Found Deceased Greece - Dr. Suzanne Eaton, 60, American, gone for a run, Crete, 2 Jul 2019 *ARREST*

[CityDancer]

I second this as well.

I second it too.

 

[otto]

I doubt it. My guess is that she was simply a convenient target in the right place during a time that felt "right" for the attacker.

Likewise, I don't know how many women in rural Greece jog alone in exersize clothes on roads. I do know that in arch rival Turkey, it was very rare as it invited attention (not necessarily murder- just persistent Romeos making assumptions). Greece, however, maybe different.

@Patrick Jane, any input regarding rural Greece and frequency of local women jogging women is welcome.

Well said. In all probability, the interest in metal bands and bunkers just follows the macho interests that a lot of such murderers gravitate towards. Politics associated with such things are not usually on the radar. Rather, they are attracted to the "hard core", macho, and dangerous "bad a...." association. ​

Greece has changed in the last 50 years, along with all European countries, but in 1970 women were expected to cover up arms, long skirts were okay, shorts were frowned upon, and cut offs with short sleeves were out. As a strict religious country, clothing could be perceived as hooker. Women should be in before dark, and they should not drink. Men should also not drink, but if men are out after dark and there are drunk women, perception was that normal family values don't apply. It is a romeo culture, men sometimes think that if a woman is without an escort, she is available for their fun.

Bikini women on Crete beaches is nothing new. Those same women hike, cliff dive and thrive on Crete. Jogging must also be popular in the last 20 years, so I don't see that a 60 year old jogging woman could be a problem for local men - suddenly excited that a 60 year old is running. However, this 27 year old suspect is different. He likes to hurt running 60 year olds.

The suspect is a dark character, embracing a lifestyle where he is superior to others (e.g.: banned record cover). Maybe he was part of some underground group where he ventured online about the bunker on or near his property, and boom, he was recruited by neonazi music culture. It's a bit odd that a Crete farmer has such abnormal thinking - treating joggers like scoring points in a video game. Is that his ruse, he is not guilty because he flash-backed to a video game while driving and thought he was scoring point by knocking down and running over joggers, bonus points for rape and the nazi cave? What happened here?

 

[Handsome Sailor]

Greece has changed in the last 50 years, along with all European countries, but in 1970 women were expected to cover up arms, long skirts were okay, shorts were frowned upon, and cut offs with short sleeves were out. As a strict religious country, clothing could be perceived as hooker. Women should be in before dark, and they should not drink. Men should also not drink, but if men are out after dark and there are drunk women, perception was that normal family values don't apply. It is a romeo culture, men sometimes think that if a woman is without an escort, she is available for their fun.

Bikini women on Crete beaches is nothing new. Those same women hike, cliff dive and thrive on Crete. Jogging must also be popular in the last 20 years, so I don't see that a 60 year old jogging woman could be a problem for local men - suddenly excited that a 60 year old is running. However, this 27 year old suspect is different. He likes to hurt running 60 year olds.

The suspect is a dark character, embracing a lifestyle where he is superior to others (e.g.: banned record cover). Maybe he was part of some underground group where he ventured online about the bunker on or near his property, and boom, he was recruited by neonazi music culture. It's a bit odd that a Crete farmer has such abnormal thinking - treating joggers like scoring points in a video game. Is that his ruse, he is not guilty because he flash-backed to a video game while driving and thought he was scoring point by knocking down and running over joggers, bonus points for rape and the nazi cave? What happened here?

Otto - that's pure gold. No BS. You cut to chase. Keep the analysis coming.

 

[Handsome Sailor]

(my opinion only)

If you were to phrase it "why would a Greek perp select a tourist as a target instead of a Greek?", then here's my speculation:

killing a Greek woman is too high-risk for a perp like this

If a Greek perp killed a Greek woman vs a random tourist, then it's a guarantee (in usual circumstances) that the amount of "heat" on him would be much higher. However, in this case, the perp (seemingly unknowingly) selected a target who (due to her job and status) was very high profile and not just "some tourist", and this brought the perp much more heat than he was ever expecting.

If a Greek perp killed a Greek woman, there would be intense local outrage. (note of caution: I'm not saying that there isn't intense local outrage on this case. I'm saying in the perp's mind he was trying to avoid intense local outrage).

On Crete if a Cretan perp killed a Cretan woman he'd not only have to worry about the police, he'd have to worry about the Cretan woman's entire family and extended family which might be coming for him to seek revenge. The Cretan vendetta is not as prominent as it once was, but it still exists. There's a good chance he'd be killed if he ever got out of prison. At a minimum he'd be looking over his shoulder the rest of his life.

A Greek perp like this would never know which Greek woman (he randomly targeted) he killed. Did he just kill someone from a family that has a lot of brothers? A lot of brothers who are going to come after me and kill me because I just killed their only sister? Did he just kill someone who has criminal connections? Some Greek girl from a family that doesn't give a damn about the police and is going to get revenge on him?

