Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #105

[Boxer]

BBM

Not limited to teens. Anyone who's spent enough time around the park can figure that out.

That is true. The south approach is a bit tricky for a complete stranger though.
MOO someone from outside of expected groups spending time in the park should
leave some what noticable.
An ex-teen i.e. young adult, is my suspicion, one that liked that area. Homeschooled, or attended one of the local high schools.

RSBM & BBM

Perhaps they feel this way because Libby's phoned pinged around town for a time that afternoon? I started reading over thread 1 and the pinging is mentioned within the first few pages, however, some of the supporting articles are no longer available.
I do remember Libby's Grandfather was the one who mentioned it. JMO

MOO the problem ia I see no way for LE to be able to get the tower pinging data from towers on 2/13/2017. It takes a court order and tome as dar as I know.
A gps tracking app might be likely - but I don't think they that either otherwise they would have known the last of the phone and gone straight there.
Possibly a friend worked at the cell phone company and was able to get that data without red tape.

 

[kodi]

MOO the problem ia I see no way for LE to be able to get the tower pinging data from towers on 2/13/2017. It takes a court order and tome as dar as I know.
A gps tracking app might be likely - but I don't think they that either otherwise they would have known the last of the phone and gone straight there.
Possibly a friend worked at the cell phone company and was able to get that data without red tape.

Good point!

 

[kodi]

Thanks for the suggestion! This was mentioned early on, you're right. But I think it's since been discussed that the phone's signal was simply bouncing off towers and never left the crime scene. JMO

I couldn't remember whatever came of the discussion, just that it was discussed. Thanks for this!

 

[sunshineray]

I'm a chronic insomniac but this case has kept me up despite of that fact, and I'm guessing the same for many of you.
The last few weeks and still yesterday, many of us just know something is off with this, really off. The PC in April set off a bit of a "storm" and we've been left "flying in the wind." We are confused by the very deliberate tone and words Carter used and yet, at the same time not really giving us much to chew on.
After doing a bit of surfing off WS (I ignore the whackos) some pieces are falling together for me. Nagging thoughts that actually started right after I saw the PC and started looking back at this case. Although I was convinced to begin with that they had their suspect locked in, they just needed to tie up the case with more evidence, I had to do an "about face" when Carter started talking more, post PC. I now believe they have a strong suspicion what group of individuals to look at, but do not know who in that element of society did this, or they have a strong suspicion but can't prove it, yet. I believe someone is VERY scared to to say anything, for if uncovered, they know THEIR possible fate. If they have, it's been through anonymous tips that were investigated and then dismissed due to alibis and such.

We remain confused because we're STUCK in the false narrative LE was for two plus years, that Abby and Libby were in the wrong place at the wrong time and that this heinous crime was "random" and opportunistic murder, with no prior connection. I'm not implying Abby and Libby knew their attacker, on the contrary, they were just innocent victims of a dark and slimy world. There is a web of lies here that is keeping us from the truth. I'm also not implying LE are to blame, they were fed lies and diversions and they "bought" them, but not anymore. I believe there's a number of individuals that could "do the right thing". It's even possible the monster that did this is already behind bars for something else, but there's no DNA to link him directly to the girls. LE has never said one way or the other that they have strong DNA evidence.


Well, that's where I'm at today All MOO, naturally. I do hope someone who knows or suspects who did this has the courage to "do the right thing."

ed:sp

While LE has never quantified the DNA they have, the Sheriff of Carroll County has said right before Christmas last year investigators sent "more evidence to FBI in Quantico" for "DNA testing research".
Cops Send Evidence To FBI In Indiana Teens Abigail Williams & Liberty German’s Murder

The other thing said I'm still trying to nail down in my mind exactly what was meant.

"...News 18 also asked Riley if there was a chance the killer could be someone police have already interviewed. BBM

"Somebody may have already interviewed him," said Riley. "I'm not going to say they have or have not, but there's a possibility that has happened. The person apparently gave the investigating officers the information they were looking for. We have to try to go back and check on the information that we have received."

ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'

 

[Wells]

Yes, I addressed this in a following post.

My apologies. I was typing too slowly and missed that.

