True, Brefie. It would be more true if the door had been locked so Madeleine couldn't get out, and doubly true if her parents had bothered to make sure the children were suitably supervised. However, with an unlocked door and a child who had already escaped alone from the apartment before, to say they were, without a doubt, positive she'd been abducted was short-sighted and wrong. And if it turns out that Madeleine was killed in the apartment by a stranger, the McCanns are partly responsible for shoving the case in a wrong direction from the get-go.
Madeleine McCann 3 year old missing in Portugal - Part 10
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True, Brefie. It would be more true if the door had been locked so Madeleine couldn't get out, and doubly true if her parents had bothered to make sure the children were suitably supervised. However, with an unlocked door and a child who had already escaped alone from the apartment before, to say they were, without a doubt, positive she'd been abducted was short-sighted and wrong. And if it turns out that Madeleine was killed in the apartment by a stranger, the McCanns are partly responsible for shoving the case in a wrong direction from the get-go.
Brefie
New Member
If she was killed in the apartment by a stranger, you are absolutely right that the McCann's are guilty of very questionable acts, however, I still do not believe they are guilty of intentionally 'shoving' the case in the wrong direction.
LE, regardless of geography should not have ANY cases shoved in the wrong direction by ANYONE. This is why we refer to them as the 'authorities'.
sleuthin4fun
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There have been reports that Maddie had actually wandered off earlier in the week. It has also been reported that they had difficulty calming her in the evening to go to sleep. Neighbors reported crying coming from their apartment at night when the children had been left.
I can say that as a mother, if I came in and found her missing after these other instances of behavior my first thought would be that she had wandered off again. I can promise that my first response would be to turn on all the lights, turn the room upside down screaming for her as I was doing it. My first response would not be "they have taken her." Who are they"? I am not saying that the McCanns are guilty of anything just observing that their behavior was negligent and a bit odd to say the least!!!!!
I will also add though that nothing would surprise me at this time.
As you already know, Laci's car was in her driveway and she wasn't ready to go into labor at anytime. And she wasn't home because her husband whom proclaimed her "missing" had already killed her. But, that's another case.
As with this 3 year old (day's away from 4), she had already left the apartment once that week when her parents were going out (to leave them alone), another time they were called back to the apartment because other vacationers reported loud crying coming from the apartment. But, you know that too since you've read "thousands of articles" on this case.
For those reasons and more, Kate's proclomation that "they've taken her" makes no sense.
Texana
Overreaching
Because the door was unlocked, according to the McCanns. Thinking that Maddie had woken and gone to look for her parents is a more rational thought than "they've taken her," but even if the "They've taken her" is the first thought, the second would surely be "but I hope to God she's just wandered off again, and she's around here somewhere."
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
twinkiesmom
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Anyone irresponsible enough to leave 3 toddlers alone in an unlocked first floor foreign hotel room and then misrepresent the truth and make excuses to justify such behavior is capable of anything. When you add in their medical degrees (and the ones of their partners) and their insistence that she couldn't have wandered away, it leads me to the impression that it may have been an oversedation death.
I find the same arrogance in these folks as that miserable Sabine Bieber who drugged her daycare kids, and one toddler died.
http://www.courttv.com/trials/bieber/timeline_ctv.html
They found diphenydramine in the babies' diapers, and her lawyers were still trying to argue that Dane's death had nothing to do with it. And then she went on to sue Costco for inadequate warnings about the dangers of sedating babies with diphenydramine, a drug she gave to children without parental consent.
I find the same arrogance in these folks as that miserable Sabine Bieber who drugged her daycare kids, and one toddler died.
http://www.courttv.com/trials/bieber/timeline_ctv.html
They found diphenydramine in the babies' diapers, and her lawyers were still trying to argue that Dane's death had nothing to do with it. And then she went on to sue Costco for inadequate warnings about the dangers of sedating babies with diphenydramine, a drug she gave to children without parental consent.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article2280654.ece
Detectives hunting for Madeline on alert for series of new searches
Detectives hunting for Madeleine McCann have been ordered to prepare for an operation over the next four days that they hope will lead to a breakthrough, The Times has learnt.
