Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #127

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Sarahlou said:
Personally I think this was a one man crime. No way do I think there was more than one involved. JMO. Obviously it's possible but I'd be extremely surprised.
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I'm tending to one-man-crime, when I think about the killing itself. But if the killer had a very close someone - like a brother for example - as an accomplice, whom he trusted 100%, then I can imagine a two-men-crime.
If there were two of them, my only question to myself would be: How comes, that ie. a man, who has freetime like he wants or like his schedule would allow, can be a "crime-working-team" (evil) with someone, who is maybe employed?
 
something I ve noticed in non peados serial killers is that they would admit anything except rape/murder of a child/pre teen ......this they would deny angrily to their dying day .. its a stigma no killer wants
this leads me to think.. fat chance BG would be bragging about this crime even when drunk
 
sandy_80 said:
something I ve noticed in non peados serial killers is that they would admit anything except rape/murder of a child/pre teen ......this they would deny angrily to their dying day .. its a stigma no killer wants
this leads me to think.. fat chance BG would be bragging about this crime even when drunk
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I agree that if there is a serial killer who usually targeted adults but had one or more child victims in their series, the child victims are the ones they try to hide or not admit to. IMO

I have always felt that Abby and Libby's killer may have judged them to be older when he initiated the crime. Along with the video/recording being recovered, which he may not have expected, I think the news of their ages may make him sweat a little bit.

Maybe it's because I was just reading about the recently solved cold case abduction of 9 year old Michaela Garecht (her apparent killer had other adult victims, including one crime where he abducted and killed two women at once - and it might have been his first abduction/murder too - which made me think of Delphi), but it really highlights how opportunistic these offenders are. The fantasy might be attraction to a certain type of victim but the paramount thing when it comes to the crime itself is the perfect moment of opportunity.
 
they don't admit to their crimes against children because they don't want that label in prison. Ted Bundy would never discuss his 12 year old victim. But he did indeed murder this little girl. BTK also but he happily admitted to all his evil doings as long as he could recite them in excruciating detail before a jury... and family of the victims.

I seriously doubt they have any real feelings about killing children...Also I don't think calling the killer a coward really
will upset or anger the killer, as no doubt he can't conceive of cowardice or other emotions that cause guilt in normal human beings.

what he really is , is just a low level loser guy ( human garbage) who thinks he's someone, but he's not...he is just a failure at life and a person with severe psychiatric problems who should be locked up forever or executed, which he will be in the State of Indiana. I have every confidence.

so he will just be this loser guy, locked up like an animal and put to death ASAP.

he could come out now and make a deal for life ,no doubt he has other crimes against humanity under his belt. ...otherwise he's gonna get caught and thats the end for him...and Indiana will make sure the doesn't get any celebrity out of it.

mOO
 
ScumbagTrav said:
I'm hoping someone here can help me...

I recall an interview with Jerry Holeman where he is asked, specifically, if they found the murder weapon at the scene. He has a visible reaction, and refuses to answer at that time.

I BELIEVE it was the interview with Fox59 (a screenshot of its preview is attached) however the interview itself is no longer available at the link the FB page provided, or anywhere else on the site.

If I'm not mistaken, Gray Hughes did a LIVE video where he watched and discussed various members of law enforcement being interviewed by different news outlets. In it he watched the Fox59 interview, and another interview with Holeman. He also did a video of all the press conferences, but that was a different video than what I am looking for.

Does anyone know which video Gray did that? I've looked through his video uploads on his YouTube but cannot locate it.

Am I mistaken? Is this a Mandela Effect?
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Hi, not sure if your question has been addressed yet, but check here:

IN - Abigail Williams & Liberty German, Delphi, Media, Maps, Timelines NO DISCUSSION
 
Keyser Söze / BG?

Perhaps the girls did see him when they were early in walk... but he was presenting as someone they did not consider threatening? Different gate/voice/nature/overall impression. Maybe even with cane? Spoke with stutter?

Imagine seeing someone approachable and non threatening appear again as a stalker - all the sudden moving quickly and well and charging bridge... and then commanding the girls down the hill?

this could explain their immediate unease followed by filming... would be disorienting, confusing to process. AND explain 2 sketches even?
 
