Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #94

[JDough]

This two sketch is somewhat worrisome. Even if there is an arrest and the case goes to trial. The defense is definitely going to bring this issue up of why LE released the second sketch after a span of two years and asked everyone to ignore the first sketch. It definitely does not project the LE in good light. I do hope the prosecuting team will have a very convincing answer to this question. MOO.

I do believe the prosecution will have a very convincing answer.

According to First SGT. Jerry Holeman, there were several sketches created. There were not only two, there were several. It took months to create sketches with witnesses, locate the individuals, and conduct interviews. Some of the sketches portrayed family members, law enforcement, volunteer searchers, etc. Each of these individuals/sketches had to be ruled out, or kept for potential persons of interest throughout the investigation.

Information can be found in the May 4, 2018 CrimeCon interview with Ashleigh Banfield, beginning roughly @ 22:48.

The Delphi Murders: The Families Speak

 

[Krwiley60]

Me, three. I know we can’t talk about it but I feel better knowing that if we can make this connection, then LE already has and that’s part of what the PC was about. If you only lurk, it’s worth creating an account to look at.

To look at what? Curious!

 

[Mamamerced]

Hope this is what you are looking for, Mama:

I think the discussion may have revolved around the posting of the March 2017 UMC newsletter? (The movie night information can be found on page 8).

This was posted by OfficerHops. Thread 90, page 25, post #493.

http://www.delphiumc.org/hp_wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/MARCH2017-NEWSLETTER.pdf

Thank you for taking the time to find that newsletter. It settles the matter and I was mistaken.
Thanks to all who responded.

 

[RedBeard]

The release of info in this case or lack thereof is very, very typical. They aren't going to solve it by giving us their investigative details like cause of death, IMO. That's how you destroy a case and lose all ability to solve it.

The public is not meant to investigate this case. That's not what LE is looking for with public outreach. They're looking for witness tips. People who saw or heard or remembered or noticed something about the crime or someone they know.

I respectfully disagree, very seldom when the cause of death is known, is it withheld. I am not talking about the C.R, but most murder investigations have information released about the crimes. Even Caylee Anthony's C.R was released. Withholding stuff is common but withholding everything is not very common.

 

[gregjrichards]

Tomorrow there is a HLN one hour special report on the Delphi Murders live at 2pm ET and repeated at 8pm ET.

Watch it live online at this link Watch HLN Streaming Online - HLN Live Stream - LiveNewsWatch

TV listings guide TV Schedule for HLN

 

[aust amateur slueth]

Walking... approximately 1.25 miles.

Any rough ideas of how long it would take to walk or run that distance?

 

[TL4S]

Disorganized offender (from F.B.I. bulletin):
NCJRS Abstract - National Criminal Justice Reference Service

"...the disorganized offender is likely to be of below average intelligence, low birth order, and subjected to harsh parental discipline. He is in a confused and distressed state of mind at the time of the murder, is socially inadequate, and sexually incompetent. The crime scene shows that the crime was committed suddenly with no set plan of action for deterring detection. Facial destruction and sexually sadistic acts performed after the murder are typical. Disorganized offenders usually leave the victim in the same position in which he or she was killed and make no attempt to conceal the body."

Is it fact they were covers in leaves, or is that rumor?

 

[kkdj]

Who was that last shorter, heavy, young searcher talking, standing beside, Abby's Father, wearing a LE or FD night jacket, in the video ?.......moo

Eek! It won't load for me!

 

[Peppery]

Dear MassGuy,

Agreed.

On a sunny but cool February afternoon in that area, with no cars close by to hide/distort noise, no leaves on trees - voices would carry - sounds would appear to the ear to be closer. Yet, no one heard - screaming, thrashing, water sounds, splashing through water?

The monster had absolute control. Absolute. No one around the trail reported hearing anything.

I thought this way at first. But. We don’t know if anyone heard anything. We haven’t been told anyone heard anything. If anyone did hear something, we don’t know if they reported it to LE. If one is walking through the woods and not on a paved path, your footsteps are loud. Leaves crunch, twigs crack, each step makes more noise than you realize until you pay attention, for example, the way a hunter learns to walk so the deer don’t hear him. And even if someone heard something, at the time it probably didn’t stand out. Any parent knows kids/teens can scream and squeal and yell and sound like they’re in major trouble but just be joking around. Parents hear shrilly screams all the time at similar parks and don’t give it a second thought. At the time, no one knew there was evil in the woods and some sounds like water splashing or BG walking to/from the area probably didn’t even register until the next day. Moo.

 

[gregjrichards]

Is it fact they were covers in leaves, or is that rumor?

Rumour.

