CO CO - Roger Ellison, 17, Cedaredge, 10 Feb 1981 #1

[Bennettras]

I hate to answer for someone else, but actually, Bennettras had it just a tad wrong. There are no windows on the first floor on that wall. Some pictures of the school are posted on findrogerellison.wordpress.com/
in the photo gallery.

Yes!!! Thanks, and for more clarity, the windows on the second story above the doors are a stairwell, so perhaps the student's were in class and the second story stairwell was empty when IMO Roger walked out of that door. I do not know which classroom the southeast classroom on the second floor is though. The front of the school is west, the back east.

I just looked at the bakery photo on Lori's website. If you go to google maps and put in the bakery address, 365 North Grand Mesa Drive, Cedaredge, CO‎, you can get a very great street view of the old highschool and then go down the street to JP's house.

 

[Bennettras]

I don't know what to say right now except that I cannot get out to Cedaredge this weekend like I had planned. Will keep y'all posted

 

[CaptAmerica]

While visiting Cedaredge, remember this is still an active police investigation, and although your intent is good, contacting them will not advance the investigation, because they won't talk to you. Why? Because its an active police investigation, and releasing information to the general public, assuming they had a piece of vital information, would require them to notify Roger's family first, which has not happened. It is like asking about the condition of a patient following a car accident taken to a hospital, under the new medical privacy law, not event their name can be released.

 

[Bennettras]

While visiting Cedaredge, remember this is still an active police investigation, and although your intent is good, contacting them will not advance the investigation, because they won't talk to you. Why? Because its an active police investigation, and releasing information to the general public, assuming they had a piece of vital information, would require them to notify Roger's family first, which has not happened. It is like asking about the condition of a patient following a car accident taken to a hospital, under the new medical privacy law, not event their name can be released.

I know all this.

 

[Danaya]

While visiting Cedaredge, remember this is still an active police investigation, and although your intent is good, contacting them will not advance the investigation, because they won't talk to you. Why? Because its an active police investigation, and releasing information to the general public, assuming they had a piece of vital information, would require them to notify Roger's family first, which has not happened. It is like asking about the condition of a patient following a car accident taken to a hospital, under the new medical privacy law, not event their name can be released.

You seem pretty concerned with this. Are you law enforcement or a relative of Roger's? Do tell...

 

[justthinkin]

Sigh. Isn't there anyone willing to answer questions to help find Roger,
old friends of Roger who likely knew him best? He didn't live in a vacuum!

 

[Bennettras]

Still no major demolition of Roger's school. Hmmmm.....

 

[Bennettras]

Sigh. Isn't there anyone willing to answer questions to help find Roger,
old friends of Roger who likely knew him best? He didn't live in a vacuum!

Help us Obi-Wan Kenobi - You're our only hope!!!!!


Sorry, just a bit frustrated.....needed to let off some steam.

Wondering why Roger's other sibs don't post here? Maybe they do and are staying anon. :waitasec::silenced:

 

[Satch]

I've just re-read the thread. Almost two years after it was started, I feel I have little idea about who Roger Ellison was.

Along the way, at least five WS members have indicated special knowledge of at least some aspect of the case. As well, others have asked many pertinent questions.

It's extremely difficult to conceive of theories - to sleuth, in other words - if one doesn't know much about the victim. Blind alleys abound.

Below, I've sifted through earlier questions, selecting only ones involving Roger himself. Answers to these questions would aid discussion, and discussion could lead to resolution.

* What sort of crowd did Roger run with, or was he a loner?
* Was he popular with his classmates?
* Did he have a girlfriend?
* Did Roger have issues regarding his sexual orientation?
* Were there changes in Roger's appearance before he went missing?
* What was the topic of the assignment Roger took to his teacher's house?
* What were his interests other than skiing?
* What might have been his major in college?
* Did his evidently good grades drop in the time just prior to his disappearance?
* Was he troubled in any way regarding his competitive skiing?
* Did his alleged injury lead to depression?
* Was Roger a religious person? Did he attend church services?
* Did he experiment with drugs or use alcohol?
* Did he ever have run-ins with authority?
* Was he ever known to hitchhike?
* Was he in correspondence with acquaintances living away from his hometown?
* If he had problems, would he tend to seek out others his age, or seek out adults?

This is a very compelling case. I read through all of the pages and responses. Very sad. But I missed something, what was Roger's alleged injury?

Did the teacher in question at one time submit to a polygraph test? What was the result of the test?

The incident in the woods is really disturbing, why didn't the deer poachers stop to help?

What was (were) the specifics of the essay assignment and Roger's responses to the questions asked?

What kind of student was Roger? Did he have behavioral and/or personality concerns noticed by the teacher in his class? Noted by other teachers? Noticed by friends? By students? By Family?

Who did Roger communicate with on the day he vanished? Did anyone come forward with what was said over the years?

It is hard for me to believe that no one saw him leave after he put his books in his locker! I wonder how this issue would be different if the small school had security cameras?

