Connecticut school district on lockdown after shooting report at a Newtown elemen #8

[fran]

Please continue the discussion here:

At least 26 dead in shooting at Connecticut elementary school

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/1...-connecticut-elementary-school/#ixzz2F3id8S00

Thread #1

Thread #2

Thread #3

Thread #4

Thread#5

Thread #6

Thread #7


http://www.ksee24.com/news/local/Of...own-Victims-in-School-Massacre-183652041.html
Officials Release Names of Newtown Victims in School Massacre

Children:
Charlotte Bacon, 6
Daniel Barden, 7
Olivia Engel, 6
Josephine Gay, 7
Ana M. Marquez-Greene, 6
Dylan Hockley, 6
Madeleine F. Hsu, 6
Catherine V. Hubbard, 6
Chase Kowalski, 7
Jesse Lewis, 6
James Mattioli, 6
Grace McDonnell, 7
Emilie Parker, 6
Jack Pinto, 6
Noah Pozner, 6
Caroline Previdi, 6
Jessica Rekos, 6
Aveille Richman, 6
Benjamin Wheeler, 6
Allison N. Wyatt, 6

Adults:
Dawn Hochsprung, 47
Rachel Davino, 29
Anne Marie Murphy, 52
Lauren Rousseau, 30
Mary Sherlach, 56
Victoria Soto, 27
Nancy Lanza

 

[Isabelle]

Passion flower: I think you are right in your post on the previous thread about NL shutting others out of her life. I think she truly believed what she was doing for her son was the best and was not willing to entrust her son's longterm care to others, As a mother, I 'm not sure how I would have acted or what I would have done if I were in her situation. To be totally honest, I may have done the same thing she did, but I certainly would not have had dangerous weapons in my home. Very sad. If no one in her family tried to intervene and convince her to see the situation differently, they should have, esp the dad and should never have given up. Am I making sense?

 

[HastingsChi]

The touching stories of all the victims of the Sandy Hook massacre are so important to keep in our hearts and prayers.

It also has brought out the best in humanity; the best example of this is the press conference Saturday night (Dec 20) where Robbie Parker, the father of 6-year-old shooting victim Emilie Parker told reporters, “This world is a better place because she has been in it.” Parker stated that he wished that the tragedy would “not turn into something that defines us, but something that inspires us to be better, to be more compassionate and more humble people.”

The full video of Robbie Parker's remarks about Emile can be viewed here: http://abcnews.go.com/US/video/connecticut-shooting-tragedy-robbie-parker-17986590

Watching it live last Saturday I was in awe of the deep belief, intricate understanding of humanity and love that Robbie Parker displays a mere 24-hours after the tragic death of his daughter Emilie Parker. I think we can all learn from Robbie Parker and, in my opinion, he showcased the best of what humanity has to offer.

 

[time]

Bringing from the last thread

I totally agree. And I certainly wouldn't trust a "few" Professor's I have had with a gun. EVER. (jmo) Let alone some of the teachers in my local high school.

According to a Juvenile Justice course that I took, most kids do join gangs because the gang is a FAMILY to them. I think we as a society need to take a step back and take a long look at a lot of issues.

Our schools need so much help, I don't believe that I could list them all here.

Well, unfortunately we are still working on an antiquated industrial model for schools. We are still forming huge consolidated schools. In some areas, they have tried a 'school within a school' approach with some success so that children/adolescents will not join gangs in order to have 'family' or belonging. I think it is the same concept with other students and would help with bullying and understanding differences. If schools were smaller, we also would not have such high administration costs and that money can go elsewhere.

 

[fran]

Reminder!

Please take all 'gun control' discussion to the thread we set up in our private area.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community




As quoted from JBean: "We know nothing concrete about the family dynamics.
As posted before almost all accounts of Nancy as a mother portray her as a lovely devoted mother.
Attacking her integrity and her choices will not be tolerated at this time. Not only is this a victim friendly site- but we have not got the first clue what is or is not true as it relates to the shooter and his mother.

