ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #12

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Has LE actually mentioned/acknowledged the 6PM Friday filthy, bawling child siting? I don't think they have. Sheriff Bowerman may have mentioned hearing a report about it in his interview with NE. I'll have to check.

In the latest video Sheriff Bowerman only talks of a witness that maybe saw Deorr/child in the car. It isn't clear whether that was when the witness was pumping gas or if it was the car the child may have been in. It doesn't sound like the witness is a cashier at one of the shops?

No one has acknowledged the 6:00 store sighting. The only way we have heard about it is because DK brought it up in the interview.

ETA: I'm guessing if there really was a store sighting, Bowerman probably would have mentioned that instead of relying on a witness pumping gas that may or may not have seen Deorr.
 
Has LE actually mentioned/acknowledged the 6PM Friday filthy, bawling child siting? I don't think they have. Sheriff Bowerman may have mentioned hearing a report about it in his interview with NE. I'll have to check.

In the latest video Sheriff Bowerman only talks of a witness that maybe saw Deorr/child in the car. It isn't clear whether that was when the witness was pumping gas or if it was the car the child may have been in. It doesn't sound like the witness is a cashier at one of the shops?

BBM Exactly...
 
http://newsradio1310.com/authorities-not-giving-up-search-for-missing-idaho-boy/

from the link:

Bowerman went on to say he is not ruling out the possibility of abduction by person or animal. Bowerman said DeOrr’s mother and father met with a sketch artist this last week. DeOrr’s parents have said they thought a man was looking strangely at DeOrr at a gas station in Leadore. The artist is drawing a composite sketch of what the man may have looked like. Bowerman hopes to release the sketch soon.
Wait, is the gas station = shop they bought fries from? Or they re-fueling twice?
 
I do not have a link and I don't know what thread, but wasn't there a blond lady that did an interview that spoke of Deorr and the french fries?

I had to walk away, because none of it was adding up. If that lady and the store clerk never saw him I think we have a big problem here.

Are you thinking of the interview of the woman working back in the kitchen? She just talked about bringing food to the search party. She didn't mention anything about seeing the family or about serving them fries. I don't think anyone but the PI has talked about fries.

Also, I rewatched the parents' interview when they talk about the clerk rumor and DK DOES SAY IT WAS HIM SEEN AT THE STORE, JUST THE CLERK HAD THE WRONG TIME

It's at 7:15 in the interview.

https://youtu.be/mwM1oG3z358

JM brings up the rumor that a clerk that had been working said she saw a gentleman with a young blond boy matching DeOrr's description, that the gentleman was buying him candy and that the boy was bawling...in a black truck. Here is what DK follows with:

DK: "Here's the problem. My pick up truck is black. As a family we went down to get some, to get a few things..."

JM: "Earlier."

DK: "It was me, but they claim it was at 6 o'clock that evening...but we were still with search and rescue until, what, a quarter to four?....We hadn't left the camp since 1 o'clock that afternoon, so it's just a lot of hearsay."

You can tell that JM is not happy with the clerk's description. (Although it's actually hard to interpret whether she meant the clerk said the boy or the man was filthy and whether the the little boy was bawling in the store or in the truck.) Still, the only part of the rumor that the parents directly debunk is the time. DK claims that it was indeed him and little DeOrr the clerk saw, just earlier.Maybe this rumor is the closest thing they have to corroborating the toddler was with them at the store that day. Dunno!

Of course, it totally could have been a different guy and kid in a different black truck. I am sure there are other filthy dads in black trucks with crying boys in the world. Especially out in the country where people are outside working on ranches and hiking/camping, etc.
 
Wait, is the gas station = shop they bought fries from? Or they re-fueling twice?

The Stage Shop is all things! It is a gas station, and a convenience store with a deli! So they were technically at a gas station and at a store. We know they were there to buy things per DK and the PI and the sheriff. And the PI said they bought fries and a man was staring at DeOrr, so the staring seems more linked to the store experience than filling up on gas. Just my interpretation!
 
Two other interesting things I notice in watching the parents' unedited interview.

1. DK explains not once, not twice, but three separate times during the interview why he drove off in his truck to make the 911 call. In fact, his very first response in the interview turned into a 30-second explanation of his 911 trip. Even though he was not asked by NE why he drove off in his truck at all during the interview.
I'm no behavior analyst, but could there be a "there" there?

2. This is how the interview was kicked off:

NE: "Okay, DeOrr, take us back to what was it, Friday?"

The parents seem a bit caught off guard and then DK seems to stall by stumbling, "I'm not sure what day it is today."

NE says "Today's Monday, it was Friday."

JM takes over the answer and says, "It was Friday."

Then DK launches into the time they called 911 and why he drove away to do it.


This would have been the perfect time for the parents, who believed their child had been abducted, to clarify with the media that their camp trip started on Thursday, not Friday as had been reported. So that if anyone saw some weird person camping or around town on Thurs they could provide that tip. I wonder why the parents wouldn't have clarified that very basic error in the timeline, but instead go into great detail about far less relevant things. Head scratching.
 
