Kyron Horman Discussion Thread 2020 - 2022

[osu]

But what would be the point? Dede should have stayed far away from Terri - she wouldn't have been on anyone's radar if she had - since they had just committed murder together. Instead she moves in with Terri, painting a bright red arrow on herself. And there was a third woman who also bought a burner phone. Why invite her into their circle?

Just because something sounds suspicious ("OMG, burner phones!") doesn't mean it is. Their explanation for them - that Terri's line was tapped and they wanted to have normal conversations without the police listening in - makes sense and also happens to be true.

Who knows? Sometimes we fail to hear something.

I have never heard anything about a search party, or that they were worried. I did a cursory check and came up empty.

The explanation TMH and DeDe gave for buying burner phones to be able to have “normal conversations” without LE listening in is absolutely ludicrous. Really, what secrets did they have and need to talk privately about but didn’t want LE to hear?

I don’t know, maybe it’s just me but if my 7-year-old had vanished a couple of weeks before, my family and I would be an open book to LE letting them listen to all phone calls and having full access to me and my home 24/7 with the desperate hope they could find my child and bring him back home again.
JMO

 

[osu]

No, it's definitely the Terri-did-it scenarios that are contrived.

A and B only work in isolation, since the bioparents and the school are quite capable of talking to each other. I see no need for the F250; it might be needed for the science project, but it wouldn't be needed for Kyron.

See, now it gets contrived again. Only Kaine and Desiree are meant to believe Kyron was at the school, but the jacket and backpack were left there, so we have to come up with an excuse for them to have remained. And if she wanted the school to believe she took Kyron to an appointment, why bother avoiding a disturbance? They already know she's taking him!

Like signing him out? Which she didn't do? And which the school never bothered to confirm?

Do you actually believe an email exists? It just doesn't make the slightest amount of sense. If it did exist, Terri would have been indicted in 2010.

It's telling, I think, how words are used to paint normal actions as sinister. "Busy bee", "barely a second unaccounted for", "forcing an 18-month-old child to accompany her", "in and out of vehicles". Yet, there are plenty of parents who can testify to doing all of this on a perfectly normal day. About the worst thing you can say here is that Terri didn't procrastinate - and of course, not even that is true, since she stopped to chat with an acquaintance at one store, but then even that gets turned sinister by some.

As with the baby-soothing driving, the parking is also something that many parents, even in this forum have admitted to. Terri drove an unfamiliar car, bigger than her usual. So she parked further from the other parked cars to avoid scraping (or getting scraped by) other cars. Unless she worked as mall security, she would have no idea what the surveillance cameras saw or not. But even with the distant parking and the potential camera-shyness, it was a parking lot, and Terri left her truck alone and unattended. Being far from the store doesn't matter if other cars pass by on their way in and out of the lot, and anyone could spot a live Kyron in the truck.

Again, word choice. She "refused" to account for the time, except she actually did (as you say in your parenthesis).

Well, first, we don't know exactly what Terri told the police about her backroad driving, nor how detailed they wanted her to make it. Second, she signed in at the gym at 11:39. That the time is detailed to the minute should give that away. The only other such time is 9:12, and that was from a written receipt. Anywhere else it's 8:45, 9:30, 10:10, 11:20, etc.

It's not the only thing Desiree is wrong about. Generally, after having read the book, I don't think Desiree always understood what the police told her, or she was far to eager to interpret every shred of information from a guilt-centric perspective. This is the woman who went to the police the evening of Kyron's disappearance and told them she believed Terri was involved, based on faulty information.

Again, how could that have possibly happened if there was an email???

I'm happy you mentioned Ted Bundy's hobbies, since I very much believe that is what happened. A well-dressed adult entered the open and unmonitored school with the other guests, walking around calmly and confidently, acting as if he belonged, then asked a helpful young boy if he could help him get something from his car. Then drove far away with Kyron in his car, not caring one bit when the alarm was sounded.