She has paid the ultimate price. leave her alone. Leave the family alone, the whole family.

TIA
fran

 

[HastingsChi]

Passion flower: I think you are right in your post on the previous thread about NL shutting others out of her life. I think she truly believed what she was doing for her son was the best and was not willing to entrust her son's longterm care to others, As a mother, I 'm not sure how I would have acted or what I would have done if I were in her situation. To be totally honest, I may have done the same thing she did, but I certainly would not have had dangerous weapons in my home. Very sad. If no one in her family tried to intervene and convince her to see the situation differently, they should have, esp the dad and should never have given up. Am I making sense?

Isabelle, thank you for your thoughtful post. You raise a lot of the same feelings that I have been trying to understand as we continue to read "news" reports crucifying Nancy Lanza. After reading endless news stories about the life of Nancy Lanza, I have come to the conclusion that we are reading a plethora of misinformation and rumors from people who casually knew Nancy Lanza or, in some documented cases, didn't know Nancy Lanza at all. It is very troubling to me; I feel like we witnessing the worst exercise of modern "journalism" with the coverage of Adam & Nancy Lanza's background-- It just seems the media is throwing spaghetti against the wall and seeing what sticks...

I'm really trying to understand why Nancy Lanza is being crucified by the media and the public to the point that many in the media are essentially blaming her for enabling Adam Lanza's actions but Adam's father, Peter Lanza, is not facing any backlash for Adam's actions.

According to USA Today the Lanza's had "joint legal custody" of Adam with Nancy having primary custody.

It is sickening and disgusting to me that the public and media are blaming a dead woman, murdered by her own son, for Adam's actions yet Peter Lanza is not accountable on any level for Adam's actions. I'm sure that Peter Lanza being a Vice President at GE Energy Financial Services and GE owning 49% of both NBC & MSNBC allows that "news" division to give Peter Lanza a pass.

Isn't it interesting that this is one of the few mass shootings that the media isn't giving the accused shooter's middle name? Guess what, the accused shooter's full name: Adam Peter Lanza. If they were using his middle name, Peter, in coverage it might remind us that he has a father too...

 

[not_my_kids]

ACK, I freaked out for a minute there....missed the jump. Fran, you almost caught my fingers in the door when you slammed it, LOL. Thanks for the new one though.

 

[mister happy]

The gun control thread is closed. ?

 

[manzana]

I realize there is a gun control forum but I think/hope we as adult posters can still address the issue of guns in school here without it getting out of control..

That being said, I would not want teachers to be armed or even a few administers. I talked with our principal at length a few days back and I mentioned the fact that I was surprised the school did not beef anything up other than placing a few more pieces of paper on additional doors with warnings that are ignored for the most part.


Ideally all schools should have one officer but I do not think it will happen.

Then they had their Xmas show today, all grades from pre-k thru 5th were seated on the floor in the cafeteria, I was there and took position at the cross part of an upside down T Hopefully this will make sense but at each end of the upside down T was entrance /exit doors. From my position I could view all doors. It was not until leaving that I did see a school officer outside cafeteria but from his vantage point he could not see one of the doors. I was very vigilant and I do not think he was there long, he was gone before people had even left.

Knowing what happened at Sandy Hook and all the recent threats, that was a bad plan to have entire school sitting in the cafeteria.

 

[Isabelle]

Isabelle, thank you for your thoughtful post. You raise a lot of the same feelings that I have been trying to understand as we continue to read "news" reports crucifying Nancy Lanza. After reading endless news stories about the life of Nancy Lanza, I have come to the conclusion that we are reading a plethora of misinformation and rumors from people who casually knew Nancy Lanza or, in some documented cases, didn't know Nancy Lanza at all. It is very troubling to me; I feel like we witnessing the worst exercise of modern "journalism" with the coverage of Adam & Nancy Lanza's background-- It just seems the media is throwing spaghetti against the wall and seeing what sticks...

