ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 21

[WildWest]

It was actually room E, so it was Maddie’s they were in.

Side note: appreciate your insightful posts.

Is room labeling from left to right from floor plans? Or other description "master bedroom" is room E?

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

It was more of a feeling than a reason, tbh.
One thing was M's parents being quiet with the stories of how it was the worst crime scene the PD has ever seen (and all the local rumours that followed).
The other was nothing about K lining up - has an ex from recent break up, but that ex is cleared; there are rumours of a stalker, but no stalker is found; there are odd discussions about it being sus she had the money for all her plans, but nothing out of the ordinary regarding her finances is detected. I thought we mainly know so much about K, because her parents are in the media, and as all these statistically likely aspects in her life were cleared, it felt like it's either a) something very unlikely with K as a victim, or b) something likely with someone else as a victim.
Along the lines with K's dad atm, I also thought for a while, that if the target was on the 2nd floor only, it is odd for the prep to to the 3rd floor. Thus I thought the target could have been M on the 3rd floor, either alone or maybe together with X, because they worked together and belonged to the same sorority and there was also no obvious reason to kill X&E in their beds, had M been the target.

logical. makes sense.

 

[hopewell]

If K and M were killed last, he could've exited via the sliders/balcony on floor 3. I seem to recall photos early on of what was perhaps blood on the banister/balusters.

My opinion.

 

[drmrgrl]

Targeted because it provided easy access for intruders or because it housed college kids or one in particular?

Both

 

[Cryptic]

Just like police often have informants in gangs, I predict that they have the same in some of N Idaho's extremist groups. People that may revel in rhetoric, but haven't yet done anything particularly illegal and would turn in vicious killers, just to keep focus off them.

Well said.

There is a saying that out of every three members of an extremist group of what ever socio political / religious orientation:

- One is a under cover agent.
- One is an under cover reporter.
- One is a true believer.

Though nearly anything is remotely possible, there is no evidence that the victims would have been targeted by an extremist group of any type.

Advocating such a motive with out any evidence seems to suggest having a pre determined out come regarding the expected perpetrators- then trying to force the facts to meet that pre determined out come.

 

[layer]

IMO, and purely speculating, this seems to suggest that X&E were the 'targets'. But if this is true, what motivation would the killer have to keep killing after he already got his targets? Maybe I'm just looking too much into it and am confused by LE's back and forth with the term 'target'

Maybe he just wanted to kill everyone in the house and didn't know there were two he missed until he watched the news.

 

[Bliss_Perth]

How do we know her wounds were worse than M's?

he just said he had information just confirmed and kaylees injurys i quote "were significantly more brutal".

Just a thought if you go into a room and its dark you might not see two people sleeping in the bed so they might not have realised until the attack had started and the other person was disturbed. Unlikely but possible..

 

[EJB123456]

There’s another individual related to the Venmo payment.

I believe that is a JK, not a JH, yeah?

 

[KPO]

Reporters do not disclose their sources if they want any additional information. There is no chance that Entin is going to say who gave him these details. That is a limited First Amendment Right for journalists.

Also, as for Kaylee's possible "stalker", that term is tossed around quite a bit these days by women. I've referred to multiple men in my life as stalkers simply because they were creepy. I'm not saying that she didn't have a stalker, but I'm saying that using the term these days does not necessarily mean you're literally being stalked.

 

[layer]

That is a statement made on News Nation this evening

Wow, a statement made by K's dad?

 

[PolarButterflie]

Is room labeling from left to right from floor plans? Or other description "master bedroom" is room E?

From the front of the house, it would be the upper left window.

From the back of the house it would be the upper right window with the pink boots.

From the floor plan, it is the smaller room on the third floor; without the sliding glass doors.

 

[debirlfan]

Want to carry this over. The Lawrence Jones interview with SG last night, LJ said from his source close to this case he was told that the two survivors and a fraternity member witnessed one of the victims. He was also told that the crime scene may have actually been pretty preserved.

SG said he didn’t know anything about any of that and so LJ moved on.

I've wondered if one of the roommates called friends because the bedroom door was locked, and when the friends got there they forced the door and realized it wasn't just a passed out roommate. Could explain the multiple people/confusion on the 911 call.

