David Carradine Found Dead

[Gracenote]

The thing that I don't get is why he didn't just stand up? Based on the photo, ashamed but I looked, it seems like his knee are bent and feet resting on the floor. So, again I ask, why didn't he just stand up?

I'm not ashamed for looking. It is a possible crime scene and that is what we do here. It is not an upsetting or gory photo. I questioned, too, his hair color, the fact that he could have stood up, the fact that his hands appear to be tied over his head. It doesn't really look like him to me. Could be his hair was dyed for the movie he was making.

I am glad the family is asking for further investigation. Maybe they can find the answers. There is a life insurance issue, too, if they say it was suicide.

That's the one thing I am sure it wasn't. Whatever else, I just don't know.

Edit- I looked at the hotel rooms on their web site and they are really gorgeous. They don't look like the picture that is supposed to be of him.
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[daisy.faithfull]

Has this been posted yet?

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/08/arts/08arts-002.html

"The family of the actor David Carradine has asked the F.B.I. and Dr. Michael Baden, a private forensics expert, to help investigate Mr. Carradine’s death, The Associated Press reported. Mark Geragos, a lawyer representing Mr. Carradine’s half brother Keith, said his client met with the F.B.I. on Friday and filed reports that may lead to in inquiry by the bureau into the death of Mr. Carradine, whose body was found in his Bangkok hotel room last week. The family also wants a private autopsy by Dr. Baden to help determine whether another person could have been involved in the death. Mr. Geragos said the family intervened because of the conflicting information coming from Thailand. Initial reports from Thai police said that Mr. Carradine was found naked and hanging in a closet, and that they suspected suicide. Later the police said he might have died from accidental suffocation or heart failure as a result of autoerotic asphyxiation. The family was upset over the weekend after learning that photos of Mr. Carradine’s body were published in a Thai newspaper, the BBC reported."

I wonder if there would be any ligature marks on his wrists if they were over his head. Maybe the severity of those could indicate signs of struggle?

 

[WhyaDuck?]

I'm not ashamed for looking. It is a possible crime scene and that is what we do here. It is not an upsetting or gory photo. I questioned, too, his hair color, the fact that he could have stood up, the fact that his hands appear to be tied over his head. It doesn't really look like him to me. Could be his hair was dyed for the movie he was making.

I am glad the family is asking for further investigation. Maybe they can find the answers. There is a life insurance issue, too, if they say it was suicide.

That's the one thing I am sure it wasn't. Whatever else, I just don't know.

Edit- I looked at the hotel rooms on their web site and they are really gorgeous. They don't look like the picture that is supposed to be of him.
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It is, of course, possible this was a fake photo sold to the paper by someone claiming to be (or possibly actually on) the police force, but who staged it at him in his bathroom for some extra cash.

 

[Dawnmarie]

I looked at the picture too. It looks fake to me. Looks like a cheap hotel room and the guy has dark hair. Doesn't seem right, which means it probably isn't. I agree someone is just trying to make a buck. I hope they get busted big time! How sick.

 

[justthinkin]

The photo looks like a fake to me too. Carradine's hair is gray. Also looks like a younger person hanging there. JMO.

I was never a Carradine fan. Just thought the guy was weird. Hate to see him end up this way though.

 

[Cubby]

imo, if it was an intentional act, he wanted to cut off his blood supply so as to heighten his arousal. Standing up would have been buzzkill.
If DC passed out and was unable to stand up, then hung as a result, it makes sense.
I know a man that did this in a closet, except he did it with a plastic bag over his head. he also cut his air supply off too long but he didn't die. he is in sorry shape though and is institutionalized. Pretty much just drools.

FWIW, I think you described this accurately JBean. My step dad is retired LE. HE told me about a case like this which was initially thought a suicide and the family thought it was murder. They did a full investigation (more than 20 years ago) and had a specialist out from another state, who had 'seen' several accidents such as this. An Autopsy was able to determine/confirm based on effects of the body where the blood was cut off.

ETA: My step dad was pretty specific and clear in how they investigated to prove it was not murder, but an accident. I think that will be found in this case as well.

 

[ziggy]

Also there were conflicting reports about his hands being tied behind his back and not overhead.

I think it's actually good for the case, in a way, to have a photo released. The more the public is outraged at the suicide decision or suggestion, the better off the family is because the powers that be can't hide from the public when the cat's out of the bag...

 

[shana]

Photo looks fake to me too, and I don't understand how that contraption would work for AEA.

I don't need to understand or know...just hoping the Carradine family gets its answers, and we can all forget about this tragic end to the life of a most talented and exceptional person whose memory does not need this tag added to it.

Yeah I know, wishing for too much here...

Farewell DC, with license plate 7GRAINS on your VW van all over the canyon in the early 70s. R.I.P.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Also there were conflicting reports about his hands being tied behind his back and not overhead.

I think it's actually good for the case, in a way, to have a photo released. The more the public is outraged at the suicide decision or suggestion, the better off the family is because the powers that be can't hide from the public when the cat's out of the bag...

About the conflicting reports... I was just at Radaronline (linked from another site) and they have this description of the photo:

The shocking published photo shows Carradine with his hands tied in front of him, hanging from the support bar in a closet.

Tattoos on the lower half of his nude body can be seen.

Discoloration of the skin on the lower extremities indicates he had been dead for hours before being found, according to people familiar with the situation.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2009/06/world-exclusive-thai-newspaper-publishes-photo-carradine-hanging-family-outraged

I don't know if that matches with the photo we see because it looks like the body is shaded and the arm positioning in either up, or up and to the back.

