GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam Co, 2 May 2014 - #13

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Valiant said:
These type of places sell buyers on the concept of security but as many posts above point out they aren’t really as secure as many residents think.
In the community I lived in, some people acted like we were 100% secured away from the “locals” outside the gates.
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I recall in the Sheriff's interviews he always said it was a zero crime rate community, they'd never had any burglaries in a couple decades. This is one reason why he believes it wasn't random, but that the couple were targeted. The security might deter a random criminal who could find other places with less risk of getting caught. However, the security wouldn't defeat someone who was determined, and then there was no security whatever from a boat.

JMO
 
Cedars said:
I recall in the Sheriff's interviews he always said it was a zero crime rate community, they'd never had any burglaries in a couple decades. This is one reason why he believes it wasn't random, but that the couple were targeted. The security might deter a random criminal who could find other places with less risk of getting caught. However, the security wouldn't defeat someone who was determined, and then there was no security whatever from a boat.

JMO
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Interestingly the community I lived in claimed to be crime free as well (in north Georgia) but after I moved in I found there was some property crime (usually a contractors employees) and a murder (love triangle, resident murdered by non-resident). Crime finds a way in
 
Valiant said:
These type of places sell buyers on the concept of security but as many posts above point out they aren’t really as secure as many residents think.
In the community I lived in, some people acted like we were 100% secured away from the “locals” outside the gates.
Click to expand...
For sure this place was not that secure. The guard gate does not even have a bar. It does not look like the people in the guard shack have a very good view to the inside of cars. As they seem a little bit removed there. And who knows how well they pay attention, you know, all the time.

Plus they are probably less secure than a regular subdivision. Because of all the new people going in there for the golfing, Marina, cottages, and whatever else they got there. Once they get in there, they're in a very isolated place with a bunch of rich people. That's less secure than a normal place, having normal traffic go by.

--- by the way I was looking around on Google maps to see if someone could drive in from the sides. And no, they seem to have that pretty well organized, there's trees and wire fences in front of any close connections. At least the ones I've seen so far. I haven't seen them all, so maybe there's a way in some of the other ones, I don't know. Because there's a couple Google maps don't show you.

- anyway, no one liked my guard shack pictures lol. Maybe they think it's not real or something. Just to explain, I got this from Google maps off the main road. They don't let you go in the subdivision, but you can look into it, from a distance. So that's what I got. And then I turned up the contrast and color etc, on the picture, so that you can see it better. So that's why it might look a little bit more colorful than usual, lol.
 
Cedars said:
I recall in the Sheriff's interviews he always said it was a zero crime rate community, they'd never had any burglaries in a couple decades. This is one reason why he believes it wasn't random, but that the couple were targeted. The security might deter a random criminal who could find other places with less risk of getting caught. However, the security wouldn't defeat someone who was determined, and then there was no security whatever from a boat.

JMO
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Yes I agree, a random criminal probably would not go for it. But a determined criminal would find a way. A determined criminal might even find it a challenge.
 
So FYI, when reading over some of the old comments, I read something very interesting. Were you all aware, that the female realtor who had listed the house right across the little bay there, was found drowned at her house at nearby Lake Sinclair, just a few days later? She was waiting out on her back dock, dressed with her purse, during the day, and then apparently they found her in the 7 ft of water there. If that is not suspicious, I don't know what is.
 
concernedcitizen706 said:
So FYI, when reading over some of the old comments, I read something very interesting. Were you all aware, that the female realtor who had listed the house right across the little bay there, was found drowned at her house at nearby Lake Sinclair, just a few days later? She was waiting out on her back dock, dressed with her purse, during the day, and then apparently they found her in the 7 ft of water there. If that is not suspicious, I don't know what is.
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Hmmm, interesting..
May 12, 2014
The body of a central Georgia real estate agent was pulled from the water not far from her dock in Putnam County Thursday night.WGXA has learned 50-year-old Vicki Stephens was found in Lake Sinclair in about 7 feet of water. Her belongings were still on the dock.
 
dotr said:
Hmmm, interesting..
May 12, 2014
The body of a central Georgia real estate agent was pulled from the water not far from her dock in Putnam County Thursday night.WGXA has learned 50-year-old Vicki Stephens was found in Lake Sinclair in about 7 feet of water. Her belongings were still on the dock.
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Yes that is such a crazy coincidence. Here's a theory for the heck of it. The perp befriended this female realtor by Lake Sinclair. She brought him in there to Reynolds with her car several times. Just to show him around, while she did her realtor errands there. The guard got a look at him and also then got familiar with him. He stole her Reynolds sticker. He did the crime. He killed her after, so she was not a witness.
 
fwiw, rbbm

1724073324031.png​

''Interpreting the Violent Crime Maps​

When looking at the violent crime map for Putnam County, remember that the rate of violent crime per resident may appear inflated when people visit the area during the day, but do not live there. For example, there are more retail establishments in the northeast part of the county. Many crimes are committed in retail areas in blocks where few people live. Red areas on the violent crime rate map do not always indicate danger for Putnam County residents who live there.
​
More issues arise with places like airports, parks, and schools. Major airports, of which Putnam County has 0, always look like high-crime locations due to the large number of people and the low population nearby. Parks and designated recreational areas, of which Putnam County has 2, have the same problem. Of Putnam County’s 22,047 residents, few live near recreational areas. Because many people visit, crime rates may appear higher even for safe parks. Ultimately crime happens where people are, whether they live there or not. Before writing off an area as unsafe, look at both the crime rate and total crime maps, then consider nearby destinations that people may be visiting.''
 
