ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 13

[positive]

In my opinion—-it’s in the police log because the animal shelter might be closed on Sunday. They needed help getting in to get the dog, I’m guessing-which means the dog was at the shelter sometime Saturday…..clearly kaylees parents and jack knew the dog was missing by 530 Sunday-so that’s when they went to pick it up….I’m sure police went to see if there was blood on the dog but I think it got out the night of the 12th (maybe someone left a door open), was found and taken to the shelter sat night. If dog was chipped (guessing it was) they had contact info and would have let kaylee know. Message saying “dog is at shelter” would have put her mind at ease and maybe she was calling j to make pick up arrangements. All just my opinion-again I don’t think dog was there when murders occurred. Sorry for multiple dog posts.
This is last one.

Thats an awesome breakdown ! I just want the info released. If they can't or won't release info on the dog time, I really wonder how well the investigation is going.

 

[layer]

that room I believe is unoccupied and it sits under Ms room.

We don't know for sure who was assigned which room or who was sleeping in which room.

One thing is for certain - LE knows, and so far it hasn't led them to naming any suspect. So it seems unlikely that our theorizing on it will lead to a suspect either. Just sayin'...

Carry on!

 

[Spb1213]

MOO but I believe that you attack the target first, it is where your rage directs you to go.

Are you suggesting he killed X and E (2nd floor) then went to 3rd floor just for the heck of it?

 

[JenJones]

None of the pieces seem to fit in this case. One resource contradicts the next. Sending good wishes to all involved.

 

[accordn2me]

I recall the case of Jessica Ridgeway where they (I believe) went door to door requesting male DNA. The killer actually gave his, and that wasn't how he was found as it turned out.

My point being that yes this is done, no you don't have to give it and yes it does make you look suspicious. If an investigator cares enough, they will follow the person who did not give DNA and get it with something discarded by the individual (once you throw or give something away, it no longer is yours). Even if it ended up they could not use the collected sample for arrest, if it matched the crime scene they'd know they had their person and would find another reason to arrest and get DNA again.

If more people said no, it wouldn't look weird to say no. But people get verbally bullied sometimes and sometimes people think they need to clear themselves and sometimes people think that their being cleared narrows the suspect pool. JMO.

Given the backlog of DNA tests sitting around that have never been analyzed, the better strategy in such a position would be to unhesitatingly give them your sample to prevent the suspicion that attaches when someone refuses to submit. In the serial killer cases we had here, a 10-year old rape kit was finally processed and cracked the case. No telling how many hours were wasted following up on a mistaken accounting of a woman being abducted.

 

[archisleuth]

Did I see a photo of a cinderblock or something like that sitting next to one of those windows? Or am I just imagining things?

Yes, I remember that, too. This is the best image I could find that shows it. A little hard to see due to the leaves on the tree tho.

 

[Ghostwheel]

MOO but I believe that you attack the target first, it is where your rage directs you to go.

I would agree, with the caveat that it would be the case only if no one else got in the way while the killer was heading to the intended victim.

In fact, it seems like someone getting in your way on the way to kill your intended target might have just increased the rage. MOO.

It's why order of kill and location matters.

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

Having been a sorority girl with a lot of roommates, I imagine that everyone slept as late as they could manage. One of the survivors thinks it's weird that she's the first one up, checks on non-survivors, clearly sees that something is horribly wrong (might even go into shock), calls friend not in the house who tells her to call the police/ambulance. This chaos wakes the other survivor, who also looks at situation and has similar reaction, so dispatcher ends up talking to more than one

Maybe they didn’t realize how bad it was (if they didn’t see the carnage). At that age maybe thinking accidental drug overdose, alcohol etc. never in wildest dreams would they know what was inside bedroom…assuming doors were locked.

If the 2 surviving housemates were on the first floor (MOO), one might have seen something very disturbing when they got up the stairs, disturbing enough that the it caused her to immediately get the other housemate. They cannot make sense of what they see, flee back down to the first floor & immediately summon nearby friends. Moo, those friends would have entered through the first level front door, perhaps gone up the stairs, confirmed that something was very wrong, & the 911 call was made.

In this scenario, there’s hope the crime scene(s) on the second &/or third floors weren’t terribly compromised. Moo

Also, that front door might have been the one referred to as open by law enforcement, rather than the second floor slider as has been speculated, maybe?

All just speculation!

 

[tokyorose]

Thats an awesome breakdown ! I just want the info released. If they can't or won't release info on the dog time, I really wonder how well the investigation is going.

MOO but LE may have good reason to withhold information from the public and this doesn't necessarily mean they are not doing a good job.

 

[EncyclopediaBrownJr]

Maybe the killer didn't go after the bottom floor girls because he made a loud noise upstairs, loud enough that he felt he had to stop the killings and get out of the house. Maybe one of the victims screamed. He felt it was loud enough to him that it would wake up the neighbors or the survivors below.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Exactly! Trivia for you Crime Junkies…
What and When was the last case where all these things happened?—
- multiple people killed
- brutally killed
- In their own residence
- in an urban area, there are neighbors
- during the night
- victims have no criminal history
- no connections to drugs, mafia, cartel
- no burglary
- no sexual assault
- no one seems to have heard or seen anything
- two weeks goes by without any POI

This situation is quite rare, how can anyone feel safe if they cannot ensure their own safety in their own home?
That is why this has our attention, IMO

It is rare, relatively speaking, but your qualifiers aren't painting a fair comparison picture. JMO. For instance, you're eliminating any murder in which police identify a POI or in which the neighbors hear something, but that really doesn't have anything to do with the crime itself. So if we add those qualifiers, then we can do that to any murder to show how it's unique because, relatively speaking, every murder has its own unique qualities. I know that's confusing and I may not be explaining it well, so let me give an example of what I mean. The stabbing in Oregon in which the husband died and the wife survived that we've been talking about on this thread. We could give a qualifier to that one that doesn't apply to this one -- a stabbing in which one victim didn't die and one did. But that doesn't really speak to the rarity of the murder; just to the outcome. So it doesn't tell us anything about likelihood. I hope that makes sense.

