Is Casey the real Zenaida?

[Valhall]

I've always felt suspicious of the June 9th date - it's the original date said caylee went missing and then coincidently a ZG has her office broken into.... just odd.

also, has anyone paid close attention to the description casey gave of the supposed ZG? CA went off about this at the trial with the ZG suing casey. She said short dark hair, 5'something (can't remember), 120 pounds and on a scale of 1-10 she was a 10. UMMM besides for me not agreeing that casey is a 10, it sounds an awful lot like casey was describing herself. She certainly would rate herself a 10. Casey just basically described what she sees in the mirror. And it would add up to the decription the police would have of this ZG who has the traffic violations because it was casey who they really stopped.

Well, and CA's description doesn't match KC's written statement on July 15th. That said 5'7", 140 lbs, black/Puerto Rican mix.

Do we have access to the decription of the car casey.. ahem sorry, "ZG" was driving when she got stopped?

Yeah, actually we have two. We have the description of the car pulled over (1995 green truck) and the description of the car that goes with the tag that was on the car that was pulled over (1997 red SUV).

 

[sadyjade]

Haven't we heard of a green truck in other records in this case? I'm wanting to say that is a description a neighbor(of the A's) gave of a vehicle seen at their home? I'm going a hunting be back in a minute.

 

[ZubenElSchemali]

Yep, we're in agreement now on the interpretation of the record. The case was satisfied (actually dismissed) and then changed in September. Now, as to the reason, I definitely agree it has SOMETHING to do with the charges filed on the same date, but I'm not sure it is because they were flagging the license.

My question is - for this particular traffic case - can it be changed to the status of "prosecutorial" indefinitely without charges filed on something different? The reason I ask this is because if, during the investigation they found that at the time of this citation KC had two driver's license, they can bring charges against her for that. Can they trip this to prosecutorial and just leave it for some time and then file a charge of holding two driver's licenses?

This is a good question for AZlawyer. I believe once the fraud charges are tried and restitution made, fines, etc, the flag would be removed, if that is infact, what this is. The reason I'm thinking this is what is going on here is I read in Michigan if there are arearages or state imposed fines not paid when they should be the licience is suspended until it is paid. Now, they wouldn't suspend her licience until she had been found guilty and got to the point she defaulted on the fines, etc. This is what has happened to ZG. She defaulted and the license was suspended.

 

[AZlawyer]

This is a good question for AZlawyer. I believe once the fraud charges are tried and restitution made, fines, etc, the flag would be removed, if that is infact, what this is. The reason I'm thinking this is what is going on here is I read in Michigan if there are arearages or state imposed fines not paid when they should be the licience is suspended until it is paid. Now, they wouldn't suspend her licience until she had been found guilty and got to the point she defaulted on the fines, etc. This is what has happened to ZG. She defaulted and the license was suspended.

Sorry--I'm still trying to figure this one out myself. But your confidence is appreciated.

 

[JWG]

Back in early February DotsEyes was working on profiles of the various Zenaida's in this case, both real and imagined. This work was being done on the Zani Timeline thread. On that same thread I followed her lead and fleshed out a profile of KC's ZFG. I am cross-posting it here as that particular description seems relevent to the discussion.

*** Begin cross-post ***

Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez (KC's fictional nannie's name)

Vitals: (all taken from first interview unless otherwise noted)

• 25 Years old
• 5' 7" (5'6" to 5'7" - email from Lee)
• 140 lbs
• Dark brown curly hair
• Brown eyes
• Mixed race: Black and Puerto Rican
• Tan complexion (email from Lee)
• No visible tatoos in 2-piece bathing suit (email from Lee)
• Birthday in September

Family:

• Mother: Gloria Gonzalez, 55 (email from Lee)
• Step-dad: Victor Fernandez (email from Lee)
• No children (interview #2)
• Has brother and sister (1st interview)
• Sister is Samantha, 1-2 years older, not sure if last name is different (email from Lee)

Roommates:

• Raquel Farrell - hostess at Friday's (email from Lee)
• Jennifer Rosa - works for ABC Distribution catalog in Orlando (email from Lee)

Residence:
From interview #1:

• Moved to FL from New York. Tony was talking about moving to NY. Sawgrass ZG drives a car with NY plates.
  
• Lived at apartment off Bumby and Robinson until about middle of 2007. The location turns out to be an "old folk's home" across the street from RM's. It is interesting to note that RM met KC in June 2007 and moved to his apartment in Orlando in Aug. 2007...the "middle of 2007."
• From middle of 2007 to some time in the first six months of 2008 she lived at her mom's house "off Michigan just over Conway". This is near the BoA she passed Amy's check at. Also kinda near a real ZG. But most interesting, there is a person with the mother's name that in fact lives "off Michigan just over Conway".
• Last lived at Sawgrass on Conway Rd., apartment #210 - moved there "just recently this year". The apartment had been vacant for several months and happened to be above the model apartment shown to prospective tenants. Sawgrass ZG looked at model apartment 6/17.
  