The Public Prosecutor’s Office signed a series of warrants yesterday authorising searches at locations that may be linked to the disappearance of Madeleine 107 days ago. Officers have been told that the operation will be carried out by Tuesday.
The Portuguese Polícia Judiciária believes that it has uncovered evidence that could be significant in discovering what happened to Madeleine after she was taken from her bed in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz.
The searches follow the arrival in Portugal of the result of tests on samples recovered from the McCann family’s apartment, their car and other locations in Praia da Luz.
The Times revealed on Thursday that the preliminary notes from the headquarters of the Forensic Science Service in Birmingham showed that traces of blood in the apartment had come from a man.
However, the findings received by the Laboratório de Polícia Científica in Lisbon on Wednesday indicated that the blood samples were too damaged to be checked against the DNA database of British sex offenders. Scientists have been attempting to recover a better profile.
The Portuguese magistrate in charge of the investigation has now been sent the full report on all the samples recovered as part of a review of the investigation completed with the help of British experts.
It is not known if the possible breakthrough in the investigation is connected with scientific evidence, although detectives are believed to have been monitoring the movements of at least one suspect for some time.
Police are also reported to have been reviewing two burglaries — one in the apartment directly above the McCanns’ apartment — which happened shortly before the family arrived at the Ocean Club resort.
Meanwhile, Madeleine’s twin sister and brother, Sean and Amelie, have finally been told that their elder sister is missing. They had previously been assured that she was on holiday and would be returning home soon.
Sean and Amelie, 2, were asleep in the ground-floor apartment when Madeleine was taken. Police have said that the twins slept throughout and have been unable to provide evidence.
Madeleine’s parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, have been advised by a British child psychologist on how to break the news to Madeleine’s siblings. The couple, both doctors, have been careful to maintain the twins’ daily routine but agreed last week not to take them to the usual morning sessions at the crèche of the Ocean Club resort because the presence of the media was disturbing other parents and children.
The twins, who, like Madeleine were born through IVF, have been encouraged to talk about their sister and her Cuddle Cat toy, which Mrs McCann now carries around wherever she goes.
Mr and Mrs McCann have thanked the thousands of people from around the world who have sent letters and e-mails of support. But the couple are still devastated at their daughter’s disappearance.
Mrs McCann, 39, a locum GP, recalled the pain of returning to Britain without Madeleine for a family baptism. “When we went back to the UK for a family baptism there was an empty seat on the plane and Sean said, ‘That’s Madeleine’s seat.’” she said. “Amelie asked me afterwards, ‘Where’s Madeleine? I miss my sister.”
The couple have also contemplated for the first time having to return home to Rothley in Leicestershire, without Madeleine. They have extended the rent on their villa on the outskirts of Praia da Luz only until the middle of next month.
Detectives hunting for Madeline on alert for series of new searches
Detectives hunting for Madeleine McCann have been ordered to prepare for an operation over the next four days that they hope will lead to a breakthrough, The Times has learnt.
The Public Prosecutor’s Office signed a series of warrants yesterday authorising searches at locations that may be linked to the disappearance of Madeleine 107 days ago. Officers have been told that the operation will be carried out by Tuesday.
The Portuguese Polícia Judiciária believes that it has uncovered evidence that could be significant in discovering what happened to Madeleine after she was taken from her bed in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz.
The searches follow the arrival in Portugal of the result of tests on samples recovered from the McCann family’s apartment, their car and other locations in Praia da Luz.
The Times revealed on Thursday that the preliminary notes from the headquarters of the Forensic Science Service in Birmingham showed that traces of blood in the apartment had come from a man.