Any other information on other students or faculty who were questioned about Roger's disappearance?

Satch

 

[Bennettras]

This is a very compelling case. I read through all of the pages and responses. Very sad. But I missed something, what was Roger's alleged injury?

Did the teacher in question at one time submit to a polygraph test? What was the result of the test?

The incident in the woods is really disturbing, why didn't the deer poachers stop to help?

What was (were) the specifics of the essay assignment and Roger's responses to the questions asked?

What kind of student was Roger? Did he have behavioral and/or personality concerns noticed by the teacher in his class? Noted by other teachers? Noticed by friends? By students? By Family?

Who did Roger communicate with on the day he vanished? Did anyone come forward with what was said over the years?

It is hard for me to believe that no one saw him leave after he put his books in his locker! I wonder how this issue would be different if the small school had security cameras?

Any other information on other students or faculty who were questioned about Roger's disappearance?

Satch

Satch, unfortunately, most of us are wondering the answers to these questions too. Thanks for post.

 

[Bennettras]

This will be my 1st post on Websleuths though I have been reading it for a while. My primary case of interest is the Morgan Nick abduction from Alma, Arkansas in 1995. Having said that, I do want to post my analysis of this case based on the information put forth and what seems to be the most likely explanation from the behaviors we know about.

Roger came to school on the school bus as was apparently his normal pattern. He did what was normal for him and went into the school and and to his locker upon arrival. From what we know, this is the last time he was accounted for at school. He did not attend any classes. We have no reports of any struggle or strange events from the school. The most logical explanation at this point seems to me to indicate that Roger planned to not remain at school that day. As someone who has worked at schools for 30 years, skipping is usually tied to one of a handful of choices. Parties (Get togethers), girlfriend/boyfriend, work, or personal demons. It is also almost always the case that the truant student is not doing it without other students (or persons) knowing it unless it is personal demons.

As a school official (and I would think, LE) the 1st thing we look for are others who are absent on that day and close friends who were not absent on that day. I do not think we can say at this point WHY Roger left, but based on what we know, I think he intended to come back to school before the day was over. We know this because he took no extra money nor clothes and had (as far as I know) no other way home after school than the bus. My best guess is that Roger willingly left to meet someone or deal with some issue, fully intending to return to school that day, but for whatever reason, did not. The WHY can likely tell us WHO and finally let us know WHAT happened to Roger.

I believe the best angle still available for investigators is to interview Roger's friends and associates. Focus needs to be placed on faculty and staff who were not at school either some or all the time that day or who were absent the following day. It is conceivable that the tragedy might not have occurred until after school hours and the next day would have been a time for cover-up and regrouping.

DrHog,

As a school official and someone who has worked for schools for some 30 years, have you ever come across another situation like this? Also, any new info on the Morgan Nick case?

 

[Satch]

It would also be interesting to know, (and I don't even know if school records would be available or how they would be retrieved) but if Roger had a first period (8:30) class that day and if it was with JP during first period? Or if he had a class that wasn't with JP, what class and teacher was it with? Or did he have a study hall?

Do you think that if JP was in his classroom teaching during first period, that this would (or could) rule him out as an interested person in Roger's disappearance? We would have to consider the time frame if JP was somehow involved with this, for him to do what he did and than come back and be able to teach class. That seems to be a very short time-line. In fact, without a recovered body, can we reasonably assume that Roger is still missing and that he could still be alive? This is where the runaway theory comes into play.

But until more students and faculty and witnesses come forward, this case remains a blind alley. What ever happened to that "possible match" that we were talking about? Has it been confirmed that this is not Roger?

Satch

 

[Danaya]

It would also be interesting to know, (and I don't even know if school records would be available or how they would be retrieved) but if Roger had a first period (8:30) class that day and if it was with JP during first period? Or if he had a class that wasn't with JP, what class and teacher was it with? Or did he have a study hall?

Do you think that if JP was in his classroom teaching during first period, that this would (or could) rule him out as an interested person in Roger's disappearance? We would have to consider the time frame if JP was somehow involved with this, for him to do what he did and than come back and be able to teach class. That seems to be a very short time-line. In fact, without a recovered body, can we reasonably assume that Roger is still missing and that he could still be alive? This is where the runaway theory comes into play.

But until more students and faculty and witnesses come forward, this case remains a blind alley. What ever happened to that "possible match" that we were talking about? Has it been confirmed that this is not Roger?

Satch

JP was preparing to teach his first class when Roger would have arrived at school. I'm not sure the specifics of time and doubt any of us will ever find out. Nobody to date has given us much information about specifics I guess the reason is, "it's an active police investigation".

I doubt Roger is still missing. It is very rare anyone dissapears one day out of no where to live a life and never contact their family escpecially when his family has said he was an active, smart student. I just think it's doubtful, unfortunately, I believe Roger was murdered shortly after he arrived at school.

It has been confirmed the possible match was not Roger.

 

[Bennettras]

Can someone give me an update about which school JP works at now? Much appreciated.

