Ground Searches & communication from LE: UPDATES

[stilettos]

Huh?


If the family didn't know about that search ahead of time, it was cruel of LE to not inform them and allow them to find out via the media. However, I don't think that Ron's attorneys feel the need to issue a press release every time there is a "rumor" about the family. Otherwise they'd be pretty busy.

++++++++++++++++++++


Back on topic -- I read a few articles that mention TIPS and that is why the Griffis property was searched. That is what I believe happened. No other reason - not because LE wanted to help Crystal's family stop rumors. Kim originally came to help Crystal with the media. (There are articles that state this). I believe that is exactly what happened yesterday. There was a search of the property that Crystal and her mother live on - and Kim did her best to put a spin on it that presented them in the best light possible. MOO.

LE is not going to spend that much money to stop rumors. That is just ridiculous, IMO. I cannot imagine the uproar if Ron or his family suggested LE help him "stop rumors". I wish I knew the cost of yesterday's search. I bet it was very costly. If Crystal and Marie wanted to stop rumors, did they fund the search themselves?

Did we ever find out who's property was the other one searched? The maternal great-grandfather?

I am saying that the Cummings family and/or their spokesperson would find your theory convenient to their cause. I am further stating that I believe that Ronald L. Cummings was aware during this search and the previous one that not one shred of evidence of HaLeigh would be found. BECAUSE I BELIEVE HE KNOWS WHERE EVIDENCE WOULD BE FOUND.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I am saying that the Cummings family and/or their spokesperson would find your theory convenient to their cause. I am further stating that I believe that Ronald L. Cummings was aware during this search and the previous one that not one shred of evidence of HaLeigh would be found. BECAUSE I BELIEVE HE KNOWS WHERE EVIDENCE WOULD BE FOUND.

Hopefully, "convenient to their cause" means finding Haleigh. I would assume LE DID notify Ronald of the search at the same time they notified the Sheffield/Griffis family and if they did not...it does point to preferrential treatment to the other family.

For the Cummings family not to make a statement is in good taste, IMO. What could they say? "FINALLY!!"? "It is about time they looked for Haleigh there!"?

 

[stilettos]

Hopefully, "convenient to their cause" means finding Haleigh. I would assume LE DID notify Ronald of the search at the same time they notified the Sheffield/Griffis family. For them not to make a statement is in good taste, IMO.

My prayers are that they find HaLeigh. Ronald Cummings could speed that along if he as requested would go in to speak with LE. IMO.

I find nothing about Ronald Cummings and his criminal history and statutory violations against minors in "good taste". If you want to grant him that because in your belief LE notified him...that is your right. When you have a link to prove that they notified him..please do post it. I still will grant him nothing resembling "good taste"

 

[MADJGNLAW]

I don't know but the acres don't seem to add up.
http://bakercountypress.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2322&Itemid=79 says:


30 acres plus 25 acres makes 55 acres, not 45.

:waitasec:Maybe they are including the area near and around the ponds? Just a thought.

Last Updated ( Saturday, 27 June 2009 ) Only animal remains at Griffis property, not Haleigh's
"Snip" http://bakercountypress.com/index.php

The search area encompassed 45 acres and three ponds.
The property has only been searched once before, two days after Haleigh Cummings disappeared in the early morning hours of February 9.

Det. Piscitello said the five hour and 45 minute effort turned up nothing but animal remains — including those of a horse, goats and cows — which were examined by an anthropologist from the University of Florida to ensure they weren't human remains. Authorities learned about the remains in an interview with local family members.

 

[Peliman]

From the Polly Klaas Fundation

With approximately 77 abductions by family members for every kidnapping by a non-family member law enforcement will inevitably follow the statistics and concentrate on the child’s known universe. They will launch parallel investigations with a focus on the family and move outward. Like concentric ripples in a pond, they will look at family, friends and acquaintances, peripheral contacts, sex offenders registered in the community and finally the most frightening and daunting scenario of all: strangers.