 

[Cherokee]

I think someone would have to know, before the day of the murders, that this is a shallow place along the creek where it's easy to cross. Because, it looks like there was no creek bed sand exposed during that time to clue someone unfamiliar with the area as to how deep the water really was. I bet BG has crossed the creek right there in the past and more than a few times. Fishing... hunting... or heading to the cemetery to "visit" a grave... something.

I have said this exact same thing privately. BG knew that area intimately, and he knew exactly where to march those girls down the hill and across the creek at a low point (with sandbars) that help a person walk across.

 

[ab01]

Any rough ideas of how long it would take to walk or run that distance?

theres various factors that come into play, 20-25 minutes walking estimated

edited

 

[pepper 34]

I think it's interesting, & what a lot of people seem to be missing, is that there was NO hint of this 'change in direction' & the original sketch (old) released was still being show in the February 2019 press conference by LE???

Hundreds of tips called in after two-year press conference for Delphi murders

Redirect Notice

I came to a different conclusion than you did. I think whatever caused the change in direction was not known to LE at the time of the February press conference. Jmo.[/QUOTE]

 

[Blueberry2720]

Rumour.

How do you know it is rumor?

 

[gitana1]

Yup. That's the one. Thank you guys for helping out!!

 

[Little Jack]

I am still firmly in the camp that I feel encouraged, rather than discouraged, by the most recent PC. LE has taken this new direction for a reason, and it is likely based on a new piece of physical evidence.

With that said, I am really struggling to comprehend the fact that the sketches are not the same person (to be clear, I do not believe that LE is lying). Honestly, it is not that the sketches look nothing alike that I keep getting hung up on. In fact, that would be a much easier thing for me to accept. It is the fact that the two sketches, who bare little if any resemblance to each other, represent the exact same underlying characteristics of BG - reddish-brown hair, same weight range, and the same height range. How unbelievably uncanny is that? There are two sketches of two entirely different people who look nothing alike.... except for the key published information. The only explanation that I can think of that rectifies those inconsistencies sounds crazier than the uncanny coincidence. Does anyone else have any thoughts?

Coming back to the two descriptions, LE has not wavered from the fact that the girls' murderer has reddish-brown hair. I wonder if LE found a hair on one of the girls. BG did make some mistakes...

I really do believe that LE has found something significant to move this investigation forward!

My take on it is that the first released sketch was not from any witness account but rather was based on analysis of the video. The second sketch was made from an eyewitness account. Now they have reason to believe the analysis of the video was flawed and have turned back to the eyewitness account instead.

 

[TTF14]

How do you know it is rumor?

It may be fact, but on Websleuths, if it's not backed up by an article in the mainstream media or an official police statement/release, it is considered rumor.

 

[MDATCA]

My thinking is very much in line with yours, as I believe BG is in his early 20s, possibly a seminary student (educated and well spoken), and that there is a religous connection to Delphi. A twist on your theory that I'd like to offer is that BG might be struggling with his own sexuality. Perhaps he is gay and is hiding that from his family, friends, and church. I would think in a small town that people are less accepting than in larger cities. And, although certain religions accept homosexuality they ascertain that it is incompatible with Christian teaching. Here is the position statement of the United Methodist Church (one mentioned on this forum many times that Libby's family has a connection to):

Regarding the ministry of the ordained

• ¶ 304.3: The practice of homosexuality is incompatible with Christian teaching. Therefore self-avowed practicing homosexuals are not to be certified as candidates, ordained as ministers, or appointed to serve in The United Methodist Church.

Perhaps the incongurency of who he really is on the 'inside', and who he is pretending to be on the 'outside' led to some type of mental break on the day he murdered Abby & Libby.

I am kind of thinking that he is the son of a prominent family in the religious community who is struggling with being gay as his family wouldn't approve. I also think he was probably popular and an athlete in high school who once he left home started exploring both with sexuality and beliefs but when he comes home has to be the good son. He acted out of his self anger that he can't be who he is and be what his family wants and expects of him.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Who was that last shorter, heavy, young searcher talking, standing beside, Abby's Father, wearing a LE or FD night jacket, in the video ?.......moo

It’s so hard watching that video, listening to Abby’s Mom and Libby’s grandfather knowing the outcome.
My prayers go out to them, and to LE for the strength required to bring this Perp in. Stay strong, we’re with you.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[pepper 34]

My thinking was that the bodies would’ve been carried by the water, or maybe he entered the water & moved them after the fact ...... it’s the movement of girls, both/either before & after COD, that raises the most questions in this matter

The creek flows from where the girls were found towards the bridge. He'd be fighting the current while dragging 1 or 2 deceased girls. Impossible, imo. The current can be seen using Google Earth.