However, the findings received by the Laboratório de Polícia Científica in Lisbon on Wednesday indicated that the blood samples were too damaged to be checked against the DNA database of British sex offenders. Scientists have been attempting to recover a better profile.
The Portuguese magistrate in charge of the investigation has now been sent the full report on all the samples recovered as part of a review of the investigation completed with the help of British experts.
It is not known if the possible breakthrough in the investigation is connected with scientific evidence, although detectives are believed to have been monitoring the movements of at least one suspect for some time.
Police are also reported to have been reviewing two burglaries — one in the apartment directly above the McCanns’ apartment — which happened shortly before the family arrived at the Ocean Club resort.
Meanwhile, Madeleine’s twin sister and brother, Sean and Amelie, have finally been told that their elder sister is missing. They had previously been assured that she was on holiday and would be returning home soon.
Sean and Amelie, 2, were asleep in the ground-floor apartment when Madeleine was taken. Police have said that the twins slept throughout and have been unable to provide evidence.
Madeleine’s parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, have been advised by a British child psychologist on how to break the news to Madeleine’s siblings. The couple, both doctors, have been careful to maintain the twins’ daily routine but agreed last week not to take them to the usual morning sessions at the crèche of the Ocean Club resort because the presence of the media was disturbing other parents and children.
The twins, who, like Madeleine were born through IVF, have been encouraged to talk about their sister and her Cuddle Cat toy, which Mrs McCann now carries around wherever she goes.
Mr and Mrs McCann have thanked the thousands of people from around the world who have sent letters and e-mails of support. But the couple are still devastated at their daughter’s disappearance.
Mrs McCann, 39, a locum GP, recalled the pain of returning to Britain without Madeleine for a family baptism. “When we went back to the UK for a family baptism there was an empty seat on the plane and Sean said, ‘That’s Madeleine’s seat.’” she said. “Amelie asked me afterwards, ‘Where’s Madeleine? I miss my sister.”
The couple have also contemplated for the first time having to return home to Rothley in Leicestershire, without Madeleine. They have extended the rent on their villa on the outskirts of Praia da Luz only until the middle of next month.
Lets hope we hear some news soon, I wonder what a burglary upstairs from the where the McCanns were staying before they got there has to do with Madelaine, the LE have obviously got information that has not been released to the public. Hope this new investigation puts to rest all the speculation and we find out what really happened to Madelaine.
I read somewhere (have read at so many places they have blurred together) that Kate was asked if they wanted the babysitting service and was warned about the burglaries on the night Madeleine went missing.
I could have read it in one of the many British tabloids, so don't know if it holds water or not.With the article I just posted it seemd like it could hold some truth after all.
If so its another reason that G&K should have to answer for what danger they put their children in.
Side note: Colomom Have a great time!You will be missed! Stay safe!
I could have read it in one of the many British tabloids, so don't know if it holds water or not.With the article I just posted it seemd like it could hold some truth after all.
If so its another reason that G&K should have to answer for what danger they put their children in.
Side note: Colomom Have a great time!You will be missed! Stay safe!
I know what you mean when you say you have read about something somewhere, there is so much information out there that really tells us nothing at the moment, it is mind blowing.
I also agree if the McCanns knew of the burglaries then that is another reason why the children should have never been left alone. Maybe a buglar was stealing from their apartment the night Madelaine went missing, she woke and the burglar had to take her so she would not talk, a bit of a long shot, but nothing surprises me anymore about this case.
No, the information came from a Portuguese or Spanish newspaper and was an interview with Silvia Batista, the Technical Services Director of Ocean Club.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1629662&postcount=36
I wonder if the PJ, by advertising the searches ahead of time, is trying to draw out whomever is responsible into doing something stupid like tampering with evidence or moving her body.
Sounds very probable, hope it works. Good thinking Calikid.
