Hannah Graham: Body Recovered, 18 Oct, 2014 **Awaiting Forensic Confirmation** #4

[klily444]

I know we've all been focused on the investigators continuing to search the area where the remains were found, thinking they may also be searching for more remains, but I'd think it's equally important for the investigators to find something, anything, that would connect JLM to that property.

I would have to go back to look in previous threads, but someone had a great post the other night about the fact that JLM was a smoker, as evidence by the many butts in the ashtray of the blue Nissan, and by interviews saying JLM was bumming cigarettes off people at the bars that night. I'm with the OP (I'll go back and give credit in a minute) that it would be a fantastic find if JLM threw a cigarette butt down on the property, essentially giving a nice little DNA early Christmas gift for investigators.
:findinglink:

edited: Found it! It was human (currently on time out) who posted this on 10/19:

He smokes, but it appears that he puts his butts in the car ashtray if I go by the pics of his sister's car interior on the way to Texas.

But just maybe he smoked one on the property somewhere.

I hope so, but being an ex smoker msyelf, if was truly a bona fide (not just one here or there) smoker, he would never be bumming one. He would always have smokes handy. I would like to know if his sister smoked, because those could be her cigarettes in her car. JMO, and hopefully he DID leave one. That would be undeniable proof he was there.

 

[Ghostwheel]

I know we've all been focused on the investigators continuing to search the area where the remains were found, thinking they may also be searching for more remains, but I'd think it's equally important for the investigators to find something, anything, that would connect JLM to that property.

I would have to go back to look in previous threads, but someone had a great post the other night about the fact that JLM was a smoker, as evidence by the many butts in the ashtray of the blue Nissan, and by interviews saying JLM was bumming cigarettes off people at the bars that night. I'm with the OP (I'll go back and give credit in a minute) that it would be a fantastic find if JLM threw a cigarette butt down on the property, essentially giving a nice little DNA early Christmas gift for investigators.
:findinglink:

edited: Found it! It was human (currently on time out) who posted this on 10/19:

He smokes, but it appears that he puts his butts in the car ashtray if I go by the pics of his sister's car interior on the way to Texas.

But just maybe he smoked one on the property somewhere.

BBM: This^^^. I think that is why they didn't take the rest of the remains. They won't be needed for ID, and it is imperative for a slam dunk conviction that they find some sort of JM's DNA on her body, clothing, on something in the area, etc. If I were LE, I'd be going over the entire scene as slowly and carefully as necessary to make sure nothing gets missed. JMO, of course.

ETA: LE is surely looking for other remains, too, but even if they find remains, they have to prove JM put them there.

 

[cubbeegirl]

It took 8 days to identify Caylee Anthony. I looked it up today out of frustration.

Thank you for that... was going to do some research on that myself...You did it for me !

 

[Jo in Calif]

Would JM's attorney be trying to bargain for something that isn't even on the table yet?

 

[Soulmagent]

As I recall, there was also unidentified blood (not Alexis Murphy's, nor RATs) on the bed sheets in RAT's trailer. That has been bothering me.

No ,there were stains that nothing could be found on(nothing).

 

[tlcya]

Not quibbling at all, just poking around until there's some news. I've always equated the "salt" to doubt. So the more salt, the more doubt. But I could have been mistaken my entire life. It wouldn't be the first time.
http://www.omgfacts.com/lists/9165/...a-grain-of-salt-comes-from-the-ancient-Romans
O/T. I know.

yes I also always thought the salt was to make the incredible more palatable. So more salt needed means less credible to begin with. Huh, learn something new everyday.

 

[Jmm124567]

I think who ever placed the body there knew the property was abandoned and that there was a creek behind there that could be a good place to throw a body

 

[GeeButtersnaps]

Just jumping off this post, but JM has everything to gain by cooperating. Depending on the relatives of missing people, all involved might be willing to take the DP off the table to get resolution on the whereabouts of their loved ones. Chelsea King's parents said OK to taking the DP off the table so that Gardner would talk and Amber Dubois's parents could get back their daughter's remains. If this guy was guilty or party to other missing people, I can see them taking the DP off the table to find the remains of several people and close those cases.

This is odd timing. I'm heading over to Alexis and RATs threads.

That's true guess I didn't think that through very well while trying to keep up dealing with work craziness..good point..

 

[Le Singe]

Early in the case when Alexis car was found they ran it to collect DNA, they had the DNA and connection to morgan and the 2005 rape just no suspect so in order to rule out a case connection they would have compared the unknown suspects dna with the unknown DNA found in the car.

Which IMO is why Nelson county has agreed to have it tested ,it didnt even appear to have to go to court to be challenged they just said "ok"

yeah on second thought report is probably just using the hype.