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Yemelyan said:
I agree that if there is a serial killer who usually targeted adults but had one or more child victims in their series, the child victims are the ones they try to hide or not admit to. IMO

I have always felt that Abby and Libby's killer may have judged them to be older when he initiated the crime. Along with the video/recording being recovered, which he may not have expected, I think the news of their ages may make him sweat a little bit.

Maybe it's because I was just reading about the recently solved cold case abduction of 9 year old Michaela Garecht (her apparent killer had other adult victims, including one crime where he abducted and killed two women at once - and it might have been his first abduction/murder too - which made me think of Delphi), but it really highlights how opportunistic these offenders are. The fantasy might be attraction to a certain type of victim but the paramount thing when it comes to the crime itself is the perfect moment of opportunity.
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Good post.

I disagree about not knowing their ages, they were dropped off there and I'm convinced he spotted them shortly thereafter. Once he saw they didn't have a vehicle, I'm sure he put 2+2 together and figured they were juveniles.

I agree 100% about these killers fantasizing about the crimes beforehand, and "striking while the iron's hot", so to speak.

JMO
 
why are we sure he must have seen them being dropped off ? assuming he came from FB .. and they entered from the reserve gate.. is the dropping place visible to those on the trails ?
 
Falling Down said:
Good post.

I disagree about not knowing their ages, they were dropped off there and I'm convinced he spotted them shortly thereafter. Once he saw they didn't have a vehicle, I'm sure he put 2+2 together and figured they were juveniles.

I agree 100% about these killers fantasizing about the crimes beforehand, and "striking while the iron's hot", so to speak.

JMO
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Bolded by me.

I do think he guessed they were young, I just feel that he may have thought upon seeing them that they could be in the age range of older teens instead of 13-ish. Just wanted to clarify that point as I realized my post could have read as if I was saying he might have mistaken them for women in their 30s, for example, which I didn't communicate well.

I think their clothes and demeanor probably marked them as young, but from a distance of several yards or without a good look at their faces it would have been challenging to know if both of them were 13-14 or more like 17-18.

Two 17 year olds who are
murdered would still be juvenile victims but probably would not be thought of as "two little girls," emphasis on little. I think that phrase by Carter was said to get under the skin of either a perpetrator or person sitting on information about a possible perpetrator.
 
minazoe said:
at the moment he realized they were little girls and not older teens he could have gone down the hill by himself .

mOO
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Unfortunately, the moment he realized they were younger girls - IF he did realize during the crime, he may have only learned when news started breaking about their disappearance - he might have thought his plans would work out better.

Even if he is caught, there will always be so much we will never know about his decisions on that day.
 
If you could ask ONE thing to be released to the public that could truly help the investigation, what would you ask?

I would want to know WHAT, if anything, was missing from the CS?

In my mind, if the killer took possession of one of the girls items, there is a HUGE possibility that someone would remember seeing said item.

I dunno.. Thoughts?

AMOO JMO MOO
 
Ravenmoon said:
If you could ask ONE thing to be released to the public that could truly help the investigation, what would you ask?

I would want to know WHAT, if anything, was missing from the CS?

In my mind, if the killer took possession of one of the girls items, there is a HUGE possibility that someone would remember seeing said item.

I dunno.. Thoughts?

AMOO JMO MOO
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This is a big one for me. I'd love to see, for example, the search warrant that was served at Bicycle Bridge Rd. I know these people are cleared (one of the very few that have been) so I'm not in any way suggesting their involvement, but I'd still love to know if LE thought at that time that they could find something a perpetrator removed from the crime scene.

My personal curiosity wants to know what the two or possibly three "signatures" were but I think the information that would have the best chance of furthering the case if released is everything LE knows about the vehicle parked at the CPS building on the day of the crime. That is, assuming they've concluded it's related which is a big "if."
 
tarabull said:
**BUMP**

RSBM....



(As requested previously, don’t post any theories or names on here...)

Just curious if anyone else took JB's suggestion & had a looky loo at obits in & around the Delphi area???
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I did that at the beginning, back in 2017
I searched that and multiple funerals, and many, many cemeteries.
 
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