As intrusive as it may become and as irrelevant as it may seem, fully cooperate with law enforcement and eliminate yourself as a suspect. They will ask questions that seem irrelevant and may even ask you to take a polygraph examination. It is not fair, but it is necessary. Remember, like you, law enforcement doesn’t know where your child is and the sooner they are able to gather and assimilate information and evidence, the sooner they are going to be able to direct their investigation toward the solution.


In your efforts to create good relations with law enforcement try to establish mutually beneficial ground rules. Ask for a law enforcement contact that can work as an official liaison. This will establish necessary stability, create trust and ease the flow of information. Work with your law enforcement liaison to ensure that relevant information about your child’s case will be relayed to you through official channels instead of through the media. This simple step could save endless heartache as the investigation progresses. The last thing you want to do is turn the television on in the morning and have a reporter announce that they have uncovered bones they believe are your child’s.


Despite the popular notion that defense attorneys are a necessary component in a missing child case, think very carefully before you hire a lawyer. Despite the protestations of parents in certain high profile missing or murdered child cases, lawyers hinder and otherwise negatively challenge investigations. Lawyers protect your interest, not your child’s. They are investigative barriers: limiting law enforcement access; insisting on being present at all interviews and their mere presence casts suspicion on your motivation.

http://www.klaaskids.org/pg-mc-lawenforcement.htm

The reality is 77 to 1 that this was not a stranger abduction and families need to cooperate fully with law enforcement to advance the case. This means families talk with law enforcement and with all the harping about the circles of grandmothers they all need to sit down and take a Polygraph if it hasn't been done. It's been reported RC has not met the task force with his attorney as requested. (how true that is unknown) but it's being reported.

Maybe it's time to have a news conference and discuss who is cooperating with the investigation. It appears as though some members of the families would rather protect their rights than find their missing child. Now it may seem cruel to some of you to question parents but at 77 to 1 odds LE needs cooperation and answers.

Really, lets put an end to the finger pointing. The quoted section above is not my suggestions but those of the Polly Claas Foundation. The person this has become cruel to is Haleigh Cummings. One would think adults can certainly put their pride away for a couple hours and sit down with law enforcement and move this investigation along.

 

[MADJGNLAW]

From the Polly Klaas Fundation
http://www.klaaskids.org/pg-mc-lawenforcement.htm

The reality is 77 to 1 that this was not a stranger abduction and families need to cooperate fully with law enforcement to advance the case. This means families talk with law enforcement and with all the harping about the circles of grandmothers they all need to take sit down and take a Polygraph if it hasn't been done. It's been reported RC has not met the task force with his attorney as requested. (how true that is unknown) but it's being reported.

Maybe it's time to have a news conference and discuss who is cooperating with the investigation. It appears as though some members of the families would rather protect their rights than find their missing child. Now it may seem cruel to some of you to question parents but at 77 to 1 odds LE needs cooperation and answers.

Really, lets put an end to the finger pointing. The quoted section above is not my suggestions but those of the Polly Claas Foundation. The person this has become cruel to is Haleigh Cummings. One would think adults can certainly put their pride away for a couple hours and sit down with law enforcement and move this investigation along.

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

I can only speak for myself and thank God that I am not a parent that has had to deal with this kind of tragedy. I, can say that if I were in this type of situation I to would let LE look into my background with a fine tooth comb and I would co-operate with them fully and give nothing but truthful answerers so they could move the investigation along and try to find my child. When a child is missing, there is no pride to worry about, there is nothing more valuable than finding the child ASAP...nothing else should matter except finding the child. Again, this is JMO. My prayers go out to all the "Victims" that are out there lost and alone somewhere. They are the ones that matter...The lost...the ones without a voice...The MISSING...they are the real "Victims" and Mr.Klaas is a great example of how someone should act if their child or love one is missing.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

From the Polly Klaas Fundation




http://www.klaaskids.org/pg-mc-lawenforcement.htm

The reality is 77 to 1 that this was not a stranger abduction and families need to cooperate fully with law enforcement to advance the case. This means families talk with law enforcement and with all the harping about the circles of grandmothers they all need to sit down and take a Polygraph if it hasn't been done. It's been reported RC has not met the task force with his attorney as requested. (how true that is unknown) but it's being reported.