Can someone do a better translation??Sorry this one is the best I can do from Babel Fish.
http://dn.sapo.pt/2007/08/18/sociedade/vizinha_inglesa_mc_cann_ser_ouvida_s.html
Vizinha inglesa dos Mc Cann vai ser ouvida segunda-feira pela PJ
A Polícia Judiciária vai voltar a inquirir na próxima semana várias testemunhas do caso Maddie, a fim de "clarificar" situações. Segundo apurou o DN, uma dessas testemunhas é a britânica Pamela Fenn, de 70 anos, que vive sozinha num apartamento situado por cima daquele de onde Madeleine McCann desapareceu, no The Ocean Club, na Praia da Luz, onde passava férias com a família.
É que, pouco depois de se aperceber, cerca das 22.00 horas do dia 3 de Maio, do barulho e agitação provocados no local por mais de duas dezenas de pessoas à procura de Madeleine, a senhora ofereceu-se, à mãe da criança, para "telefonar para a polícia". Mas Kate McCann recusou a ajuda, dizendo-lhe: "Não, obrigada, já telefonámos. Agora temos de nos organizar." Isto depois de Kate ter afirmado, em jeito de desabafo: "Perdemo-la." Porém, o desaparecimento da menina só acabou por ser participado à Guarda Nacional Republicana de Lagos pelas 22.40 horas.
Por outro lado, de acordo com informações recolhidas pelo DN, Pamela Fenn contou a amigos na Praia da Luz que, no dia 1 de Abril, sensivelmente "entre as 22.30 e as 23.45" lhe pareceu ouvir uma criança naquele apartamento "a gritar aflitivamente daddy, daddy! (papá, papá)". Nessa altura, o casal McCann estaria a jantar num restaurante junto à igreja da Praia da Luz. "Não falo com jornalistas", limitou-se a dizer, ontem, quando contactada pelo DN.
Três semanas antes do desaparecimento de Madeleine, Pamela Fenn fora alvo de uma tentativa de assalto em sua casa por um homem que mais tarde identificou como tendo as características do retrato-robô do suspeito de rapto de Maddie, contou a sobrinha de Pamela à polícia inglesa. A jovem, na altura de férias na Praia da Luz, em casa da tia, apercebeu-se que "andava um indivíduo a rondar os apartamentos". Pamela Fenn será ouvida na segunda-feira, no Departamento de Investigação Criminal de Portimão da PJ.
O director nacional adjunto da PJ e responsável pela Directoria de Faro, Guilhermino Encarnação, confirmou ao DN estarem previstas "outras diligências" na próxima semana, altura em que "podem acontecer" novas inquirições. O responsável aproveitou para apelar à "serenidade e tranquilidade" no "caso Madeleine", numa altura em que dezenas de jornalistas de vários países não largam a PJ, em Portimão, e a Praia da Luz. "Não é que tal perturbe a investigação. Mas não ajuda", disse.|
Babel Fish Translation:
English neighbor of Mc the Cann goes to be heard monday for the PJ JOSE MANUEL OLIVEIRA AP (image) The Judiciary Policy goes to come back to inquire in the next week some witnesses to the Maddie case, in order "to clarificar" situations. As it selected DN, one of these witnesses is the British Pamela Fenn, of 70 years, that live alone in a situated apartment for top of that one of where Madeleine McCann disappeared, in the The Ocean Club, in the Beach of the Light, where it passed vacation with the family. It is that, shortly afterwards of if aperceber, about the 22,00 hours of day 3 of May, of the racket and agitation provoked in the place for more than two sets of ten of people to the search of Madeleine, was offered to you, to the mother of the child, "to telephone for the policy". But Kate McCann refused the aid, saying to it: "Not, debtor, already we telephoned. Now we have of in organizing them." This after Kate having affirmed, in relief skill: "We lose it." However, the disappearance of the girl alone finished for being participated to