And like Ted Bundy, they didn't know who he was and where he lived, and he had no reason to ever come back. Thus, there was no way of tracing his movements. Unlike Terri, he had all the time in the world to do what he wanted to, far away from any witnesses.

Would this be actual or alleged?

So, the backroad area where she said she was driving.

What would those bank transactions possibly be? And where does that information come from?

I would suggest the "area of interest" was that because she told them she was in the area and they were by then suffering from tunnel vision.

Or it's another case of Desiree fudging the truth in the Morris book.

The coffee was at the first Fred Meyer, the dry cleaners was at the second. Neither would require much in the way of driving.

But it would still be visible to anyone driving past, which they would do in the parking lot of a large store.

Which she would have had no time or place to actually do.

Going down the route of "sold" or "buyer" leaves us in the realm of fiction.

Yeah, but it should be plausible, I think. The scenarios needed for Terri to be guilty are incredibly contrived. She either has to kill Kyron in a public place, in full view of the road, the church and the entrance to the parking lot, or she has to have him alive in the truck at three public places, not to mention the road between them. She has to have made the bioparents believe Kyron was at school, but she also have to have the school believe he was with her (which doesn't make sense in itself - why would she concoct a story that explicitely puts her and Kyron together?).

I wouldn't call "in full view of a road and a church" "amazingly private".

The witnesses are attested to by Desiree alone. What I find fascinating is that she identifies those witnesses in the book, but neither her nor Morris appears to have actually talked to them.

No, it's perfectly explainable. She drove around with her daughter trying to get her to sleep in the truck. It's not something she can confirm, by the very nature of her locations, but she did explain it.

Think about it. Let's say you decide to go for a walk on a trail in a forested area, like thousands of people do daily. You take about an hour to do so, and during that time a murder occurs within walking distance of the forest. Now, you can say that you can't prove you were on the trail the whole time. That's valid. But you can't say that you "refuse to account for" it or that it is "unexplainable". People, including you and me, do things every day that can't be confirmed. It doesn't make them suspicious in and of itself.

Of course she thought that. Kyron was marked absent at 10. She left the school just before 9. It had to have happened between those times. And how was she to know when the school marked him as absent? They should have done that at 8:45. Given the sloppiness of the teacher, they may well have waited until the afternoon, so how was Terri to know how long she needed to make her alibi?

The polygraphs do not justify speculation - we might as well do a tarot reading. But law enforcement does seem to put weight on them, which just goes to show how unfit they were to handle this.

There won't be. The evidence was presented before a grand jury, and they didn't indict. When (hopefully not if) Kyron is found, she will likely join the ranks of Lindy Chamberlain, Joanne Lees, Timothy Da'Shaun Taylor, Faith Hedgepeth's roommate, Isabel Celis's father, Samantha Koenig's father, Jacob Wetterling's neighbour, Amanda Knox and many more who the public were convinced were guilty either by their behaviour or because LE said so, but were ultimately shown to be innocent.

It's telling that they haven't been able to get an indictment against her after twelve years. Getting an indictment is the easy part!

Why do we assume it was Terri's car? By the time those pictures were released, they had already asked the public to specifically look for Terri's car, not just any white car. Of course the public will think any white truck they saw that morning was Terri's. Not to mention this being before the groundskeeper came forward (and he also drove a white truck).

Or she was at the far end of the property working, like she was supposed to, from 11:30 to 13:00, not hearing the call for lunch. Also, if she was involved and had a burner phone, then moving in with Terri shortly after and getting new burner phones along with a third, innocent party would be extremely irrational.

Yeah, the reason being that they had nothing. Terri had a solid timeline with no room for an abduction that didn't involve parading Kyron through public places. Their sting operation had failed. They had no witnesses, no evidence.

Desperation is the reason.

