CO - Mass shooting at King Soopers, 10 fatalities including 1 LEO, Boulder, 22 Mar 2021 *arrest*

[Betty P]

According to the arrest affidavit a criminal history of Alissa shows only a charge for third degree assault out of Arvada in 2018. I don't think that's a felony charge.

Under federal law, people are generally prohibited from purchasing or possessing firearms if they have been convicted of a felony or some domestic violence misdemeanors, or if they are subject to certain court orders related to domestic violence or a serious mental condition. However, federal law merely provides a floor, and has notable gaps that allow individuals who have demonstrated significant risk factors for violence or self-harm to legally acquire and possess guns.

It appears his family never made him seek diagnosis and treatment, even though he exhibited symptoms of mental illness while in high school.

 

[Cryptic]

Mental illness does not necessarily preclude planning.

And being mentally ill to a degree does not preclude being responsible for ones actions.

 

[MsBetsy]

Not speculation, from the Affidavit -
Officer Frederking saw the male, who later identified himself as Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa (hereinafter "Alissa"), walking backward to the SWAT Team to be taken into custody. Alissa had removed all of his clothing and was dressed only in shorts.



I think he undressed himself to show he wasn’t armed. He didn’t want to be killed. This doesn’t show a mentally ill person IMO. He’s someone thinking ahead.

I don't think people with mental health disorders lack the ability to plan ahead. He could be both intelligent and mentally disordered. From the way his family described him it sounds like he is paranoid and/or delusional. That doesn't mean he doesn't know right from wrong or is not responsible for his crimes. He could have been fanatisizing about killing people for a long time. Imo

 

[Inthedetails]

Not speculation, from the Affidavit -
Officer Frederking saw the male, who later identified himself as Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa (hereinafter "Alissa"), walking backward to the SWAT Team to be taken into custody. Alissa had removed all of his clothing and was dressed only in shorts.



I think he undressed himself to show he wasn’t armed. He didn’t want to be killed. This doesn’t show a mentally ill person IMO. He’s someone thinking ahead.

I'm just not seeing that as an indication of his mental state. If he took of his clothes on his own volition, that shows a muddled mind, imo. If he followed orders to take off his clothes, that just shows he could follow orders, after being shot. I honestly don't think there was much thinking ahead on his part at that point, but I appreciate the discussion and the idea to think about.

jmo

 

[Betty P]

And being mentally ill to a degree does not preclude being responsible for ones actions.

Agree. It's extremely difficult to successfully plead an "insanity" defense in the US criminal court system, especially for mass murder. JMO, that doesn't seem to be a concern in this case.

 

[MsBetsy]

Agree. It's extremely difficult to successfully plead an "insanity" defense in the US criminal court system, especially for mass murder. JMO, that doesn't seem to be a concern in this case.

Yes, the insanity defense is used in less than 1 percent of cases, and is rarely successful. Imo

 

[Inthedetails]

Yes, the insanity defense is used in less than 1 percent of cases, and is rarely successful. Imo

What we might see is a long, long process of testing and evaluations to determine competency, etc. before a trial ever happens.

jmo

 

[ReadySet]

I agree, and my post did not in any way imply otherwise. It was in response to posts that implied he could not be mentally ill because he appeared to plan ahead.

And being mentally ill to a degree does not preclude being responsible for ones actions.

 

[Shamrock1]

Premeditation and mental illness are two separate things. MOO.

 

[Shamrock1]

No motive was uncovered in the Vegas shooting. I find this helpful to remember when seeking to understand someone’s devastating choices. JMO.

 

[shotgun09]

Suspect in hand, investigators hunt for a motive in the Boulder shooting.

Per article, RSBM

"The suspect’s identity was previously known to the F.B.I. because he was linked to another individual under investigation by the bureau, according to law enforcement officials."

 

[Inthedetails]

Suspect in hand, investigators hunt for a motive in the Boulder shooting.

Per article, RSBM

"The suspect’s identity was previously known to the F.B.I. because he was linked to another individual under investigation by the bureau, according to law enforcement officials."

From the same link:
"When he was a senior at Arvada West High School, Mr. Alissa was convicted in 2018 of misdemeanor assault against another student in a classroom, and told the police at the time that it was in retaliation for insults and ethnic taunts. Fellow students recall him as having a fierce temper that would flare in response to setbacks or slights."

jmo

 

[Betty P]

Suspect in hand, investigators hunt for a motive in the Boulder shooting.