dotr said:
fwiw, rbbm

View attachment 525570​

''Interpreting the Violent Crime Maps​

When looking at the violent crime map for Putnam County, remember that the rate of violent crime per resident may appear inflated when people visit the area during the day, but do not live there. For example, there are more retail establishments in the northeast part of the county. Many crimes are committed in retail areas in blocks where few people live. Red areas on the violent crime rate map do not always indicate danger for Putnam County residents who live there.
​
More issues arise with places like airports, parks, and schools. Major airports, of which Putnam County has 0, always look like high-crime locations due to the large number of people and the low population nearby. Parks and designated recreational areas, of which Putnam County has 2, have the same problem. Of Putnam County’s 22,047 residents, few live near recreational areas. Because many people visit, crime rates may appear higher even for safe parks. Ultimately crime happens where people are, whether they live there or not. Before writing off an area as unsafe, look at both the crime rate and total crime maps, then consider nearby destinations that people may be visiting.''
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Well Putnam looks fairly orange for being out in the middle of nowhere.
 
I tried to look up the autopsy report results of realtor Vicky Stevens who died, but I didn't see anything. So I suppose it was ruled accidental. But how did they do that? Did they have a toxicology report come back? Did she have a stroke or heart attack etc? Or do they think she just fell in the water and drowned. I mean that's kind of what it sounds like, because no one said otherwise. So how likely is that, that that happened. Someone could have zip tied her hands and thrown her head in the water. Then took them off.

Also I looked around in Georgia for some similar cases to this before. And I also heard about a couple things in Florida that got my interest as well. Because there was a couple cases in Florida that seemed a little similar in some elements too. I might look into that more later.
 
Here's kind of an interesting link. A murder of a woman in 2002 in Athens GA, by a teen, was linked to that weird religious cult that is based in Putnam county.

"2002 Athens cold case solved through evidence found on newspaper" 2002 Athens cold case solved through evidence found on newspaper

"Laroche was 16 years old in 2002 and attending Clarke Central High School. He lived with an older sister and had a part-time job at a Winn Dixie in Homewood Hills.

He was born in Brooklyn, N.Y., where his family were members of the Nuwaubian Nation, a controversial religious cult, according to the police reports. The family later moved to Georgia to live at the infamous Nuwaubian Pyramids in Putnam County."

16 is really young to commit that murder. Also I wonder who the aspiring musician was, who got the reading.
 
So no match on the DNA yet? The question is, are police going to test the right people. For example, they may have already been told of a good suspect, but because of his long running connections working with law enforcement, they will never dare to test him in a million years. So I suspect this case will not be solved for a long time. Because police will not look in the right direction. And that leaves the suspect free to go on committing more crimes sadly. Secure in the knowledge that his DNA will never be tested.
 
concernedcitizen706 said:
So no match on the DNA yet? The question is, are police going to test the right people. For example, they may have already been told of a good suspect, but because of his long running connections working with law enforcement, they will never dare to test him in a million years. So I suspect this case will not be solved for a long time. Because police will not look in the right direction. And that leaves the suspect free to go on committing more crimes sadly. Secure in the knowledge that his DNA will never be tested.
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If no matches, hopefully they will try genetic genealogy--it is a proven method when no matches are initially found!
 
concernedcitizen706 said:
Here's kind of an interesting link. A murder of a woman in 2002 in Athens GA, by a teen, was linked to that weird religious cult that is based in Putnam county.

"2002 Athens cold case solved through evidence found on newspaper" 2002 Athens cold case solved through evidence found on newspaper

"Laroche was 16 years old in 2002 and attending Clarke Central High School. He lived with an older sister and had a part-time job at a Winn Dixie in Homewood Hills.

He was born in Brooklyn, N.Y., where his family were members of the Nuwaubian Nation, a controversial religious cult, according to the police reports. The family later moved to Georgia to live at the infamous Nuwaubian Pyramids in Putnam County."

16 is really young to commit that murder. Also I wonder who the aspiring musician was, who got the reading.
Click to expand...
One of WS esteemed members, "Red"Fox" ?? (Who is deceased) firmly believed the Nuwaibian Cult was involved in the murders.
His theory was this was the Cult's way of getting back at the Sheriff ; creating a murder that could not be solved. An independent thread was created on WS featuring the Nuwaibian Cult. It may be worth your time to research it.
 
Cedars said:
I recall in the Sheriff's interviews he always said it was a zero crime rate community, they'd never had any burglaries in a couple decades. This is one reason why he believes it wasn't random, but that the couple were targeted. The security might deter a random criminal who could find other places with less risk of getting caught. However, the security wouldn't defeat someone who was determined, and then there was no security whatever from a boat.

JMO
Click to expand...
There's not a place on earth where people live that has a zero crime rate.

I just hope this can be solved.
 
airportwoman said:
There's not a place on earth where people live that has a zero crime rate.

I just hope this can be solved.
Click to expand...
Well I believe the perp came across this couple and was specifically looking for the attributes there. Such as an isolated place with an older couple. To live out his ideas. He wanted a place where he could spend time there.
 
Razz said:
One of WS esteemed members, "Red"Fox" ?? (Who is deceased) firmly believed the Nuwaibian Cult was involved in the murders.
His theory was this was the Cult's way of getting back at the Sheriff ; creating a murder that could not be solved. An independent thread was created on WS featuring the Nuwaibian Cult. It may be worth your time to research it.
Click to expand...
Yeah I hope the sheriff doesn't get too caught up on that. I doubt it's them.

I think it may have more to do with the clubs there or neighbors. Someone got in that place and spotted them.

I'd be curious what cars the guard saw coming in that night. And what view they had to driver.
 
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