But she did come forward. She did cooperate. She was interviewed by the police multiple times in 2010. The only thing she didn't do was take a polygraph (again, voodoo science, so good on her). She told them the truth, that she wasn't involved and didn't think Terri was. They claimed they didn't believe her. What was she supposed to do then?

She won't be charged, since they have no evidence against her. She never forced LE to do anything. She was summoned before the grand jury in 2010, but they didn't ask her anything. The police could have done that at any point until 2013, but chose not to. In 2013 she testified before the grand jury, and that was that. If you want to blame anyone, blame LE.

I doubt the FBI administered any polygraph. And in the year of 2010, the FBI certainly had no objections to female killers. But their profile in this case is more than likely a correct one.

“The coffee was at the first Fred Meyer, the dry cleaner was at the second.”

I never knew the coffee shop and the dry cleaners were located inside of the Fred Meyer grocery stores? Was that information released by LE/media at some point?

JMO

 

[Truth Prevails]

Since everything is secret and unknown to us, I don't draw that conclusion. I'm encouraged that they were still meeting seven years after Kyron's disappearance. And as far as we know, they could have met since then.

In the Kristin Smart case, Paul Flores was a known suspect for neary 25 years before he was arrested.

In the Deorr Kunz Jr. case, the parents have been named suspects for seven years; no arrests.

At trial, it's not about what's true, it's about what can be proven.

Terri did a good job of covering up her crime. I guess that's damning with faint praise.

Strike-through done by me. (Hope you're okay with that).

True enough. Probable cause is certainly enough to make an arrest, although the burden required for proof beyond a reasonable doubt is much higher, especially if Kyron's case ends up being tried as a "no body" case. I guess that's why they're still methodically gathering evidence. {groan}

One thing I found interesting in the link from KGW8 was the response to Kyle Iboshi's public records request for the Sheriff's report into the 1990 murder-for-hire plot.

I didn't realize it would be held with such significance in Kyron's case. They denied Kyle's request but they explained why in their response. It's interesting.

Here is a short transcription from an interesting part and I'll link to just the document below. It's embedded in the media link, but it's easier to read full screen.

Snipped Quote: "We accept the determination of the criminal investigators that, under the circumstances, the information gathered in the reports relate to the Kyron Horman disappearance case, that the information has potentially significant value to the ongoing case and that disclosure could interfere with the investigation and could jeopardize future law enforcement proceedings. See generally, Declaration of Keith Krafve. We also accept that representations of the Roseburg Police Department that their investigation is ongoing. In accepting these representations, we again note that a grand jury is currently empaneled in the Kyron Horman case. While the grand jury process is secret, evidence contained in MCSO report 11-401045 may cover evidence and testimony which has been or will be presented to the grand jury. Disclosure of these reports could clearly interfere with that evidence and testimony before the grand jury. Furthermore, the evidence contained in MCSO report 11-401045 could be offered into evidence in a future criminal prosecution (in either a guilt or punishment phase of a criminal case) regarding the Kyron Horman disappearance. See e.g., OEC 404; State v. Williams, 357 Or 1 (2015)(discussing the applicability of OEC 404 and the admissibility of other acts evidence in criminal cases); see also State v. Longo, 341 Or 580, 604 (2006) (discussing the state’s burden to prove the probability of “future dangerousness” in certain capital cases). For the foregoing reasons, we conclude that at this time there does exist a clear need to delay disclosure and that the MCSO report falls within the exemption outlined in ORS 192.501(3)."
DocumentCloud

After reading the Appeal Decision, I'm encouraged that someday she may hear a knock on her door.

 

[ReadySet]

Strike-through done by me. (Hope you're okay with that).

True enough. Probable cause is certainly enough to make an arrest, although the burden required for proof beyond a reasonable doubt is much higher, especially if Kyron's case ends up being tried as a "no body" case. I guess that's why they're still methodically gathering evidence. {groan}

One thing I found interesting in the link from KGW8 was the response to Kyle Iboshi's public records request for the Sheriff's report into the 1990 murder-for-hire plot.