Republican National Guarda of Lakes for the 22,40 hours. On the other hand, in accordance with information collected for the DN, Pamela Fenn counted the friends in the Beach of the Light that, in day 1 of April, significantly "between the 22,30 and the 23,45" seemed to hear a child to it in that apartment "to cry out daddy distressingly, daddy! (papá, papá)". In this height, the McCann couple would be it supper in a together restaurant to the church of the Beach of the Light. "I do not speak with journalists", was limited to say it, yesterday, when contactada for the DN. Three weeks before the disappearance of Madeleine, Pamela Fenn are white of an attempt of assault in its house for a man who later identified as having the characteristics of the picture-robot of the suspected one of abduction of Maddie, counted the niece of Pamela to the English policy. The young, in the height of vacation in the Beach of the Light, in house of the aunt, apercebeu itself that "it walked an individual to go up to around the apartments". Pamela Fenn will be heard in the monday, in the Department of Criminal Inquiry of Portimão of the PJ. The associate national director of the responsible PJ and for the Directoria de Faro, Guilhermino Incarnation, confirmed to the DN to be foreseen "other diligências" in the next week, height where "new inquiries can happen". The responsible one used to advantage to appeal to "serenity and tranquilidade" in the "Madeleine case", in a height where sets of ten of journalists of some countries do not release the PJ, in Portimão, and the Beach of the Light. "it is not that such disturbs the inquiry. But not aid ", disse.|
http://dn.sapo.pt/2007/08/18/sociedade/vizinha_inglesa_mc_cann_ser_ouvida_s.html
Vizinha inglesa dos Mc Cann vai ser ouvida segunda-feira pela PJ
A Polícia Judiciária vai voltar a inquirir na próxima semana várias testemunhas do caso Maddie, a fim de "clarificar" situações. Segundo apurou o DN, uma dessas testemunhas é a britânica Pamela Fenn, de 70 anos, que vive sozinha num apartamento situado por cima daquele de onde Madeleine McCann desapareceu, no The Ocean Club, na Praia da Luz, onde passava férias com a família.
É que, pouco depois de se aperceber, cerca das 22.00 horas do dia 3 de Maio, do barulho e agitação provocados no local por mais de duas dezenas de pessoas à procura de Madeleine, a senhora ofereceu-se, à mãe da criança, para "telefonar para a polícia". Mas Kate McCann recusou a ajuda, dizendo-lhe: "Não, obrigada, já telefonámos. Agora temos de nos organizar." Isto depois de Kate ter afirmado, em jeito de desabafo: "Perdemo-la." Porém, o desaparecimento da menina só acabou por ser participado à Guarda Nacional Republicana de Lagos pelas 22.40 horas.
Por outro lado, de acordo com informações recolhidas pelo DN, Pamela Fenn contou a amigos na Praia da Luz que, no dia 1 de Abril, sensivelmente "entre as 22.30 e as 23.45" lhe pareceu ouvir uma criança naquele apartamento "a gritar aflitivamente daddy, daddy! (papá, papá)". Nessa altura, o casal McCann estaria a jantar num restaurante junto à igreja da Praia da Luz. "Não falo com jornalistas", limitou-se a dizer, ontem, quando contactada pelo DN.
Três semanas antes do desaparecimento de Madeleine, Pamela Fenn fora alvo de uma tentativa de assalto em sua casa por um homem que mais tarde identificou como tendo as características do retrato-robô do suspeito de rapto de Maddie, contou a sobrinha de Pamela à polícia inglesa. A jovem, na altura de férias na Praia da Luz, em casa da tia, apercebeu-se que "andava um indivíduo a rondar os apartamentos". Pamela Fenn será ouvida na segunda-feira, no Departamento de Investigação Criminal de Portimão da PJ.