In support of my theory, the Cyprus SK targeted exclusively foreign women and their children.

So, your idea here is that, if Yiannis had chosen a Greek woman, he would feel not just guilt but shame, but that if he chose a foreigner, there would be guilt but no shame. Interesting...

 

[Patrick Jane]

So, your idea here is that, if Yiannis had chosen a Greek woman, he would feel not just guilt but shame, but that if he chose a foreigner, there would be guilt but no shame. Interesting...

That's not what I said at all.

I'm saying that the perp is interested in self-preservation.

MOO

 

[CityDancer]

Greece has changed in the last 50 years, along with all European countries, but in 1970 women were expected to cover up arms, long skirts were okay, shorts were frowned upon, and cut offs with short sleeves were out. As a strict religious country, clothing could be perceived as hooker. Women should be in before dark, and they should not drink. Men should also not drink, but if men are out after dark and there are drunk women, perception was that normal family values don't apply. It is a romeo culture, men sometimes think that if a woman is without an escort, she is available for their fun.

My mum grew up in the late sixties, and women dressed in normal 60s girls clothes, short skirts and shirts, in the summer they wore bikinis, they went out partying and drank lightly, the same way men did. Drinking is big in Greece but it's social drinking, this article here explains it well: Drinking in Greece • Greek Landscapes

Though the culture of the sixties (music, clothes, etc.) was going strong til 1967, it stopped abruptly because of the military junta in 1967, and resumed after 1974 when the junta collapsed. Women have been pretty liberated til then, though religion means there's still a gap between the cities and the rural areas. Rural areas are more religious. In essence, we're a lot like Italy and Spain, though these countries are Catholic and we are Orthodox. There is machismo and a romeo culture all over the Mediterranean but it's fading fast among younger generations.

The last part of what you say, the underground culture, is big in Greece as it is all over the world atm as a result of video game culture and the internet pushing all kinds of "edginess". Take a look at this guy's favourite channels on YouTube: the paranormal, weapons, games. It's the Zeitgeist, unfortunately. A topic worthy of attention all over the world IMHO.

 

[otto]

I think the term "toxic masculinity" that another member mentioned a few posts back, is key here.

ETA: and it is, as we all know, not a regional or political problem but global.

MOO.

I think so too, but I'm not convinced that it's a new idea.

 

[Handsome Sailor]

The ear was not so much a "souvenir" as a "trophy" .

 

[Handsome Sailor]

That's not what I said at all.

I'm saying that the perp is interested in self-preservation.

MOO

Au contraire, my friend, the operative world view for Yiannis is THANATOS

 

[CityDancer]

Στο λάθος μέρος, τη λάθος ώρα, η άτυχη Sue - "Θα το έκανα σε όποια κι αν βρισκόταν μπροστά μου" | Cretalive

"I would have done it [to] no matter whom would happen to be there in front of me that very moment". Traces of blood were found at the abduction spot.

 

[otto]

Crete was poor up to the mid-70s but the situation has changed dramatically. They make and export goods that are valued highly in the international market (olives, olive oil, wines, liquor, pharmaceutical herbs) and in the past 3-4 decades this has really taken off the charts. Also, tourism has exploded. So a lot of money has been made. The perp is said to come from a rich local family, one of the richest in the region. They are also saying he's the son of a priest. I guess we'll hear more today and in the days to come.

I would guess his motive to be typical machismo accompanied by hatred for his mother and mother figures in general. His speech is very strange: he sounds almost retarded, his tone of voice is almost that of a little boy. This was the first thing that struck me about him. That's not what a grown man is supposed to sound like.

As re: jogging, it's true that in the islands local women rarely want to be seen exercising in public, especially on their own. Some of them, mostly aged 30 or younger, may go to gyms, dance schools and do sports. But I wouldn't expect to see a local woman exercising out on her own on one of the islands. The situation is completely different in Athens and the big cities.

Thank you. With all the big hotels since the 1970s, I would expect nothing less. It sounds possible that he grew up with privilege and not enough common sense or guidance - perhaps too much time to explore WW2 bunkers and familial history. I understand being more reserved in some places and Athens is probably ahead of a place like Crete, the farthest Island from mainland Greece.

He obviously has a psychological problem with women, especially older women, but that is not a real "psychological problem" that can be resolved with a psychologist. His problems are so deep seated in his personality that he will never recover from sexual attraction to older women and harming them because of his deviance.