 

[mtnlites]

That is true. The south approach is a bit tricky for a complete stranger though.
MOO someone from outside of expected groups spending time in the park should
leave some what noticable.
An ex-teen i.e. young adult, is my suspicion, one that liked that area. Homeschooled, or attended one of the local high schools.

I agree that it would be difficult for a stranger; I was responding to the part about it being a teenager. Teens and young people are not the only ones who know that park well and can find their way around easily. People of all ages hang out there.

ETA for clarity

 

[sunshineray]

Even if someone does know...which I very much doubt...again, if no DNA or perhaps an item of their clothing in his possession, etc...not sure how LE can rule a person in or out. Jmo

From the April PC:
"We are confident that you have told someone what you have done, or at the very least they know because of how different you are since the murders"

ISP had reason(s) to state the firm belief in the above. I don't know why, I can only surmise why.

I wonder if marital privilege comes into play? It could be the reason behind the car needing another's witness to it being somewhere other than home?

 

[MassGuy]

From the April PC:
"We are confident that you have told someone what you have done, or at the very least they know because of how different you are since the murders"

ISP had reason(s) to state the firm belief in the above. I don't know why, I can only surmise why.

I wonder if marital privilege comes into play? It could be the reason behind the car needing another's witness to it being somewhere other than home?

This is a pretty standard profile, one based on the actions and behavior of many others who have committed crimes like this.

It wouldn’t require any specific knowledge of him actually doing this.

This is something you could say with confidence, as you’d be right most of the time.

 

[NameUser]

Does anyone know what you cannot reply to someone from thread 104? I wanted to try to inquire with another member about something, but cannot quote them. Any Ideas why this is?

 

[Krwiley60]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>

I remember when it was fresh, billboards were placed across the nation. I wonder if they still believe he could be somewhere else, considering their focus on Delphi?

My unscientific and subjective gut feeling tells me he is a long ways away.

I feel the same. If he was from Delphi, moved away, came back or visits, why would you want to murder someone in your own backyard where you could easily be identified? I go back and forth with this but my gut tells me he left the area immediately to go back “home” without anyone realizing he was gone.

 

[cluciano63]

This is a pretty standard profile, one based on the actions and behavior of many others who have committed crimes like this.

It wouldn’t require any specific knowledge of him actually doing this.

This is something you could say with confidence, as you’d be right most of the time.

I suppose so though I am doubtful he would tell anyone he murdered two young girls. Unless he told a priest maybe, which also seems unlikely.

As far as motive, it is glaringly obvious to me as a sex crime. Would be shocked if otherwise.

 

[cluciano63]

Does anyone know what you cannot reply to someone from thread 104? I wanted to try to inquire with another member about something, but cannot quote them. Any Ideas why this is?

Once a thread is closed, you can’t post on it.

 

[Krwiley60]

That is true. The south approach is a bit tricky for a complete stranger though.
MOO someone from outside of expected groups spending time in the park should
leave some what noticable.
An ex-teen i.e. young adult, is my suspicion, one that liked that area. Homeschooled, or attended one of the local high schools.


MOO the problem ia I see no way for LE to be able to get the tower pinging data from towers on 2/13/2017. It takes a court order and tome as dar as I know.
A gps tracking app might be likely - but I don't think they that either otherwise they would have known the last of the phone and gone straight there.
Possibly a friend worked at the cell phone company and was able to get that data without red tape.

There are some carriers that will ping a phone without a warrant if it involves suicide or potentially some other bodily harm.

 

[Boxer]

I agree that it would be difficult for a stranger; I was responding to the part about it being a teenager. Teens and young people are not the only ones who know that park well and can find their way around easily. People of all ages hang out there.

ETA for clarity

Yes, agree not just teens are on the trail.
I wonder what to label adult groups that are familiar to the MHB. With the lowered age range I believe all groups
need to be looked at again.

Here are are two adult groups:

Local Adults who knew about and went to MHB as kids or teens. Example, was a student at a local HS, or spent some time in Delphi area for one reason or another. Now lives in Delphi or Delphi area.

Adults who discovered MHB later,
as adults, and explored it. Some examples, someone who moved to Delphi as an adult, IP employee or other Delphi worker, a trucker that stops there, a drug dealer, or a RR, nature, or fitness buff, any reason to be a temporary visitor.