I agree with you about hoping that this encourages investigation be the pictures real or fake so that the family can know the truth.

 

[christee]

IDK, looks like from the position of his feet and bent left(?) knee, the pic was taken from behind him, IOW, his back was to the camera(?).

Such a tragedy...

 

[daisy.faithfull]

I looked at the picture too. It looks fake to me. Looks like a cheap hotel room and the guy has dark hair. Doesn't seem right, which means it probably isn't. I agree someone is just trying to make a buck. I hope they get busted big time! How sick.

Its hard to tell because the picture shows so little of the hotel room, but I did think about that. But why would his family be outraged about an invasion of privacy if they were fake? Wouldn't the family just say they were fake if they were?

 

[WhyaDuck?]

Its hard to tell because the picture shows so little of the hotel room, but I did think about that. But why would his family be outraged about an invasion of privacy if they were fake? Wouldn't the family just say they were fake if they were?

From all accounts, the family is really no better informed than we are, so they might not know they are fake (if they indeed are).

 

[shana]

Its hard to tell because the picture shows so little of the hotel room, but I did think about that. But why would his family be outraged about an invasion of privacy if they were fake? Wouldn't the family just say they were fake if they were?

Hi Daisy!

How can they know, or even prove it is a fake? And even if so proven, is it not still an invasion, especially at this time so close to his passing?

That his death occurred in a foreign country adds to the confusion.

This family is in grief...they need this, NOT...they don't need to disprove fakes nor dispel all the rumors nor defend him, etc & so on.

Price one pays for being a 'celeb', I guess. One's memory can be trashed with a load of speculation, fake photos, and more. Or at best, the 'world' can know you went-out pleasuring yourself in an unconventional way.

All that said, I hope the investigation continues to a satisfactory end for the family and friends who survive him.

Amities

 

[opme]

Pardon my ignorance but I am confused over the positioning with the hands tied..If the point of the autoerotic affixiation was to cut of your blood supply and thus heighten your pleasure wouldnt you have to some how actually be plaeasuring yourself during the act and when he bent his legs then tighten the cord around his neck thus creating the heightened experience.. how can that happen if there is no phycial contact with his hands, a external mehcanical device or another person? It would be impossible to derive pleasure with out some form of contact with is genitals.. in this case there is no other then the cord which wouldn't seem to be a form of pleasure except for the possible prolonged length of the pleasure due to the compressed blood vessels. Other wise it simply would appear to be more of a wacked out method of suicide.. as there is no pleasure principal here.. if I am missing something please correct me..

 

[SleuthyMama]

I agree, opme. The whole "hands being tied" thing makes no sense to me.

You stated it more tastefully than I ever could so thank you.

 

[CyberLaw]

I do think that David did not intend to kill himself, but it was an auto-erotic "misadventure" and he died. This would not be the first time and unfortunately not the last time.

When ever someone(even not well know) dies in this maner, it is very difficult for the family to accept that the person died by their own hand, intentionally or not.

Someone else of course must be to blame.....but in the Divorce fillings from some years ago, the auto erotic sessions were alluded to, as "dangerous" and potentially life threatening "sexual" acts.

So I have some difficulty in determining if someone else was involved, I just think it does not fit the "crime scene".

 

[gaia227]

The thing I really don't understand is if he was participating in auto-erotic asphyixiation wouldn't he need his hands? The whole point is the cut of oxygen while performing the act - if your hands are tied that would be kind of hard to achieve.

I had two friends who were into AEA until one time during sex she passed out, vomited and had to be rescuitated. It is not common for it to go too far and for someone to die. I think there was another person involved in this. I am leaning towards the theory he hired a prostitute to perform these acts and something went wrong, maybe she didn't know what she was doing, there is a language barrier, he ended up suffocating, she freaked out and ran.

 

[robinparten]

The thing I really don't understand is if he was participating in auto-erotic asphyixiation wouldn't he need his hands? The whole point is the cut of oxygen while performing the act - if your hands are tied that would be kind of hard to achieve.

I had two friends who were into AEA until one time during sex she passed out, vomited and had to be rescuitated. It is not common for it to go too far and for someone to die. I think there was another person involved in this. I am leaning towards the theory he hired a prostitute to perform these acts and something went wrong, maybe she didn't know what she was doing, there is a language barrier, he ended up suffocating, she freaked out and ran.

Initially, there were reports that he had a rope around his neck and his penis. If there was a rope around his penis, could it have been done in such a way as to provide stimulation, thereby not needing his hands?

 

[CyberLaw]

There is a video camera for security purposes outside DC "very upscale" hotel suite.

According to the video camera(which if tampered with, could easily be discovered due to the time) no one went into his room.

Therefore I feel it was an "accident" and unfortunately this "risky" type of action does lead to "misadventure" due to the fact that it could easily end up unintentionally causing death.

But the FBI will only be serving in an "observer" capacity, I am sure that this will serve the purpose of ensuring everything was and is done according to accepted practices. So no questions of incompetence, cover up, missed evidence, lost evidence, etc.

The FBI can report that they observed the investigation and came to the same conclusion as the Thai police force. Again, I have no doubt that this was an accident.

Maybe it will make one person think twice about this "risky" type of action.

 

[gaia227]

Thanks CL - I had not heard anything about the surveillance cameras.