 

[otto]

My mum grew up in the late sixties, and women dressed in normal 60s girls clothes, short skirts and shirts, in the summer they wore bikinis, they went out partying and drank lightly, the same way men did. Drinking is big in Greece but it's social drinking, this article here explains it well: Drinking in Greece • Greek Landscapes

Though the culture of the sixties (music, clothes, etc.) was going strong til 1967, it stopped abruptly because of the military junta in 1967, and resumed after 1974 when the junta collapsed. Women have been pretty liberated til then, though religion means there's still a gap between the cities and the rural areas. Rural areas are more religious. In essence, we're a lot like Italy and Spain, though these countries are Catholic and we are Orthodox. There is machismo and a romeo culture all over the Mediterranean but it's fading fast among younger generations.

The last part of what you say, the underground culture, is big in Greece as it is all over the world atm as a result of video game culture and the internet pushing all kinds of "edginess". Take a look at this guy's favourite channels on YouTube: the paranormal, weapons, games. It's the Zeitgeist, unfortunately. A topic worthy of attention all over the world IMHO.

Georgie Girl gogo skirts and Greek culture were not on the same wavelength in the 1970s. The world was not yet one big unified culture. The women's revolution was inspired by the birth control pill, freedom from forced birthing and trappings. The machismo has always been there, but isn't there also a gentleman behind most of the machismo? Typically, that's how it works when family values are at play?

The suspect seems to be missing the "family values" piece. If this is a larger global or regional problem, that would suggest that family values have been lost in the newest generation.

When video game culture became a thing, the reference was *advertiser censored* magazines. It was proven that *advertiser censored* magazines do not inspire sexual assault or murder, and expanded to include that video games do not inspire violence. In this case, I do wonder if the farmer went online to brag about his bunker, and attracted the wrong attention, or perhaps the attention he wanted. Maybe his family ancestors in the 1940s were collaborators ... who knows.

 

[otto]

The ear was not so much a "souvenir" as a "trophy" .

Where is it? Which ear? Initial reports used the word "cut."

 

[otto]

Au contraire, my friend, the operative world view for Yiannis is THANATOS

Why the name change from Yiannis to Thanatos?

 

[Handsome Sailor]

Why the name change from Yiannis to Thanatos?

"Death Wish"

 

[CityDancer]

Why the name change from Yiannis to Thanatos?

Source for a name change?

 

[otto]

The Greeks don't mince words

"She had the fatal misfortune to finding herself in the wrong place at the wrong time. The unfortunate American biologist crossed paths with the 27-year-old alleged confessor of her shameful assassination.

The creepy details about how he hit her with his car, put her in the trunk and kept her silent, hitting her and causing her final fatal death shock."
​

Στο λάθος μέρος, τη λάθος ώρα, η άτυχη Sue - "Θα το έκανα σε όποια κι αν βρισκόταν μπροστά μου" | Cretalive

 

[Handsome Sailor]

The Greeks don't mince words

"She had the fatal misfortune to finding herself in the wrong place at the wrong time. The unfortunate American biologist crossed paths with the 27-year-old alleged confessor of her shameful assassination.

The creepy details about how he hit her with his car, put her in the trunk and kept her silent, hitting her and causing her final fatal death shock."
​

Στο λάθος μέρος, τη λάθος ώρα, η άτυχη Sue - "Θα το έκανα σε όποια κι αν βρισκόταν μπροστά μου" | Cretalive

I don't like that first line. Makes the murder sound impromptu. Whereas I believe (MOO) that he stalked Dr. Eaton. Surveilled her. There was premeditation. And I wouldn't believe a word he has said so far to explain his crime.

 

[otto]

I don't like that first line. Makes the murder sound impromptu. Whereas I believe (MOO) that he stalked Dr. Eaton. Surveilled her. There was premeditation. And I wouldn't believe a word he has said so far to explain his crime.

Wrong place at the wrong time does not mean that the predator saw a woman and suddenly had the idea to abduct and murder her. It means that someone who had already decided to abduct and murder a woman saw her first.

I think he is omitting information, he didn't have a plan to murder Dr Suzanne Eaton when he woke up that morning. There's absolutely nothing about her that would justify that line of thinking.

Did he wake up that morning and decided to run over Dr Suzanne Eaton, or to look for an easy victim? <modsnip - stating opinion as fact> What was he doing in Afrata? If he wasn't there for work during siesta, was he looking around for something else?

 

[otto]

BBM. I don't think we can conclude that he's attracted to grandmothers. It's not like he had a choice between young and old on that road that day. IMO he planned to attack a woman. SE's age might not have been obvious to him. Also, maybe he figured that an older woman would have less strength to put up resistance.

<modsnip - not victim friendly>

He always had a choice. He chose Dr Suzanne Eaton. If she was still kicking after being hit and run over by a car twice, he had a choice to stop inflicting wounds that are her stabbing defensive wounds.

He had a choice between choosing a victim and choosing his preferred victim. We can only assume that he chose his preferred victim, and not someone his age.