Maybe it's time to have a news conference and discuss who is cooperating with the investigation. It appears as though some members of the families would rather protect their rights than find their missing child. Now it may seem cruel to some of you to question parents but at 77 to 1 odds LE needs cooperation and answers.

Really, lets put an end to the finger pointing. The quoted section above is not my suggestions but those of the Polly Claas Foundation. The person this has become cruel to is Haleigh Cummings. One would think adults can certainly put their pride away for a couple hours and sit down with law enforcement and move this investigation along.

There is still the one chance it was a stranger abduction and could be the very reason this case has stalled out. Ronald and Misty were not the first ones to acquire an attorney, IIRC. They met with LE on many, many occasions and were very cooperative. They gave them whatever was requested until such a time they did need to protect the best interests of themselves and of Rj.

Moving the investigation along is exactly what needs to happen. Hopefully, the new set of eyes looking at this case will take off their blinders and open their vision to the beginning where this one fell apart. Tunnel vision from LE brought them to a dead end. And here we are...

Are they still searching today or has the search been called off now?

 

[MADJGNLAW]

I am not sure if this was posted yet, if so sorry for the repeat. It is a video report about yesterday's search and Crystal speaks briefly.

Video Report: Dozens Of Deputies Search Property Of Haleigh's Grandmother http://www.news4jax.com/video/19879394/index.html

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I am not sure if this was posted yet, if so sorry for the repeat. It is a video report about yesterday's search and Crystal speaks briefly.

Video Report: Dozens Of Deputies Search Property Of Haleigh's Grandmother http://www.news4jax.com/video/19879394/index.html

I won't go into my personal comments on Crystal's statement, but how did she "KNOW" nothing would found there? She spoke with great certainty.

 

[Tom'sGirl]

I am not sure if this was posted yet, if so sorry for the repeat. It is a video report about yesterday's search and Crystal speaks briefly.

Video Report: Dozens Of Deputies Search Property Of Haleigh's Grandmother http://www.news4jax.com/video/19879394/index.html

Thanks so much for the Video link Mad, would you also post it in the Media Links thread?

 

[elle1919]

Sad to watch the video because I see a mom that is torn up and missing her daughter. Same thing I saw in the video's Ronald gave. I cannot imagine the pain and heart ripping agony either is going through.

I too wonder if the search is concluded. I stick by my opinion that we will be seeing more of these searches in the coming weeks. Law Enforcement got so sidetracked with all the drama back in the beginning that it is entirely possible that something was missed. Do I think they will find it now?......nope. How truly sad.

With all due respect Pel, while i appreciate the post and the information, in the paragraph following those statistics it states that those findings were from 1988. It states that with the 77 to 1 statistics, law enforcement will generally follow the statistics. Well I for one do not think that is a good thing. Groups need to get together and get a new set of statistics worked up. When Mark Klass was posting that information I read it like he was trying to point out all the things that are working against finding these missing children. But thats just me....lol.

Sadly,I really feel that there is a better than good chance that Haleigh was abducted, if not from her home then from a small radius near her home. By a sex offender.

 

[Peliman]

There is still the one chance it was a stranger abduction and could be the very reason this case has stalled out. Ronald and Misty were not the first ones to acquire an attorney, IIRC. They met with LE on many, many occasions and were very cooperative. They gave them whatever was requested until such a time they did need to protect the best interests of themselves and of Rj.

BBM - See that's where we disagree, it's not about themselves or RJ, Haleigh is the one missing. Questions will arise that need addressed, why would they not do so in the interest of Haleigh. They apparently wont even meet with an attorney present. RC or CS don't get the luxury of saying when it's over. They can but it doesn't go over well in real life, it becomes suspicious.

