Disturbing LA quote

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But what did Tony offer to Lee for him to write down? Nothing basically. It was really sad to me seeing Lee desperate for information and TL obviously not caring one bit about any of it. If I'd been Lee, my blood would have run cold. I would have really been frightened seeing TL's cavalier attitude and noncommunication. Lee had incredibly good faith to go there to talk to TL in the first place, treating him like a friend and assuming he would also want to help find Caylee. He could see that TL didn't care at all. Then TL actually ridiculed him afterward, this young man worried to death to find his little niece. The only information I can remember Tony mentioning at all was reiterating how annoyed he had been picking Casey up at the Amscot and the part about his drug dealer in the complex (which made Lee slow down and become pensive and worried). When Lee went into that meeting with TL, he seemed to still be thinking (or at least convincing himself) that this was all some crazy Casey stunt or mix-up, and that Caylee was with some friend of hers. When he heard from TL about the drug dealer, he did pause and look worried and pensive, you could see he was worried Casey might have stolen money from the drug dealer or something, which could be a more serious situation than he'd allowed himself to consider up to that point. (Because TL had mentioned she'd said she had some money to get a new car or something? IIRC.) Lee does seem to laugh out of embarrassment regarding Casey, and out of nervousness, and I think also to be accomodating/deflect confrontation, for example, when the officers in the other interview are saying, I hope you don't mind me asking this question or making this face and Lee laughs and says no problem. It does sound like a nervous laugh and him trying to be cooperative. Not that there couldn't be some kind of pattern of exactly what kind of questions make him laugh. It's an interesting question.

huh... Interesting. It seems to me TonE was the one there at the request of LE (who were actually the only people who were truly looking to find Caylee) Iirc, he is also the one who took a lie detector test, allowed his phone to be tapped and have his car searched. Oooh poor Lee. Sorry but I'm just not feeling it!
 
I honestly think from everything I've seen of Lee, if he had wanted to record TL he would have said, "I'm going to record this if that's okay with you" or something like that.
I agree with the above poster who said that Lee seems pretty serious and sincere when trying hard to get information out of Casey in the prison conversation. He seems to want very badly to find Caylee.

I don't think he laughed when talking to Casey, did he? I'm trying to remember now. Maybe just when talking to others about her? And about the horrible situation that you can tell he was trying to believe was going to turn out just fine, Caylee must be with some friend, this is all a stupid stunt or mixup, or something like that.

Yeah, OK.. as he's sitting in the garage choking on the smell of death coming from his sisters car? I kinda doubt that's what he was thinking at this point, ya know?
 
I remember thinking he seemed cavalier, like he was planning a party & deciding who to invite & what to eat. Specifically, I recall him laughing inappropriately when something was inferred about KC lying. He seemed serious only about the 'timeline' - just trying to figure out this timeline dude (I'm paraphrasing from memory).

What I found most odd though, was that he was supposedly trying to figure out the timeline but he didn't seem to be writing anything down - he did pull out his cellphone to look at a calendar once or twice & I think he even pulled out a small notebook & flipped it open for reference - but I did not see him write anything down.

Now, did I miss something? Does he have such a good memory that he will be able to recall everything he's told w/o writing it down? Is it possible he was surreptitiously recording that conversation in the car too? I know T. said he had to get back to him about a couple of things but there were definites he told LA & I just don't know how someone can remember that much info w/o writing it down, particularly when there's so much conflicting info coming from various people.

JMO

He seemed to think he could make TonE jealous with things too. Lee's odd.. he'd say little things like about Jesse and Casey still hooking up and how she had another boyfriend.. I can't think of all the things off the top of my head but there were a few other things like that too iirc..
 
I didn't even notice he wasn't writing it down. I remember him saying that when they first found out Caylee was missing he ran to get a notebook and paper to start writing things down that KC was saying. He added that he only got a few lines down before the police arrived. Very odd that he wouldn't have a pen and pad when he certainly had time to prepare.

If I had to guess I would say he was recording it too which is pretty ironic.

