Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, and Liberty (Libby) German, 14/The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #88

[margarita25]

I was doing some research on a female reported missing today out of Dearborn County, IN and came across the ISP link below. I’m pretty sure we’ve posted it before but thought it couldn’t hurt to bring it fwd again:

Indiana Missing Person Bulletin - ...
PDFIN.gov › isp › files › Indiana_Missing_P...
May 8, 1995 · Indiana Missing Person Bulletin. ADAMS ...... SHERIFF DEARBORN COUNTY. 11/20/2018.
36 pages·125 KB
https://www.in.gov/isp/files/Indiana_Missing_Person_Bulletin.pdf

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ETA:

Bringing this forward as well:

Indiana / List:
Search for Missing Children

 

[gregjrichards]

I was doing some research on a female reported missing today out of Dearborn County, IN (IN - IN - Whitley Sierra McCabe, 17, last seen walking through a field, Dearborn County, 1 Apr 2019), and came across the ISP link below. I’m pretty sure we’ve posted it before but thought it couldn’t hurt to bring it fwd again:

Indiana Missing Person Bulletin - ...
PDFIN.gov › isp › files › Indiana_Missing_P...
May 8, 1995 · Indiana Missing Person Bulletin. ADAMS ...... SHERIFF DEARBORN COUNTY. 11/20/2018.
36 pages·125 KB
https://www.in.gov/isp/files/Indiana_Missing_Person_Bulletin.pdf

Thank you for sharing this margarita25. It is shocking how many people are missing. I wish we knew of any other missing people or deceased people’s cases law enforcement are looking at for similarities with this case.

 

[margarita25]

Bringing forward this old article:

“Carter held up a blue sticky note, calling the names of the four girls killed in the fire, in addition to those of the two girls found dead in Delphi in February. All six girls died in Carroll County, with less than three months between the incidents.

"The sticky note's been on my desk for months, close to a year now, and I have the exact same one at home. It's the last thing I see every single day. The Carroll County residents have endured something very few of us will ever be able to comprehend or understand," Carter said.“

ISP responds to NAACP allegation that fatal Flora fire investigation 'smells of a cover-up'

 

[margarita25]

Delphi murders: Dirt moves on Abby & Libby Park, their families’ hands-on, $1M dream

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Families of Delphi, Ind. murder victims hope new park will be place of healing

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Construction slow on Abby and Libby Memorial Park in Delphi

 

[Jim_M]

Delphi murders: Dirt moves on Abby & Libby Park, their families’ hands-on, $1M dream

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Families of Delphi, Ind. murder victims hope new park will be place of healing

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Construction slow on Abby and Libby Memorial Park in Delphi

They say time heals all wounds. I hope that the park will really bring more healing to the town.

The 'bestest' healing will be when they capture this monster, and provide justice for these young girls.

 

[NickoD]

Howdy folks, I am reading up and diving into this case after finding out about it yesterday. I have some questions but reading 88 threads seems daunting. Will I be breaking TOS if I were to ask them here? I used the search feature but couldn’t narrow down any discussion that provides answers. Thanks!

 

[kc1023]

Howdy folks, I am reading up and diving into this case after finding out about it yesterday. I have some questions but reading 88 threads seems daunting. Will I be breaking TOS if I were to ask them here? I used the search feature but couldn’t narrow down any discussion that provides answers. Thanks!

Go ahead and ask I'd say. Many of us have been here since the beginning and should be able to answer most of your questions fairly easily. Plus it's never a bad thing to bump the thread IMO.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Howdy folks, I am reading up and diving into this case after finding out about it yesterday. I have some questions but reading 88 threads seems daunting. Will I be breaking TOS if I were to ask them here? I used the search feature but couldn’t narrow down any discussion that provides answers. Thanks!

Welcome Nicko. We love seeing new faces on this thread.

Before diving in, you might like to have a look at the Media, Maps and Timelines thread. You may find many of the answers you're looking for there.

IN - Abigail Williams & Liberty German, Delphi, Media, Maps, Timelines NO DISCUSSION

The above link and many others can be found on p.1 of this thread. Once you get your head around some of that, you can ask your questions here.

 

[TTF14]

Welcome, Niko!

 

[NickoD]

Go ahead and ask I'd say. Many of us have been here since the beginning and should be able to answer most of your questions fairly easily. Plus it's never a bad thing to bump the thread IMO.

