Laura Babcock Murder Trial 10.26.17 - Day 4

[Satchie]

That is what I don't understand , that LB had a ongoing relationship with DM and CN was dating the last witness today and they were all friends. I thought the motive for DM wanting to kill Laura was because Laura told CN that they were involved. Things are not making sense at all.

I guess a few months later it was supposed to be over between LB and DM, and CN and DM were supposed to be exclusive. But either it was still going on behind CN's back (my guess), or LB just claimed it was. Making CN jealous, mad, maybe threatening to break up with DM.

My guess is he claimed LB was lying and promised CN to "remove her from our lives". Kind of like a Valentine's present I guess (irony).

 

[RandomName479]

Oh okay , I can't remember the names. Yeah but if CN had a bf at the time and all of them were together all the time, there would be no reason why CN would care if LB was in a relationship with DM. If DM was in a relationship with Laura he lied to the last boyfriend. This is such a strange case.

billandrew......maybe you could post your kick-butt timeline and help some of the newer people out/refresh the memory of others? There was def. some partner overlap (esp with DM), but the testimony today didn't change anything about the motive for me.....at the time of LB's murder DM was dating CN (with several side pieces) .....MOO

 

[winter2017]

I think the guy not only sold guns but drugs so could be where MS got the drugs.

 

[Satchie]

Why would you think he didn't need a motive? TB's was the truck, LBs was because she was interfering in his relationship with CN, and WM was for his money.

I mean a motive that normal people can relate to! Like jealousy, economic desperation, an overbearing, bullying father. I think DM's motives are more like 'excuses'. The real motive was that he perceived certain people as being in his way, so he 'removed' them, feeling perfectly entitled and never experiencing remorse.

 

[hugsherman]

Satchie, a motive isn't the same as a reason. IMOO, as I'm not a legal eagle, motive is a tool that makes it look reasonable the person would have committed the crime. Sort of the back-story. But it doesn't need to make sense to us, in an if-i-were-in-his-shoes way. It's not a justification, just a plausible answer to the question of Why?

IMO if we try to really understand why, we might never get a conviction because some acts are senseless evil more than anything else.

 

[redwing7225]

billandrew......maybe you could post your kick-butt timeline and help some of the newer people out/refresh the memory of others? There was def. some partner overlap (esp with DM), but the testimony today didn't change anything about the motive for me.....at the time of LB's murder DM was dating CN (with several side pieces) .....MOO

Side pieces, iirc, DM wasn't faithful to JS. Side pieces included LB, CN, LW (any others)?

 

[musicaljoke]

I'll add one....

- Does DM wear lawyer's robes into the courtroom?

Only lawyers can wear the barrister's robes, black or grey "court striped" pants or skirt, a white wingtip collared shirt, waistcoat, robe and white tabs. Their robes are carried in a blue velvet bag with their initials.

 

[DavidCronin]

In response to user Winter2017; Yes I was a witness. Was there testifying this morning. Also thank you everyone for your messages of encouragement. Means a lot to me.

Thanks,
David Cronin

 

[JuneBug67]

Just wanted to say that it’s a really big deal that you’ve come out the other side of heroin addiction DavidCronin. A really big deal. I’m sure there’s still road to travel to get to where you want to be, but you should be super proud of the distance between where you were, and now. Hope your important contribution to justice today was part of of a lifetime of being on the right side of the law, the right side of society, and the right side of life. Well done. And hugs.

 

[billandrew]

billandrew......maybe you could post your kick-butt timeline and help some of the newer people out/refresh the memory of others? There was def. some partner overlap (esp with DM), but the testimony today didn't change anything about the motive for me.....at the time of LB's murder DM was dating CN (with several side pieces) .....MOO

My timeline is in my signature, but I have not documented the relationships because the timing of them is too blurry to reflect properly in this format.

I have, however, added all of the evidence that I could find with a date/time from this trial so far. Eg. the texts between Lerner/Millard, Smich's rap lyrics, the date that photos were taken on Millard's phone, the "BBQ is ready for meat" message, etc. Lots of stuff from July 2012. If you open the timeline and search the word "Babcock" you can jump to each entry related to this trial. It's fascinating to see everything fit with the Bosma trial evidence and other info to present a bigger picture of what these guys were up to.

 

[james9]

Here are some questions that interest me...

- where do Smich and Millard spend their nights during the trial?
- do they travel in the same police van?
- are they in separate holding areas at the courthouse?
- do they eat lunch in separate areas?

I'd just be interested to know if there was a place or time during the day where they might feel comfortable enough to communicate? Granted, Smich likely wouldn't have much to say, but Millard most certainly has some things he'd like to say to Smich.

Both DM and MS are in the same detention centre. MS is in segregation and DM is in general population. They sleep at the detention centre at night and leave early in the morning to head to the court for the trial. I can't tell you if they travel in the same van or not. I doubt they have much interaction with each other. For safety reasons they are kept apart, since they both blamed each other for the TB murder. I don't think they eat lunch in the same area, and I'm guessing they are kept in separate holding areas in the courthouse.

