For Those Who Do Think Avery was Framed & Evidence Planted - Discuss

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Mystic ~ she lost all credibility when she said it was clean and uncluttered LOL The bleach bottles on the cupboard was just a bonus in case we thought maybe, just maybe she was credible at all.... she proved she is not ;-) Unfortunately, some locals (and not locals) will hear that and go "seeeeeeeeee". We will have to wait to see if they are going to start talking to the media more... they being LE and the prosecution.
 
Mystic ~ she lost all credibility when she said it was clean and uncluttered LOL The bleach bottles on the cupboard was just a bonus in case we thought maybe, just maybe she was credible at all.... she proved she is not ;-) Unfortunately, some locals (and not locals) will hear that and go "seeeeeeeeee". We will have to wait to see if they are going to start talking to the media more... they being LE and the prosecution.
The Prosecution. We already have That Man talking up a storm, contradicting him self where ever he goes. I only want them to come out if they have changed their thoughts on the case. Not some quack lady who won't even admit her name and obviously lying through her shoes.
 
From your link:
[RH] A. The plan was to call the sheriff, or to call 911, or whatever number they had available to them, to get a hold of somebody.

[Buting] Q. So, did you give them any of those direct phone numbers?

A. I gave Pam -- Pam Sturm, I gave her Jerry Pagel's number that morning. The cell phone coverage out in that area is absolutely horrid. And to get a call out to -- most of the time when I used my phone out there, I only had 30 seconds or a minute to talk before your phone cut off on you. But I gave Pam that number, Jerry Pagel's number, that morning, with the intent that if she was going into the car lot and needed to call somebody quick, and get somebody out there, that would be the best way for her to.

Yet, on p85, he says:
Q. Okay. Before the morning of November 5th, had you ever been out to the Avery property?

A. The 5th, no.

Q. That Saturday morning?

A. No.

Q. So, before the vehicle was located, you had never been -- in your whole life, you had never been to that Avery property?

A. No.

Q. I mean, that's correct?

A. That is correct.

So... the question of the day? How would he know cell coverage was "absolutely horrid" if he'd never been there before the 5th? Recall, he claims that he gave Pam Sturm the map and phone, and SB gave her the camera, while they were at Ms. Halbach's residence.

Importantly, why didn't anyone call him on his "inconsistent" testimony?

I wouldn't make too much of this. I know the cell coverage in Abrams WI is terrible. Doesn't mean I've been to Abrams lately. He could have fished or hunted in the area and still have not been to the Avery property previously and knew from that--that the cell coverage was terrible. I've been to Manitowoc and Two Rivers, I know certain cell phone carrier coverage is bad in that area, I've never been to the Avery property.
 
I wouldn't make too much of this. I know the cell coverage in Abrams WI is terrible. Doesn't mean I've been to Abrams lately. He could have fished or hunted in the area and still have not been to the Avery property previously and knew from that--that the cell coverage was terrible. I've been to Manitowoc and Two Rivers, I know certain cell phone carrier coverage is bad in that area, I've never been to the Avery property.

I get that it could mean the general area, but they are specifically talking about the Salvage area... the area Pam was going to and he knew she was going there and he was concerned about her cell coverage? because he knew it was bad there? So concerned that he gave her Pagel's direct number in case she needed to call someone quickly? huh? LOL Remember... he didn't give anyone else his direct number.... I guess he wasn't concerned about anyone else and their cell phone coverage that was also in that general area? It all seems very convenient. IMO

ETA: copied from shadowraiths post....
[RH] A. The plan was to call the sheriff, or to call 911, or whatever number they had available to them, to get a hold of somebody.

Pam had Pagel's number... thanks to RH.
 
Well... this is new to me. Reading Earl Avery's testimony in the pre-trial motion. Someone else was in the Salvage Yard before Pam got there, about 45 minutes before.

Q. Um, tell us about that, you had someone come?
A. Yeah, I had -- At first I had two -- two people come. I don't know what time it was, but there was a man and a lady there that asked if they could take a ride through the yard, just to take a look. And I told them, go ahead, I'm more than willing to help you guys out.
Q. Did they give you anything to hang up in the office?
A. Yeah, they gave me a poster or something to hang up in the office. Actually, they asked me if they could hang it up and I said, yes.
Q. Okay. So they did, and they kind of asked if they could take a ride around?
A. Yes.

http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...2/Partial-Motion-Hearing-Part-1-2006Aug09.pdf

he goes on to say that after the RAV4 was found, he was "down there" (I think he means the crusher because that's where all the LE testified too being there IMO) and he couldn't see it, they had to point it out to him. He goes on to say that him and Fabian were there on the Wednesday/Thursday rabbit hunting and it wasn't there then.