 

[Boxer]

There are some carriers that will ping a phone without a warrant if it involves suicide or potentially some other bodily harm.

Good to know. Then it is possible.
I think that the pinging around was due to their moving around in the overlap range area of two towers. Horrible to think about.

 

[Boxer]

There are some carriers that will ping a phone without a warrant if it involves suicide or potentially some other bodily harm.

MOO if they called the cell company and said that, MOO it means the police did not think the worst thing that would happen was cold night. I have never thought they were possibly that cavalier, MOO they were concealing their concern.

 

[FleurQualia]

I suppose so though I am doubtful he would tell anyone he murdered two young girls. Unless he told a priest maybe, which also seems unlikely.

As far as motive, it is glaringly obvious to me as a sex crime. Would be shocked if otherwise.

BBM

This is also what I suspect, first and foremost. Though I would think it would be difficult to sexually assault two victims; on the other hand, he managed to control and murder both of them, which would also be difficult. Excuse my language, but this guy was brazen AF.

Another thought: I suppose the victims don't have to be sexually assaulted for the crime to be sexually motivated. He could've just got off on the controlling and killing.

I actually hope the later is more true; I don't want to think these girls endured the horror of a sexual attack.

My other thought for motive is possibly just a thrill kill, but I am not confident in that. Mainly because I think he targeted them for specifically being two young females, as opposed to just killing anybody.

JMO and all that jazz.

 

[FleurQualia]

Also, adding that if it was sexually motivated it feeds into my fears that he has done this before and will do it again, if he hasn't already. Unless he has been locked up on other charges.

 

[ab01]

I suppose so though I am doubtful he would tell anyone he murdered two young girls. Unless he told a priest maybe, which also seems unlikely.

As far as motive, it is glaringly obvious to me as a sex crime. Would be shocked if otherwise.

I'm not sure any of these types normally confess their sins to a priest or religious figure

most perps that commit these types of crimes have zero conscious about that

Normally bits and pieces come out while they are consuming loud mouth soup and or drugs

Atleast thats been my experience from cases I have followed
JMO

 

[Tiger Stripes]

Same. It's like he vanished into thin air.

I wonder if he has no close living relatives, and is a recluse with no friends or even acquaintances. His neighbors might think he's just kind of weird guy, if they even think of him at all (or have even ever seen him out and about).

JMO (or random thoughts, I should say)

Noop! I don't believe for a nano-second that he has "no close living relatives", or is a recluse, etc. What he does have? Immediate family that are frightened.out.of.their.minds. So frightened, in fact, that even though they know that telling LE about their relative is "the right thing to do", they are afraid of, oh -- soo many things: afraid of him (What'll he do when he finds out that we were the ones who turned him in?), afraid of their futures (We'll have to move! Everyone who's known us for years will shun us, or never again want to do business with us, etc., etc., re: their employment/employers, etc.), and just...filled with fears (after all, who can even begin to imagine what it would be like to be, say, immediate family members living in the same town, highly respected, seeing the suspect perhaps weekends, or once a week, etc., wondering if he might turn his angry impulses on them, murdering them?

n. b. While I have nothing other than MOO on this, I'm thinking that the suspect did not directly tell his family; rather, I think that he "ambiguously" told someone (i. e., told someone indirectly, without actually telling the "what" of his crime) who does know his family/at least one of his parents very well (and imagine how awful it would be, to have to have the burden of that knowledge). How thankful I was last evening to see & hear Supt. DC on a video link that a WS-er provided from a very recent interview that someone (the Armchair Detective? not sure) had with DC. During the course of that brief interview, DC very clearly stated that LE will protect [the informant]. Hearing *that* was a great "bright spot" in this case, I thought. (They've probably said it privately, LE to each other, but...have never been so clear about that as DC was on the short video I saw/heard last evening.) Sorry I'm not good at locating things yet here on WS, or I'd post it for everyone to watch...

That "offer of protection" -- by LE -- very well *may* be a game-changer in this case. Praying that the suspect's family and confidante(s) will DO the right thing, and SOON.