Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #3

[SkyBoomer]

That used to be the case.

But, it was later changed as an incentive to the now dead peace process. Also, the Palestinians wore out their welcome in Jordan, so the Jordanians stopped claiming most of them unless they are "grandfathered" in.

As a side note, the US Government) technically does not recognize them as "citizens"- because "citizen" implies "country".

Rather, they are recognized as Nationals of the Palestinian Authority or something like that. Taiwan is the same way.

In the end, however, both Palestinian and Taiwanese "not truly a passport passports" are given the same weight as regular passports.

Tyvm- edifying!

 

[JennieM]

Since all this started 6 days ago, your question is ridiculous. It's been posted over and over again that evacuations started then. 1.1 million people at this point is a wildly inflated number. But of course it sounds better huh?

Please post your links for all the evacuations of civilians that have taken place over the past 6 days.

 

[MassGuy]

Israel is being called out for involving the civilian population by numerous organisations and countries.

Of course. Every nation in that part of the world believes that Israel should not exist.

 

[Vern]

<modsnip - quoted post contained an unapproved source. The following is concerning the use of White Phosphorus>

Regardless:

https://geneva-s3.unoda.org/static-unoda-site/pages/templates/the-convention-on-certain-conventional-weapons/PROTOCOL%2BIII.pdf

Article 2 of Protocol III defines the regulated use:
1. Can’t use against civilians in any circumstance;
2. Can’t use against military targets via air near civies;
3. Can’t use it via other-than air (ground based) against civilian areas UNLESS military objective is clearly separated and you make effort to limit civilian casualties; and
4. Can’t use in forests unless they’re used for concealment.

1. Israel is NOT a signatory to this, but isn't using WP munitions anyway ...
2. BUT, if they were to use them, they are NOT banned for use against military targets (regardless of signature); and
3. They are banned for those that signed for use against civilian areas with exceptions.

 

[Vern]

Israel is being called out for involving the civilian population by numerous organisations and countries.

They always are. Funny that.

 

[JennieM]

Of course. Every nation in that part of the world believes that Israel should not exist.

I am not taking about a part of the world.

Is Norway part of that world?

The US is concerned. Are they part of that world?

The UN, WHO, Amnesty International, Oxfam all have raised concerns.

 

[cottonweaver]

Since all this started 6 days ago, your question is ridiculous. It's been posted over and over again that evacuations started then. 1.1 million people at this point is a wildly inflated number. But of course it sounds better huh?

Really? The order wasn't made until this morning.
Are you referring to Israel's evacuation of Israelis living near the frontier? ( 8th October)

screenshot from wikipedia timeline 2023 Israel–Hamas war - Wikipedia

 

[Cryptic]

You’re in a lifeboat, surrounded by sharks that want to kill you. That’s Israel.

A good reason to stop "chumming" the water. But, I am thinking that chummed water and the increased risk of shark attack helps to keep Netanyahu in the captain's seat.

Israel OK's plans for thousands of new settlement homes, defying White House calls for restraint

Israeli media say the country's far-right government has approved plans to build over 5,000 of new homes in Jewish settlements in the occupied West Bank.

apnews.com

Israeli settlers storm Al-Aqsa Mosque complex on fifth day of Sukkot

Israeli settlers storm complex in groups and attempt to perform ‘Talmudic rituals’, according to a Waqf official.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[mickey2942]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/13/us/stanford-instructor-jewish-holocaust-comments-reaj/index.html

Why would anyone even discuss whether or not the holocaust was real? Yes, it was real. We had neighbors in Chicago who had numbers tattooed into their arms.

 

[Friday Fan]

Humanitarian Putin…

Did he ever claim to be one?

 

[SkyBoomer]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/13/us/stanford-instructor-jewish-holocaust-comments-reaj/index.html

Why would anyone even discuss whether or not the holocaust was real? Yes, it was real. We had neighbors in Chicago who had numbers tattooed into their arms.

You’d be surprised at the number of Holocaust deniers on SM and well, elsewhere. Mind boggling, the cognitive dissonance.

 

[cottonweaver]

We've seen some posts about opinion polls of Palestinians in Gaza but has anybody looked at polls of Israeli opinion?
example

מעל למחצית מהציבור: על נתניהו להתפטר לאחר הלחימה; הרוב טענו - ההנהגה אחראית למחדל

סקר שנערך בקרב יהודים בלבד חשף כי כמעט כל הציבור סבור שאירוע חדירת מחבלי חמאס לשטחי הדרום הוא מחדל של הנהגת המדינה וטענו כי שלממשלה יש אחריות למצב שהוביל לקריסת כל מערכת ההגנה על היישובים בדרום

www.maariv.co.il

 

[vls12345]

Homemade rockets and modified AK-47s: An annotated look at Hamas’ deadly arsenal

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/13/middleeast/hamas-weapons-invs/index.html

 

[Gardenista]

We've seen some posts about opinion polls of Palestinians in Gaza but has anybody looked at polls of Israeli opinion?
example

מעל למחצית מהציבור: על נתניהו להתפטר לאחר הלחימה; הרוב טענו - ההנהגה אחראית למחדל

סקר שנערך בקרב יהודים בלבד חשף כי כמעט כל הציבור סבור שאירוע חדירת מחבלי חמאס לשטחי הדרום הוא מחדל של הנהגת המדינה וטענו כי שלממשלה יש אחריות למצב שהוביל לקריסת כל מערכת ההגנה על היישובים בדרום

www.maariv.co.il

Yes, we've talked about it in here numerous times

 

[JennieM]

WORLD NEWS

Palestinians in Gaza face impossible choice: Stay home under airstrikes, or flee under airstrikes?​

[…]

In understaffed and poorly supplied hospitals, Palestinian doctors said they felt they had no choice but to stay put. There was no way to evacuate Shifa, Gaza’s biggest hospital, its general director Mohammad Abu Selim said. Even though the hospital was in chaos — its electricity dwindling under an Israeli siege, its beds overwhelmed, its morgue overflowing — Abu Selim said there was simply no other safe place in Gaza to put 600 patients, many of them in serious condition from the attacks.

