ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 38

[cottonweaver]

Feels like this is the most relaxed have ever seen Chief Fry.

anybody else think that?

 

[10ofRods]

@10ofRods Regarding Advanced Placement. That isn’t what I was suggesting. I was wondering if K might have arrived as a Freshman with enough Advanced Placement credits to clear out some General Ed requirements and be a half year ahead of the game, right from the start of her college time. (That would have given her more opportunities, not less, to follow her special interests.)

That wouldn’t be at all impossible, from what I know of modern HS AP opportunities. I was responding to people who couldn’t understand how she might be graduating a half year early. Lots of other possible reasons for that, of course.

All my speculation

Ah, I get it now. Sure, very likely. And took 18 units rather than 15 for a couple semesters. Easy to finish early.

 

[cottonweaver]

I think the reporter was taking liberties with what he actually said when she wrote KA-BAR.

“They were specifically asking whether or not we carry KA-BAR-style knives, which we do not,” Jutte told the paper. “If we did, we could’ve reviewed surveillance footage. But it wasn’t something I could help them with.”

https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/local/crime/article268833397.html

iirc the quote direct from the supply shop manager is in the newspaper link ( what he says LEOs specifically inquired about)

 

[CityKid]

I've tried to respond to 10 of Rods' post in previous thread unsuccessfully, so have cut and pasted here - hope that's OK - unsure how else to it (technically challenged)
(snipped)
This is 10 of Rods excellent post. (Apologies to The Observer and everyone for my intrusion)
Unfortunately, Kaylee's sister has already gone public with the fact that Kaylee "always called people up in the middle of the night," sometimes dialing over and over and then asking what she should have for breakfast and regarding this as a prank."

(Surely, this could have happened to the sister - but did Kaylee really do that in general? If not, I sure wish the sister hadn't already said that she did).

I don't take any statements from grieving family members at face value, but I agree, the sister really did the case (and Kaylee in particular) no favors with those statements. The G family was bending over backward in support of K's ex-bf and said IMO a number of unflattering things about K (spam calling at all hours, a brat taking a break from the bf) while stating they were supporting the bf 1,000%. From Lawrence Jones on fox 11/19; Fox link is broken:

 

[drmrgrl]

The Moscow police update today deflated me. It made me feel like they are at square 1. I had some hope tha5 5hey knew the suspect was and they were working on collecting data to ensure an arrest-I know silly me reading into things and conjecturing. Today just seemed like no new news and nobody to call POI.
I do wonder why the FBI profiler is not used as of yet. I know it is to ensure all reports be provid3d but it just seems they would give people something to Explore. Maybe they know there ar3 50000 people who are conjecturing and don’t want to endanger real leads‍

IMO, LE might still know or suspect someone, they just can say it at this time.

 

[drmrgrl]

“Investigators believe someone has information that adds context to what occurred on the night of the murders and continue requesting additional pictures, video, and social media content.

I wonder what context they are looking for in particular?

What would the video/photo social media content show?

Someone being at a venue when they said they weren't?

Someone hanging around a person not regularly in that immediate group of friends - an outsider visiting randomly that day?

Someone staying at a person's house that is within walking/bike riding distance to where the murders happened. MOO

IMO.All of the above. A face in the crowd….

 

[OrlandoJames]

I think LE can say what ever they want while conducting their investigation and also keep many things tight to their chest, as to not ruin the integrity of the investigation. Obviously there is a great deal of information that the sleuthing world wouldn't know about but LE does.

I also think some people that were initially 'cleared' in the investigation, can most definitely become a POI again, as time goes and the investigation progresses on and more social media is leaked out.

My prediction, there will an arrest sometime in January when LE completes the complex jigsaw puzzle. Remember the 'jigsaw puzzle' only started 6 weeks ago. Confident someone's in their cross hairs.

I suppose it ultimately comes down to what you believe the motive was. If you believe that the killer was connected to at least one of the victims and had a specific motive to kill them (revenge, jealousy, to silence them, etc), then I agree that LE will probably solve the ‘jigsaw puzzle’ soon. Other people will hold key information and eventually it will come out.

However, if you believe that the killer was more likely a sexual psychopath with little or no connection to the victims, it will be much more difficult for LE to identify him. In this scenario, there is no ‘jigsaw puzzle’ as such - no complex web of connections to slowly uncover. Just a deeply disturbed individual with an intense rage against women.

 

[drmrgrl]

Spitballing here but potentially imo:

maybe LE thinks that the killer stalked K&M or E&X and the killer will potentially show up in multiple places near one of the pairs, and maybe if LE gets enough photos/videos, they'll find that person in the background multiple places, so as many angles, as innocuous as the photos may seem to be, maybe they'll find that face in the crowd? could that be a reason? JMO and asking.