 

[Stratocaster]

Rip Laura Babcock

Followed closely from the first TB trial, and we have one more to fully absorb with the WM case, I mean, who kills their father? I loved mine, rip dad. Today, I took a peak into the life of David Cronin, I applaud you for sharing your story, and wish you sincere continued success.

 

[Tealgrove]

This just occurred to me today as I was driving home and maybe I'm terribly naive but here we go....

I didn't pay a whole lot of attention to Isho. I know he's the gun guy. I know he pled guilty of supplying guns to DM. I looked at that ridiculous video. I get what he is.

After today's testimony about Isho being seen at MS's home, coming and going from a shed in the backyard, am I to take from that that Isho was MS's supplier?

And then I wondered, if MS had been selling drugs way before he met DM and apparently continued to sell drugs, how come he didn't have any money? He lived with his mother, didn't have a car, rode a bike and cleaned toilets for favours from DM. Am I missing something? :waitasec:

Please help out this 50 something woman who sips wine and listens to classic rock. I'm lost. :gaah:

 

[Stratocaster]

This just occurred to me today as I was driving home and maybe I'm terribly naive but here we go....

I didn't pay a whole lot of attention to Isho. I know he's the gun guy. I know he pled guilty of supplying guns to DM. I looked at that ridiculous video. I get what he is.

After today's testimony about Isho being seen at MS's home, coming and going from a shed in the backyard, am I to take from that that Isho was MS's supplier?

And then I wondered, if MS had been selling drugs way before he met DM and apparently continued to sell drugs, how come he didn't have any money? He lived with his mother, didn't have a car, rode a bike and cleaned toilets for favours from DM. Am I missing something? :waitasec:

Please help out this 50 something woman who sips wine and listens to classic rock. I'm lost. :gaah:

Lol on your closing statements, same boat loving the sleuthing, I would like to see 'isho' on the stand, wonder if it will happen

 

[Inspector_North]

And then I wondered, if MS had been selling drugs way before he met DM and apparently continued to sell drugs, how come he didn't have any money?

My guess would be he was a user. Don't use if you sell and want something left at the end of the month. JMO

 

[Alice Ramnit]

This just occurred to me today as I was driving home and maybe I'm terribly naive but here we go....

I didn't pay a whole lot of attention to Isho. I know he's the gun guy. I know he pled guilty of supplying guns to DM. I looked at that ridiculous video. I get what he is.

After today's testimony about Isho being seen at MS's home, coming and going from a shed in the backyard, am I to take from that that Isho was MS's supplier?

And then I wondered, if MS had been selling drugs way before he met DM and apparently continued to sell drugs, how come he didn't have any money? He lived with his mother, didn't have a car, rode a bike and cleaned toilets for favours from DM. Am I missing something? :waitasec:

Please help out this 50 something woman who sips wine and listens to classic rock. I'm lost. :gaah:

Haha! I am a member of the same club Tealgrove!

 

[winter2017]

I am sure that it was not easy and to have to face MS, and DM. It was many years ago and to have to remember everything would not be easy. Most people on this site and a few on fb are 100% for the victims not the accused. Only one person on a fb group was pro the accused.

 

[winter2017]

Hugsherman, that is what Tim Bosma s death was senseless. DM had the money to buy the truck. They could have tied Tim Bosma up and left him stranded in the country instead of the the cold blooded murder. All of it is senseless and that is what made me have interest in the case , like what was the motives for the killings. In case of Tim Bosma there was no known motive, because DM could have paid for the truck or like I said dumped Tim Bosma out of the truck and taken off. I guess trying to get into the mind of DM is not possible because the crimes just senseless.

 

[JPC]

Why would you think he didn't need a motive? TB's was the truck, LBs was because she was interfering in his relationship with CN, and WM was for his money.

He didn't have to kill TB for the truck. He could have let him go. He could have taken the truck from the driveway in the night without ever being seen. He CHOSE to kill him and did it not long after leaving the Bosma's house. I believe that killing the owner of the truck and using his fancy new BBQ was the plan all along. He could have written LB off to CN as a delusional junkie. He CHOSE to kill her and if the defence strategy is correct was planning to incinerate her all along.

 

[Sphinx]

He didn't have to kill TB for the truck. He could have let him go. He could have taken the truck from the driveway in the night without ever being seen. He CHOSE to kill him and did it not long after leaving the Bosma's house. I believe that killing the owner of the truck and using his fancy new BBQ was the plan all along. He could have written LB off to CN as a delusional junkie. He CHOSE to kill her and if the defence strategy is correct was planning to incinerate her all along.

I have suspected for a long time that DM wanted to establish a murder for hire and/or body disposal business. There would be big money in this, and he thought he needed a lot more money coming in each month. Such a business sounds like something out of a crime novel. I think all the power and excitement greatly appealed to him as well. He got rid of people that got in his way, like his father, then Laura. Her death may have been in part because he wanted to test the Elininator. It was easy, so he planned to kill the owner of a truck, and steal the truck. If he and Smitch had not been arrested, and put away for life, they likely would have killed hundreds more people, or at least helped other criminals dispose of bodies for a big fee. That eliminator was on a trailer, and the man who sold them said no one in his company had ever seen one mounted that way to make it easy to move around. They might have traveled to other places to kill and/or dispose of bodies, not always using the hangar. IMO