“To ask us to evacuate is ridiculous, it’s impossible,” Abu Selim said.

[…]

When asked about how civilians would be able to evacuate to safety even as heavy bombardment persisted, Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari, an Israeli military spokesman, told reporters: “We will try to make sure that it will happen.”

[…]

Others did not have the means or the foresight to pack up and leave.

Jamal, in the Jabaliya camp, simply didn’t have a car. The thought of piling his infant son, ailing mother and 30 other family members onto a horse cart and sending them through a war zone made him shudder. He said he was resigned to whatever God had in store for him.

“This way we will be together and can read the Quran and pray,” he said.

[…]

DeBre reported from Jerusalem.

Palestinians in Gaza face impossible choice: Stay home under airstrikes, or flee under airstrikes?

Palestinians are struggling to figure out what to do in the face of Israel's demand that they leave northern Gaza ahead of an expected Israeli invasion.

apnews.com

 

[cottonweaver]

Yes, we've talked about it in here numerous times

I was shocked at that. I would have expected a rally around the Govt effect during war time ( not 59% of Israelis have no faith in this government leading the war)

unstable ( unpopular) political leaders during wartime are a concern eg
56% of Israelis believe Netanyahu should resign at end of conflict with Palestine: Poll

 

[Vern]

I am not taking about a part of the world.

Is Norway part of that world?

The US is concerned. Are they part of that world?

The UN, WHO, Amnesty International, Oxfam all have raised concerns.

Just to be clear:

Israel told them 5 days ago to move to the south. Last night they told them they had 24 hours left to move out. Ask Hamas why they are disrupting their civilians movement.

What other war (has ever seen) sees a country being required to provide food, water, fuel etc to the enemy it is currently engaging? NONE. Israel is the only nation held to this standard.

What other country is expected to open humanitarian corridors midst-war into it's own territory when that humanitarian corridor already exists, and has for years through a 3rd party nation (Egypt in this case) that claims to be supportive o the Palestinian plight? .... despite the fact that Egypt has locked down those crossings and reuses to let women and children through. Only Israel is held to this standard.

What other country bears the brunt of inflicting a "humanitarian disaster" despite roof-knocking, cell calls, texts, millions of leaflets advising civilians where/how to evacute only to be road-blocked by their own Palestian State Television telling them to do otherwise and still carries 100% of the blame or all of it? Only Israel.

It's always Israel's fault .... and they stand on their own with very few friends who are willing to forego the political correctness and call out terrorism, Hamas and a corrupt Palestinian Government, and - quite frankly - a majority chunk of Palestinan civilians who support, even celebrate Hamas and their actions nor do they ever take opportunity to condemn them for their very own complicity is being the actual cause of ths disaster.

This is not and will not be a PC war. But win it Israel must. And wear it they will because only by winning it will they be around to wear it.

I stand with Israel.

 

[JennieM]

10:48 pm BST

Biden says addressing humanitarian crisis in Gaza is a priority

President Joe Biden said Friday that it’s a priority of his administration to address the unfolding humanitarian crisis in the Gaza Strip.

Speaking at an event in Philadelphia to promote a $7 billion program to kickstart development and production of hydrogen fuel in the U.S., Biden paused to note the deteriorating situation for Palestinians as Israel continues to bombard the strip in retaliation for last weekend’s attacks on Israel.

Biden said he’s directed his team to work with the governments in Israel, Egypt, Jordan, and other Arab nations and the United Nations to surge humanitarian relief to those impacted by the war.

“We can’t lose sight of the fact that the overwhelming majority of Palestinians had nothing to do Hamas,” Biden said. “And they’re suffering as a result as well.”
Biden again lashed out at Hamas, saying the militant group in control of Gaza makes the terrorist group Al-Qaida “look pure.”

Current US assessment is Israel 'not responsible' for Gaza hospital blast, White House says

The statement did not mention fuel, and it was not clear when aid would start flowing.

apnews.com

 

[Gardenista]

I was shocked at that. I would have expected a rally around the Govt effect during war time ( not 59% of Israelis have no faith in this government leading the war)

unstable ( unpopular) political leaders during wartime are a concern eg
56% of Israelis believe Netanyahu should resign at end of conflict with Palestine: Poll

Last post I saw in here had him at a 2% approval rating after the attacks. It was 27% before the attacks

 

[Vern]

Please post your links for all the evacuations of civilians that have taken place over the past 6 days.

I posted the notification for them to evacute south (given on 8 October!!) earlier in the thread. I also posted the link to Palestinian State television then telling them to remain as "we live in our homes, we'll die in our homes" in the very same post.