I didn't realize it would be held with such significance in Kyron's case. They denied Kyle's request but they explained why in their response. It's interesting.

Here is a short transcription from an interesting part and I'll link to just the document below. It's embedded in the media link, but it's easier to read full screen.

Snipped Quote: "We accept the determination of the criminal investigators that, under the circumstances, the information gathered in the reports relate to the Kyron Horman disappearance case, that the information has potentially significant value to the ongoing case and that disclosure could interfere with the investigation and could jeopardize future law enforcement proceedings. See generally, Declaration of Keith Krafve. We also accept that representations of the Roseburg Police Department that their investigation is ongoing. In accepting these representations, we again note that a grand jury is currently empaneled in the Kyron Horman case. While the grand jury process is secret, evidence contained in MCSO report 11-401045 may cover evidence and testimony which has been or will be presented to the grand jury. Disclosure of these reports could clearly interfere with that evidence and testimony before the grand jury. Furthermore, the evidence contained in MCSO report 11-401045 could be offered into evidence in a future criminal prosecution (in either a guilt or punishment phase of a criminal case) regarding the Kyron Horman disappearance. See e.g., OEC 404; State v. Williams, 357 Or 1 (2015)(discussing the applicability of OEC 404 and the admissibility of other acts evidence in criminal cases); see also State v. Longo, 341 Or 580, 604 (2006) (discussing the state’s burden to prove the probability of “future dangerousness” in certain capital cases). For the foregoing reasons, we conclude that at this time there does exist a clear need to delay disclosure and that the MCSO report falls within the exemption outlined in ORS 192.501(3)."
DocumentCloud

After reading the Appeal Decision, I'm encouraged that someday she may hear a knock on her door.

LOL, no problem with the strike-through.

I have no doubt Terri will get that knock at her door. Justice is coming for her. And her choice to disappear Kyron will have horrible consequences for her.

 

[cocomod]

Thank you! That's interesting. I must say, if the grand jury is still hearing evidence in 2017, it certainly doesn't sound like they have probable cause.

I disagree. They could have probable cause, but not enough to ensure a conviction. Double jeopardy and all. Josh Powell was the POI in Susan's disappearance. He was never charged even though there is a ton of circumstantial evidence against him. There are many, many cases that are the same. A recent one is Karen Swift. Her husband has always been the main POI, he was finally arrested this year - 10 years after her death. Sometimes there is just one key piece of evidence that tips the scale and makes the arrest possible.

 

[SuziQ]

Same here.



Her DUI also involved child endangerment. At the very least, that is probably why she was never able to get a teaching job.

What about the lurid affair with Kaine's old friend 3-weeks after Kyron's disappearance and providing him Kaine's strictly confidential address? Law enforcement called her sexual escapades part of her MO. Apparently, she had used a similar modus operandi with the landscaper. And there has been discussion of her involvement in another murder-for-hire plot when she wasn't even out of her teens, or just barely.

What about threatening to kidnap the baby from the gym? What about the California incidents since Kyron's disappearance that were newsworthy? Examples: stealing a vehicle, having a stolen gun in her possession, and holding a kitchen knife to her boyfriend's neck. I'm probably missing some.

It can't be denied that these all show disrespect for the rules of society and a predilection towards crimes of violence.



Just to be clear, the second is "The fact that Terri places herself with Kyron shortly before he disappeared." She certainly did place herself with him. She took the now iconic photo of Kyron at 8:45 am inside his classroom. At 8:50 am, they were seen walking side by side through the school parking lot. The vehicle was not parked in the school parking lot where she had said it was but instead was parked on the gravel road on the west side of the school where the elevation drops, partially concealing the vehicle. And that is strange, IMO.



The ping does nothing to support her whereabouts. For one thing, we can't say for sure who had her cell phone that day. My understanding is that someone was trying to call her and the call went unanswered.