Thank you all! OK, I have tried to read up and still do. I am in the process of viewing some YT videos from others about this case.

My questions are around the scene. IMO, there is no more doubt about BG being on the bridge walking towards the girls. However one video showed that the other end of the bridge is closed. Essentially it looks to me as if someone would have to turn around, walk all the way back over the bridge and continue backwards through the path to get back to where cars can be parked. One article stated that this is pretty much the only reason for locals to walk on the bridge (as in, to return back).

Is this accurate? Do we know if the other end of the bridge (the direction the girls were walking towards) is closed off?

I also understand that the girls were found in the opposite side of the stream (meaning, they would have to either go back over the bridge as mentioned above or somehow cross at another point).

Assuming the above is accurate, are there any other areas one can cross the stream? Or is the stream essentially shallow (or non-existent during the time of the murders) that allows crossing at any point?

This case, IMO, needs to stay in the news. With all this evidence to take two years and have this unsolved is not good. The families need justice. Thank you and I will probably have more questions the more I dive into this. I appreciate everyone’s input.

 

[watcher9]

Thank you all! OK, I have tried to read up and still do. I am in the process of viewing some YT videos from others about this case.

My questions are around the scene. IMO, there is no more doubt about BG being on the bridge walking towards the girls. However one video showed that the other end of the bridge is closed. Essentially it looks to me as if someone would have to turn around, walk all the way back over the bridge and continue backwards through the path to get back to where cars can be parked. One article stated that this is pretty much the only reason for locals to walk on the bridge (as in, to return back).

Is this accurate? Do we know if the other end of the bridge (the direction the girls were walking towards) is closed off?

I also understand that the girls were found in the opposite side of the stream (meaning, they would have to either go back over the bridge as mentioned above or somehow cross at another point).

Assuming the above is accurate, are there any other areas one can cross the stream? Or is the stream essentially shallow (or non-existent during the time of the murders) that allows crossing at any point?

This case, IMO, needs to stay in the news. With all this evidence to take two years and have this unsolved is not good. The families need justice. Thank you and I will probably have more questions the more I dive into this. I appreciate everyone’s input.

Welcome to WS and this thread.
I'll make a stab at this.

I'm not good at posting maps and pictures but this link shows the trail from the town of Delphi to the Deer Creek which dead ends at the bridge. Any parking was done on this side of the bridge. The bridge was not intended to be part of the trail but was kept more to view and for its historic value. At this trail end were several posts put in the ground to discourage hikers, atv's, etc from going across the bridge which was once a railroad crossing. The rails though had been taken up and were no longer there. Over the years the planks had become in bad repair. The bridge (railroad crossing) passed real high over Deer Creek and some land before ending near a private road on the other side. At the time, there were no posts on that end of the bridge. People did go past the posts anyway to walk on the planks of the bridge. It was more of a thrill to try it (no handrails and watch your step) and once across they would turn around and walk back across.

It is believed that the girls passed through the posts to walk on the bridge and take pictures. One picture that Libby took of Abby shows in the background the posts at the beginning of the bridge so we know that the girls were at the far end of the bridge. It is believed that BG (bridge guy) came towards them and made them get off the bridge at the far end where he ordered them to go down the hill. There was a path there. This would be across the creek from the trail. When the girls were found, they were back on the trail side of the creek. Looking at this same map the final crime scene would be below the "g" on the words Monon Bridge. You will notice there is a bend in the creek which kept this site from the view of anyone on the bridge. Also there were sandbars showing in the creek where it would have been easier for them to cross.

Monon High Bridge Trail - Delphi | Indianatrails.com

 

[gregjrichards]

Howdy folks, I am reading up and diving into this case after finding out about it yesterday. I have some questions but reading 88 threads seems daunting. Will I be breaking TOS if I were to ask them here? I used the search feature but couldn’t narrow down any discussion that provides answers. Thanks!

Welcome NickoD thank you for joining us. You can ask anything but not about the girl’s families, the land owner or prior persons of interest as it’s against TOS. Thank you for your co-operation.

 

[NickoD]

Thank you so much @watcher9! That helps a lot.

One of the items that strikes me as odd is the choice of the approach: the bridge. I get the tactical advantages such as the inability for the girls to go anywhere but towards either end of the bridge as directed by BG. But why add the complexity of guiding two girls off a fully exposed bridge when he could have as easily used the woods to stage an attack? This is just IMO.