IMO, I agree 100%

 

[EJB123456]

Idaho cops offered counseling as pressure intensifies to find suspect

There are no leads and no suspects in the murders of four University of Idaho students six weeks after the brutal slayings.

www.dailymail.co.uk

SBM: Locked in their rooms on the first floor, it was one of these two survivors who placed the 911 call at 11.58am November 13 because they were unable to wake one of the victims and feared she may have passed out.

 

[drmrgrl]

This might be a stretch of sorts, but I wonder if somehow letting individuals know that if they come forward with that missing important piece of the puzzle they will be provided with police protection if needed.

I can’t begin to imagine the fear some of those students must feel right now.

IMO,use positive reinforcement. LE can start handing out 20, 50 and 100 dollar bills for pertinent information regarding the murders. The more reliable the info, the higher the dollar amount. Money talks. Let’s think outside of the box.IOW, provide an incentive to come forward. Moscow PD will have lines of potential for miles and miles.

 

[CityKid]

Ah, I get it now. Sure, very likely. And took 18 units rather than 15 for a couple semesters. Easy to finish early.

Although if she indeed had been working full time throughout high school and university (per her mother), 18 credits sounds like a stretch to me MOO.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

The “risk factor” is part of the thrill. The hunt. The execution of a skilled psychosomatically planned out multiple murder. This is not the work of an amateur. Jmoo

IMO every killer is an amateur at one time. First time for everything adage.

I disagree that this was a psychotic serial killer. Serial killers have types. If you look at the women victims of a serial killer they all look enough alike to be sisters or brothers. An SK carefully watches for someone who fits his "type". A SK doesn't pick a random house and kill two blonde females, one brunette female and one male. Some of the people who have been mentioned on here are not bona fide serial killers. They are mass murderers, family annihilators or spree killers, not true serial killers like Bundy, Dahmer, BTK ect. A serial killer kills one victim at a time who has something in common with all his other victims, e.g all blondes, all brunettes, all children, all women, all men, all prostitutes ect.

These kids knew their killer and he knew them. Probably well. Knew their inclination to drink, party, have an open door policy at their home ect. This was no random guy hiding up in the woods and suddenly deciding to stab 4 people to death.

There is a motive behind these killings. The main motives for murder is money, sex or revenge. I would add keeping a secret but with 4 victims it is unlikely all 4 knew the killers secret. If keeping a secret known to one victim was the motive it would have been easier to get that victim alone rather than enter a house with six people or possibly more, that may or may not have been asleep. If one person in that house was awake they could have called 911. That is why I discount that theory, too many unknowns and variables.

This was not an assassination. Assassins don't use knives for a very good reason. If the target is a male and awake or wakes up during the attack the victim might fight back to the point he gains control of the assassins knife and turns it on him. If the target is a woman she might fight enough to get away. Assassins use a gun usually with a silencer and do a double tap to the head quietly and quickly.

This was a rage fueled murder. As SG described it "Sloppy, messy". No planning went into this. This was spur of the moment fueled by an overwhelming rage at one or more of the victims. You can bet the killer made a mistake or several of them that will lead to his/her arrest.

In naming the usual motives for murder, we know it was not money, nothing was stolen, it was not sex, no one was raped, so that leaves only revenge.

So what was the revenge for?

An altercation between the killer and one or more of the victims? This could have easily occurred at any one of these parties where you have testosterone filled young men drinking heavily. A friends grandson recently ended up with a broken nose after a dispute over ownership of a fishhook during a party just to outline how little a fight ending in injuries can break out where alcohol or drugs are involved. Here you have entire fraternities and sororities full of such young people all drinking and partying heavily, indeed from statistics, half of a town full. It's easy to see how an altercation that night or revenge for a prior altercation could have provoked these murders.


An ex boyfriend/girlfriend (I am not singling out any particular ex since I am sure all 4 victims have had prior ex boy/girlfriends at their age.)? Little has been said about prior relationships before college or the current ones named. M met her BF at college, E&X met at college, K had recently broken off a semi long term relationship that did not preclude a different relationship in between those on/off again breakups or even a current one that led to the breakup. Them being in a relationship does not preclude them having a fling outside the relationship at one time or another either. It's easy to see a jilted lover being responsible especially if that jilted lover believed the other three friends were in some way involved in he/she being jilted. I am not ruling out a woman with strong upper body strength, rage filled woman, with 4 drunk, sleeping victims.

Someone in that house was connected to the evil that came in it that night. That you can be sure of. Eventually the police will single out which one which in turn will lead them to the killer.

Then you have a college full of young people who live on SM and post their innermost private details of their lives on it. Nothing remains a secret for long among very socially active kids these days. Sooner or later, sworn to secrecy frat brothers or sorority sisters or not, someone will talk. After all this is the murder of 4 people, not a super secret dark of the night Greek ritual known only to the brothers and sisters of that Greek house.