 

[drmrgrl]

Interesting detail on the official December 2 update from Moscow police- says...on the night of the incident, officers located a dog at the residence. I interpret that statement as LE didn't find the dog until later in the evening because at 12 pm it says they found the 4 victims. So was dog in closet or closed off somehow from incident??

Yes.probably caged

 

[whirrledpeas]

Is room labeling from left to right from floor plans? Or other description "master bedroom" is room E?

I believe it’s the one on the left without the balcony.

 

[steeltowngirl]

I believe that is a JK, not a JH, yeah?

Haven‘t located a verification link, so cannot confirm.

 

[theonewithallthequestions]

I feel like tonight's developments have only made things more confusing and are only going to serve to whip the reddit/FB/tt detectives into a frenzy (have a feeling the finger pointing is going to shift from JS back to JD all over again).

SG, who I believe was Brian's source, only has info on Kaylee and Maddie's bodies. There's no way of knowing whether Kaylee's wounds were significantly worse or the same as Xana and Ethan's. Add in the fact that they were in the same bed - so did the killer go into Maddie's room first? Wouldn't this make her the target? Also, we don't know how dark it was - possible the killer got mistaken? Did Kaylee wake up and fight back, thus she received more severe wounds?

I truly feel for all of the families, I can't imagine what they're going through. But at the same time, I can't imagine LE are happy right now with all of this info getting out and I can't say I blame them.

 

[newredtabby]

RE: Steve Goncalves' remark "He doesn’t have to go up the steps" (recent interview, can't find link)

Verbatim: “He doesn’t have to go up the steps.... Let's stop playing games, guys. I need somebody to step up and be an alpha... somebody to be a leader. Don't make me do. I don't wanna do it. He doesn't have to go up the steps."

I understand that SG's frustration and grief is driving his behavior and I'm very sad for him; but this kind of veiled threat to reveal info to the public unless someone "steps up" is really unconventional. I'm surprised a judge hasn't issued an order for him to desist. It doesn't matter if he "paid for" the info - allowing the perp to know what he knows is assisting the perp who is no doubt in constant personal protection mode these days. First, it seems SG's remarks alluded to his belief that X and E were the targets and so K and M were collateral and apparently, he believes the public needs to know this? If this is truly a fact based on the evidence, the public does not need to know this because people close to X and E would scatter and the perp would then know that LE is tightening the circle and would hide or run even more. Hunters use hunting blinds for a reason - to reduce the chance of detection when they finally have a target in scope. It's an attempt to control the environment. Information is like a hunting blind - the more that's hidden the more likely the perp won't notice and will step into range. It's not a lack of leadership in LE - it is literally the collective intelligence of thousands of investigators over hundreds of years that has taught professionals this lesson: cooler heads prevail.

In the 15 years I've been studying true crime, I've learned that deviant minds often think of everything. And they can ideate a long, long time. If this perp had killed just one person, it's a pretty good chance that person was the target, so the logic is to follow the data set mapped to that one victim in order to catch the perp. In this case, with each victim he (or she) killed he increased the data set related to his acts so the path back to him is that much harder to determine and the odds of him being found are greatly diminished - it was tactical. So, also to be tactical, LE does not reveal why they believe it was a targeted attack or who was targeted.

Best post I have read on this topic. Logical and appropriate. Hope it sticks around!

 

[isabella88]

Wow, a statement made by K's dad?

Not sure that it originally came from her dad but Entin and Banfield reported it this evening as new info. That K&M were killed in Maddie's bedroom (bedroom E) and that Kaylee's injuries were significantly more brutal. I'm sure they will have a free video and/or article summary of the broadcast soon.

 

[layer]

I should have said *supposedly* worse than M’s since that is not confirmed by LE… This is news from the NewsNation special that was just aired. @LAhiker has a few posts about the special.

I wonder if he disclosed his source, or at least the nature of his source. I'm just going to have to go look...

 

[hopewell]

If one victim was "more brutal" than the one laying beside her, could that also suggest a male/female duo? What if Ethan and Xana were treated the same?