Dr. Phil w/George and Cindy Anthony Air Date 9/13 and 9/14 2011 Thead # 2

[PeteyGirl]

I've always felt that Cindy never really cared for Caylee. If she had, I don't see how she could have cleaned up the decomp in the trunk of Casey's car. If she had cared for Caylee she would never have thought it fine to leave her "shell" in the swampy woods. I would have fought tooth and nail to retrieve the body of one of my pets if it lay dead in a swamp.

I don't think she really cares for Casey either except where it shows a good light upon herself. Cindy always talked so sweetly to Casey, similar to how Casey talked to her friends. (Remember how Casey said, "Oh, honey, you know I love you," to her friend, Kristina, just before she said "calling you all was a waste.") In the same manner, Cindy, while in the midst of talking sweetly to Casey, she was constantly cutting her up, being passive aggressive. I got the impression, even in the letters Cindy sent Casey in jail that she was constantly telling her things she knew would hurt her.

This is another example of the truth of Cindy's relationship to Caylee. Caylee can be scrubbed away, if necessary, to protect CINDY.

I don't believe it's ever been about Cindy protecting Casey. It's been about Cindy protecting Cindy.

Casey doesn't even exist as a real person to Cindy.

I think the major difference between Cindy and Casey is that Cindy was raised by a normal parents. I'm sure Cindy's narcissistic/antisocial behavior was discouraged in a way that Casey's was encouraged (by Cindy).

And here we are . . . Caylee is dead, Casey is disappeared, and Cindy has the stage. This is her dream come true. That her granddaughter is dead, found rotting in a swamp, and her daughter the likely murderer were just the red carpet to her rightful place.

 

[twomanywords]

The more I hear them speak and hear their perspectives ..."LIES...", I feel that the computer searches for neckbreaking and household weapons were meant for a grown up in that house, not a toddler.

 

[twomanywords]

This is another example of the truth of Cindy's relationship to Caylee. Caylee can be scrubbed away, if necessary, to protect CINDY.

I don't believe it's ever been about Cindy protecting Casey. It's been about Cindy protecting Cindy.

Casey doesn't even exist as a real person to Cindy.

I think the major difference between Cindy and Casey is that Cindy was raised by a normal parents. I'm sure Cindy's narcissistic/antisocial behavior was discouraged in a way that Casey's was encouraged (by Cindy).

And here we are . . . Caylee is dead, Casey is disappeared, and Cindy has the stage. This is her dream come true. That her granddaughter is dead, found rotting in a swamp, and her daughter the likely murderer were just the red carpet to her rightful place.

Bolded by me. I wonder how "normal" her upbringing truly was.

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I didn't read previous posts and must tell y'all I DO NOT GIVE A CARP what they said in their interview. It means absolutely Nothing to me. KC killed that precious baby and it was NO accident. I am sick and tired of this. Now the parents of this monsta are trying to make money off of their daughter's deed.....

 

[BellaVita]

The depth of CA's love for Caylee is evident in how she's responded to Caylee's death and all the circumstances around it.

It's not hard to put together, a person doesn't need a crystal ball or a degree in psychotherapy to make a very informed guess.

People with CA's (and KC's) character disorder see other people as "objects" that exist to serve their needs. Caylee did not exist in her own right, to the Anthony's. If she did, their response to her loss would have been very different.I think this explains our fascination with the Anthony family. Beneath the surface, the Anthony's are bizarre and frightening.

The Anthony's behave, in my opinion, as if they lost a very valuable OBJECT. Like an heirloom, maybe. A precious possession. Even Jeffrey Dahmer treasured the contents of his refrigerator. There weren't PEOPLE in his refrigerator, they were HIS little things, they meant whatever bizarre and evil meanings to him, but had no value other than what he gave them, to meet HIS needs.

To me, the same thought process shows in the Anthony's, in a much less gruesome way. Caylee was a beautiful doll that existed to please them. I have no doubt Lee and KC were regarded in just the same way. Now she is gone and they feel entitled to exploit the public's sympathy (and money, please). I just want to throw up.

CA couldn't love Caylee, and is only behaving "naturally" according to her character. And Casey (imo) killed her because of the same dynamic. George (imo) has capitulated, surrendered, given up and lost himself a thousand years ago because it was "easier" to disappear, so he ain't much better in the integrity department.

