Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #109

[Lmustang89]

I learned something scary over the weekend with my 16 year old son. He was supposed to go somewhere with friends then plans changed. My son showed me snap-maps. He said look, I can see where Seth and Luke are on snap-maps. It showed it right down to the spot they were at. So wondering if the BG used snap maps after talking with the girls on snap chat (with a profile - in my opinion) was a younger bg.

also, maybe they showed the younger version (in my opinion -pics are one and the same) to see if any other young teens have seen the profile on snap chat.

 

[Boxer]

I learned something scary over the weekend with my 16 year old son. He was supposed to go somewhere with friends then plans changed. My son showed me snap-maps. He said look, I can see where Seth and Luke are on snap-maps. It showed it right down to the spot they were at. So wondering if the BG used snap maps after talking with the girls on snap chat (with a profile - in my opinion) was a younger bg.

also, maybe they showed the younger version (in my opinion -pics are one and the same) to see if any other young teens have seen the profile on snap chat.

At school kids habitually borrow phones and let friends use their phones or know passwords. A person up to no good could have gained access through this loose info. I am sure all actual communication exchanges were intensely scrutinized, but the ability to observe her postings passively may mot be able to be exactly tracked.

 

[sunshineray]

I learned something scary over the weekend with my 16 year old son. He was supposed to go somewhere with friends then plans changed. My son showed me snap-maps. He said look, I can see where Seth and Luke are on snap-maps. It showed it right down to the spot they were at. So wondering if the BG used snap maps after talking with the girls on snap chat (with a profile - in my opinion) was a younger bg.

also, maybe they showed the younger version (in my opinion -pics are one and the same) to see if any other young teens have seen the profile on snap chat.

It's frightening indeed how easy it is to put your movements on display for the public to see. As kids they don't think about the possible danger. I remember years ago seeing my kid's facebook page for the first time. They were in freshman year of high school and had 700+ "friends" listed. I started asking them who's this, who's that. 50% of the time they responded, I don't really know them, that's so and so's friend. Very scary.

 

[CCJD]

I learned something scary over the weekend with my 16 year old son. He was supposed to go somewhere with friends then plans changed. My son showed me snap-maps. He said look, I can see where Seth and Luke are on snap-maps. It showed it right down to the spot they were at. So wondering if the BG used snap maps after talking with the girls on snap chat (with a profile - in my opinion) was a younger bg.

also, maybe they showed the younger version (in my opinion -pics are one and the same) to see if any other young teens have seen the profile on snap chat.

BBM

Snap Maps wasn't launched until June 2017.
Introducing Snap Map!

 

[Jax49]

If its "per LE" how is it "moo" ? I'm confused.

Sorry, pure habit. At the time I didn't have the link (added later).

 

[Yuletide]

I think Libby and Abby were protecting each other. Handcuffing or tying up one may have been easy enough for him or making one girl put the handcuffs on the other while he’s holding a weapon would have been fairly easy. We have no idea what was going through their minds. What always bothered me was why the girls didn’t run when they first saw this guy. Perhaps they didn’t fear him? Why let him get so close? I think one fought like heck for the other. They were a bond in life and in death. MOO

In my opinion the girls saw him before they crossed the bridge and thought he was kind of creepy. They carried on. When they saw him coming toward them on the bridge I think they made a split second decision to stop and let him pass so he would no longer be behind them. If they had decided to run instead the outcome may have been far different. But in fairness to their decision not to run, he was looking down, he wasn’t overtly threatening them.

 

[Torch Carrier]

I think BG was there as well searching with them and that could throw DNA into quite a hard issue to make sense of , I think they know this too .

And if BG's DNA there is easily explainable, this is why they need more evidence pinning him to having actually committed the crime. His having been at the crime scene itself can be explained away. So WHO are among those who were present AT the crime scene (the taped-off crime scene) exactly?

 

[Imvp2]

I appreciate this information. Yes, you know.. at that point they just thought the girls were lost or hurt and many thought they had just left and not told parents where they were going. So I can see how it was sort of make shift.. which is fine. I would have come out if I didn't live 900 miles away!

Thanks for your post@!

If that was the case, looking for lost, injured or inebriated young girls, wouldn't that be all the more reason to continue searching through the cold night? If it had been two 6 years I believe they would have continued. JMO...I will never understand why the official, professional searching stopped. It's not like a bad storm came in while searching or it was in the high mountains. This was a local wilderness trail close to many homes and a highway. I greatly support LE but just don't understand that decision. AJMO

Exactly. They were not worldly 16 to 18 yr olds, or truants. They were just kids trying to take pictures on a nice day off from school.

 

[Imvp2]

I appreciate this information. Yes, you know.. at that point they just thought the girls were lost or hurt and many thought they had just left and not told parents where they were going. So I can see how it was sort of make shift.. which is fine. I would have come out if I didn't live 900 miles away!

Thanks for your post@!

In my opinion the girls saw him before they crossed the bridge and thought he was kind of creepy. They carried on. When they saw him coming toward them on the bridge I think they made a split second decision to stop and let him pass so he would no longer be behind them. If they had decided to run instead the outcome may have been far different. But in fairness to their decision not to run, he was looking down, he wasn’t overtly threatening them.