BBM ...

If this is true, where was the RAV4 prior to Friday ? Anyone know what Fabian said ?
 
I get that it could mean the general area, but they are specifically talking about the Salvage area... the area Pam was going to and he knew she was going there and he was concerned about her cell coverage? because he knew it was bad there? So concerned that he gave her Pagel's direct number in case she needed to call someone quickly? huh? LOL Remember... he didn't give anyone else his direct number.... I guess he wasn't concerned about anyone else and their cell phone coverage that was also in that general area? It all seems very convenient. IMO

ETA: copied from shadowraiths post....
[RH] A. The plan was to call the sheriff, or to call 911, or whatever number they had available to them, to get a hold of somebody.

Pam had Pagel's number... thanks to RH.

What am I missing? He gave 2 WOMEN a phone number in case they got into trouble at the very place that TH was last seen. I would have done the same. I guess I wouldn't be as concerned about the others in the area because they either had a man with them for protection or were not going directly ON the property, thereby lessening the risk to their safety. Maybe I'm looking at that wrong, but that is what I would have done anyway. I don't know--last place TH seen, 2 women without protection of a male, SA prior criminal history known = more protection...no?
 
What am I missing? He gave 2 WOMEN a phone number in case they got into trouble at the very place that TH was last seen. I would have done the same. I guess I wouldn't be as concerned about the others in the area because they either had a man with them for protection or were not going directly ON the property, thereby lessening the risk to their safety. Maybe I'm looking at that wrong, but that is what I would have done anyway. I don't know--last place TH seen, 2 women without protection of a male, SA prior criminal history known = more protection...no?

BBM ...

Did LE actually know at that time that Avery Salvage was the last place TH was seen ?
 
BBM ...

If this is true, where was the RAV4 prior to Friday ? Anyone know what Fabian said ?

I think the man and the woman that was there prior to Pam was Mr. Beach (Beech) not sure of the spelling. He was TH's cousin.

Fabian doesn't talk at all about being down by the pit at all--he talks about being my SA's house and the burn barrel is smoking from whatever was being burned in there. I wish they would have asked him about being down there.
 
BBM ...

Did LE actually know at that time that Avery Salvage was the last place TH was seen ?

Ok, if this was my daughter and she was already missing 3 days, on her appointments she shows the Avery property as being her last stop, I along with her friends and others are forming a search party--Yes, I would think that something happened to her there. They would be suspect in my mine. So, if I thought that--I'm sure the rest of the search party thought that too...including RH.
 
ha ha!! I missed Missy's post about this subject also...
 
BBM ...

Did LE actually know at that time that Avery Salvage was the last place TH was seen ?

No, as the audio between Remiker and Weigart clearly show on Nov 4, before the RAV4 was "discovered", some in LE were looking at the Zipperer residence as her last stop. It also mentions TH being spotted taking a photograph of a cow on the side of the road somewhere later that afternoon. (around 4:45 mark in video)

The audio is on the second video shown. (around the 2:18 mark)

Edit: included more information.

http://stevenaverycase.com/phone-calls-between-investigators/#sthash.EdJQb71y.dpbs

 
David Beach stopped at the Salvage Yard on the Friday, the 4th. IIRC he even spoke to SA, and I don't think he went through the yard.

Earl said that a couple was there 45 minutes before Pam and her daughter, they were going to drive through the lot... he didn't know if they were still there and he didn't see them leave when Pam arrived.

Saturday morning, they did not know if the Avery lot was her last stop.

As for the going through there on the Wednesday or Thursday going rabbit hunting.... I have read tidbits here and there about it, in old news articles, and I think a video of Earl's wife at the time saying the same thing (and she doesn't like SA lol), but it was the first time I had seen it in court doc's.

BCA ~ we will have to agree to disagree on the fishiness of RH/Pam. ;-) Because I doubt either of us will change our thinking, and that's ok :)
 
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/making-murderers-steven-avery-given-7429287

"Making a Murderer's Steven Avery given 'freedom' court date as judge cracks down on prosecutor."

Take it with a grain of salt, but looks like things may be heating up soon.