I'm really trying to understand why Nancy Lanza is being crucified by the media and the public to the point that many in the media are essentially blaming her for enabling Adam Lanza's actions but Adam's father, Peter Lanza, is not facing any backlash for Adam's actions.

According to USA Today the Lanza's had "joint legal custody" of Adam with Nancy having primary custody.

It is sickening and disgusting to me that the public and media are blaming a dead woman, murdered by her own son, for Adam's actions yet Peter Lanza is not accountable on any level for Adam's actions. I'm sure that Peter Lanza being a Vice President at GE Energy Financial Services and GE owning 49% of both NBC & MSNBC allows that "news" division to give Peter Lanza a pass.

Isn't it interesting that this is one of the few mass shootings that the media isn't giving the accused shooter's middle name? Guess what, the accused shooter's full name: Adam Peter Lanza. If they were using his middle name, Peter, in coverage it might remind us that he has a father too...

Agree. As I continue to move through the stages of grief after losing my son 9+ years ago, I think I understand the source of the blame for this tragedy. Immediate family, parents specifically and especially the children's mothers will remain in the intial stages of grief for several months, shock, disbelief. Those removed from the immediate family, the community, will advance to the anger stage much much faster. I think the blame and anger is not really directed at NL, but directed to the fact that she had guns in the home and AL was able to obtain and use them and when we place blame, we place it on people, not things ordinarily. Hope this makes sense. At this time in my life, 9+ years later, I continue to travel back and forth through the stages of grief and often jump around. I don't think this ever ends. Am so incredibly sorry this happened. Even though I have experienced the loss of a child, I cannot imagine what the parents of these Angels will feel but I know that they will feel pain that no living thing should ever have to feel for any reason. Thanks for letting me ramble.

 

[justthinkin]

We need to be able to have a civilized discussion about solutions to the problem of lunatic shooters somewhere, please! I posted here, then saw Fran said that was a no no, so went to the designated thread, and found it closed.

I don't want to see our schools turned into police states nor do I want children and teachers to be sitting ducks for the next loon.

 

[not_my_kids]

Unless some things change, it'll be awfully hard to get an armed officer in every school. We have more schools here than we do full time police officers. Whether you are for or against guns in schools....that's a sad state of affairs, right there.

 

[wfgodot]

4 Dead, 3 State Troopers Injured in Blair County Shooting (pittsburgh.cbslocal.com)

Will start a thread on this.

Here 'tis.

PA - Four dead, three state troopers injured, in Blair County shooting

 

[HastingsChi]

Agree. As I continue to move through the stages of grief after lost in my son 9+ years ago, I think I understand the source of the blame for this tragedy. Immediate family, parents specifically and especially the children's mothers will remain in the intial stages of grief for several months, shock, disbelief. Those removed from the immediate family, the community, will advance to the anger stage much much faster. I think the blame and anger is not really directed at NL, but directed to the fact that she had guns in the home and AL was able to obtain and use them and when we place blame, we place it on people, not things ordinarily. Hope this makes sense. At this time in my life, 9+ years later, I continue to travel back and forth through the stages of grief and often jump around. I don't think this ever ends. Am so incredibly sorry this happened. Even though I have experienced the loss of a child, I cannot imagine what the parents of these Angels will feel but I know that they will feel pain that no living thing should ever have to feel for any reason. Thanks for letting me ramble.

Isabelle: I'm so sorry to hear about the loss of your son and will keep you and your loved one's in my thoughts and prayers this holiday season.

In the last week I saw two very different versions of parents dealing with tragic loss: Robbie Parker's words last Saturday night and Tilda Swinton's performance in the film "We Need to Talk About Kevin".

 

[JBean]

Reminder!

