Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #20

[Lilly b]

What i am wondering is how did nobody see the van? Have there been any witness statements about the van that CB was using?

If you aren't looking for something, then you don't take notice.
I can drive up my road, get in the house, and then if someone said to me, which of my neighbours cars where parked up, I wouldn't know, why would I?

 

[Dlk79]

IMO the front door/entrance was around the corner!

In Praia da Luz würde man gern vergessen

The window to the sleeping room is directly behind the complex and was very "protected" from viewing it IMO.

View attachment 268405

The door is on the same side as MM's window, albeit slightly inset from window due to the shape of the building. You can see it here, just above the rear of that black car. MM's window is to the right of it.

 

[SuperdadV8]

The door is on the same side as MM's window. You can see it here, just above the rear of that black car. MM's window is to the right of it.

Thank you, but that wouldn't make sense to build up a child protection fence. I'm a bit confused, i must admit!

It must have been accessable through the patio doors either?

Easy in on the side, easy out on the back and even protected from viewing by a wall and some trees in 2007?

IMO the trees had been removed later on.

 

[Anxala]

Does anybody know, if there is time delay between Rothley and PDL in around may? Same or different longitudes?

I'm pretty sure there's no time difference. Portugal has GMT as its standard time. Their DSTs (daylight saving time) which occurs in March and Oct are the same.

 

[SuperdadV8]

I'm pretty sure there's no time difference. Portugal has GMT as its standard time. Their DSTs (daylight saving time) which occurs in March and Oct are the same.

Thank you Anxala! So we can rule out differences in mentioning times due to a time shift IMO.

But i do not see any problem to snatch a child and take it to a vehicle in 90 seconds, if the parking lot is just in front if the window of MM's sleeping room.

 

[mrjitty]

So what else could only the abductor know that isn't already in the public domain?

I forget the details, but I understood there are actually pieces of evidence not released by PJ

 

[mrjitty]

There's the possibility that CB planned to get into the apartment as soon as the coast was clear and all the group were seated. From there, he would then hide and wait until the next check was complete before making his escape. We know from his ex that he hid under her bed, he may have done something similar here. Either for kicks or to give himself maximum time to get away.

There's also the possibility that he knew nothing of MM, the Tapas group or their routines and the event was not really planned. He may have simply broke in to rob the place initially, then was forced to hide as someone enetered. A number of horrible things could have happened next and I won't elaborate, but it could be that at some point MM woke up and began to scream. It may be that CB killed her there and took her body with him fearing his DNA was left on her from a struggle.

IMO your 2nd possibility seems rather more likely. He simply waited for them to go to dinner, and entered the apartment.

This guy is no crime lord - just a 2 bit dirt ball

 

[SuperdadV8]

IMO your 2nd possibility seems rather more likely. He simply waited for them to go to dinner, and entered the apartment.

This guy is no crime lord - just a 2 bit dirt ball

Obviously no crime-lord, but blanking out the known anti-social behaviour, a very calculating kind of person IMO....

 

[Dlk79]

Thank you, but that wouldn't make sense to build up a child protection fence. I'm a bit confused, i must admit!

It must have been accessable through the patio doors either?

Easy in on the side, easy out on the back and even protected from viewing by a wall and some trees in 2007?

IMO the trees had been removed later on.

I'm a bit confused about what you are referring to Super. The pic you've attached is the gate on the side of the building which leads up steps to the patio doors at the back. This is a newer photo though with a different gate, attached below shows how it looked back then. I thought you were talking about the front door in your other post.

 

[SuperdadV8]

I'm a bit confused about what you are referring to Super. The pic you've attached is the gate on the side of the building which leads up steps to the patio doors at the back. This is a newer photo though with a different gate, attached below shows how it looked back then. I thought you were talking about the front door in your other post.

Just as confused as i am!

IMO there are entrances/exits by the roads R. Dr. Agostinho (backside, wooden door) and R. Dr. Francisco (patio doors) ????

 

[SuperdadV8]

Just as confused as i am!

IMO there are entrances/exits by the roads R. Dr. Agostinho (backside, wooden door) and R. Dr. Francisco (patio doors) ????

If the patio doors had been unlocked, it's easy entry, and maybe an almost invisible exit through the shutters on the backside, where MM's sleeping room has been placed?!

 

[redplanet]

IMO your 2nd possibility seems rather more likely. He simply waited for them to go to dinner, and entered the apartment.

This guy is no crime lord - just a 2 bit dirt ball

IMO it is possible an intruder entered immediately after her parents went out and even before the first check (which was nothing more than a listen at a window externally by MO).

 

[Anxala]

There's also the possibility that he knew nothing of MM, the Tapas group or their routines and the event was not really planned. He may have simply broke in to rob the place initially, then was forced to hide as someone enetered. A number of horrible things could have happened next and I won't elaborate, but it could be that at some point MM woke up and began to scream. It may be that CB killed her there and took her body with him fearing his DNA was left on her from a struggle.

I just can't see that.

If it was a random burglary as you suggest, interrupted by the inconvenient, brief return of the occupier, a subsequent woken-up, vocal child would imo have sent the burglar out that door as fast as his self-preservating legs could carry him. Possibly grabbing something of value on his way - eg. a camera, a phone, a laptop - so his bungling, burgling evening wasn't entirely wasted.