Moving the investigation along is exactly what needs to happen. Hopefully, the new set of eyes looking at this case will take off their blinders and open their vision to the beginning where this one fell apart. Tunnel vision from LE brought them to a dead end. And here we are...

I have no problem with new eyes and moving the investigation along, they all need continue to cooperate when requested. Since people think Grandma's are not being truthful on either side, polygraph all of them. Lets settle it get it done with. I'm 100% for it.

Are they still searching today or has the search been called off now?

No idea where they may be, they should be welcome to search if and when they feel a need to, both sides. Straight up pure cooperation with whatever's requested from LE. Neither do we know what evidence LE is working from. People who have nothing to hide don't need attorneys to investigate her disappearance. I also don't think it's realistic to expect LE to dig to china either.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

BBM - See that's where we disagree, it's not about themselves or RJ, Haleigh is the one missing. Questions will arise that need addressed, why would they not do so in the interest of Haleigh. They apparently wont even meet with an attorney present. RC or CS don't get the luxury of saying when it's over. They can but it doesn't go over well in real life, it becomes suspicious.



I have no problem with new eyes and moving the investigation along, they all need continue to cooperate when requested. Since people think Grandma's are not being truthful on either side, polygraph all of them. Lets settle it get it done with. I'm 100% for it.



No idea where they may be, they should be welcome to search if and when they feel a need to, both sides. Straight up pure cooperation with whatever's requested from LE. Neither do we know what evidence LE is working from. People who have nothing to hide don't need attorneys to investigate her disappearance. I also don't think it's realistic to expect LE to dig to china either.

I would say if I had been in their shoes after trying to be forthcoming with LE, I would have hired an attorney long before they did! There are times when it is best to know when to protect your rights if the people who are responsible for finding your child want to concentrate on one or two people and you are those people. It becomes neccessary to refocus their attention especially if you know you are innocent. Evidently, LE wasn't going to concentrate their efforts off Misty in order to get a grasp on this case until it was shut down for them to brow beat her yet again. There is a huge difference in being cooperative with LE and being stupid enough to let them paint you into a corner.

The reason for this search has to be more than what is being told, imo. Yes, they may have told LE to come see after LE got a tip about them burying an animal. I can't believe they would spend that kind of money for that much manpower to check out the property at the family's request. It is not a logical response for LE. The way I see it coming about is that LE heard about the animal and they reinterviewed the family during which time the family offered them to come see for themselves. There could be additional information which LE did not share with the family, but this was the "in" for them to conduct the search which they gladly took.

I don't expect them to say if they did find anything. LE is going to maintain they did not expect to find anything and nor did they find anything. We won't know the truth either way, imo.

 

[Peliman]

Sad to watch the video because I see a mom that is torn up and missing her daughter. Same thing I saw in the video's Ronald gave. I cannot imagine the pain and heart ripping agony either is going through.

I too wonder if the search is concluded. I stick by my opinion that we will be seeing more of these searches in the coming weeks. Law Enforcement got so sidetracked with all the drama back in the beginning that it is entirely possible that something was missed. Do I think they will find it now?......nope. How truly sad.

With all due respect Pel, while i appreciate the post and the information, in the paragraph following those statistics it states that those findings were from 1988. It states that with the 77 to 1 statistics, law enforcement will generally follow the statistics. Well I for one do not think that is a good thing. Groups need to get together and get a new set of statistics worked up. When Mark Klass was posting that information I read it like he was trying to point out all the things that are working against finding these missing children. But thats just me....lol.

Sadly,I really feel that there is a better than good chance that Haleigh was abducted, if not from her home then from a small radius near her home. By a sex offender.