But the time of the ping does fall within the 90-minutes she can't account for. However, it is doubtful that the location of the tower places her in the area where she said she was. But she was driving, so maybe.

Also falling within those same 90-minutes is yet another of those pesky, unreliable eyewitnesses who told LE that the F250 was seen pulled over on a fire trail off Newberry Road. And this had enough weight to it that it caused Terri to add to her story that she may have stopped around there somewhere to change a diaper but she couldn't be sure. She had no idea what she might have done with the soiled diaper.

Now this is a relatively young woman, hopefully not stricken with Alzheimer's disease. She surely would have to have some memory of where she drove and where she stopped during a 90-minute interval. She had her 18-month-old daughter with her. The word responsibility comes to my mind.

Law enforcement twice took her back to the area where she said she was in hopes of jogging her memory, but, nope, it didn't help.

It would be a very good thing for her to be able to prove where she was during those 90-missing-minutes on the day her stepson would seemingly vanish. (After he was seen leaving the school with her). So why can't she? Why won't she?



Not at all. There is that strange matter of the partially concealed vehicle. What was going on there?

How much time existed between when she exited the field of the witness's vision and when she pulled out onto the highway driving the F250? She would only need a few minutes. To harm him? To pass him off? She is just as guilty if she passed Kyron off to someone.

Could another adult have been waiting in the vehicle? After all, if she parked in the school parking lot, how did the vehicle get to the partially concealed area of the gravel road?

Are the 90-missing-minutes she won't explain because she had to meet the "someone" she had passed Kyron off to, but first she had to set up her "tight" alibi? Her early emails to friends show that she wanted everyone to believe Kyron went missing between 9 am and 10 am. The big hole in her timeline starts at approximately 10 minutes past 10 o'clock on the morning of June 4, 2010.

What about the strange parking positions at both Fred Meyers? It would have been to her advantage to show that Kyron's booster seat was empty and that she was alone (with the exception of having her baby with her).

I don't believe for a moment she was trying to conceal the presence of an alive and well Kyron sitting up alertly in his booster seat. If he was in that vehicle at that time he was under a tarp or in a recycling bin of some sort.

Is this an indication of three people involved?



Yes, her car never left the flower farm on Old Germantown Road and her known cell phone inexplicably was locked inside it. But both the ping area and the witness sighting of the F250 on NW Newberry Road are within a driving time range for Terri to have picked DeDe up and reached the gym by 11:39 am. IIRC, wasn't she working near an old hot house on the back end of the property that day? A pretty easy location from which to slip away unseen and then return, equally unseen.

The time Terri left the gym offered enough time for her to drop DeDe off at the flower farm by 1:00 pm. Which is when she surfaced.



Sure, but it's best for us to call in what we see and let law enforcement be the judge. In cases of this magnitude, the media gets desperate for any bit of news it can find and things like this get out.

Yeah, DeDe was promptly at work by 9 am.



It does, indeed, leave us with the evidence. Which none of us are privy to. IMO, based on what we know which is what you are also doing, Terri, or someone else acting on her behalf, could certainly have killed Kyron before 10:10 am.

That whole morning reminds me of Gannon Stauch. And we know how that ended. JMO.

 

[minazoe]

looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck. mOO

 

[FergusMcDuck]

“The coffee was at the first Fred Meyer, the dry cleaner was at the second.”

I never knew the coffee shop and the dry cleaners were located inside of the Fred Meyer grocery stores? Was that information released by LE/media at some point?

JMO

Channel 6 KOIN said the Starbucks employees summoned to the grand jury were at the Cornelius Pass Road Starbucks, which is the location of the first Fred Meyer. I have no link to the broadcast, but the information was relayed here. There are two Starbucks there, one inside the Fred Meyer, one outside. Apparently the employees were from the outside store, but I don't have a reliable source for that.