That may be true, but IMO the problem with that is, we wouldn't have even known about that rumor if they hadn't brought it up in the first place.

They obviously heard about that rumor from SOME source. How were they to know who had also heard it?
 
But..... If neither the store clerk or the gas station clerk can confirm 100% they saw Deorr, and neither IR or GGP can confirm 100% he was at the campsite, wouldn't the parents have been taken in for questioning by now or charged with something? The police have interviewed all of these people in detail, so surely it must mean at least one of each pair of them must have confirmed sightings?
 
But..... If neither the store clerk or the gas station clerk can confirm 100% they saw Deorr, and neither IR or GGP can confirm 100% he was at the campsite, wouldn't the parents have been taken in for questioning by now or charged with something? The police have interviewed all of these people in detail, so surely it must mean at least one of each pair of them must have confirmed sightings?

IR might have confirmed he saw the toddler. We just haven't been told that. But even if he couldn't confirm that he saw DeOrr specifically on, say, Fri after the store, or Fri before the store, or even at all, doesn't necessarily mean the toddler wasn't there. And even if the clerk can't confirm seeing the toddler in the store, doesn't mean that he wasn't there or in the car. (I don't know about GGP, but if his mental health is declining to the point that they weren't originally going to name him a POI, I'm not sure how much weight his statements hold in terms of accuracy.)

It seems that the toddler could have been exactly where the parents said he was at all times right up until he went missing and there is a chance that others couldn't confirm that every step of the way.

That could possibly be grounds for head scratching or suspecting something is off, but no way could the parents be arrested for that.

As far as questioning the parents, it absolutely seems that the parents have been questioned and continue to be questioned. In fact, LE is going back to the beginning and re-interviewing them again. Interviewing is questioning. I don't know if those interviews are being recorded (hopefully) or where they are being held, but LE wouldn't read them their rights and hold them for questioning unless the parents were being charged with something or weren't being cooperative (and it seems like they have been very cooperative).

Just my take!!!
 
But..... If neither the store clerk or the gas station clerk can confirm 100% they saw Deorr, and neither IR or GGP can confirm 100% he was at the campsite, wouldn't the parents have been taken in for questioning by now or charged with something? The police have interviewed all of these people in detail, so surely it must mean at least one of each pair of them must have confirmed sightings?

Not necessarily. The first thing we heard about GGP was that he was mentally and physically "disqualified" from being a person of interest (although that later changed). So while GGP may have indicated that he had seen the child, that information may be unreliable, although not necessarily an outright lie.

And if IR was in bed when the family arrived, and asleep or off fishing when they were up and about the next morning, then he might not have seen the baby at all. Remember, in his NE semi-naked interview, he answered, 'as far as I know, he just disappeared,' to one question, and 'what did the grandfather say?' to another.

So it was possible for him to say he hadn't seen the child, and that wouldn't necessarily have been a red flag. Both the camping buddies have plausible reasons for not having seen DeOrr (even though GGP might think he had). And it's possible that the store clerk(s) might not have remembered seeing him, even assuming that they were questioned and shown a photograph right away.

And if any of the above makes sense, maybe that's where the filthy bawling candy bar story (repeated by DK) comes from.
Perhaps LE talked to the clerk, who said 'well I do remember a man and a little boy in a black truck at about 6pm on Friday (or Thursday?) evening.'

Wow! I just said a whole lot of things that might or might not make sense, and it would still mean that there are no real clues. Sorry...
 
Could someone please help me with the timeline? Do we know what time they left the campground to go to the store 20 minutes away? And what time they returned to camp? Then how long until the 911 call? I'm trying to figure how long they were back at the camp until Deorr goes missing.

40 minutes travel time to and from store. Maybe 10-15 minutes at the store. Right?

Thanks so much.


http://www.eastidahonews.com/2015/08/lemhi-sheriff-opens-up-about-deorr-kunz-case/

"The next morning, DeOrr’s parents said they took their son to a store about 20 minutes from the campsite."
 
IR might have confirmed he saw the toddler. We just haven't been told that. But even if he couldn't confirm that he saw DeOrr specifically on, say, Fri after the store, or Fri before the store, or even at all, doesn't necessarily mean the toddler wasn't there. And even if the clerk can't confirm seeing the toddler in the store, doesn't mean that he wasn't there or in the car. (I don't know about GGP, but if his mental health is declining to the point that they weren't originally going to name him a POI, I'm not sure how much weight his statements hold in terms of accuracy.)

It seems that the toddler could have been exactly where the parents said he was at all times right up until he went missing and there is a chance that others couldn't confirm that every step of the way.

That could possibly be grounds for head scratching or suspecting something is off, but no way could the parents be arrested for that.

As far as questioning the parents, it absolutely seems that the parents have been questioned and continue to be questioned. In fact, LE is going back to the beginning and re-interviewing them again. Interviewing is questioning. I don't know if those interviews are being recorded (hopefully) or where they are being held, but LE wouldn't read them their rights and hold them for questioning unless the parents were being charged with something or weren't being cooperative (and it seems like they have been very cooperative).

Just my take!!!