It's entirely possible elle, from where we sit LE has 60% or more information. I agree the statistics are 12 yrs old but they still apply at 40 to 1. LE will focus where they feel a need to for different reasons. The search yesterday could have been done so it wasn't used against them in court if they decided to charge someone. We wont know what LE's up to until they're ready. That could mean years from now too. I'm only saying there's reasons for people to cooperate with LE to find Haleigh.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Where are my manners?!

Welcome to WS, Tboy!

 

[Busylady]

Today marks the first major search effort since police gathered all the search teams together to redefine their focus in the search for Haleigh.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/news-article.aspx?storyid=140562

I think LE is going over everything and looking at different angles since their meeting. IMO this search had nothing to do with a request by family so rumors would stop. LE just isnt gonna spend the resources or money to stop rumors IMO.

 

[kageykaren]

Today marks the first major search effort since police gathered all the search teams together to redefine their focus in the search for Haleigh.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/news-article.aspx?storyid=140562

I think LE is going over everything and looking at different angles since their meeting. IMO this search had nothing to do with a request by family so rumors would stop. LE just isnt gonna spend the resources or money to stop rumors IMO.

:clap:

:crossfingers::Justice:

 

[Peliman]

I would say if I had been in their shoes after trying to be forthcoming with LE, I would have hired an attorney long before they did! There are times when it is best to know when to protect your rights if the people who are responsible for finding your child want to concentrate on one or two people and you are those people. It becomes neccessary to refocus their attention especially if you know you are innocent. Evidently, LE wasn't going to concentrate their efforts off Misty in order to get a grasp on this case until it was shut down for them to brow beat her yet again. There is a huge difference in being cooperative with LE and being stupid enough to let them paint you into a corner.

Since we don't know everything that LE may have, some things we do know now is the reported 1 to 1 1/2 hour verified last seen statement from Tyler St. on the 911 tape. The changing of the story and timeline a few times ( 5 or 6). Not knowing which bed Haleigh slept in until RC (who wasn't there) told her. That she woke up 5 minutes before Ron got home a little before 3 and he didn't get home until 3:25. Totally unable to tell the same story twice and walking out of a police interview qualifies as "them (LE) painting you in a corner" I guess your right. Police had no reason to concentrate or question her. Not to mention we haven't even seen the phone records yet. I guess it was LE's fault for not having a grasp. I'm glad they were so forthcoming, I'm touched. I can go on but I'll stop there for now. Oh the bus and who picked Haleigh up. I know, I'm not supposed to question it.

The reason for this search has to be more than what is being told, imo. Yes, they may have told LE to come see after LE got a tip about them burying an animal. I can't believe they would spend that kind of money for that much manpower to check out the property at the family's request. It is not a logical response for LE. The way I see it coming about is that LE heard about the animal and they reinterviewed the family during which time the family offered them to come see for themselves. There could be additional information which LE did not share with the family, but this was the "in" for them to conduct the search which they gladly took.

I cant believe they'd even turn a shovel of dirt considering two well trained cadaver dogs could tell you the same thing. To dig and search only when they got a hit. I'm glad they did search the area because the next thing we'd hear is they didn't search the area.

I don't expect them to say if they did find anything. LE is going to maintain they did not expect to find anything and nor did they find anything. We won't know the truth either way, imo.

Well even if they did find something like a body there or 50 miles away they'd have to explain how it got there. I'd still like to think there was a live Haleigh Cummings, people would't be in so much trouble.

 

[Patty G]

PLEASE stay on topic of this thread. Thank you!

 

[Donjeta]

I won't go into my personal comments on Crystal's statement, but how did she "KNOW" nothing would found there? She spoke with great certainty.

I suppose it might be because she knows she buried Haleigh somewhere else. But then again, it might be because she's certain that she and her family didn't hide Haleigh and doesn't believe anyone else would have buried her on their property either.

But there's just no way for her to win, is there?
If she's sure that nothing will be found at her home, you appear to think it's suspicious. But if she was uncertain, and scared that something would be found at her home, you'd think it was suspicious too... (and so would I).