There is a few new entries recorded on his case file.... not sure what they are, I see the clerk was granted an extension until March 2, and then the entries after that .... maybe the records being filed? I just can't see him getting out on bail lol

https://wcca.wicourts.gov/courtReco...et=12&linkOnlyToForm=false&sortDirection=DESC
 
So... the question of the day? How would he know cell coverage was "absolutely horrid" if he'd never been there before the 5th? Recall, he claims that he gave Pam Sturm the map and phone, and SB gave her the camera, while they were at Ms. Halbach's residence.

Importantly, why didn't anyone call him on his "inconsistent" testimony?

It's not inconsistent at all. You can be in an 'area' of coverage and not be on a particular person's property. Cell areas cover more than just the 40 acres of Avery property. You could be a mile or 2 away or even more, still on the same tower, still in "the area,", and get horrible service and report it as such. And it doesn't require you to be standing on Avery property to know your cell service is wonky. So, it's not a lie to say "cell service is horrible in that 'area' " and also say, "no I had never been on the Avery Salvage Yard Property before."
 
If some in LE were looking at Zipperer as being her last stop that day then they weren't *only* focused on Avery...they were attempting to track TH's movements against a timeline, which is exactly what they should have been doing. Had they ignored all her other appointments and not bothered to see where she was going or had appointments, that would have been zeroing in on 1 and only 1 person or on only 1 place. And that didn't happen in the beginning stages.
 
http://www.postcrescent.com/story/n...2/23/avery-stood-become-millionaire/80452202/

"In the fall of 2005, Steven Avery was on track to join the exclusive millionaire's club of Manitowoc County through a most unconventional route — a DNA exoneration....While $30 million-plus was basically a pipe dream, Avery still was in line to become a rich man. DNA exonerees who pursue a civil lawsuit tend to receive about $483,000 for every year of wrongful incarceration, according to a comprehensive Innocence Project study. For Avery, that translates into a wrongful conviction payment of at least $8.7 million."

To SA, that money would have probably been life-changing. If Zellner is able to exonerate him, once again, I can see the it being a much bigger price tag this time around. The justice I would like to see even more, is for the people responsible behind that joke of an investigation and trials to finally have to answer for their wrong-doings and be held accountable. I also hope that this will set a precedence for the rest of the country, where this kind of shenanigans go on everyday and I read about more and more in the news, so that the system can be fixed so that TRUE justice is seen for ALL victims, and not just the ones with power and money behind them.
 
Page 145 line 5 .. Read ..
Answer in line 9 - got the number from Weigert to call Niocole..

Question- how did Weigert get that number? Lost here :/
 
Page 145 line 5 .. Read ..
Answer in line 9 - got the number from Weigert to call Niocole..

Question- how did Weigert get that number? Lost here :/

I'm not sure I have read that yet, but when Pam called Pagel and Wiegert.... she gave him Nikole's cell number. The call is somewhere online, or in the trial transcripts in Pam's testimony.
 
It looks like the state and media are back to using the tried and true method of demonizing SA in the media once again in preparation of him possibly getting a new trial. There's Kratz out there everywhere he can find spouting off about all the "evidence" that possibly wasn't used in the original one. He promises his book, (which will be coming out in June) is going to explain it all. Uh huh. :rolleyes:

http://www.************.au/interview-with-ken-kratz/

Now we have the new complaint forms from prison trying to say that SA makes violent threats, yet the accuser is the one who actually tells prison officials, "I wanna kill this guy!" (that scares me as I have been worried that something may happen to SA while in prison, because of how high-profile this all has become). It's ironic to me that the accuser is the one making violent threats, while all SA seems to want to do is stay in his cell. I don't blame him for not wanting to mingle with the population, seems its probably safer that way. IMO. :jail:

http://www.nbc26.com/news/prison-re...tes-concerned-about-averys-violent-tendencies

http://www.tmj4.com/news/local-news/prison-records-reveal-glimpse-into-steven-averys-life-in-prison

Finally, there's FOX6 with their ridiculous interview of the deputy that was in SA's spotless pristine trailer with all the bleach bottles in full view (of course, no pics or video of that, conveniently). :liar:

http://fox6now.com/2016/02/23/she-w...estigation-what-she-saw-thats-stuck-with-her/


I don't understand why they cannot see how truly ridiculous and desperate this all seems, like people haven't researched for themselves the TRUE facts of the case. Not to mention, you would think that they would realize that SA now has an attorney such as KZ who is going to immensely enjoy shooting down all of these points they are trying to make. Anyway, this is all just my :twocents: on the situation. :)

Edit: Not sure why the first source isn't showing up, but it can be found by googling probably ;)
 
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