I'm enjoying your posts. You make some great points!!
 
But what did Tony offer to Lee for him to write down? Nothing basically. It was really sad to me seeing Lee desperate for information and TL obviously not caring one bit about any of it. If I'd been Lee, my blood would have run cold. I would have really been frightened seeing TL's cavalier attitude and noncommunication. Lee had incredibly good faith to go there to talk to TL in the first place, treating him like a friend and assuming he would also want to help find Caylee. He could see that TL didn't care at all. Then TL actually ridiculed him afterward, this young man worried to death to find his little niece. The only information I can remember Tony mentioning at all was reiterating how annoyed he had been picking Casey up at the Amscot and the part about his drug dealer in the complex (which made Lee slow down and become pensive and worried). When Lee went into that meeting with TL, he seemed to still be thinking (or at least convincing himself) that this was all some crazy Casey stunt or mix-up, and that Caylee was with some friend of hers. When he heard from TL about the drug dealer, he did pause and look worried and pensive, you could see he was worried Casey might have stolen money from the drug dealer or something, which could be a more serious situation than he'd allowed himself to consider up to that point. (Because TL had mentioned she'd said she had some money to get a new car or something? IIRC.) Lee does seem to laugh out of embarrassment regarding Casey, and out of nervousness, and I think also to be accomodating/deflect confrontation, for example, when the officers in the other interview are saying, I hope you don't mind me asking this question or making this face and Lee laughs and says no problem. It does sound like a nervous laugh and him trying to be cooperative. Not that there couldn't be some kind of pattern of exactly what kind of questions make him laugh. It's an interesting question.

yeah, I felt kinda bad for him too when the cop & T made fun of him afterwards

it does seem like a lot of ppl. connected to this have that cavalier attitude but I suppose it's difficult to judge when I haven't been in their position(s)
 
But what did Tony offer to Lee for him to write down? Nothing basically. It was really sad to me seeing Lee desperate for information and TL obviously not caring one bit about any of it. If I'd been Lee, my blood would have run cold. I would have really been frightened seeing TL's cavalier attitude and noncommunication. Lee had incredibly good faith to go there to talk to TL in the first place, treating him like a friend and assuming he would also want to help find Caylee. He could see that TL didn't care at all. Then TL actually ridiculed him afterward, this young man worried to death to find his little niece. The only information I can remember Tony mentioning at all was reiterating how annoyed he had been picking Casey up at the Amscot and the part about his drug dealer in the complex (which made Lee slow down and become pensive and worried). When Lee went into that meeting with TL, he seemed to still be thinking (or at least convincing himself) that this was all some crazy Casey stunt or mix-up, and that Caylee was with some friend of hers. When he heard from TL about the drug dealer, he did pause and look worried and pensive, you could see he was worried Casey might have stolen money from the drug dealer or something, which could be a more serious situation than he'd allowed himself to consider up to that point. (Because TL had mentioned she'd said she had some money to get a new car or something? IIRC.) Lee does seem to laugh out of embarrassment regarding Casey, and out of nervousness, and I think also to be accomodating/deflect confrontation, for example, when the officers in the other interview are saying, I hope you don't mind me asking this question or making this face and Lee laughs and says no problem. It does sound like a nervous laugh and him trying to be cooperative. Not that there couldn't be some kind of pattern of exactly what kind of questions make him laugh. It's an interesting question.

No offense, and I hope this doesn't come across as rude, but were we watching the same surveillance video? Tony couldn't give info for lee to write down because he couldn't even get a word in! Hence the comment at the end about lee not shutting up. You've also got to remember that Tony was working for LE at the time and was going by what they told him to do.

I actually shocked that you said Tony doesn't care. I think his willingness to aid investigators in whatever he could, doing multiple interviews to help out, taking a polygraph even, shows to me atleast that he cares a great deal about Caylee and justice for her. That's a lot more than I can say about the A family, including lee... who refused a polygraph.