Hey, Kammie, I really didn't copy your post and ideas! While I was laboring along on mine, you had already posted the nearly exact same thing I had. Jinx, Sphinx, I owe you a Coke!
 
I don't think anybody ever said where the blanket, cup and monkey were. I think it was assumed they were in the truck based on a comment that Grandpa Kunz said in one of the early interviews, but it has never been confirmed.

ETA: Grandpa Kunz was not at the campground the day little Deorr disappeared.

Adding on to that, in the parents' interview, DK said the blanket JM was holding was "just like" DeOrr's or some other phrase to say it wasn't the actual blanket.
It's confusing that GPA Kunz said DeOrr's blanket, cup and monkey were in the truck, because DK and JM seemed to think it was telling that he disappeared without them--like someone must have taken him against his will because he wouldn't have wandered off without his favorite things. But if they were in the truck, he wouldn't have had the option of taking them.

ETA: It just occurred to me that the toddler's blanket would be one of the more obvious items for LE to take into evidence.
 
Could someone please help me with the timeline? Do we know what time they left the campground to go to the store 20 minutes away? And what time they returned to camp? Then how long until the 911 call? I'm trying to figure how long they were back at the camp until Deorr goes missing.

40 minutes travel time to and from store. Maybe 10-15 minutes at the store. Right?

Thanks so much.


http://www.eastidahonews.com/2015/08/lemhi-sheriff-opens-up-about-deorr-kunz-case/

"The next morning, DeOrr’s parents said they took their son to a store about 20 minutes from the campsite."

I am way over-posting and need to go pack for a trip, but...

The sheriff says in the newest video that the parents left the campground for Leadore (the store) at 10:30 or 11.

DK said in the parents' first interview that they returned to the campsite by 1 PM.

JM called 911 at 2:26 (or within a few mins).
 
Did I miss something? Did the sheriff say he had to go back to square 1? Did the FBI report caome back? I must have missed something here. Please help.

Anything I write is just my opinion
 
I am way over-posting and need to go pack for a trip, but...

The sheriff says in the newest video that the parents left the campground for Leadore (the store) at 10:30 or 11.

DK said in the parents' first interview that they returned to the campsite by 1 PM.

JM called 911 at 2:26 (or within a few mins).

Thank you. So back at camp about 1pm. Deorr is missing for over 1 hour before Jessica calls 911. That leaves approximately 26 minutes that they were back at camp. And Bowerman said it was 20-45 minutes that Deorr was unattended. This leads me to believe Deorr went missing almost immediately after returning to camp from the store. Any thoughts on that?


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/07/2...den-yield-no-clues-in-hunt-for-idaho-toddler/
"What happened during the 20 to 45 minutes the child was alone is a mystery to authorities, said Bowerman, who noted "all possibilities" are being investigated."


http://www.kboi2.com/news/local/911-call-for-missing-Idaho-Falls-toddler-released-315660311.html

"My 2-year-old son. We can't find him," said Jessica Mitchell in the 911 call.

She goes on to say the boy was wearing cowboy boots, blue pajama pants, and a camouflage jacket. She said they checked around the area they were camping for over an hour before calling 911.
 
We need confirmation from our clerks:

1) The candy bar clerk

2) The french fry clerk

Did you or did you NOT see little DeOrr when these purchases were made?

I'm sure they can be shown photos of the immediate family and confirm whether they saw them or not...and when.

Okay, LAST thing I'm posting tonight (haha, we'll see)...

In the newest article, it said that a receipt AND cashier proves the parents' trip to the store. I think cashier means clerk. So it sounds like the cashier/clerk was able to confirm that one or both of the parents were there buying things, but could not confirm that the toddler was with them (based on the fact that the sheriff instead referenced a gas customer's maybe sighting of DeOrr in the car and no mention of the clerk seeing the toddler at all).


A receipt and cashier proves the parents trip to the only convenience store in town, but was the toddler with his mother and father?

"Somebody said they thought they saw a child in the vehicle while they fueled up, but they're not positive," Bowerman said.

The family went back to camp and a few hours later the mother called 911 saying her son was missing.
 
The Stage Shop is all things! It is a gas station, and a convenience store with a deli! So they were technically at a gas station and at a store. We know they were there to buy things per DK and the PI and the sheriff. And the PI said they bought fries and a man was staring at DeOrr, so the staring seems more linked to the store experience than filling up on gas. Just my interpretation!

--i wish the sheriff would "treat" us, and let us know what was listed on the receipt that they have from the store.
 
IMO, The fact they are re-interviewing the 4 POI means that the FBI and LE do NOT believe this was an animal snatching or (based on the helicopter, heat seeking surveillance etc etc in the 3 mile radius) that they think Deorr wandered away either.

<modsnip>

The parents seem genuine and broken to me..but the sheriff saying they were going back to square one tells me something wasnt thorough ENOUGH.. he isn't saying.. "we are going to search 5 miles out for bones and a camo jacket". He is saying.. we are re-interviewing the 4 POI.. IMO, he must think the answer lies with them. That is my interpretation. JMO

Anything i write is just my opinion.
 
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