From interview #2 (after fessing up that she'd been lying):

• Lived at Alafaya Club Apartments when KC first met her. Says a good friend from high school still lives there (male). These apartments are near JG and TR, - about half way in between.
• More recently she was renting a house in Andover Lakes, off Dean and Curry Ford. This is fairly close to Lake Vaj, possibly area where she was at one point going to get a home or condo?

Babysitting: (from 1st interview unless otherwise noted)

• Met her around Christmas 2004, "before she was pregnant", or about 3 1/2 years.
• Has been watching Caylee for 1 1/2 to 2 years (statement)
• Started watching Caylee about end of April 2006 at Jeff Hopkins and within the past 1 1/2 years at ZFG apartment. This coincides with Rev. Grund's statement regarding when he first heard of ZG.
• Has known her for six years (IM's with Iassan).
• Watched Jeff Hopkin's fictional son Zachary. Jeff introduced KC to ZFG. (interview #2)
• The fictional Juliette Lewis's equally fictional daughter played with Caylee at ZFG's apartment. ZFG may have watched Lewis's child as well. (IM's between KC and l7tone)

Other:

• Seasonal employee at Universal (interview #2)
• Went to University of Florida (interview #2)
• Drives 2008 silver Ford Focus purchased by step-dad (email from Lee)
• Apparantly has some money, based on witness interviews relating what KC said to them.

 

[jandkmom]

I've always felt suspicious of the June 9th date - it's the original date said caylee went missing and then coincidently a ZG has her office broken into.... just odd.

also, has anyone paid close attention to the description casey gave of the supposed ZG? CA went off about this at the trial with the ZG suing casey. She said short dark hair, 5'something (can't remember), 120 pounds and on a scale of 1-10 she was a 10. UMMM besides for me not agreeing that casey is a 10, it sounds an awful lot like casey was describing herself. She certainly would rate herself a 10. Casey just basically described what she sees in the mirror. And it would add up to the decription the police would have of this ZG who has the traffic violations because it was casey who they really stopped.

Do we have access to the decription of the car casey.. ahem sorry, "ZG" was driving when she got stopped?

Have you seen the movie "Liar, Liar" with Jim Carrey. He beats himself up in the bathroom, and then when the judge asks him to describe the person that did it to him, he gives the judge a description of himself.

 

[JBean]

This is a good question for AZlawyer. I believe once the fraud charges are tried and restitution made, fines, etc, the flag would be removed, if that is infact, what this is. The reason I'm thinking this is what is going on here is I read in Michigan if there are arearages or state imposed fines not paid when they should be the licience is suspended until it is paid. Now, they wouldn't suspend her licience until she had been found guilty and got to the point she defaulted on the fines, etc. This is what has happened to ZG. She defaulted and the license was suspended.

FWIW and this may be of no consequence, but I'll throw it in the heap o' info anyway. We do know for fact that as of Jan 17, 2009 her license was VALID with no restrictions.
As of today her license expired on her birthday 3-19-2009

Driver License Check

As of Jan 17, 2009, at 02:02 PM, driver license number A535XXXXX is VALID. This license is a Class E. Restrictions are (NONE ON RECORD). Endorsements are (NONE ON RECORD). Motorcycle endorsements are (NONE ON RECORD).
Expiration Date is Mar 19, 2009. You may purchase a driver history via mail or electronically.​

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78216

 

[cecybeans]

I know I read here about the journalist ZG at UCF - physical description, type of car, even # of children, IIRC.

As circumspectly as possible, does anyone remember if any of that ZG's details are similar to either ZG22, or KC's physical description of the bogus Zanny? Could any similarities also point to the fact that KC was more than aware of this ZG?

 

[ZubenElSchemali]

FWIW and this may be of no consequence, but I'll throw it in the heap o' info anyway. We do know for fact that as of Jan 17, 2009 her license was VALID with no restrictions.
As of today her license expired on her birthday 3-19-2009

Driver License Check

As of Jan 17, 2009, at 02:02 PM, driver license number A535XXXXX is VALID. This license is a Class E. Restrictions are (NONE ON RECORD). Endorsements are (NONE ON RECORD). Motorcycle endorsements are (NONE ON RECORD).
Expiration Date is Mar 19, 2009. You may purchase a driver history via mail or electronically.​

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78216

I wouldn't expect there to be any kind of restriction or suspension at this stage because the fraud charge hasn't even gone to trial. I think this may be a standard procedure with pending financial cases. Otherwise why isn't the more recent ticket without her middle initial now the same? They can't prosecute a closed case that has been satisfied. If she had a fake ID they could bring a new charge to add to her bundle, but not prosecute this one.

 

[Valhall]

I wouldn't expect there to be any kind of restriction or suspension at this stage because the fraud charge hasn't even gone to trial. I think this may be a standard procedure with pending financial cases. Otherwise why isn't the more recent ticket without her middle initial now the same? They can't prosecute a closed case that has been satisfied. If she had a fake ID they could bring a new charge to add to her bundle, but not prosecute this one.

The only difference between the other traffic charge and this traffic charge is that this one involved having to show a driver's license in order to get it dismissed, while the other had to do with showing that the equipment (probably seat belt) had been fixed.

