuming there is a lot of evidence that is not publicly available. When I was a state level prosecutor I tried cases when I was not certain of guilt and in those cases had access to all of evidence.

And we haven't seen evidence that LE is or was processing her home as a crime scene. We have seen a very large LE presence at PF's home, on the other hand. There are reasons for that which are still unknown to us. IMHO.

 

[Z88]

I was so surprised that Safeway had video of Nov 22. We don’t know when LE obtained the video, but assuming it was shortly after the Dec 2 well-check, then that’s almost 2 weeks after KB went to the store! The video was released to the media on Dec 11, so it could’ve been kept even longer than 2 weeks!

Don't be surprised. A 30-60 day retention policy would be common if a store wanted to protect against credit card or money order fraud. The video needs to be retained long enough for a fraud to be reported to the bank involved and then make it back to the store's loss prevention department.

 

[darring21]

I am somewhat bothered by how PF has been tried unfairly on some facts but two things bother me.

1. The police have to know by now both of their cell phone activity. They should know roughly where her phone was pinging on the 22nd and when it stopped. They have also likely subpoenaed PF's so they can roughly tell if they were traveling together at some point. They could also tell if they were not traveling together and doing separate activities. Would police still be pursuing him if it didn't appear they were together? Maybe, I suppose.

2. I ask myself if there is a situation that I would not talk to police (with an attorney) if my child's parent was missing and I had nothing to do with it? Even if I hated that person I would talk to police just to clear myself. That's hard to get past. The only caveats are if I was doing something else illegal or if the police had already harshly and unfairly accused me.

 

[sun16]

Here is the truth. People are hating him not because we have evidence against him. We simply have nothing and he lawyered up and is not giving interviews.

We are blaming him in the court of opinions.

And now imagine this - she is found, and he is not guilty? My 15% chance.

How would we look? Asking to destroy his business without solid evidence? Him being the sole provider for the child? Driving him onto the street with this poor child?

It is one thing to voice our opinions. But honestly - we don't know much about Kelsey, either! I can't say anything about her, her family is silent, except for someone cussing on the FB; her ex is silent. Her old friends are silent. Her coworkers are silent. LE is silently chasing some rubbish now. We don't know much. If there is animal maltreatment, let PETA deal with it. I don't know much about dogs so I don't know.

We can voice ideas but we are all going in the same direction. It is ok but we can't stone without a fair trial.

I just don’t agree.

 

[Gardener1850]

Here's the thing. If I am going for a walk or run, my car and my purse are at my house, but my cell phone and keys are with me. If I am going on a trip lasting, say a week, I pack a suitcase with clothes, toiletries, makeup, and vitamins, and don't leave fresh baked goods out on the counter. If my car is at my house, but my purse and I are not, then I left my house in someone else's vehicle.

Exactly. A few have mentioned she could have gone for a hike alone. Who takes their purse to go hiking? And that still doesn't explain the texts or the ping in Idaho.

 

[SandyQLS]

Her aunt who is a verified insider said it here and elsewhere. I also believe she was quoted in a couple news articles. We don’t know how she came to believe that though. Did her sister tell her that? Was it what PF claimed? Or had someone in the family heard that from Kelsey at some point?

Thank you. The relationship status information is like Swiss cheese, full of holes.

The baby exchange information was also Swiss cheese:
Safeway parking lot (media), no wait KB dropped the baby off with PF (media, aunt), currently PF picked the baby up (LE not confirming where, aunt corrected).

Her family is so distraught it's understandable if they get things mixed up. But in a missing person case these little details do matter. If it becomes a murder case, these holes are a defense attorney's dream for creating reasonable doubt. It is not sufficient at law to say, "if not him, then who?"; the OJ Simpson case is an example, the prosecutor must fill in the holes and prove their case.

 

[Madison418]

Who in their right mind tells the father of their child on a holiday during the exchange of the child that the relationship is over? Then leaves the child with that person? I personally do not believe KB said anything about ending the relationship and then left Baby K with him.

Yeah, no way. She was a pilot/flight instructor, I don't reckon she was that stupid.

All MOO

 

[allboys]

I agree. It is possible, right?

except that for ME, it still does not address his apparent aloofness. Which I find “troubling”.

Not all families are especially close. Some may be the types where both sides are mutually there in times of need and joy. They have a balanced reciprocal support system. I know some people that have complete jack holes for in laws, but even they have enough common decency to show a little civility and support when crap happens.

For me it is just odd that there seems to be such a huge chasm between the F and B families. So I come back to “this is weird AF.”

It sure seems like there is some major distrust between the families - and maybe a solid reason for it.

There are just so many sticking points. Like the ping. The oddly timed texts. The ambiguities of who, what, where, when and whys.

And I think PF is the only person who knows all the answers.

And all of it could also be benign...

Just my two cents.[/QUOT

People want to develop a theory in which KB is still alive. I understand and respect that. So here it is: It is remotely possible that someone is holding her against her will.

^Well, I don’t think it’s likely, but I will say that it’s my new ‘best case scenario’ dream ending. And to continue the dream...it is PF holding her captive, and since he obviously can’t get to her right now...In my dream, she has ample food and water, and someone is about to stumble on her hiding place any minute. Ahhh, wouldn’t that be nice?

Okay, that’s my one unrealistic post. I promise to keep things more “real” in the future.

ETA: oops. I only meant to add the last quoted post.

 

[SausagePizza]

I wonder how many tips LE is getting in this case?

 

[jewelsmac]

If he did something, he's has 10 days to hide/get rid of evidence.

Exactly, when exactly did this run to the dumps happen?

 

[cattlekate]

The cases mentioned of a person being abducted and held were before cell phones and all of the devices which record our daily lives. If KB was planning to spend, or not, TDay with PF, then all of those texts would be available through her carrier, I would think.

 

[jewelsmac]

I doubt it. That phone is probably somewhere in Idaho.

Yes, and she could be anywhere between her home and there.

 

[SausagePizza]

How did LE even know he went to the dump? Tracking his movements? The dump called it in?