IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #8

[LietKynes]

One would think the guilty plea that SA has now offered would end the chances for the lawsuit against the 'evil' RCCL ?
No way in Hello should RCCL have to pay a single dime.
Well, ok. A dime.

 

[justice4allnow]

Attorneys here, would Sam's attorney already have all of the Prosecutor's evidence before now, or is it possible that he recently received more evidence, witness statements , for instance, that would cause Sam to change his plea?

 

[TDoc72]

One would think the guilty plea that SA has now offered would end the chances for the lawsuit against the 'evil' RCCL ?
No way in Hello should RCCL have to pay a single dime.
Well, ok. A dime.

IMO, in this specific case, it shouldn’t even be a dime. I feel RCC had 0% to do with her death.

 

[TDoc72]

One would think the guilty plea that SA has now offered would end the chances for the lawsuit against the 'evil' RCCL ?
No way in Hello should RCCL have to pay a single dime.
Well, ok. A dime.

IMO, in this specific case, it shouldn’t even be a dime.

 

[sl222]

One would think the guilty plea that SA has now offered would end the chances for the lawsuit against the 'evil' RCCL ?
No way in Hello should RCCL have to pay a single dime.
Well, ok. A dime.

I don't think so, Liet, because they will not spin it that way.

Is there still a motion to dismiss from RCCL pending? I think that is the only possibility this case will go away.

SA has never taken responsibility for what happened. And the only way he can ever do that is by not just taking responsibility but stating publicly - or at least to the family in private - why he did what he did. (Truthfully.) If he was under the influence of something then that is what he needs to say (IMO). Only then can anyone believe or respect him.

Perhaps some things have happened behind the scenes in his admissions to his family that led to this change; something must have happened in recent days (seems like).

 

[sl222]

double post

 

[LietKynes]

IMO, in this specific case, it shouldn’t even be a dime. I feel RCC had 0% to do with her death.

I know... it was a jest.

Could RCCL counter-sue, though ?
For defamation and slander ?
There weren't any safety violations.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

I know... it was a jest.
Could RCCL counter-sue, though ?
For defamation and slander ?
There weren't any safety violations.

I was hoping just that because of the outright lies MW and KW were spouting about the location of the "accident". That must have cost RCCL a lot of lost business. Not to mention the people who witnessed the horror, and had their vacations and lives forever impacted and changed by these heinous actions on SA's part. IMHO the family and SA should be sued, not the other way around.

 

[justice4allnow]

The DM is pay-for-play and is putting out this story, which is soft-selling it, imho. The story is moderated and is not disclosing the terms that David Begnaud revealed, though they may be added as the DM frequently updates stories.

Grandfather who dropped toddler to her death from cruise ship window will plead GUILTY | Daily Mail Online

 

[Safetybug]

The DM is pay-for-play and is putting out this story, which is soft-selling it, imho. The story is moderated and is not disclosing the terms that David Begnaud revealed, though they may be added as the DM frequently updates stories.

Grandfather who dropped toddler to her death from cruise ship window will plead GUILTY | Daily Mail Online

Finally the DM quit using the term “elderly”

 

[sl222]

Finally the DM quit using the term “elderly”

It was there but they took it out.

 

[Hughaskton]

I'm curious how this would have played out if the window had been closed and he lifted her up and held her on the bar and dropped her and she fell inside the ship onto the floor and suffered a fatal head injury. Wouldn't he be the one considered liable then? Why is it different because she fell out the window? The reason she fell is because he dropped her, she didn't do this herself.

Still RC’s fault. They should be providing carriers for any child you can lift off the ground. They should also have foam flooring and bumper pads on corners. (Sarcasm

 

[BeachSky]

Grandfather of toddler who died falling from cruise ship to plead guilty in her death

This was so predictable.
Winkleman makes it look like everything was his idea ...blah, blah, blah...
He brings up all the particulars of HI$ case going forward...blah$...blah$ ...blah$

 

[MsMarple]

So SA is going to issue a statement tomorrow? WTF can he possibly say? There's no way he'll own up to his reckless behavior so what's the point?