Per article, RSBM

"The suspect’s identity was previously known to the F.B.I. because he was linked to another individual under investigation by the bureau, according to law enforcement officials."

Very interesting. ETA: Has anyone seen anything in the news to indicate whether the killer had a job or lived independently? How was he able to purchase those extremely dangerous weapons before the murders?

 

[SouthAussie]

From the same link:
"When he was a senior at Arvada West High School, Mr. Alissa was convicted in 2018 of misdemeanor assault against another student in a classroom, and told the police at the time that it was in retaliation for insults and ethnic taunts. Fellow students recall him as having a fierce temper that would flare in response to setbacks or slights."

jmo

I was wondering if ethnic taunts were involved. These kinds of shooters seem to always have some kind of general grievance. Perhaps something similar happened to him at King Soopers.

 

[coffeeandacig]

Are you sure the .223 round is "much the same" as a .22 long rifle bullet?

I could not help but noticing that .223 bullets are significantly larger than my .22 long rifle bullets. The increase in size is also marched by a larger case in the .223 with far more grains of powder. This allows for .223 rounds to keep a high velocity, despite their increased size.

I dont really care if a gun looks "scary" or not.

What I do care about is size / weight of the bullet and the velocity of the bullet. The increased size / weight of the bullet coupled with the retention of high velocity makes .223 rounds very lethal.


Technically, assault rifles have the ability to fire on full automatic.

Permits for fully automatic weapons are very difficult to obtain. So in all probability, the weapon recovered from the scene was not an "Assault Rifle" in the true sense of the word.

But.... even semi automatic AR 15s and clones can be fired very quickly. Combine that with relatively very little recoil and a rampager can kill ten people very quickly.

<modsnip>

The diameter of the .223 is the same as the .22LR...thus making the same size hole.
The length of the bullet, and amount of grains is irrelevant, as in this case, where the very big possibility is that he shot all of his victims at point blank range. JMHO

Also, a semi automatic can only be shot as fast as your fingertip allows.
(JMHO, as a competitor in shooting sports)

And it is true, fully automatic assault weapons are only available permitted to a very select tiny fraction of gun owners.

In order to save this from being deleted. These are my own opinions. Contact your local licensed firearms safety instructor if you have any questions.

 

[303gmf]

I was wondering if ethnic taunts were involved. These kinds of shooters seem to always have some kind of general grievance. Perhaps something similar happened to him at King Soopers.

Wondering why this specific King’s ?
There are ones much closer to his part of Arvada, or why a grocery store?
Why Boulder ?

 

[Inthedetails]

Very interesting.

Yes it is.

jmo

 

[Dawookie]

Suspect in hand, investigators hunt for a motive in the Boulder shooting.

Per article, RSBM

"The suspect’s identity was previously known to the F.B.I. because he was linked to another individual under investigation by the bureau, according to law enforcement officials."

While he wasn't the main target, it's not a good look for the FBI knowing about another mass shooter/terrorist before they committed it. Pulse nightclub, San Bernardino, Ft. Hood, the Boston bombing, Parkland High, Garland Texas(not a mass shooting because it was stopped by an off duty LEO) and now this. Doesn't lead people to having faith in their abilities

 

[GoJacks]

Wondering why this specific King’s ?
There are ones much closer to his part of Arvada, or why a grocery store?
Why Boulder ?

Been thinking about this. Where he was said to have lived there were 2 King Soopers within minutes and at least 6 total north-ish of him that would have been closer to him 'on the way' to Boulder.

 

[Betty P]

While he wasn't the main target, it's not a good look for the FBI knowing about another mass shooter/terrorist before they committed it. Pulse nightclub, San Bernardino, Ft. Hood, the Boston bombing, Parkland High, Garland Texas(not a mass shooting because it was stopped by an off duty LEO) and now this. Doesn't lead people to having faith in their abilities

It probably has more to do with their inability to arrest these killers if they haven't yet engaged in criminal activity. Sadly, modern laws allow them to purchase all the deadly weapons money can buy in the US and the FBI is unable to do anything to stop it. Only exceptions would be if they were convicted of some prior crime and were forbidden to own weapons as part of their sentence. JMO