I never seen lee as an uncle desperately looking for his niece. I seen a guy who was very much aware what his sister had done and was trying to piece it all together. Even in the surveillance lee admitted that he didn't think KC was ever looking for Caylee. I do think lee had ulterior motives meeting up with TL. This is a family who was trying to pin what happened to Caylee on someone else other than KC. Ricardo, Jesse, Amy, Tony.... anyone but KC.
Honest and decent people just don't do that.

(It kind of stands out, kind of like KMT's statement of "and that was the last time I ever heard her".) It's like, why throw in that detail?
:waitasec: I'm sorry but I don't see how you can compare the two statements, and not too sure how it relates to this thread and Lees laughter??? I'm actually a bit concerned that you are willing to see such suspicions in people who did nothing but cooperate with investigators, yet fail to see issues with the very people who have blatantly lied under oath and hindered the investigation into their own granddaughter/nieces' disappearance/murder.

Like I said, I'm not trying to be rude.. I guess i'm just confused as to where you're coming from.
 
huh... Interesting. It seems to me TonE was the one there at the request of LE (who were actually the only people who were truly looking to find Caylee) Iirc, he is also the one who took a lie detector test, allowed his phone to be tapped and have his car searched. Oooh poor Lee. Sorry but I'm just not feeling it!

You posted as I was typing but I wanted to say more than 'thanks'. My thoughts exactly.
 
And again, I'm certainly not trying to draw any conclusions from LA's laughter I just think it is interesting to look at some of the subconcious things we all do because they can sometimes be so telling.

I just began watching CA's deposotion again and was trying to look at the times she took a drink of water. Again, this appears to be another sort of subconcious reaction. I'm not sure why she does it but I'm sure it's not because she is thirsty (have you noticed how long it lasts even after taking so many drinks?)

Here's a quick transcript of a few of the times. It would be great to hear everyone's opinions. I've put mine, but again this is just an opinion.

Making the obsurd sound normal
JM: Have you ever seen a picture of Zanny?
CA: No, but I have a picture in my head. From descriptions, from the last 2 and a half years... (Drink of Water)

Possible lie since the need to call Zanny sure would have come up during the 31 days she was trying to track down her daughter and grandaugher. It's funny how she never has said that she was frantically searching or attempting to locate Zanny's number during this time.
JM: If the need arose that you ever needed to talk to her (Zanny), you would have had to go to these addresses and phone numbers that Casey gave you?
CA: Yes, correct.
JM: Did you ever dial or call or talk to this person.
CA: No, I have not. (Drink of Water)

Possible Lie
JM: Did you ever hear Jesse talk about Zanny?
CA: Yes...
JM: What did he say?
CA: I can't rememnber, I just remember the name came up. (Drink of Water)

Making the obsurd sound normal
JM: Is there any other adult that has said to you 'I have met Zanny and know who she is'.
CA: Not that I'm aware of (long sigh and whispers 'this is not relevant') (Drink of water)

Possible lie. I find it hard to believe the topic of paying for Zanny never came up. I have a feeling Casey used it as an excuse for never having money.
CA: Casey would give me a new phone number for Zanny probably every three months. She said the girl changed her phone number almost like she changed her address.
JM: Did Casey tell you that she was paying Zanny?
CA: I never asked her (Drink of Water)

Possible Lie
JM: How many times did Casey stay out of the house with Zanny and Caylee?
CA: (Drink of Water) What time frame?
JM: Let me narrow it down, how many times was it before June 15th. That Casey stayed out of the house with Zanny?
CA: Maybe on an average, once or twice a month.

Avoidance
JM: There came a point in time when your daughter. According to her, gave Caylee to the babysitter.
CA: What specific date are you talking about? (Drink of Water)
JM: June 15th...
CA: Casey in my understanding never gave Caylee to Zanny (she goes on to correct him that it was June 16th).

Excellent, SFW!!! If Cindy keeps this up they will have to install a chamber pot in the courthouse witness stand for her. :innocent:
 
No offense, and I hope this doesn't come across as rude, but were we watching the same surveillance video? Tony couldn't give info for lee to write down because he couldn't even get a word in! Hence the comment at the end about lee not shutting up. You've also got to remember that Tony was working for LE at the time and was going by what they told him to do.