 

[pregodego2]

Haven't we heard of a green truck in other records in this case? I'm wanting to say that is a description a neighbor(of the A's) gave of a vehicle seen at their home? I'm going a hunting be back in a minute.

yes, the green truck was definitely seen at the A's house. Can't remember if it was amy's, tony's, annie's.... but it was someone's!

 

[blubuni99]

I don't know if this is the right place to post this or not (I almost posted it in another thread - I'm just not sure exactly where to post this) but I'm fairly new to the whole evidence part of this case and I was just going through the first doc dump. I'm reading all the lies and stuff - I was wondering, did KC just GUESS about a Zeniada Gonzalez at the Sawgrass Apt and it was just a coincidence that a women by that name applied to live there or is there something I missed?

 

[EchointheDark]

I don't know if this is the right place to post this or not (I almost posted it in another thread - I'm just not sure exactly where to post this) but I'm fairly new to the whole evidence part of this case and I was just going through the first doc dump. I'm reading all the lies and stuff - I was wondering, did KC just GUESS about a Zeniada Gonzalez at the Sawgrass Apt and it was just a coincidence that a women by that name applied to live there or is there something I missed?

Hi and welcome-- this has been a huge topic of speculation. There's miles of thread(ing... or whatever these little bits of convo are called). That is one of the many mysteries of this case. It's how this specific ZG got hauled into this mess. It's the key fact that the civil suit hinges on. Between the 2 stories of how/where Caylee was left/taken (Sawgrass/JBP) this is on KC's sworn statement to LE. We don't know, is the short answer, how KC's twisted little pea-brain got hold of this ZG.

 

[KenoshaKid]

[*]Mother: Gloria Gonzalez, 55 (email from Lee)
[*] Step-dad: Victor Fernandez (email from Lee)

So, given this, wouldn't her name be Zenaida Gonzalez Fernandez?
Every Latina I have ever known has her mother's maiden name as the MIDDLE name, not the last name.

I've never seen a hyphenated Hispanic surname, unless its in a younger person who has married and hyphenated the two names.

I guess Gonzalez could be Gloria's husband's name (Z's stepfather) and they hyphenated Z's last name, but really, has anyone EVER seen that? It would require a legal name change. I work at a University and see a lot of last names and this is a first for me.

 

[steadychick]

I seem to remember something being said quite a while back that ZG (the one who has filed the lawsuit) lost her driver's license. Anyone else with a better memory than mine remember that? If this is true, perhaps KC found it -- maybe at the tatoo parlor?????

 

[steadychick]

And didn't the green truck belong to someone at the tatoo parlor????

 

[~ Amy ~]

I seem to remember that she lost her DL back in Feb 08. I just can't find where I read that at.

 

[princess]

So, given this, wouldn't her name be Zenaida Gonzalez Fernandez?
Every Latina I have ever known has her mother's maiden name as the MIDDLE name, not the last name.

I've never seen a hyphenated Hispanic surname, unless its in a younger person who has married and hyphenated the two names.

I guess Gonzalez could be Gloria's husband's name (Z's stepfather) and they hyphenated Z's last name, but really, has anyone EVER seen that? It would require a legal name change. I work at a University and see a lot of last names and this is a first for me.

The mothers last name is always used last, my husband & his relatives have a first & middle name, followed by the fathers last name and then the mothers last name.


When we got married the clerk at the courthouse had to remind him not to sign his mothers last name, to just use his "first" last name, his fathers.

http://perez.cs.vt.edu/twolastnames
One of the most misunderstood characteristics of Hispanic culture is the use of our last names. In the last 20 years, more and more Hispanics are being mentioned in the mainstream of American society. Names like Gabriel García Marquez and Arancha Sanchez Vicario are two names that get lots of press. Their last names, two in each case, are every now and then confused.

 

[BondJamesBond]

Babysitting: (from 1st interview unless otherwise noted)

• Met her around Christmas 2004, "before she was pregnant", or about 3 1/2 years.
• Has been watching Caylee for 1 1/2 to 2 years (statement)
• Started watching Caylee about end of April 2006 at Jeff Hopkins and within the past 1 1/2 years at ZFG apartment. This coincides with Rev. Grund's statement regarding when he first heard of ZG.
• Has known her for six years (IM's with Iassan).
  

*snipped*

Terrific post, JWG (as usual) :clap:

FWIW, RE: Babysitting

IIRC, Casey also indicated in her IM's w/ Tony that ZG watched Juliette's daughter too.

Dunno if you wanted to consider adding in ZG watching Jeff's son Zachary also.

 

[JWG]

*snipped*

Terrific post, JWG (as usual) :clap:

FWIW, RE: Babysitting

IIRC, Casey also indicated in her IM's w/ Tony that ZG watched Juliette's daughter too.

Dunno if you wanted to consider adding in ZG watching Jeff's son Zachary also.

Thanks Bond, especially for pointing out the Juliette Lewis connection from the IM's. :thumb:

I added both to the description of KC's alternate universe.