This is just "my" gospel . . . but I believe the Anthony's illustrate human evil. Oblivious to reality outside of their own heads, disregard and blindness to what exists outside what they WANT to exist.

I don't think the Anthony's are in a stand alone category, this is how people end up dead all over the world. They don't "exist" to the person(s) responsible for their deaths. And the person(s) responsible are constitutionally incapable of behaving or relating in any other way than they do.

OMG! You are so right. I know a diagnosis is only possible by a qualified person but Cindy is a total narcissist, IMO. As a layperson, when reading formal criteria for this disorder, it is not so easy to apply that knowledge to real life. When you dig deeper and read stories of people with close relationships with Narcs, you truly come to understand what they are. Others are only useful if they perform a function. Once they no longer do that, they are useless. No one is valued on their merit as an individual. Yes, Caylee was only an object and the investigation and trial of Casey merely a huge inconvenience for the family. Their life was a train wreck before Caylee died and it still is. Nothing has changed except that the house is out of foreclosure, money is in the bank, don't have to work anymore and now they are paid to LIE, LIE, LIE. No doubt in my mind that Cindy feels it was all worth it. After all, Caylee's body was only a shell and she was going to heaven anyway.

I also believe Cindy is evil. Evil is not always a Dahmer or Bundy. Cindy's type of evil is far more dangerous.

 

[BellaVita]

Snipping this part...



I've met a lot of them. Even if I hadn't read enough on grief to know that spending money is something that many grieving people do, I've seen enough people do it in my own personal life that I know it's a reality. I just can't judge anybody who does that. One person sits and cries, another spends money or does other things.

They loved to spend money before Caylee died too. Their finances were a disaster at that time. Instead of buying so many THINGS, maybe Cindy could have hired a REAL babysitter which would have been money well-spent. But no, it was more important to keep Target in business. Well, now Caylee is gone and so are the financial problems. Every dark cloud has a silver lining and Cindy shops at finer department stores now. Just as the felon's behavior never changed for 31 days, neither has CA's changed for more than 3 years. Except now she buys higher-end clothing. Excessive spending is something CA was doing long before Caylee turned up missing. Don't see how it can be interperted as grieving as it has always been part of who she is. Personally, I would expect to see loss of interest in activities previously enjoyed if someone is grieving.

I know what the Grief Lady would say but I laughed all the way through her whole testimony. Except the part about the mother standing in the rain at her child's grave. Believing like I do-that CA knew for quite some time that Caylee was in the swamp and let her stay there-I will judge her and feel zero remorse for it.

 

[Intermezzo]

And don't forget the phone call to LA..your sister is in alot of trouble.
Very telling...and where was GA, the head of the household..at work with his head in the sand.

:seeya:
IMO
George was not the head of that household..that was Cindy..
Cindy said she would confide in Lee and lean on him for support...George, it seems, was left out of.
IIRC, in one of the docs Lee stated he and Casey would make fun of George, as a person and as a father...George was the odd man out.

 

[Intermezzo]

Remember when the felon was arrested and walked through the door with her hands cuffed and that #82 target shirt. Just before she walked through the door she was looking down but as soon as she came through the door and saw the cameras, that smile/smirk of defiance came to her face. I always thought she looked like this was all funny to her, like she thought she was in some kind of movie...:sick:

I remember that video vividly...
I was saddened to hear a local Orlando toddler was missing and then shocked to see her mother walk thru a door, hand cuffed...and no grief, no saddness...just a smirk at the camera.. Oh Wow, this is for me.
I believed then toddler Caylee Anthony was not missing because she was kidnapped, she was missing because her mother did something to her.

 

[Intermezzo]

I cannot forget Lee asking Casey, "Is this like the last time?"

WTH was that all about, I would like to know!

CA and GA both have said Caylee was never out of their home for more than a day until the 31 days. But they lie so easily that we do not know what statements might be true. Could Casey have taken Caylee away for days or weeks at a time prior to June 2008 but brought her back safely each time? Did both CA and GA tell themselves she would come home safely this time as well?