Reporter Kyle Iboshi mentions the staff member from the dry cleaners, Magic Cleaners, and specifies it was in Beaverton. No remaining video here either, but I did find a transcript:

Kyle Iboshi: Terri Horman's lawyers also hope to question the owner of Magic Cleaners in Beaverton. She says that Terri came in ALONE and dropped off some clothes the day Kyron disappeared.

The only Magic Cleaners in Beaverton (no longer open) was at 16035 SW Walker Road, which is in the second Fred Meyer.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

The explanation TMH and DeDe gave for buying burner phones to be able to have “normal conversations” without LE listening in is absolutely ludicrous. Really, what secrets did they have and need to talk privately about but didn’t want LE to hear?

I don’t know, maybe it’s just me but if my 7-year-old had vanished a couple of weeks before, my family and I would be an open book to LE letting them listen to all phone calls and having full access to me and my home 24/7 with the desperate hope they could find my child and bring him back home again.
JMO

Different strokes, I suppose. At which point do you realize that nothing you say to the police will stop them from suspecting you?

Rather than specifying the time passed, I'd be more inclined to look at the events in between, which include a failed police sting, phone surveillance, public posters that imply her guilt. If you're innocent, you know that the police are looking in the wrong place. If you're innocent, what does it matter what you say, if the police just refuse to believe you? And if the stories about the focus on polygraphs are true, they're doing so on something that is little better than astrology.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

I disagree. They could have probable cause, but not enough to ensure a conviction. Double jeopardy and all. Josh Powell was the POI in Susan's disappearance. He was never charged even though there is a ton of circumstantial evidence against him. There are many, many cases that are the same. A recent one is Karen Swift. Her husband has always been the main POI, he was finally arrested this year - 10 years after her death. Sometimes there is just one key piece of evidence that tips the scale and makes the arrest possible.

I suppose we'll see. My guess is that we'll see one of two scenarios.

1. Nothing ever happens, and the case just becomes another cold one on the lists.
2. The body is found, either by accident or a thanks to a confession, and it will be revealed to be an hitherto unknown suspect.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

I disagree. They could have probable cause, but not enough to ensure a conviction. Double jeopardy and all. Josh Powell was the POI in Susan's disappearance. He was never charged even though there is a ton of circumstantial evidence against him. There are many, many cases that are the same. A recent one is Karen Swift. Her husband has always been the main POI, he was finally arrested this year - 10 years after her death. Sometimes there is just one key piece of evidence that tips the scale and makes the arrest possible.

I suppose we'll see. My guess is that we'll see one of two scenarios.

1. Nothing ever happens, and the case just becomes another cold one on the lists.
2. The body is found, either by accident or a thanks to a confession, and it will be revealed to be an hitherto unknown suspect.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Tldr. I have never heard the expression "... guilt-centric perspective". ?

I don't know how common it is. I heard it on another forum and thought it useful. Basically, it means when you've decided - either by mere intuition or some outside information - that a person is guilty, and then proceed to interpret pretty much all that person says or does as strange/suspicious and thus another indication of guilt.

 

[ilovewings]

The explanation TMH and DeDe gave for buying burner phones to be able to have “normal conversations” without LE listening in is absolutely ludicrous. Really, what secrets did they have and need to talk privately about but didn’t want LE to hear?

I don’t know, maybe it’s just me but if my 7-year-old had vanished a couple of weeks before, my family and I would be an open book to LE letting them listen to all phone calls and having full access to me and my home 24/7 with the desperate hope they could find my child and bring him back home again.
JMO

It's not just you---- LOL

 

[ChatteringBirds]

I don't know how common it is. I heard it on another forum and thought it useful. Basically, it means when you've decided - either by mere intuition or some outside information - that a person is guilty, and then proceed to interpret pretty much all that person says or does as strange/suspicious and thus another indication of guilt.