I actually shocked that you said Tony doesn't care. I think his willingness to aid investigators in whatever he could, doing multiple interviews to help out, taking a polygraph even, shows to me atleast that he cares a great deal about Caylee and justice for her. That's a lot more than I can say about the A family, including lee... who refused a polygraph.

I never seen lee as an uncle desperately looking for his niece. I seen a guy who was very much aware what his sister had done and was trying to piece it all together. Even in the surveillance lee admitted that he didn't think KC was ever looking for Caylee. I do think lee had ulterior motives meeting up with TL. This is a family who was trying to pin what happened to Caylee on someone else other than KC. Ricardo, Jesse, Amy, Tony.... anyone but KC.
Honest and decent people just don't do that.


:waitasec: I'm sorry but I don't see how you can compare the two statements, and not too sure how it relates to this thread and Lees laughter??? I'm actually a bit concerned that you are willing to see such suspicions in people who did nothing but cooperate with investigators, yet fail to see issues with the very people who have blatantly lied under oath and hindered the investigation into their own granddaughter/nieces' disappearance/murder.

Like I said, I'm not trying to be rude.. I guess i'm just confused as to where you're coming from.

I'm with ya!
 
Excellent, SFW!!! If Cindy keeps this up they will have to install a chamber pot in the courthouse witness stand for her. :innocent:

funny-1.gif
 
I understand what you are saying, but George doesn't seem to use laughter as a way to deal with stress. I don't think Lee gets the "laughter as a coping mechanism" from George.

During his interviews when George gets stressed, he seems to lash out, not laugh.

That is because it is personal for GA. He is not on the job and the crime scene is not one for which he would be able to detach himself. When it is that close to home, it's no joking matter, it's up close and personal for him. GA knows the truth. LA does not want the truth. CA would deny the truth if it bit her head off.
 
This is a little OT, but I think Lee has been between a " rock & a hard place" through this whole thing. I think he & his sister were really close, and like George, in the beginning, they just wanted to find Caylee/ get to the bottom of it all. Sooner, rather than later, it became abundantly clear, because of all the damning evidence, car smell, No Caylee & the knowledge that Casey was capable of some pretty horrible things, ( by their own admission) the Casey probably did something "unthinkable" to Caylee. Each for their own reasons, they all went into cover up mode, each for self preservation. Cindy is stuck with George, at least for now, or half of the house and all assets will be divided. neither of them have had a "real job" since July 17th 2008. I'm not making excuses for their outrageous behavior, and I bet they're in some ways still in shock over the fact thatnot only was the baby murdered, but by Casey, which they just can not accept on so many levels. Denial is the only way they can cope. I'm not going to touch cindy, we all know way more about her than we ever want to know. And of course now, it's really going to be about the $$$$. They can't bring Caylee back & Casey is done for, no matter what. A staff of 30 Psych Docs, nurses & therapists could spend the rest of their lives on this bunch. MOO of course. :)
 
But what did Tony offer to Lee for him to write down? Nothing basically. It was really sad to me seeing Lee desperate for information and TL obviously not caring one bit about any of it. If I'd been Lee, my blood would have run cold. I would have really been frightened seeing TL's cavalier attitude and noncommunication. Lee had incredibly good faith to go there to talk to TL in the first place, treating him like a friend and assuming he would also want to help find Caylee. He could see that TL didn't care at all. Then TL actually ridiculed him afterward, this young man worried to death to find his little niece. The only information I can remember Tony mentioning at all was reiterating how annoyed he had been picking Casey up at the Amscot and the part about his drug dealer in the complex (which made Lee slow down and become pensive and worried). When Lee went into that meeting with TL, he seemed to still be thinking (or at least convincing himself) that this was all some crazy Casey stunt or mix-up, and that Caylee was with some friend of hers. When he heard from TL about the drug dealer, he did pause and look worried and pensive, you could see he was worried Casey might have stolen money from the drug dealer or something, which could be a more serious situation than he'd allowed himself to consider up to that point. (Because TL had mentioned she'd said she had some money to get a new car or something? IIRC.) Lee does seem to laugh out of embarrassment regarding Casey, and out of nervousness, and I think also to be accomodating/deflect confrontation, for example, when the officers in the other interview are saying, I hope you don't mind me asking this question or making this face and Lee laughs and says no problem. It does sound like a nervous laugh and him trying to be cooperative. Not that there couldn't be some kind of pattern of exactly what kind of questions make him laugh. It's an interesting question.