Please take all 'gun control' discussion to the thread we set up in our private area.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community




As quoted from JBean: "We know nothing concrete about the family dynamics.
As posted before almost all accounts of Nancy as a mother portray her as a lovely devoted mother.
Attacking her integrity and her choices will not be tolerated at this time. Not only is this a victim friendly site- but we have not got the first clue what is or is not true as it relates to the shooter and his mother.

She has paid the ultimate price. leave her alone. Leave the family alone, the whole family.

TIA
fran

The Gun Control thread is locked until the personal back and forth insults can be addressed.
As for the conversation about NL it seems to just continue to spiral out of control.
We do not have any concrete information as to the dynamics and the accusations are getting OTT. Wait until we have concrete information. TO's will be given to those that continue to attack the victim.

 

[time]

<snip>
It is sickening and disgusting to me that the public and media are blaming a dead woman, murdered by her own son, for Adam's actions yet Peter Lanza is not accountable on any level for Adam's actions. I'm sure that Peter Lanza being a Vice President at GE Energy Financial Services and GE owning 49% of both NBC & MSNBC allows that "news" division to give Peter Lanza a pass.

Isn't it interesting that this is one of the few mass shootings that the media isn't giving the accused shooter's middle name? Guess what, the accused shooter's full name: Adam Peter Lanza. If they were using his middle name, Peter, in coverage it might remind us that he has a father too...

Wow... I think this is pretty caustic towards the father. You're suggesting he manipulated the media? Everyone knows his name, everyone knows Adam had a father. No one has said he didn't try to be involved in Adam's life. So, about misreporting, why hint that Peter WAS irresponsible when there is no basis for that so far. I don't know that anyone is giving Peter Lanza a pass, there just doesn't seem like much to grab onto to blame him for something. He couldn't force Adam to have contact with him if he didn't want it after Adam turned 18. We don't know that he wasn't trying to help or get info from Nancy for the past 2-3 years, do we?

 

[Abby Normal Again]

Remember he cut out his dad a couple years back. We don't know why. At some point there isn't much you can do for your ex-wife and adult son who won't speak to you.

I won't crucify either parent, personally. Yes, maybe they should have seen warning signs- but also think there are tons of withdrawn and distant people in the world who never hurt anyone. DH has an uncle who has basically lived in his room his whole life. He's in his 50's. Doesn't work- but he's smart, and speaks dryly. You only see him when he comes out to eat a meal that's been prepared for him. No idea what he does in his room all day. I would never ever ever consider him violent, scary, or a risk to society. Ever. Quite the opposite, I'd think he's more likely to be a victim and I could see the logic in trying to "toughen him up" if that's even what NL was doing with the guns.

If he went postal, his parents would be vilified for enabling all these years. But since he never did, they are just accepting of him and loving of his differences.

 

[HastingsChi]

Wow... I think this is pretty caustic towards the father. You're suggesting he manipulated the media? Everyone knows his name, everyone knows Adam had a father. No one has said he didn't try to be involved in Adam's life. So, about misreporting, why hint that Peter WAS irresponsible when there is no basis for that so far. I don't know that anyone is giving Peter Lanza a pass, there just doesn't seem like much to grab onto to blame him for something. He couldn't force Adam to have contact with him if he didn't want it after Adam turned 18. We don't know that he wasn't trying to help or get info from Nancy for the past 2-3 years, do we?

I'm simply suggesting that much of the "reporting" on Nancy Lanza (who was tragically murdered by her own son) is based on comments from acquaintances, 2nd hand information and in one well-documented example someone who heard a rumor and told it to a news organization who ran with it as the truth. It is easier to crucify a murder victim who is not in a position to respond to the speculation being reported by the media whereas if there was such misreporting (or any reporting) about Peter Lanza, it would be quite easy for him to file a slander lawsuit.