Give these kids some time to think about how being charged as an accessory to 4 first degree murders can ruin their bright futures and all that sworn to be brothers and sisters forever will fly out the window.

ETA: When the killer is named there is going to be a lot of shock among relatives, townsfolk and people on here as to who it is and how close they were to the victims. IMO it's going to come out of left field.

JMO

 

[Mark Connell]

Struggling to keep up with the thread but is there still no reward for information? I find that so odd!

 

[deadfoot13]

IMO every killer is an amateur at one time. First time for everything adage.

I disagree that this was a psychotic serial killer. Serial killers have types. If you look at the women victims of a serial killer they all look enough alike to be sisters or brothers. An SK carefully watches for someone who fits his "type". A SK doesn't pick a random house and kill two blonde females, one brunette female and one male. Some of the people who have been mentioned on here are not bona fide serial killers. They are mass murderers, family annihilators or spree killers, not true serial killers like Bundy, Dahmer, BTK ect. A serial killer kills one victim at a time who has something in common with all his other victims, e.g all blondes, all brunettes, all children, all women, all men, all prostitutes ect.

RSBM

Do some research on Israel Keyes. No type. No common trait to his victims other than the fact that they had a pulse and weren't too big for him to dispose of by himself.

 

[cottonweaver]

Conclaves family (father and sister) claim voice messages were left ("we share a dog together") so I think K left the voice messages. This was on Lawrence Jones 11/19 on Fox; Fox links are 404 (I don't know why) but you can listen here:

good to get a refresher of the early reporting ( 19th November?)

wonder what Kaylee was planning to do there 13th onwards ( Mom says in that interview that K was only planning to return on the Tuesday )
anybody heard anything on that?

 

[OrlandoJames]

IMO every killer is an amateur at one time. First time for everything adage.

I disagree that this was a psychotic serial killer. Serial killers have types. If you look at the women victims of a serial killer they all look enough alike to be sisters or brothers. An SK carefully watches for someone who fits his "type". A SK doesn't pick a random house and kill two blonde females, one brunette female and one male. Some of the people who have been mentioned on here are not bona fide serial killers. They are mass murderers, family annihilators or spree killers, not true serial killers like Bundy, Dahmer, BTK ect. A serial killer kills one victim at a time who has something in common with all his other victims, e.g all blondes, all brunettes, all children, all women, all men, all prostitutes ect.

These kids knew their killer and he knew them. Probably well. Knew their inclination to drink, party, have an open door policy at their home ect. This was no random guy hiding up in the woods and suddenly deciding to stab 4 people to death.

There is a motive behind these killings. The main motives for murder is money, sex or revenge. I would add keeping a secret but with 4 victims it is unlikely all 4 knew the killers secret. If keeping a secret known to one victim was the motive it would have been easier to get that victim alone rather than enter a house with six people or possibly more, that may or may not have been asleep. If one person in that house was awake they could have called 911. That is why I discount that theory, too many unknowns and variables.

This was not an assassination. Assassins don't use knives for a very good reason. If the target is a male and awake or wakes up during the attack the victim might fight back to the point he gains control of the assassins knife and turns it on him. If the target is a woman she might fight enough to get away. Assassins use a gun usually with a silencer and do a double tap to the head quietly and quickly.

This was a rage fueled murder. As SG described it "Sloppy, messy". No planning went into this. This was spur of the moment fueled by an overwhelming rage at one or more of the victims. You can bet the killer made a mistake or several of them that will lead to his/her arrest.

In naming the usual motives for murder, we know it was not money, nothing was stolen, it was not sex, no one was raped, so that leaves only revenge.

So what was the revenge for?

An altercation between the killer and one or more of the victims? This could have easily occurred at any one of these parties where you have testosterone filled young men drinking heavily. A friends grandson recently ended up with a broken nose after a dispute over ownership of a fishhook during a party just to outline how little a fight ending in injuries can break out where alcohol or drugs are involved. Here you have entire fraternities and sororities full of such young people all drinking and partying heavily, indeed from statistics, half of a town full. It's easy to see how an altercation that night or revenge for a prior altercation could have provoked these murders.


An ex boyfriend/girlfriend (I am not singling out any particular ex since I am sure all 4 victims have had prior ex boy/girlfriends at their age.)? Little has been said about prior relationships before college or the current ones named. M met her BF at college, E&X met at college, K had recently broken off a semi long term relationship that did not preclude a different relationship in between those on/off again breakups or even a current one that led to the breakup. Them being in a relationship does not preclude them having a fling outside the relationship at one time or another either. It's easy to see a jilted lover being responsible especially if that jilted lover believed the other three friends were in some way involved in he/she being jilted. I am not ruling out a woman with strong upper body strength, rage filled woman, with 4 drunk, sleeping victims.