 

[Calico66]

http://www.bdtonline.com/news/article_014f083a-5965-11e4-b67d-67a03ffc3f40.html

Does that mean Jesse L. Matthew Jr. will now face charges in the 2009 killing of Morgan Harrington?
Harrington’s mother said Tuesday she hasn’t heard from Virginia State Police investigators on their next step in her daughter’s case.
“I am always the last to find out about something,” Gil Harrington said in an interview.
Harrington contrasted the stealthy state police approach to the tack taken by Charlottesville Police Chief Timothy Longo, who has been the public face in the search for Hannah Graham, the U.Va. student who disappeared Sept. 13.

(snip)
Gil Harrington, who with her husband, Dan, has worked to keep her daughter’s unsolved case in the public eye, said she has not been told by state police whether they will seek charges against Matthew.
“Virginia State Police are really a very closed shop,” Harrington said. “Their culture and their approach is really different from Chief Longo. He’s really collaborative in the way he utilizes and engages with the media.”

 

[Dear Prudence]

wow this is crazy, I didnt follow the AM case, will need to read up on that, how was RAT convicted?

I am thinking JM is singing like a canary.

http://www.wdbj7.com/news/local/day-2-alexis-murphys-mother-testifies-in-randy-taylor-trial/25773594

Good article with summary of evidence against RAT.

 

[PricklyPear]

Unfortunately, no. Not legally. One is a murderer, another is an accessory.

Does this depend on Virginia state law? I know several serial killers in California were convicted of the same murders when they committed them together (Loren Herzog and Wesley Shermantine, for example; Charles Ng was convicted of several murders he committed with Leonard Lake, although Lake committed suicide upon his arrest so he never went to trial; I think Gerald and Charlene Gallego were both convicted of murders they committed in Nevada, but I could be wrong).

 

[Ghostwheel]

Unfortunately, no. Not legally. One is a murderer, another is an accessory.

Well, that depends on the case and the state. In Georgia, Kelly Renee Gissendaner and Gregory Owen were both guilty of murder of the same individual, even though Kelly didn't actually do the killing. Or are you saying in VA it is that way? TIA.

 

[zapped]

Defense attorneys will use anything they can to get this scum a reduced sentence.

They can try but remember that judges dont have to honor plea agreements.They usually do but sentencing is up to them and its not unusual in a case of this magnitude to see a judge impose a VERY strict sentence.

 

[Le Singe]

Nah, I'm the one who's quibbling, and I do apologize for the minutia. It's just that a grain of salt is the smallest bit of credibility. I suppose that if you wanted to hyperbolize it, you'd say a "crystal of salt"!

read the link i don't think you are correct and i've always hear it used in the way MomnVA used it.

 

[RSC]

i've never thought the two were related but this can't just be a coincidence to announce this right now.

So here are my crazy brainstorm theories:

1. JM is talking.

2. RAT is talking, because he and JM were in on it together, and he knows that if AM is found, JM's DNA will also be found, and all sorts of doubt will be cast on his conviction.

3. RAT is talking, even though JM had NOTHING to do with AM, because he thinks that this is an opportunity to cast doubt on his own conviction by blaming it on someone else (not really sure how he could defend knowing where body is).

4. This one is a big stretch, but still: Perhaps RAT is talking simply because the combination of the Indiana serial killer and JM is taking the spotlight away from him, and he has a depraved need for attention.

 

[tlcya]

That's a nice thought wrapped up in a pretty package. I don't see it that way and don't want to take one minute part away from his evil act and what happened to her body after she died. (No offense... I debated whether to post this differing view... I still appreciate your sentiment...)

None taken at all, differing POVs is what brought me here and keeps me coming all these years later. Its what makes this the best true crime discussion forum on the web.

 

[Heroine]

Me too Heroine :skip: We are neighbors!

Haha, I have neighbors here yay!!!!:happydance:

 

[ksj3]

Well, that depends on the case and the state. In Georgia, Kelly Renee Gissendaner and Gregory Owen were both guilty of murder of the same individual, even though Kelly didn't actually do the killing. Or are you saying in VA it is that way? TIA.

That's my understanding from previous cases (trying to figure out which injury of many was the fatal one to tie that to a certain person), but I'm no lawyer. Let me see if I can find it.

 

[Whiteorchids]

Yeah, I'm sure JM said "I didn't kill AM, RAT did, but I'll tell you the location of her body in exchange for a lesser sentence." /sarcasm

He might be talking. I really have no idea. But I think we are going to find out a lot from this search on Old Lynchburg that will shed light on many things.

Someone posted a news link to cnntogo that said JM was cooperating with the investigation.