IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #41

[BoggLed in Ohio]

bout ready to give up for the day......cant find what I want to share.....I hope to see an arrest soon ....

Same here. Very frustrated tonight and everything I post seems to vanish lately so goodnight

 

[gliving]

The thing about looking at online court records, is they only go so far back so far. It's difficult when sleuthing an "older person" as record keeping has changed. We don't know if there were events from the 1950s-1990s .

Years ago people got away got away with all kinds of mischief, where today it would be public record.

I only add this as a sleuthing topic. :fence:

 

[rainny03]

It's also been suggested that the phone may have been put in a pocket, thrown down, or hidden in leaves so it continues to record only audio but not video.


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I wanted to point out that I read in one of the LE statements that they were getting pings from the girls cell phone from one of the cell towers for about 6hrs after they went missing before it went dead ..?? IMO this tells me that that their cell phone must of been recovered from the crime scene ?? All just IMO of course any thoughts on this ?? I also DO NOT think that BG is RL IMO he is not capable of pulling of such an organized crime and this is the work of a sophisticated SK ?? All is just IMO of course.. Any ideas as to what you all think ?

 

[iscaremyself]

The thing about looking at online court records, is they only go so far back so far. It's difficult when sleuthing an "older person" as record keeping has changed. We don't know if there were events from the 1950s-1990s .

Years ago people got away got away with all kinds of mischief, where today it would be public record.

I only add this as a sleuthing topic. :fence:

so true...I remember when a dui was a hundred dollar fine with time served and sometimes the cop would give you a ride home.
Those records are molding in a basement somewhere if they were kept at all.

 

[AmateurAnalyst73]

Trying to clarify things, as I understand them, so obviously, these are my opinions/speculations based on what we know(or think we know)...
First, I believe that whether RL participated in this crime or not, in the eyes of LE, the girls simply be found on his land makes him "involved", and that alone(girls found on his private property) is likely enough PC for the SW.
Second, since we don't know where the girls were between the time they dropped off and the time they were on the bridge, I'm willing to speculate that they could have ventured onto RL's land during that time, and had some sort of interaction with him, or simply been seen by him. I still can't see RL being BG, but accept that it's possible. I believe RL is plenty agile, strong, etc to have perpetrated this crime, I just can't get to a motive.
Third, given the meticulous work and seemingly tedious attention paid to detail in the videos by GH, I came away with a few things that I feel fairly certain of: a) Liberty was ahead of Abigail on the bridge, probably throughout the whole span(?) b)in the photo of Abigail, BG is nnot on the bridge yet, and c) when Liberty reached the end, she turned to take another picture/video of her buddy, and saw BG nearly on top of her(assuming, as several have, that blur in the one photo taken from video is actually Abigail).

Now, if those facts and speculation are correct, we can assume that LE won't release any more video captures because, quite possibly, in the next few frames the crime is commencing. Maybe he is subduing Abigail, or worse? We can also speculate that shortly after, the girls are directed "down the hill", and are probably not alive much longer afterwards.
Back RL and the SW: I assume/believe that the SW would have been good procedure regardless of what LE thought of RL's alibi. Statistically(and LE operates largely on statistics), the property where murder victims are found has a high likelyhood of being the scene of the murder, and the property owner(and ALL of his property) are going to be closely scrutinized. If his lawyer advised him to be silent due to the pending probation violation, this would have been frustrating to LE, and maybe served as a catalyst for the SW, but again, I believe PC was there as soon as the girls were found.
The simplest solution is obviously that RL is either guilty or a participant, and this investigation may well come to that conclusion, however...I hope/pray/beg, that if the evidence DOESN'T bear that out, that LE not get "tunnel vision", and be become unwilling to look at the possibility of something outside their usual profiling formula, because from some of the things I read in the news, there are subcultures of the criminal underworld which seem to be evolving, and LE would do well to pay attention, if they aren't already. This case has affected me on a very personal level, for some reason, and I get on here each day hoping to see that the person(s) has been charged and is in custody. Trying hard to stay optimistic about that. If nothing else, in researching these kinds of crimes, I've had my eyes opened to how dangerous it can be to be a woman or young girl in this world we live in. That's heartbreaking. Ladies, stay safe. And my fellow gentlemen...BE gentle men.

 

[2Hope4]

I can hear Foxfire..... keeping things from the public isn't solving cases....