O director nacional adjunto da PJ e responsável pela Directoria de Faro, Guilhermino Encarnação, confirmou ao DN estarem previstas "outras diligências" na próxima semana, altura em que "podem acontecer" novas inquirições. O responsável aproveitou para apelar à "serenidade e tranquilidade" no "caso Madeleine", numa altura em que dezenas de jornalistas de vários países não largam a PJ, em Portimão, e a Praia da Luz. "Não é que tal perturbe a investigação. Mas não ajuda", disse.|
Babel Fish Translation:
English neighbor of Mc the Cann goes to be heard monday for the PJ JOSE MANUEL OLIVEIRA AP (image) The Judiciary Policy goes to come back to inquire in the next week some witnesses to the Maddie case, in order "to clarificar" situations. As it selected DN, one of these witnesses is the British Pamela Fenn, of 70 years, that live alone in a situated apartment for top of that one of where Madeleine McCann disappeared, in the The Ocean Club, in the Beach of the Light, where it passed vacation with the family. It is that, shortly afterwards of if aperceber, about the 22,00 hours of day 3 of May, of the racket and agitation provoked in the place for more than two sets of ten of people to the search of Madeleine, was offered to you, to the mother of the child, "to telephone for the policy". But Kate McCann refused the aid, saying to it: "Not, debtor, already we telephoned. Now we have of in organizing them." This after Kate having affirmed, in relief skill: "We lose it." However, the disappearance of the girl alone finished for being participated to Republican National Guarda of Lakes for the 22,40 hours. On the other hand, in accordance with information collected for the DN, Pamela Fenn counted the friends in the Beach of the Light that, in day 1 of April, significantly "between the 22,30 and the 23,45" seemed to hear a child to it in that apartment "to cry out daddy distressingly, daddy! (papá, papá)". In this height, the McCann couple would be it supper in a together restaurant to the church of the Beach of the Light. "I do not speak with journalists", was limited to say it, yesterday, when contactada for the DN. Three weeks before the disappearance of Madeleine, Pamela Fenn are white of an attempt of assault in its house for a man who later identified as having the characteristics of the picture-robot of the suspected one of abduction of Maddie, counted the niece of Pamela to the English policy. The young, in the height of vacation in the Beach of the Light, in house of the aunt, apercebeu itself that "it walked an individual to go up to around the apartments". Pamela Fenn will be heard in the monday, in the Department of Criminal Inquiry of Portimão of the PJ. The associate national director of the responsible PJ and for the Directoria de Faro, Guilhermino Incarnation, confirmed to the DN to be foreseen "other diligências" in the next week, height where "new inquiries can happen". The responsible one used to advantage to appeal to "serenity and tranquilidade" in the "Madeleine case", in a height where sets of ten of journalists of some countries do not release the PJ, in Portimão, and the Beach of the Light. "it is not that such disturbs the inquiry. But not aid ", disse.|
AfterMidnight
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If the staff at the tapas bar had been doing their job, which I have no reason to believe they weren't, they would have been too busy to keep their eyes on the McCann table all night. Something doesn't add up there.
And, as far as Warner is concerned, and not wanting the staff to lie about their clients, something about the resort has my hinky meter going.
april4sky
It is not who is right, but what is right, that is
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A breath of fresh air!!!! And a lot of common sense. :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
I completely agree with everything in this post. And I have read all the previous threads.
I see nothing wrong with the parents reactions since Madeleine disapeared.
They seem to be condemned no matter what they do.....or even what they don't do.
I have been wondering why people are so quick to accept the workers version of events over the several adults with the mccanns even though, as many have pointed out, workers being busy often fail to know who comes and goes when or even at all in some cases. I suppose it comes down to people just choosing to believe the side they want to believe. It seems more exciting for the parents to have lied and so therefore the staff are right and the parents lied and thus must surely have harmed their own child. And a frog with no legs can't hear.
(Sorry about the frog remark - its an old story about reaching conclusions based on faulty logic.)
BethInAK
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Perhaps the mccanns lie because they are too proud to admit that they left their children in a very shady situation.
I can't imagine what the tapas staff has to gain by lying.
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