Much of the "reporting" seems to put more blame on Nancy than Adam; and no one is even mentioning Peter's role in Adam's life. I'd encourage you to read the reports from MSM about their divorce settlement and how they would both make the decisions about Adam together even during his adulthood. This crucifixion of Nancy Lanza is not responsible journalism and it is not fair to Nancy Lanza who is a victim of murder by her own son.

And TIME, you're absolutely right "We don't know that he wasn't trying to help or get info from Nancy for the past 2-3 years, do we?". Your comment is absolutely correct and only furthers my point that Nancy Lanza is being crucified by the media when we don't actually know the reality of her life the past 2-3 years and the decisions Nancy AND Peter made regarding Adam. It is odd that a victim is blamed by the media yet the other parent of the shooter isn't being discussed. As we know here at WS we honor the victims and do not blame them.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

Here's a thought..........

And this is "just a thought" ...................

Instead of putting weapons on school grounds to deter a shooter what about "remote monitoring" - meaning cameras? I am "rabidly" for cameras in schools - EVERYWHERE! (well not in bathrooms, shower/locker rooms of course).

While school shootings are horrible, horrific events - everyday we read about "this teacher that slept with a student" or "that teacher that slapped around a special needs child" - with cameras in classrooms I do believe that would dern near stop.

I've always wanted a camera in my classroom - I do nothing wrong, so what's the problem?

Funny story - years ago - the school I was in had hallway cameras but none in the classrooms. What we did have was a combined fire, carbon monoxide, alarm thingy that was up at the ceiling in a corner of the room. It had red and green lights. Through the years I had my share of behavior problems - so one day I pointed to that box and told them "see that? There's a camera in there so when I take you to lunch I'm going to the office to review the footage" (I think I had a case where one of the students had come up missing the $20.00 bill mom have given her to pay on her lunch account). But that small act - after that - the kids were always "mindful" of that little box up in the corner.

Were they cameras? No. But even if it was - what's the problem? I've asked over the years about putting cameras in classrooms and I'm always faced with teachers, administrators, and the unions telling me "no way - that's not going to work - its an infringement of the bargaining agreement" or whatever silly excuse they use.

We have the technology now to remotely monitor our front doors, speak with a visitor through your phone, and the elderly programs with the little necklace that has an emergency button on it if they are in need.

Remote monitored cameras are a good idea but in a case like Sandy Hook - we're still faced with response time by LE. But also in a case like Sandy Hook - even if an armed resource officer had been on campus what is the likelihood of him being in that area as is occurred? Even IF Victoria Soto or Dawn Hochsprung had access to a weapon - they wouldn't have had time to get to it.

There is no one solution to fixing our schools - but I truly believe cameras (monitoring) should be a huge part. We have daycare facilities now that have monitoring cameras so parents can log-in at work to see what their children are doing. HUGE GREAT IDEA!!!

We have to work together to keep our children safe.




JMHO

 

[HastingsChi]

Remember he cut out his dad a couple years back. We don't know why. At some point there isn't much you can do for your ex-wife and adult son who won't speak to you.

I won't crucify either parent, personally. Yes, maybe they should have seen warning signs- but also think there are tons of withdrawn and distant people in the world who never hurt anyone. DH has an uncle who has basically lived in his room his whole life. He's in his 50's. Doesn't work- but he's smart, and speaks dryly. You only see him when he comes out to eat a meal that's been prepared for him. No idea what he does in his room all day. I would never ever ever consider him violent, scary, or a risk to society. Ever. Quite the opposite, I'd think he's more likely to be a victim and I could see the logic in trying to "toughen him up" if that's even what NL was doing with the guns.

If he went postal, his parents would be vilified for enabling all these years. But since he never did, they are just accepting of him and loving of his differences.

I'd be interested to see factual documentation that "he cut out his dad a couple years back".

I think that the media is too heavily relying upon speculation, comments from acquaintances and, in some cases, people who didn't even know the Lanza's. It is troubling when guy who talked to her a few times at a bar is headline news or Adam's barber is in the spotlight and their words are taken as gospel by the media..