 

[kellala]

kind off topic, but here is a news about a mid aged man pretends to be a teen. http://fox59.com/2017/03/29/police-...to-sending-nude-photos-to-man-posing-as-teen/ It sounds interesting to me is that my daughter's friend 2 ys ago had the same drama, met a boy online, and shortly developed suicide thoughts. Her parents think it is shamed and kept it quietly. They didn't talk to LE or any authorities about this. I wish they did something to prevent this jerk from doing this to other girls.


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[Hazelnutty]

It usually takes me a couple of hours to catch up on all the evenings new posts, but not tonite. I can't decide if that's a good thing or Not? Seems unusually quiet on A+L's threads tonight.

Prayers again tonight for the families of Abigail & Liberty, LE, Delphi, and those here at WS who have been deeply affected by their deaths. Praying for tomorrow to be the day all of us get answers.

 

[Beth11311]

your theory makes a whole lot of sense to me. I wonder about motive? This is MOO but was it public knowledge that RL frequently violated his probation, was it talked about in town, for example " Yup, my dad says he saw RL at a bar in Lafayette last week" could people have been getting ready to turn him in to his probation officer? I wonder if LE recovered a gun during the SW of RL's property. It would be a crime for him to have one apparently because he's a felon. Now, I believe that he didn't shoot the girls, but I may be wrong, but I think LE would be able to run forensics on the gun to see where it came from and if it had been used recently..JMO and speculating.

ETA: This is not the original post I quoted, in fact it seems the original post was perhaps deleted? The comment I was replying to was a poster suggesting the use of a knife for the COD....

I'm not sure if RL is BG, I actually don't think he is, but that point aside, I'm curious - and based on other research I do believe that you might be on target for the COD - but that leaves me with one nagging question.

If the COD was in fact as you described then we would have a very bloody crime scene, no? Arterial spurting etc...sounds like at least how RL described it the area was "pristine". Our POI would have most likely been covered in blood, IMO. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong - but I think that's something to consider if people are going to ruminate about COD.


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[AmateurAnalyst73]

One more observation/speculation...again, I'm basing this off the assumption that GH's latest video is accurate, but if BG is not yet on the bridge when Liberty stopped and turned around to take Abigail's picture, then I assume they were "goofing off" or "dilly dallying", IOW taking their time across the bridge. If they also did the same on the trail leading to the bridge, that could account for why it took them ~ an hour to get to the point where the picture was taken. Adults tend to walk trails with more "purpose", and thus don't stop as often to talk, take pictures, maybe sit down and have a "heart to heart", as girls in their age group often do. I won't go down the "catfished" or "met a boy" scenario unless LE states it as a fact, so I'm working with what we have, in terms of accounting for the unusual amount of time it seemed to take for them to get from point A(which we aren't even sure of AFAIK?) and the photo of Abigail at 2:07pm.

 

[otto]

I would guess because the only one we are aware of is mr Logan because of his media interviews? Not sure. Imo.


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Exactly. A dozen search warrants have been issued in relation to the murdered children, and the media has only made the connection with the warrant served on the property owner. As a result, that one person has been smeared all over the internet even though police stated up front that he is not a suspect in the murders. It's sad that this is where we are with the internet and privacy.

 

[LadyL]

[bbm]

and yet suspicion of him seems to be based on one crummy bad photo ...

Yes IMOO I do think BG and RL are the same. Cmon LE... what do you need to make this arrest?????? The photo is distorted and it is fooling the eye a bit. But!!! Just look at the mannerisms, hands in pockets, gate, height, chin and eye socket shadows... what are they waiting for... we can't base this entire investigation on a crummy bad photo. They must have more evidence. Take away the photo. Take away the voice recording... LE must have something!!!


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[LadyL]

you can actually get caught up? wow ...

It usually takes me a couple of hours to catch up on all the evenings new posts, but not tonite. I can't decide if that's a good thing or Not? Seems unusually quiet on A+L's threads tonight.

Prayers again tonight for the families of Abigail & Liberty, LE, Delphi, and those here at WS who have been deeply affected by their deaths. Praying for tomorrow to be the day all of us get answers.

 

[crhedBngr]

Look at the second video,how quick RL is making it down that hill..

All IMO

-Nin

Yep! That crossed my mind as well.

 

[bessie]

ADMIN NOTE: If you have a question or concern about the rules, or thread moderation, address them in a private message (PM) to an admin or a mod. Do not post your complaints and questions in the thread.

Also, if you read such posts, please do not respond. Alert the post so a staff member can take care of the situation.

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[sbaughman]

I'm not sure if RL is BG, I actually don't think he is, but that point aside, I'm curious - and based on other research I do believe that you might be on target for the COD - but that leaves me with one nagging question.