And if you believe someone to be innocent of a crime, you will also be prone to interpreting the case in that light. You would have a strong confirmation bias as well, whether over small details or the "picture at large," regardless of what a potential suspect "says or does." IMO.

 

[ReadySet]

And if you believe someone to be innocent of a crime, you will also be prone to interpreting the case in that light. You would have a strong confirmation bias as well, whether over small details or the "picture at large," regardless of what a potential suspect "says or does." IMO.

Absolutely.

 

[ReadySet]

Different strokes, I suppose. At which point do you realize that nothing you say to the police will stop them from suspecting you?

Rather than specifying the time passed, I'd be more inclined to look at the events in between, which include a failed police sting, phone surveillance, public posters that imply her guilt. If you're innocent, you know that the police are looking in the wrong place. If you're innocent, what does it matter what you say, if the police just refuse to believe you? And if the stories about the focus on polygraphs are true, they're doing so on something that is little better than astrology.

Many parents have been in the same situation, and they have been heavily suspected, even more so than Terri, and they have not given up and stopped talking. They have done the hard work, they have kept the faith and no matter how devastated and panicked they were, they knew that since they knew their child better than anyone, they HAD TO KEEP TALKING TO LE. Because what if, after three and a half weeks, they REMEMBERED SOMETHING that might be helpful to LE, or to other searchers, or to the public, something helpful to find their child?

Innocent parents can't see the future. They do not know for a fact that they will remain a suspect forever. They work to prove their innocence, so that LE can move on from them. They want the perp caught, so that their child can be found. They don't just give up!

Unless they're guilty.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Many parents have been in the same situation, and they have been heavily suspected, even more so than Terri, and they have not given up and stopped talking. They have done the hard work, they have kept the faith and no matter how devastated and panicked they were, they knew that since they knew their child better than anyone, they HAD TO KEEP TALKING TO LE. Because what if, after three and a half weeks, they REMEMBERED SOMETHING that might be helpful to LE, or to other searchers, or to the public, something helpful to find their child?

Innocent parents can't see the future. They do not know for a fact that they will remain a suspect forever. They work to prove their innocence, so that LE can move on from them. They want the perp caught, so that their child can be found. They don't just give up!

Unless they're guilty.

How many of them were the subject of a failed police sting, based on a bogus murder-for-hire plot, that tore their family apart? How many of them had their faces plastered on police posters, and had constant police leaks through family members?

It's not like Terri Horman can't talk to the police, she just requires them to go through her lawyer and have him be present. According to her (the dr Phil interview, I believe) the police have never requested an interview since she got her lawyer. I've never seen the police claim otherwise.

 

[FergusMcDuck]

And if you believe someone to be innocent of a crime, you will also be prone to interpreting the case in that light. You would have a strong confirmation bias as well, whether over small details or the "picture at large," regardless of what a potential suspect "says or does." IMO.

Which is why it's rarely all that productive to analyze what a person says or does after a crime, unless it deals with concrete information. Maybe it seems like I'm always interpreting these things in Terri's favor, but what I'm actually highlighting is that if the "innocent" reasons for their words and actions exist, it is entirely pointless in establishing guilt.

My focus is on the evidence, and that is where the case against Terri falls apart, imo.

 

[OddOneOut]

I don't know how common it is. I heard it on another forum and thought it useful. Basically, it means when you've decided - either by mere intuition or some outside information - that a person is guilty, and then proceed to interpret pretty much all that person says or does as strange/suspicious and thus another indication of guilt.

In other words, it means "tunnel vision." We usually fault the police for having "tunnel vision;" however, anyone can have it.

 

[OddOneOut]

I don't know how common it is. I heard it on another forum and thought it useful. Basically, it means when you've decided - either by mere intuition or some outside information - that a person is guilty, and then proceed to interpret pretty much all that person says or does as strange/suspicious and thus another indication of guilt.

Sorry, I accidentally double posted this.