In as much as they could, given their location. I think they did run, right thru the creek , and resulting in Libby's shoe coming off

 

[Torch Carrier]

Do we think it merely an odd coincidence that LG's phone was glitching and set back to factory reset just days before this murder? I wonder about that, if someone close to LG caused this phone jam making a reset necessary to clear things? Did someone *help* her reset it? Did someone mess with her phone in the days before the murder,perhaps while she was asleep or she left it out unattended somewhere or someone grabbed it, erased stuff or changed settings, she found it not working right so she factory re-set it?

 

[they'll get you]

If people came to search after LE had called the search off for the night would they have been verified as official searchers. Just thinking that it would be one way of explaining how your DNA was at the scene. I too believe that he was involved closely with the events.

Imagine the confusion the dogs had the next day.

When your cop said ‘he could even be in this room, hiding in plain sight’ or words to that effect, I knew they have nothing but hot air.

 

[Boxer]

In my opinion the girls saw him before they crossed the bridge and thought he was kind of creepy. They carried on. When they saw him coming toward them on the bridge I think they made a split second decision to stop and let him pass so he would no longer be behind them. If they had decided to run instead the outcome may have been far different. But in fairness to their decision not to run, he was looking down, he wasn’t overtly threatening them.

Sounds right.
There are two houses just through the tree line south and southwest between the end of the bridge and 625. There is a "beware of dog"up sign now, don't know about then.
I think that he quickly closed the distance between them after the 2:30 video, produced a gun, and that from then on they had no chance.

 

[rosesfromangels]

In as much as they could, given their location. I think they did run, right thru the creek , and resulting in Libby's shoe coming off

Her shoe could have come off in the struggle. I’m hoping our little hero got some good hits and scratches in.

 

[Boxer]

Imagine the confusion the dogs had the next day.

When your cop said ‘he could even be in this room, hiding in plain sight’ or words to that effect, I knew they have nothing but hot air.

He means a local, and to shock local people into looking around and wondering. Moving them from thinking the suspect is a stranger, an older transient worker type.

CDC didn't mean that the assailant WAS in the room, but he COULD be in that room.
That BG out of disguise could reasonably attend the PC without arousing suspicion, because he is local or has relevant community standing.

 

[Yuletide]

Sounds right.
There are two houses just through the tree line south and southwest between the end of the bridge and 625. There is a "beware of dog"up sign now, don't know about then.
I think that he quickly closed the distance between them after the 2:30 video, produced a gun, and that from then on they had no chance.

Agreed. I think it happened very quickly.

 

[moonlessnight]

This has always made me wonder. If there was a couple under the bridge at that time, they could have easily seen/heard something. It would be nice to know if LE identified the couple and interviewed them.

FSG said he heard/saw a "couple" down under the bridge right before Libby's dad started walking a trail looking for them. Didn't CE walking and taking pictures on the bridge also say she hear a couple? They are the only two I remember that actually heard something in the area that day, close to the time of the murders. I wonder just where this occured on the bridge, over water side or over land.

 

[Charlot123]

I still hope the perpetrator will be found. I hope he does not have a calm day now, waking up and thinking of what he has done.

 

[tresir2012]

Just some (more) speculation here.

I am not convinced that the person who committed the crime was a part of the actual search party.

I think that there is a chance that the killer may have had a close friend who was a searcher. Someone who is either in L.E. or the Fire Dept. who would be a valid source of 'real-time' certain information for him to keep on top of where the search was at.
'Someone who has followed this case to an extreme ' as the FBI has mentioned.

This person who searched could have unknowingly kept the killer apprised of the search status as it went on.

I really think that as soon as the crimes were committed, he got the hell out of there with a sick high from what he had done, and arrived quickly to his 'alibied' destination with a very reasonable excuse as to why he arrived later than expected.

I think that all searchers need to be questioned yet again and the right questions need to be asked. There may be 'that one tip' in there with the answers that are given.

JMO

What do you think the perp's alibi could have been for NOT attending the search party, assuming he was local as stated by LE. As witnessed by others, many came out to search all through the night from the area and outside the area even.

 

[Nerissa]

After reading quite a few theories - also many 'gut theories' of others who are very new to the case it is interesting that most:

1) think initially some type of catfish online - though I agree seems perp be caught by now (unless perp has alibi) - they were meeting him there deliberately

2) that this person maybe comfortable with kids or in general directing people - his ease of 'command' and assumption it will be followed through - teacher, coach, someone in a supervisory position, possibly even military or former military, or LE or former LE

3) that the reason they went along to some extent is that they knew the perp, to some extent at least, and so there was a level of trust

4) the perp knew they were going to be there - for instance, the sister who was dropping them off before meeting with her boyfriend (if memory serves) - who might have knew/overheard? (BF could say 'so&so will meet us/or have to wait or whatever, 'cause she's dropping her sister off at park', as example) or one of the fathers, correct?, who was at work & couldn't either pick/drop off, etc. - who could have overheard discussing this- ?

JMO

 

[CCJD]

In as much as they could, given their location. I think they did run, right thru the creek , and resulting in Libby's shoe coming off

Is there a link somewhere that says that Libby's shoe wasn't on her foot?