IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 13, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #1

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Davereid said:
After reading this case and that the park was somewhat well visited and a place for teenagers I had my thoughts leaning more toward them secretly arranging to meet someone.

Girls and boys at 13 are awkward looking and know it and it takes a toll on their self-esteem-especially for girls. They also still think like children in their maturing bodies and do not always imagine the consequences of their actions.

This is why so many predators seek this age group because they can manipulate them and know they are old enough to successfully hide things from the parents and would not mind hiding some things as much as younger ages. The breaking away from authority is also something else going on which sucks for parents.

One or more manipulative pervert could talk them in to meeting. He gets there before they do, sets up his camp or whatever out of the way of hikers and gets them to go there. Probably gives them some alcohol or drugs to subdue them or just one and then has a couple hours to take his time with them. He could be behind the camera for all we know.

Just speculating here but I was thinking whether they knew the POI online or in person they knew him somehow.


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I'm thinking the same thing. Someone they met online or possibly older guy from the area.
 
Thanks everyone for all the updates, maps, sm, etc...great caliber of posts and posters here.

skibaboo said:
Irsbm

I'm thinking more than one perp. Were the girls lured to their death by a group of other girls? Does anyone else get that vibe?
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Yes, possibly, imo. A bullying type situation with young males or females. I also strongly suspected a pedo predator too, but from what I'm reading here now re: LE saying no threat to the public....

skibaboo said:
Bodies ID'd as Abigail and Liberty

Family has been notified

Considered a double homicide investigation

No further details

Appealing for witnesses who may have been out at Monon bridge or trail, have taken photos, anything. Please come forward

Don't believe at this time there is any threat to the public

NO POI at this time. Can't release COD/MOD at this time
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Veeeery significant that they say no threat to the public.

Dushi said:
How would you subdue two girls at the same time?
Possibly more than one person involved

It is truly heartbreaking
I can't imagine the pain the families are going through
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MJK was able to subdue 2 young victims.
 
janrh1290 said:
I'm thinking the same thing. Someone they met online or possibly older guy from the area.
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I agree with this. I really think that is how this all started and the girls may have been going to meet him. But I hesitate when I think about how school was off that day. It might be a risky place to do something to two girls in an area that people do seem to frequent.
 
skibaboo said:
Not a mod but I make a lot of maps :p You can post a map that includes SO information, just make sure to include the SO registry link, linking to the individuals information, in the map itself.
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Excellent map making skills! Thanks for the guidance.
 
JeannaT said:
The park and bridge have a facebook page - apparently there is a community movement to restore the bridge. Sounds like a well-used and loved park, although on a Monday afternoon it was probably quiet. No other people in the pic of the one girl on the bridge.
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Speculation there is

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The Monticello Herald Journal has some interesting points. A $1.50 for a day subscription is required..but worth the read in my opinion. Brings up some contradicting things from what I've read anywhere else.

"A local resident helping with the search found the bodies, and officers found personal items from those two people in the water, Leazenby said, adding that person who found them is not a suspect. Leazenby said the theory police have is that the girls 'either they came across someone in that area on the trail system or this was a prearranged meeting unknown to friends or family'...."
 
readyplayer1 said:
@KayElJay would it be alright to post a link to a map I created showing the location of where the drop/find of the girls occurred, compared to the sex offenders that are registered in the area? It has the offenders names and their classification (sexually violent predator, crimes against children, non-compliant, etc) as well as public information regarding their registered addresses. All of it's public info..just want to be clear.
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skibaboo said:
Not a mod but I make a lot of maps :p You can post a map that includes SO information, just make sure to include the SO registry link, linking to the individuals information, in the map itself.

Example - Like this one I did recently
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Sorry it took me so long to answer. I had to run out for just a bit. Skibaboo is spot on though & posting a map like that is fine :)

On my way home and anxious to catch up with the discussion! Soon!
 
That strikes me as they know a lot more than what is being said.. If they didn't know who killed them it doesn't seem like they would say they don't think the community is in danger.
 
I'm still catching up so don't know if anything else was posted yet but one news article said it was Liberty's older sister who dropped them off & they were last seen around 1pm.
 
janrh1290 said:
I'm still catching up so don't know if anything else was posted yet but one news article said it was Liberty's older sister who dropped them off & they were last seen around 1pm.
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That's the second time I've read that. I think the first time was on the fb group that's growing like wildfire. Lot's of speculation and rumor though.
 
JeannaT said:
I don't want to turn this into a parenting debate, but after googling the park I don't see how teenagers grow into functional adults if they aren't allowed the freedom to go to this park, in pairs, for a couple hours on a pretty afternoon. Suddenly they'll be 16 and driving, never having been out of eyesight of an adult.

Statistically, it is extremely unlikely that a pair of 13 year old girls would both come to harm at a park, even one with a trestle type bridge.
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Unless of course they decided to meet a "boy" from the internet....who could have been a man that snagged them
 
Sgt. Kim Riley said parents should keep a close eye on their children. "I think people need to be cautious and careful," Riley said. "Parents should make sure they know where their children are and what their children are doing, and if nothing else, know what's going on in their lives. That's the most important thing I can say at this point in time."

Police said they do not have any suspects in custody at this time, but they do not believe there is a threat to the community.
"There is someone out there that did this crime and we’re going to track them down," Sheriff Tobe Leazenby said. “Folks should continue with business as usual but be more mindful and watch your surroundings a little closer.”

The more I read of this the more I believe there was a plan to meet someone there and that it was probably someone not from this area....probably someone online.
 
To me, it is 100% understandable how any number of people could be "subdued". In a hostage situation, there might be one gunman, but several people (like everyone in most situations!) who stay and comply. On 9/11, only one of the planes even attempted to take them over. And it was an entire plane of adults. Even as an adult, if someone walked up to my friend and me with a gun, I wouldn't run away from her! Not to mention, we all know the backlash people get if one would happen to run and the other is left behind and killed. "Who would leave their friend behind to get killed?" I mean, come on. Not only are they at an age where they comply with authority and have loyalty to friends, but even adults would likely stay in the group and comply. Here's the way I try to approach every case---- as soon as a violent criminal enters into the situation, any and everything that the victim did is excused, ok, and was the best they could do at the moment. No shame needs to be placed at all! (I'm not talking about this case, but I see it so much and it is bothersome to me).

Can I also just say that if this is a repeat offender that has been let out on the street after proving to the courts that they are a danger to society already, I just might lose it! I cannot handle the amount of murder that happens by people who were already convicted of extremely violent behavior. It is not fair to any of us or our children, who are just trying to enjoy being out in the world, on a hike through nature.
 
Imo parents can't just drop kids off anymore. These kids get into so much trouble with the internet, it's just not like it was growing up with no such thing or even cable.
 
janrh1290 said:
Sgt. Kim Riley said parents should keep a close eye on their children. "I think people need to be cautious and careful," Riley said. "Parents should make sure they know where their children are and what their children are doing, and if nothing else, know what's going on in their lives. That's the most important thing I can say at this point in time."

Police said they do not have any suspects in custody at this time, but they do not believe there is a threat to the community.
"There is someone out there that did this crime and we’re going to track them down," Sheriff Tobe Leazenby said. “Folks should continue with business as usual but be more mindful and watch your surroundings a little closer.”

The more I read of this the more I believe there was a plan to meet someone there and that it was probably someone not from this area....probably someone online.
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SABBM

Those words are telling. Le knows what happened.
 
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