What other things had Casey done that her mother cleaned up for her? Did Cindy just automatically go into "fix things by cleaning up this mess" mode because she was used to doing this over the years?

bbm
Yes, I believe when Cindy found out or was confronted about Casey's wrongful deeds she did go into clean up mode...she would take care of it, she would fix it, she would then deal with Casey...no one else was to confront Casey..Cindy would take care of it all.

When Cindy found out Casey stole from her grandmother and stole money out of her grandfathers assissted living bank account it was Cindy who took care of that...she did get Casey to call her grandmother to apologize but Casey did not pay the monies back herself..Cindy took care of it.

:twocents:

 

[Intermezzo]

Well, if one is to go with this theory, if she were triple bagged perhaps they wouldn't know that the duct tape were there if OCA omitted that portion and they didn't open the bag.

When you go back and look at the jail house visit tapes, she was telling her family that she was trying to tell them where Caylee was but no one was listening, OR perhaps they were, her family was listening. She was throwing out clues for them. One was, She's close. Perhaps we should go back and listen to all the tapes again. I'm sure there's more clues that she gave them that we would now see as a clues being that we know now where her remains were found.

Yes, looking back now perhaps they were clues but I believed Casey was saying anything that would appease her family so they would back off and stop asking her questions about Caylee and her whereabouts.
:twocents: :seeya:

 

[LambChop]

:seeya:
IMO
George was not the head of that household..that was Cindy..
Cindy said she would confide in Lee and lean on him for support...George, it seems, was left out of.
IIRC, in one of the docs Lee stated he and Casey would make fun of George, as a person and as a father...George was the odd man out.

After being on the outs within this family dynamics what happened to Caylee suddenly brought GA back into the fold. Nothing like a tragedy to unite a family. LA said it himself at the memorial, "This family is united." At the trial it was clear KC was back on the let's make Dad the "odd man out", again trick. This may be why some truth from GA is emerging. He liked the past three years with CA and does not want KC back in the household where he will again get kicked to the curb. jmo

 

[Intermezzo]

If these *men* had stepped up to the plate this tragedy might not have happlened. I do believe that in that household the females ruled and the males just did their bidding, whatever it was. Some households are like that...governed by a matriarch rather than a patriarch.

I agree and you are right there are households where the matriarch rules.
I see that in my own extended family aunts and their female daughters are the top dogs in the family while the husband and brother are to do what they are told.

 

[coco puff]

I'm not sure how to answer, as words like 'integrity' and 'value system' and 'world view' aren't ones I used.

I do think there are many people who judge others by their behavior after a loss, but I'm not one of them. I've seen people do things and act in ways that are very different from their pre-loss behavior and standards, and I've seen people whose behaviors don't appear to change much, if at all.

If you experience the loss of a loved-one, you don't get a free pass to act any way you choose. We have seen too many good people lose their babies in the most horrific way possible and not approach the behavior of Cindy. Having your daughter kill your grandaughter does not make you a good person. You have to start out that way.

 

[strawberry]

I expect today's Dr. Phil to be CAs guano-craziest yet.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

I expect today's Dr. Phil to be CAs guano-craziest yet.

Yep, here's a sample: "In the final instalment of the first and only interview the Anthonys have given, they will look towards their future without their daughter or granddaughter and shockingly reveal that Casey may have another child.
Mrs Anthony said: 'Casey always wanted to be a mom, she was a good mom but something happened along the way. Until we find out what triggered that then I don't know that another pregnancy would trigger another incident.'"

(Much more at link. With thanks to okiedokietoo.)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...l-speak-daughter-again.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

 

[strawberry]

Yep, here's a sample: "In the final instalment of the first and only interview the Anthonys have given, they will look towards their future without their daughter or granddaughter and shockingly reveal that Casey may have another child.
Mrs Anthony said: 'Casey always wanted to be a mom, she was a good mom but something happened along the way. Until we find out what triggered that then I don't know that another pregnancy would trigger another incident.'"

(Much more at link.)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...l-speak-daughter-again.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

:crazy:

This baffles me too: "George Anthony will tell Dr Phil that though his wife Cindy might reconcile with their daughter, he will likely never speak to her again."