bbm~ With all due respect I totally disagree with this statement in every way, shape, form or fashion.

Seagull, I have to imagine that TL was quite ...shall we say upset with KC at the time, so the cavalier attitude (that you apparently see) would be VERY understandable imho. I can't even begin to imagine what TL would have been thinking. What could he offer? He had only known KC a couple of months and could count on one hand the # of times he saw Caylee. Not to mention that he was finding out that EVERY single thing that KC had told him was a lie and that most likely just prior to him seeing her the night of the 16th KC had murdered her daughter!!! Think about the text that he sent back to KC after finding out about Caylee 'disappearing'. HE wanted to know WHERE she was and KC showed no concern except for the fact that if Caylee wasn't found...she would be in trouble. (can't remember exactly how it was worded, but I'm sure you know which quote I'm talking about) Not a word of concern for Caylee's well being..not from her anyway. She was worried only for herself and HE was the one asking questions about Caylee. There's something very wrong with that picture. :rolleyes:

You know I enjoy reading your posts, but can't for the life of me understand how you seem to search for reasons for others to be guilty, with no benefit of doubt despite the fact that as of yet we have seen absolutely nothing (imho) to point to anyone other than KC, but seem to find some reason to give KC a pass at every turn and benefit of doubt even in the face of the sum total of everything that we have learned. I know and appreciate that we all have differing opinions, but I have to say this confounds me. Maybe it's just me..:)
 
IMO, the A's haven't said very much that makes sense..."not ever"... lol. If we really wanted to challenge ourselves, we could start listening for information that DOES make sense!

:laugh:One thing is driving me crazy..... DEAD SQUIRRELS DON'T CRAWL!! It's also not common practice for a dead squirrel to come back to life, find his friend, crawl into a car engine, and then RE-die. And in my experience, live squirrels don't normally get together and decide to climb under the hood of a vehicle, either. I live in Arkansas, though, so maybe our squirrels aren't advanced enough to schedule their gatherings and make plans to rendevous inside of car engines.
LOL! I was going to say the exact same thing myself!
 
Excellent, SFW!!! If Cindy keeps this up they will have to install a chamber pot in the courthouse witness stand for her. :innocent:

Perhaps the courthouse lawn could use some organic fertilizer?
 
I agree.
Also, Cindy bringing up the "lanyard" makes me wonder if Casey didn'twant to high tail out and get it because if anyone took a close look at it, they could tell that it was a " fake" or home-made ID . . . after all we know she really did not work at Universal, just wantedt people to think that she did.

And in terms of LA' s speaking/laughing. None of them can put a complete thought together without a lot of hmmm's, duh's and absolutely's in it ... ( word salad as Brini would say). Anthony Speak : say a lot of BS which means nothing. :croc: ( They always have to have their minds working above what they say, to come up with the lies they need to use for whatever they're covering. ) Normal peeps can just talk. They need to concoct the lie while they are speaking . . can't be easy :loser: :furious: MOO of course!

It isn't easy. I recently saw a study on ID of brain function in chromic liars.

They actually use TWICE the number of neural plexi as normal people. That may be why they "overspeak."
 
I sometimes find it helpful to quiz myself, honestly, as to whether I have ever acted in a similar way to one of the characters involved in this matter..

Have I ever laughed inappropriately?