 

[CaptAmerica]

DrHog, your analysis is compelling and insightful, and I believe you are correct on all accounts.

 

[DrHog]

DrHog,

As a school official and someone who has worked for schools for some 30 years, have you ever come across another situation like this? Also, any new info on the Morgan Nick case?

I have never had a student disappear to never be seen again, but I have seen all kinds of incidents evolve from skipping school. I have had truant students involved in accidents, crimes, fights, and a whole host of other lesser events. Sometimes these things go off the rails, but usually they are pretty harmless. The key to me is that it is almost never in isolation. There are usually others who are part of the skip or the planning. It is not always other classmates. It may be recent graduates, dropouts, or kids from nearby schools that are in the mix. More and more today I am seeing adults being involved with kids during truancy, but in the 1980s it would have been rare.

The 2nd key point is that if Roger had been forcibly taken from the high school, I can almost guarantee someone would have seen it and reported it. I think the odds are very skewed toward him voluntarily leaving and something going wrong or he needed to deal with personal issues.

As far as the Morgan Nick case goes, there is no new news reported but I do believe they have a person of interest who is currently in prison for other crimes. I have spent a considerable amount of time learning all I can about the case. It is every bit as mysterious as Rogers.

 

[Danaya]

I have never had a student disappear to never be seen again, but I have seen all kinds of incidents evolve from skipping school. I have had truant students involved in accidents, crimes, fights, and a whole host of other lesser events. Sometimes these things go off the rails, but usually they are pretty harmless. The key to me is that it is almost never in isolation. There are usually others who are part of the skip or the planning. It is not always other classmates. It may be recent graduates, dropouts, or kids from nearby schools that are in the mix. More and more today I am seeing adults being involved with kids during truancy, but in the 1980s it would have been rare.

The 2nd key point is that if Roger had been forcibly taken from the high school, I can almost guarantee someone would have seen it and reported it. I think the odds are very skewed toward him voluntarily leaving and something going wrong or he needed to deal with personal issues.

As far as the Morgan Nick case goes, there is no new news reported but I do believe they have a person of interest who is currently in prison for other crimes. I have spent a considerable amount of time learning all I can about the case. It is every bit as mysterious as Rogers.

DrHog, thank you for your insight.

I want to touch on the statement you wrote "If Roger had been forcibly taken from the high school". I agree that if he were forcibly taken from the high school someone would have reported it. However, if Roger in fact knew his attacker, he would have went with that person willingly. If they had had some sort of relationship, even more willingly. If it were a secret relationship, for whatever reason, he probably would have gone even more quietly with this person or to meet this person.

What do you think of the statement a poacher gave to police where one claimed, on his death bed, that he had seen a man in the woods holding a gun to another? Do you think that is false?

I agree he left the campus voluntarily, however, I don't think he went out to start a brand new life in another state. I think he left to meet someone he knew (or thought he knew) who then led to his dissapearance.

 

[Satch]

I agree he left the campus voluntarily, however, I don't think he went out to start a brand new life in another state. I think he left to meet someone he knew (or thought he knew) who then led to his dissapearance.

I agree.

Satch

 

[DrHog]

Danaya:

I think there are really 2 choices that have to be considered until evidence rules one out. Either he left school to meet one or more people for something (We have no solid clues what it might be) or he left alone and did not plan to meet others.

If it is the 1st choice, I certainly agree he had some reason to trust the person or persons he was going to meet. I further agree if it were a "secret" relationship, it would have been kept even 'closer to the vest', so to speak. Still, it has been my experience, and that isn't evidence, that someone else knew or suspected this "secret" relationship. I still believe the best line for investigators is to go back to his friends, teachers, school counselor, coach, and etc. Someone has a clue even if they don't know it.

If it is the 2nd choice, this makes it more difficult because he may be the only one who could provide us with answers. Kids exaggerate the importance of things going on in their life at the time. What might seem a small thing to adults is a huge problem for a kid. I don't really know much about Roger, but I have seen some pretty solid kids make some really bad decisions at a moment of despair. I remember distinctly a student of mine who talked to me about ending his life. He was a senior and had all "A"s and one "B". His life was wrapped around that one "B" and that he might not be valedictorian. I have had others who believed they just didn't fit in or were different and needed to escape.

I think the main thing is to keep an open mind to all choices and only let the evidence drive our logic.

Do we really have anything that tells us what his plans were? I don't see much but let's look at what Roger didn't do.
1. He did not take extra money with him that we know of.
2. He didn't hitch a ride but road the school bus.
3. He didn't take extra clothes to school.
4. He has never called anyone that we know of.

If you apply those known facts to our 2 scenarios, it means he was coming home after school in choice 1, but he was probably never coming home in choice 2.

 

[Danaya]

I still believe the best line for investigators is to go back to his friends, teachers, school counselor, coach, and etc. Someone has a clue even if they don't know it.

Exactly. I can only hope that is what they are currently doing.

Since Roger didn't bring any money or any type of extras, I think it was intention to meet someone and come home after school.