Bless GA if he could do it but I couldn't. If my spouse reconciled with my child who killed my grandchild, lied and strung me along, and made terrible accusations against me, it would be my daughter or my spouse. No way would I be able to live with someone who chose that over me. IMO

 

[cityslick]

I've always felt that Cindy never really cared for Caylee. If she had, I don't see how she could have cleaned up the decomp in the trunk of Casey's car. If she had cared for Caylee she would never have thought it fine to leave her "shell" in the swampy woods. I would have fought tooth and nail to retrieve the body of one of my pets if it lay dead in a swamp.

I don't think she really cares for Casey either except where it shows a good light upon herself. Cindy always talked so sweetly to Casey, similar to how Casey talked to her friends. (Remember how Casey said, "Oh, honey, you know I love you," to her friend, Kristina, just before she said "calling you all was a waste.") In the same manner, Cindy, while in the midst of talking sweetly to Casey, she was constantly cutting her up, being passive aggressive. I got the impression, even in the letters Cindy sent Casey in jail that she was constantly telling her things she knew would hurt her.

Did you think CA was 'acting' during trial when they were replaying the 911 calls?

It's very easy to judge how much one cares for another simply by what they see on tv. I'll just say I disagree with you and leave it at that.

 

[sumbunny]

Just as OCA did, Cindy cried the most when talking about her actions (ie-calling 9-11). Casey cried the most when the grief lady was talking about Casey.

It's just odd. IMO. I think todays episode of DrP. will be a bucket full of denial from CA.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Sometimes I feel after this long that hating the As has become a favorite pastime. I try not to get caught up in that but it is hard sometimes.

I try to look at the deeper issues and why things may be the way they are.

We talk about them being dysfunctional (some say the most dysfunctional family they have ever seen) but I believe there is always a root cause for that dysfunctional behavior.

I have read countless articles about what family members have to endure when living with a family member who is a cold unfeeling narcissistic psychopath and that alone makes the family dysfunctional and the ones who aren't narcissists become targets and are in survival mode everyday of their lives. I wanted to see if other families go through what I went through in my childhood growing up while living with one.

I realize now how lucky I was that I did not bring all that dysfunction into my own adult life but it sure left my mom with many issues having to deal with him for 41 years. To be quite honest she too become a 'yes' woman who never stood up for herself just like GA. Even though he was extremely abusive to me... in the end it made me a better person. I realize now if I had been the chosen child where he wanted me to be just like him then I could have turned out just like him (shudder) and I am the polar opposite. Cindy saw Casey and she saw herself all over again and she groomed and polished Casey to become just like her.

Now in this family, IMOO, the dysfunction is compounded by having not just one........but two narcissists living in the home to contend with on a daily basis. I cant even begin to imagine how hard that must be.

Wouldn't we be more shocked if they weren't dysfunctional?:waitasec:

We have a family here where the powerful narcissist rules the roost. Allowing only her daughter to have power because the daughter is just like the mother. Cindy knew it would then be all consuming and always about them.......and no one else.

Now Lee......well Lee knew early on that he was valued very little but he did realize the best way to survive his ordeal was to be for his mother and sister and against the main one they pushed off the back burner.

George had no purpose except to make Cindy appear to be a good wife to others who may see her outside of her home. He was to make sure the cars were shiny and clean and the lawn immaculate so that the As home seemed like the idyllic place to be from the outside. He was to be there if Cindy and Casey needed a gopher or a ready made babysitter for Caylee when Cindy and Casey had plans. And he was there only to be in agreement on everything Cindy said.

Just like abusers pick their victims imo narcissist marry those they know they can dominate and rule with an iron fist. After awhile like the abused spouse or child they begin to think their lives are normal. One only looks to control and the other one thinks the micro-managing every step they take is done out of love.

Narcissist are masters at manipulations especially when it comes to their own families. They blame you for their own wrongdoings and convince you that you are the one that is unworthy and it is a cruel mind game that often works. It is like years of brainwashing and they are excellent at it.

IMO

 

[watcher9]

If only Dr. Phil, Larry King, and the others could have read this thread before their interviews, they might have understood the dynamics of the A's and asked the real questions instead of pussyfooting around with their top of the morning questions.

Thanks to all of you for your insight into this demonic family.