 

[SuperdadV8]

I just can't see that.

If it was a random burglary as you suggest, interrupted by the inconvenient, brief return of the occupier, a subsequent woken-up, vocal child would imo have sent the burglar out that door as fast as his self-preservating legs could carry him. Possibly grabbing something of value on his way - eg. a camera, a phone, a laptop - so his bungling evening wasn't entirely wasted.

That's my opinion too. There are some clues (if confirmed), that lead to a planned abduction.

- nothing missing except MM
- horrible job to change a life
- moving to germany in some way
- changing jag registration
- last day of MC's vacation
- NOT a single forensic trace, like in the JC and IG cases

 

[Dlk79]

I just can't see that.

If it was a random burglary as you suggest, interrupted by the inconvenient, brief return of the occupier, a subsequent woken-up, vocal child would imo have sent the burglar out that door as fast as his self-preservating legs could carry him. Possibly grabbing something of value on his way - eg. a camera, a phone, a laptop - so his bungling evening wasn't entirely wasted.

I was trying not to be graphic but a few people seem to have misunderstood what I was getting at. I am saying what if his initial intent was to rob but then after seeing MM, he tried to do something else. I don't really want to go into the scenarios of what might have transpired but below are some articles of what we know about CB's tendencies. I'm just saying I can imagine more than one scenario where trying to silence the child could have felt like a better option that simply running away. Or where by running away, he would have been leaving incriminating evidence at ths scene. I'll leave it at that.

Christian Brueckner 'joked about performing sex act while girls slept'

Die Akte Christian B. - DER SPIEGEL - Panorama

Mum claims Maddie suspect Christian Brueckner 'exposed himself' to her daughter

ETA: not saying this is what I think happened, just that I think it is plausible as a possibility. There are some aspects to it that make more sense than the planned abduction angle.

 

[redplanet]

Obviously no crime-lord, but blanking out the known anti-social behaviour, a very calculating kind of person IMO....

Based on cases tentatively attributed to CB: yes he calculated and planned. But his planning was not risk-minimising. For example, in Praia Rocha the perp escaped by running along the street in a leotard and mask. That was a calculated plan which actually increased risk IMO.

 

[SuperdadV8]

I was trying not to be graphic but a few people seem to have misunderstood what I was getting at. I am saying what if his initial intent was to rob but then after seeing MM, he tried to do something else. I don't really want to go into the scenarios of what might have transpired but below are some articles of what we know about CB's tendencies. I'm just saying I can imagine more than one scenario where trying to silence the child could have felt like a better option that simply running away. Or where by running away, he would have been leaving incriminating evidence at ths scene. I'll leave it at that.

Christian Brueckner 'joked about performing sex act while girls slept'

Die Akte Christian B. - DER SPIEGEL - Panorama

Mum claims Maddie suspect Christian Brueckner 'exposed himself' to her daughter

Has she been still alive when GM checked at 9.05 pm? A theory, that could fit PJ's assumptions IMO, so plausible!

HCW stated, he thinks MM died soon in Portugal....

Molesting gone wrong and removing evidence?!

 

[tedtink]

I was trying not to be graphic but a few people seem to have misunderstood what I was getting at. I am saying what if his initial intent was to rob but then after seeing MM, he tried to do something else. I don't really want to go into the scenarios of what might have transpired but below are some articles of what we know about CB's tendencies. I'm just saying I can imagine more than one scenario where trying to silence the child could have felt like a better option that simply running away. Or where by running away, he would have been leaving incriminating evidence at ths scene. I'll leave it at that.

Christian Brueckner 'joked about performing sex act while girls slept'

Die Akte Christian B. - DER SPIEGEL - Panorama

Mum claims Maddie suspect Christian Brueckner 'exposed himself' to her daughter

ETA: not saying this is what I think happened, just that I think it is plausible as a possibility. There are some aspects to it that make more sense than the planned abduction angle.

Yes, agree that it's a possibility and certainly plausible.
Perp may have just planned to rob 5a, which imo he would have planned.
After seeing MM he may have faced a situation where he had no control over an impulsive act or could not control his other urges.
We know that ASPD impulsivity is linked to risk taking behaviors and that most do not see danger.
The planned burglary could have presented an opportunity beyond his control.

And I agree that we should take into consideration his known M.O which reveals a pattern of either opportunistic or planned (predatory) behavior.

 

[Anxala]

I was trying not to be graphic but a few people seem to have misunderstood what I was getting at. I am saying what if his initial intent was to rob but then after seeing MM, he tried to do something else.

Just to say I haven't misunderstood anything you've said/suggested so I'm not one of the 'few' you think might have misunderstood you and your position/perspective.

I'm just not seeing your 'possible' scenario. It just doesn't make any sense to me and really lacks the objectivity that's crucial to keeping this investigative thread on an objective track.

 

[Chiatos]

If the patio doors had been unlocked, it's easy entry, and maybe an almost invisible exit through the shutters on the backside, where MM's sleeping room has been placed?!

To enter through the patio door -even though not locked- you would still need a key.....
Somehow I believe CB entered through the window by lifting the shutters. The same happened to my parents once many years ago. It's simple routine for an experienced burglar.
Once inside he would be able to choose his exit: back through the window or through the unlocked door.