Yeah.. one time my little two year old nephew fell down the basement stairs.. and I laughed! .. not because I thought it was funny, but because I was scared out of my mind that he was hurt or dead. fortunatly not badly hurt, but I was so ashamed of myself for laughing about it, and I still feel really badly.. what must that little guy have thought of me? I rushed down the stairs to him, still laughing like a loon..when I found out he was okay, I started crying.. (sigh)

Helps me put this whole crazy laughing thing with LA into perspective. Maybe there is some sort of mis-wired switch in some people's brains that causes us to mix up our laugh response with our cry response under conditions of extreme stress.
 
Helps me put this whole crazy laughing thing with LA into perspective. Maybe there is some sort of mis-wired switch in some people's brains that causes us to mix up our laugh response with out cry response under conditions of extreme stress.

I do this at funerals. It is highly embarassing and don't think I don't realize for one minute that it is inappropriate. I have been to many therapists, and they all believe it is definitely subconscious.
 
But what did Tony offer to Lee for him to write down? Nothing basically. It was really sad to me seeing Lee desperate for information and TL obviously not caring one bit about any of it. If I'd been Lee, my blood would have run cold. I would have really been frightened seeing TL's cavalier attitude and noncommunication. Lee had incredibly good faith to go there to talk to TL in the first place, treating him like a friend and assuming he would also want to help find Caylee. He could see that TL didn't care at all. Then TL actually ridiculed him afterward, this young man worried to death to find his little niece. The only information I can remember Tony mentioning at all was reiterating how annoyed he had been picking Casey up at the Amscot and the part about his drug dealer in the complex (which made Lee slow down and become pensive and worried). When Lee went into that meeting with TL, he seemed to still be thinking (or at least convincing himself) that this was all some crazy Casey stunt or mix-up, and that Caylee was with some friend of hers. When he heard from TL about the drug dealer, he did pause and look worried and pensive, you could see he was worried Casey might have stolen money from the drug dealer or something, which could be a more serious situation than he'd allowed himself to consider up to that point. (Because TL had mentioned she'd said she had some money to get a new car or something? IIRC.) Lee does seem to laugh out of embarrassment regarding Casey, and out of nervousness, and I think also to be accomodating/deflect confrontation, for example, when the officers in the other interview are saying, I hope you don't mind me asking this question or making this face and Lee laughs and says no problem. It does sound like a nervous laugh and him trying to be cooperative. Not that there couldn't be some kind of pattern of exactly what kind of questions make him laugh. It's an interesting question.

BBM

Instead of just throwing out some blanket statements which can be read as nefarious innuendo, (or even rewriting taped history whether consciously or not), how about some specifics that led you to your opinions on this interaction? I don't think I'm alone in my understanding (or misunderstanding) of this post because I've read ahead a bit to some of the responses that challenge the ideas asserted herein. You use some pretty harsh language - 'blood run cold' etc. - but don't explain anything specific to justify how you came to believe these things about someone who was obviously cleared by LE and who, iirc, passed a poly which the entire A clan, including LA, refused.

TL was there aiding LE at the request of LE. There is no doubt he was encouraged to let LA talk without interruption as much as possible; SOP. A lot of us were surprised at just how much the heretofore seemingly closed-mouthed LA did open up and carry on when he thought he was in private with TL. And how did attempting to bait TL with discussion of KC's trampy, philandering ways and other boyfriends aid in LA's search for his niece?
 
I do this at funerals. It is highly embarassing and don't think I don't realize for one minute that it is inappropriate. I have been to many therapists, and they all believe it is definitely subconscious.

I wouldn't hold it against you no more than I hold it against LA or TMc. I've consciously laughed, or made the small not really amused sounding noises that are under discussion, at what may seem inappropriate times to others myself. It's a way of deflecting and trying to minimize something.

ETA: Just wanted to clarify --- some of LA's laughter I see as a nervous or deflecting type response but some of the laughter just seems WEIRD with all capital letters imo. A lot of LA's speech and behavior seems very calculated to me and those are the times I don't give him a pass on the giggles.
 
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