If the COD was in fact as you described then we would have a very bloody crime scene, no? Arterial spurting etc...sounds like at least how RL described it the area was "pristine". Our POI would have most likely been covered in blood, IMO. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong - but I think that's something to consider if people are going to ruminate about COD.


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IMO a gun was used at some point, but I'm not sold that it was the COD (although if it turns out it was, I won't be surprised). A gun is the easiest way to get and keep control of two people, although certainly it isn't the only way. With so little variables known, it's hard to fill in the blanks, so this is just speculation and gut feeling. If a motive for the crime was known, I think it'd be easier to guess at a COD but without even having the slightest clue why this crime was committed, I think it's all just guesswork. Personally, it's one of the things driving me nuts about this crime. At this point, I don't see any evidence that anyone other than BG committed the murder (not saying it's impossible, also not saying that others weren't involved after the fact, although there is no solid evidence of either ATM) and it's pretty rare for a single perp to take control of and murder two victims. JMO


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[bessie]

ATTENTION EVERYONE:

With the latest search warrant being served at the home of property owner Ron Logan we have decided to open up Ron Logan to sleuthing with these rules:

*Use his initials only (R.L.) or call him the land owner.

*This does not mean you can sleuth his family or neighbors.

*In the event you do discover something about someone else who happens to be connected to R.L. and you think
it is related to the case you must check with us before you post it.

* R.L HAS NOT BEEN NAMED A PERSON OF INTEREST. Please do not accuse him of the crime.

If you have any questions alert on any post and send us your question. Or you can send a private message to one of the mods.

To reiterate, You can now sleuth the land owner R.L. but ONLY R.L. No accusing R.L. or anyone of being the killer.

Thank you,
Tricia

:bump: (rbbm)

 

[Beth11311]

IMO a gun was used at some point, but I'm not sold that it was the COD (although if it turns out it was, I won't be surprised). A gun is the easiest way to get and keep control of two people, although certainly it isn't the only way. With so little variables known, it's hard to fill in the blanks, so this is just speculation and gut feeling. If a motive for the crime was known, I think it'd be easier to guess at a COD but without even having the slightest clue why this crime was committed, I think it's all just guesswork. Personally, it's one of the things driving me nuts about this crime. At this point, I don't see any evidence that anyone other than BG committed the murder (not saying it's impossible, also not saying that others weren't involved after the fact, although there is no solid evidence of either ATM) and it's pretty rare for a single perp to take control of and murder two victims. JMO


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I'm in absolute agreement with everything you said! Great post, thank you! I too am going nuts because we know so little, next to nothing. All speculation; drives the fact-driven nerd in me batty.


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[SouthernCutie]

One more observation/speculation...again, I'm basing this off the assumption that GH's latest video is accurate, but if BG is not yet on the bridge when Liberty stopped and turned around to take Abigail's picture, then I assume they were "goofing off" or "dilly dallying", IOW taking their time across the bridge. If they also did the same on the trail leading to the bridge, that could account for why it took them ~ an hour to get to the point where the picture was taken. Adults tend to walk trails with more "purpose", and thus don't stop as often to talk, take pictures, maybe sit down and have a "heart to heart", as girls in their age group often do. I won't go down the "catfished" or "met a boy" scenario unless LE states it as a fact, so I'm working with what we have, in terms of accounting for the unusual amount of time it seemed to take for them to get from point A(which we aren't even sure of AFAIK?) and the photo of Abigail at 2:07pm.

I actually have always thought that's what they did. Took their time walking chatting about girl talk maybe cute boys. Enjoying the weather and snapping photos. 2 best friends together and there's always something to talk about you know. IMO that's what they were doing. Not actually "hiking" but walking the trail and enjoying each others company All MOO of course

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[LadyL]

[bbm]

good advice!

Living in a place without guns i must ask is it usual to see open carry and if it is do you always feel scared seeing a holster or gun shape in someones pocket?

Second thing i have always wondered since i first heard about the video. and i think about this for us ALL and any issues we ever face in future in public/private

Does anyone think if the girls had announced LOUDLY they were obviously streaming a LIVE video to Facebook, Periscope or Snapchat they would still be alive?

If they had not just flashed the phone quickly without BG even being aware and instead made it clear his image was already online he would have known there was a good video and photo of him out there before attempting the murders or participating.

In dodgy situations i think id advise anyone to anmounce they are live streaming/recording to SM.

Love to hear some views on this!

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