I predict he's going to say something like he still believes RCL is responsible for Chloe's death and will reiterate that he thought the window was closed but is pleading guilty for the sake of Chloe's parents. Or something to that effect.

IOW he'll make a mockery of the law. IMO he should be required to admit guilt plainly in no uncertain terms, no more playing the victim. To do otherwise sends the message that PR law is a sham. I hope the judge surprises us.

SA doesn't deserve closure or peace if he's not willing to own his behavior. Great role model for Chloe's brother. Way to go mom and dad, SMDH.

 

[Kindred]

Damn, the same day I say that Winkleman doesn't have anything to cause trouble/drama he sure as hell proves me wrong

Sam and the prosecutor may have come to an agreement, but that doesn't mean that the judge has to accept it. The judge could accept the guilty part and sentence him to jail time, or insist that he has to stand before the bench and tell them exactly what happened at that window before they agree to it. That's why there needs to be a hearing. This case won't be over till the judge says it is.

I suspect one of two things is going on with this sudden change in course. My first thought is this is being done because the family realized that there is some damning evidence the prosecution has and is trying to reduce the chance that 1) RCCL and 2) the public might get it. They know if this stuff gets out it's over, and if it goes to trial they're screwed. If they sacrifice him to a plea deal, none of this stuff has to see the light of day. And since Winkleman isn't party to the criminal case (though we all know the defense lawyer has been giving him stuff through his own filings ie: the doctors statement) he doesn't have to turn over any of that stuff if/when the civil case hits discovery.

My second thought is possible concerns of perjury? I'm wondering if their medical experts fell through and they can't find anyone willing to back the "colorblind" argument and that is literally the only excuse they had for why he possibly couldn't have known the window was open. And with no medical experts/documents to support the claim the lawyer can't just be throwing it out there.

JMO of course.

 

[book-thinker]

SA has changed his plea from not guilty to guilty. Why now. Last I read he waived his rights to a jury trial is he worried
a judge is going to sentence him to 3 years in jail.

The family's attorney told NBC SA filed paperwork to change his plea in return for a agreement of no jail time and probation in his hometown. The DA's office needs to agree to a plea deal. How is that justice for Chloe.

I know as a parent it would be near impossible to forgive SA for his utter negligent in the death of my child.

What I don't understand is the family talks about closing this chapter and turning the focus on mourning Chloe.
Will suing RCCL help with the mourning of Chloe. Lawsuits take time and this toddlers's family has little or no grounds in winning this suit. The family needs to let this poor child rest in peace.

 

[HRH Phoebe Cat]

Well, with this development, I am shocked beyond belief.

The only thing I can think of which is fit enough to post is that, as far as I am concerned at this point, ALL of the adults in this family have blood on their hands.

And, continuing the suit against RCCL? Blood money in my opinion and nothing good ever comes from it.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

Well, with this development, I am shocked beyond belief.

The only thing I can think of which is fit enough to post is that, as far as I am concerned at this point, ALL of the adults in this family have blood on their hands.

And, continuing the suit against RCCL? Blood money in my opinion and nothing good ever comes from it.

I want to see that backfire.

 

[neesaki]

Thank you.

Deal: no jail time
No admission to the facts
Probation served in Indiana

Sickening. Disgusting coward. Sorry, but that’s MOO.

 

[neesaki]

You’re welcome. I think Begnaud is human and even though he is a reporter he has to feel for Chloe. He interviewed SA when this first happened and was shown a doctored video by his lawyers.
I think the trial would probably have the same outcome as a plea. Guilty and probation. The sentencing guidelines in PR are pretty strict. His trial might have been streamed live, so SA is probably avoiding more publicity.

Sentencing guidelines for being recklessly negligent to th point of killing an 18 month old baby should require prison time, IMO. So the probation seems quite lenient.