I wish after two years the authorities would release some more from that video.

 

[gregjrichards]

Thank you so much @watcher9! That helps a lot.

One of the items that strikes me as odd is the choice of the approach: the bridge. I get the tactical advantages such as the inability for the girls to go anywhere but towards either end of the bridge as directed by BG. But why add the complexity of guiding two girls off a fully exposed bridge when he could have as easily used the woods to stage an attack? This is just IMO.

I wish after two years the authorities would release some more from that video.

Whatever is on the rest of the video law enforcement don’t want to share it. I don’t know if we will find out what is on it until the case goes to trial if it does.

Have you heard him say “down the hill”? Have you any thoughts about it?

 

[NickoD]

Have you heard him say “down the hill”? Have you any thoughts about it?

I did. While it’s just a snip of the larger audio track, the voice comes across as confident, calm, and collected to me.

Assuming that the phrase is part of the criminal event, and not part of an unrelated conversation, “down the hill” becomes a directional command. In that scenario, the suspect is telling the girls where to go as he is walking behind them, possibly threatening them with a firearm.

Secondary, it conveys premedication. “Down the hill” as a directive command to get the group away from any other potential hikers that might be on the trail. He is determined that he will commit this crime and now he is just making sure this is done in the most efficient manner possible. Forgive my description but this is that clinical for the suspect.

Finally, it could also relay familiarity with the environment when combined with the calmness of the voice. Someone who is nervous and is just frantically looking to get off the road at any “down the hill” area would come across differently.

All above are based IMO.

 

[gregjrichards]

I did. While it’s just a snip of the larger audio track, the voice comes across as confident, calm, and collected to me.

Assuming that the phrase is part of the criminal event, and not part of an unrelated conversation, “down the hill” becomes a directional command. In that scenario, the suspect is telling the girls where to go as he is walking behind them, possibly threatening them with a firearm.

Secondary, it conveys premedication. “Down the hill” as a directive command to get the group away from any other potential hikers that might be on the trail. He is determined that he will commit this crime and now he is just making sure this is done in the most efficient manner possible. Forgive my description but this is that clinical for the suspect.

Finally, it could also relay familiarity with the environment when combined with the calmness of the voice. Someone who is nervous and is just frantically looking to get off the road at any “down the hill” area would come across differently.

All above are based IMO.

Thanks for replying and sharing your thoughts on the audio clip. I agree with everything you have said.

 

[JudgeJudi]

This is Gray Hughes' animated video for those who may have missed it.

When you get to the end and BG has caught up with Abby, you can well imagine how terrified they both must have been. It's beyond creepy.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Assuming that the phrase is part of the criminal event, and not part of an unrelated conversation, “down the hill” becomes a directional command. In that scenario, the suspect is telling the girls where to go as he is walking behind them, possibly threatening them with a firearm.

@NickoD, did you see the closeup image where you can see what appears to be a gun underneath BG's jacket? If it is, that would indicate to me that he's left-handed. Many of us share your view that he had a firearm. The girls were very close friends and from what we know of the them, Libby would have tried to protect Abby. She had a much bigger build and was very sporty so obviously she would have been a lot stronger. For this reason, I think he murdered Libby first. If he did have a gun, he had total control over both of them.

 

[JudgeJudi]

However one video showed that the other end of the bridge is closed.

I'm not sure which video you're referring to but this is the current situation.

The bridge was quite dangerous to walk on due to the weathered railroad ties. I've read that you couldn't run on it if you needed to.

The bridge is currently being refurbished. A temporary chain-link security fence was installed at the north end with gates that allow access for construction equipment. Fencing surrounds the area, limiting access while workers stabilize one of the main supporting piers.

In the next phase, to be finished sometime later this year, new decking will replace the old railroad ties, and handrails will be added for safety so that visitors will be able to walk part way across to overlook the Deer Creek Gorge.

 

[JudgeJudi]

My questions are around the scene.

I think you'll like this Gray Hughes video. In the beginning you can see the track the girls took that leads to the bridge. Once on the bridge, you can fast forward to 16:25 which will take you from the end of the bridge, down the hill, and on to the crime scene (which still has the crime scene tape). The commentary is very interesting.