Someone in that house was connected to the evil that came in it that night. That you can be sure of. Eventually the police will single out which one which in turn will lead them to the killer.

Then you have a college full of young people who live on SM and post their innermost private details of their lives on it. Nothing remains a secret for long among very socially active kids these days. Sooner or later, sworn to secrecy frat brothers or sorority sisters or not, someone will talk. After all this is the murder of 4 people, not a super secret dark of the night Greek ritual known only to the brothers and sisters of that Greek house.

Give these kids some time to think about how being charged as an accessory to 4 first degree murders can ruin their bright futures and all that sworn to be brothers and sisters forever will fly out the window.

ETA: When the killer is named there is going to be a lot of shock among relatives, townsfolk and people on here as to who it is and how close they were to the victims. IMO it's going to come out of left field.

JMO

You really can’t be ‘sure’ of it. It’s possible, sure. But it could just as easily not be true.

 

[Fascinated1]

Not disputing what you're saying, but thinking about the minds of individuals. Why in the world would more than one person be involved in a murder unless it was for a financial reason, i.e. stealing? I just cannot fathom what would motivate a mass murder group effort. If several are aware, what mindsets have no conscience/

I read the police update and did not get the impression they think it’s more than one person (look at the apostrophe placement). “Individual’s” vs individuals. IMO they are looking for pictures where people may be engaging in illegal activity (underage drinking; drug use) and want people to know no one is going to get in trouble for providing the picts. They have said this several times now so I get the sense they are looking for one specific point in the evening. I wish they would be more specific here to encourage people to come forward (unless they are concerned ab safety of the people who have pictures).

IN MY OPINION ONLY-they are looking for pictures at the frat party or involving those people with e and x. More and more I’m thinking e and x were killed first and may not fully have been asleep. Before the other girls arrived home. The early articles only gives one time for e and x (in Idaho statesman article from 11.16)—that’s from 8:00 on. They don’t know WHEN they got home except Xana’s dad indicated a text at 1230 that said they were home. Ethan’s mom noted in that article that the downstairs roomates heard loud male voices—and the downstairs roomates were said to be home by 1:00. So just thinking that they heard the loud voices ard then-and locked their doors. Once it was quiet they assumed (IMO) that the party was over and slept through the top floor murders. It’s possible that k and m came home at the end of it but didn’t know what had happened. Maybe they saw something they could ID him. Maybe he thought they could ID him-which is why they “had to go upstairs” to quote KG dad. Maybe there was someone waiting outside (a look out) as things were unfolding inside who the girls talked to (so they could ID them). Lots of scenarios are possible but anyone who was a witness is dead. I’m sure that has others scared to come forward. MOO.

 

[Bliss_Perth]

Idaho cops offered counseling as pressure intensifies to find suspect

There are no leads and no suspects in the murders of four University of Idaho students six weeks after the brutal slayings.

www.dailymail.co.uk

SBM: Locked in their rooms on the first floor, it was one of these two survivors who placed the 911 call at 11.58am N

I have a different theory on that...I'd like to know where DM gets their info

The roommates didn't come out their locked room - Instead they could have called a friends boyfriend to come over because they couldn't get in contact with X and E. The person they called discovered X and E and placed the 911 call from inside the house on the room mates phone.

MOO

On November 13th, at 11:58 a.m., a 911 call requested aid for an unconscious person. The call originated from inside the residence on one of the surviving roommates’ cell phone.
On November 13th, the surviving roommates summoned friends to the residence because they believed one of the second-floor victims had passed out and was not waking up

King Road Homicides | Moscow, ID

www.ci.moscow.id.us

 

[Marie A]

All IMHO -
I’m personally sad to be reading so many conspiracy theories about someone targeting X and E.
They didn’t tick anybody off, no hit men (eyes rolling around and around), no drug cartels, nada.

It simply didn’t happen.

They are just regular, nice, good and normal college kids.

Here‘s the real scoop:they were young and in love.
Simple as that. Nothing to report here.
Likely they spent quality time and possibly quantity time in the privacy of E’s room at the Sigma Chi house and/or they may have gone back and forth from X’s private locked bedroom at King Road to the frat party 5 minutes away.
They were off the grid doing what young and in love college people do in some form or fashion and nobody else paid any attention to their coming and going from the frat party.
They may have gone to take a nap and cuddle, right?
Timeline filled in.
Been there, done that.

Nothing nefarious happened that night until hours later.
It was a regular normal Saturday night for a regular normal college couple until it wasn’t.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Feels like this is the most relaxed have ever seen Chief Fry.

anybody else think that?

maybe there's a suspect or an arrest in the horizon?