I also don't think we can compare Moscow to larger (or even smaller) towns. There's something unique about a college town in a largely rural state where the year-round population may be vastly different from the school-year population. It reminds me of resort town murders in some ways.

All MOO.

 

[ktm44]

Thats an awesome breakdown ! I just want the info released. If they can't or won't release info on the dog time, I really wonder how well the investigation is going.

Their job is to solve a multiple homicide not satisfy public curiosity.

 

[whirrledpeas]

McDonald was convicted, the blurb I just read said he hurt himself and killed his wife and two little girls at Ft Bragg, NC. It was family annihilation, claimed was attacked.
I should have on the list not family annihilator- actually that is kind common- and the rest of us are not in danger.
JMO

Fair enough. At the time though, he was not a suspect. In fact, he was found not guilty during an ARMY court martial. It wasn’t until years later that he was convicted in civilian courts.

Edited for grammar.

 

[tokyorose]

I would agree, with the caveat that it would be the case only if no one else got in the way while the killer was heading to the intended victim.

In fact, it seems like someone getting in your way on the way to kill your intended target might have just increased the rage. MOO.

It's why order of kill and location matters.

I do believe that LE has said that all 4 were asleep when they were attacked.

 

[Friday Fan]

In my opinion—-it’s in the police log because the animal shelter might be closed on Sunday. They needed help getting in to get the dog, I’m guessing-which means the dog was at the shelter sometime Saturday…..clearly kaylees parents and jack knew the dog was missing by 530 Sunday-so that’s when they went to pick it up….I’m sure police went to see if there was blood on the dog but I think it got out the night of the 12th (maybe someone left a door open), was found and taken to the shelter sat night. If dog was chipped (guessing it was) they had contact info and would have let kaylee know. Message saying “dog is at shelter” would have put her mind at ease and maybe she was calling j to make pick up arrangements. All just my opinion-again I don’t think dog was there when murders occurred. Sorry for multiple dog posts.
This is last one.

A Websleuths poster familiar with Moscow stated that animal control does not work at night. The only time police would get involved with an after hours animal call would be if the animal is dangerous etc. A loose labradoodle puppy would not be considered a threat.
Logs from Saturday do not indicate there was a dispatch call involving a dog that fits the description of Murphy.

MPD Press Log 11/12/2022

www.ci.moscow.id.us

Sunday logs do not show anything about a dog call (except a stray was picked up at 7 pm) and likely Murphy was picked up from the impound at 5:30 pm MPD Press Log 11/13/2022

If that happened where I live on Saturday night, the 311 operator would ask the caller to take care of the dog until business hours.

 

[TooMuchGun]

I do not believe that the suspect entered through the 3rd floor balcony...M

Thanks. I think it's reasonable to assume that K & M were in their rooms. That confirms to me that the target was almost certainly K or M (if LE is correct that there was one target).

There are two possible reasons, which I've already mentioned.

1) The perp might not have know who was in each room. The room that E & X were in might have been the first room he tried. Assuming that they stirred before he discovered that neither was is target, he would have killed them before continuing his search.

2) E & X may have awakened while the perp was upstairs killing K & M. They might have interrupted him while he was fleeing the scene. Even if they didn't leave their room, he might have felt compelled to kill them in order to buy more time if he realized that they had been alerted by the attack on K & M.

IMO, it is extremely unlikely that the perp would have ascended the staircase to the third floor if the target was E or X. He would have just killed the two of them and then fled.

I agree with that which is why I think he started at the 3rd floor.
I think it's more likely to leave a 3rd floor bedroom window or door unlocked than a main floor exit.
I agree if it's targeted why go upstairs which makes me think if he enters on floor 2 he's there to kill everyone. Maybe he watched the 4 come home at 145am. Where the killer entered makes a difference to what kind of person did it. Too much info withheld to know for sure

 

[indicolite22]

We don't know for sure who was assigned which room or who was sleeping in which room.

One thing is for certain - LE knows, and so far it hasn't led them to naming any suspect. So it seems unlikely that our theorizing on it will lead to a suspect either. Just sayin'...

Carry on!

We have seen K's room in her TikToks. It's the one with a balcony.

 

[nao]

Moo...why is the dog important? It is not a guard breed..it would of hid or wandered away if door left open. What is important..is stabby person..left handed or right handed. Stabbing is usually not thought out. But this person succeeded in killing 4 people efficiently..that needs alot of muscle,energy and knowledge. I am very knife friendly, hunting, farming etc. But i would need to google to deal with humans..or be military..but military does not teach that to all. Moo

 

[Ghostwheel]

I do believe that LE has said that all 4 were asleep when they were attacked.

The phrase was "likely asleep " which leaves room for "not asleep ", so I err on the side of maybe asleep, maybe not.

King Road Homicide | Moscow, ID

www.ci.moscow.id.us

The coroner stated the four victims were likely asleep, some had defensive wounds, and each was stabbed multiple times.

 

[positive]

Their job is to solve a multiple homicide not satisfy public curiosity.

....and if one can not or will not release the time of when one found a dog, I seriously consider everything else one has said.