Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #6

[Owlpellet]

good point about testing.
FP was an Anaesthetist, surely she would have been able to tell any subtle difference between sleeping and drugged. you would assume she would have thought to check the twins, from her professional background. she spent a long time in the apt5a with Kate immediately after the disappearance. Also the twins were moved into FP's apt during that night. here's what FP said:

'No, and that was the other thing, she kept going into the twins, she kept putting her hands on the twins to check they were breathing, she was very much concerned in checking that they were okay. But they were okay, I mean, they were fine, they didn't, they were asleep, but at the time it did seem weird, I remember thinking, you know, when the Police came they turned the lights on, there was loads of noise, obviously from the moment Kate discovered that Madeleine was gone, the screaming and the shouting and there was a lot of noise and they, they didn't, you know, so much as blink'.
P.J. POLICE FILES: FIONA PAYNE ROGATORY

I think they would have been relieved the twins were asleep so they could focus on their missing child. Their attention was inevitably on what had happened and I think it would only be now and again they would wonder about them sleeping and be happy to assume an easy explanation. When you are in a state of panic, the amygdala takes over and reduces the capacity for rational thought. It's a basic human survival response.

 

[NCanning]

I've got 3 kids (4, 5 and 6), they all sleep in the same room and apart from the eldest I could see them sleeping through a lot of noise and commotion. For instance a house 4 doors down from me was on fire and I had to literally drag the kids out of the house because they wouldn't wake up. Children who are a couple of years younger are even deeper sleepers as their brains require more sleep.

Not discounting drugs were used, just offering a fatherly perspective.

My son is 9. He could sleep through a nuclear explosion

 

[leticiaoliveira]

I know it's Red Top - Take it with a pinch of salt, but I'll drop it in anyway.

Christian B left Portugal days before Maddie disappearance to set up drugs network

Headline says "before"
First paragraph says "after"
What does that even mean...

Yes, waiting with bated breath to see which word they edit haha.

DRUG RAP
Madeleine McCann suspect Christian B left Portugal days after her disappearance to set up drugs network

They edited the misleading headline

 

[tedtink]

How Long Does Rohypnol (Flunitrazepam) Stay In Your System
You need to test within 30 days

Just from a quick search, it takes appx 15-20 mins for rohypnol to take effect.
Administering it to a small baby imo would have bound to have woken them.
Also as it takes so long to take effect I doubt the perp would have used a higher dose as that could have proved fatal imo.
I just think all 3 kids were exhausted as KM said herself they were out within seconds.
My kids would have slept through a nuclear explosion when they were small!

 

[Kiranerys]

That's always stuck in my mind, it was mentioned on the documentary. If the abduction was planned, they would have been aware that there was another two small children in the room.
The twins sleeping through when people were panicking around the room (if true) was a worry as well. imo

Maybe there was an accomplice and a plan to take all 3,maybe they were disturbed by something,maybe it's true that this was a taken to order abduction and Madeleine was the specific target,or maybe CB or someone else assaulted M in the apartment and she was killed so they took her body with them so as not to leave any evidence, there are so many possibilities here, I go round in circles in my own head with theories daily

 

[JediJim]

The only drug that the McCann's mentioned using was Calpol and Nurofen. I can't imagine the abductor had enough time to drug the other children. Surely he grabbed her and got out of there quickly. Sorry to mention Alesha Macphail again, but AC carried her out of bed and down a flight of stairs without her waking up plus she was a few years older than Madeleine.

I think the McCanns said they took nurofen and calpol with them but didn’t use them.
Going abroad with young children, this would be totally normal.

 

[worldwatcher]

good point about testing.
FP was an Anaesthetist, surely she would have been able to tell any subtle difference between sleeping and drugged. you would assume she would have thought to check the twins, from her professional background. she spent a long time in the apt5a with Kate immediately after the disappearance. Also the twins were moved into FP's apt during that night. here's what FP said:

'No, and that was the other thing, she kept going into the twins, she kept putting her hands on the twins to check they were breathing, she was very much concerned in checking that they were okay. But they were okay, I mean, they were fine, they didn't, they were asleep, but at the time it did seem weird, I remember thinking, you know, when the Police came they turned the lights on, there was loads of noise, obviously from the moment Kate discovered that Madeleine was gone, the screaming and the shouting and there was a lot of noise and they, they didn't, you know, so much as blink'.
P.J. POLICE FILES: FIONA PAYNE ROGATORY

It says nothing imo, In a situation like this, it seems to me that you are restless and keep checking that everything is okay with your other childern. A lot of thoughts go through your mind and at the time, time seems to stand still.I lost my daughter ,out of sight, once on the beach, in a second she was gone and I never felt so sick.
Fortunately I found her back, but I was so scared..
And I used to check too, if they were breathing at nights, when my kids were about that age. Just like most kids, they were deep sleepers too, they slept through New Year's night while fireworks were set off.

 

[NCanning]

Maybe there was an accomplice and a plan to take all 3,maybe they were disturbed by something,maybe it's true that this was a taken to order abduction and Madeleine was the specific target,or maybe CB or someone else assaulted M in the apartment and she was killed so they took her body with them so as not to leave any evidence, there are so many possibilities here, I go round in circles in my own head with theories daily

If someone had assaulted/killed her in the apartment , there would have been visible as well as DNA evidence to say so

 

[Midwestmom2019]

There was always speculation that the parents themselves had given the children a mild sedative following the reports of audible crying on previous nights.

That was the bases of Amarel’s focus on the parents and his comments that it wouldn’t be the first time an overdose had been administered by tourists. This was reported WAY back, in the days immediately following the abduction as I recall now, before the search spread and sightings were reported. I just could not fathom doing that to children, recalling (back then,) that when ours were that age and we traveled, it had not even crossed our minds to give them a sleep aid. Back then, it made sense to me that LE accused the parents of an accidental overdose and then a coverup.

 

[Bit of hope]

Very interesting, I hadn't seen that before. Did you hear the bit about what else was apparently discussed in the "bar confession"? Not heard that mentioned anywhere in the Press, why not? Was that a slip-up, was he not supposed to have spoke about that publicly?

Yes. I heard....don't know what to think of that....I always ask myself why would people lie..or tell this...or whatever....He could have been drunk and bragging, or telling his deepest secrets....but the rape of the elderly lady back in 2005 has "come true"....what to think of Maddie? Doubts here.

 

[Owlpellet]

Very interesting, I hadn't seen that before. Did you hear the bit about what else was apparently discussed in the "bar confession"? Not heard that mentioned anywhere in the Press, why not? Was that a slip-up, was he not supposed to have spoke about that publicly?

It was all reported earlier in the media

 

[Dlk79]

Maybe this is posted already...I like the tone and non-sensational wording in this one.

04:36 in the video, MWT talking about the bar confession-

"It is said he talked not only in relation to Madeleine's disappearance, but about how he was involved in it, how he disposed of the body"

Do we think this is accurate? Did CB tell the friend how he got rid of the body? Wondering if the reason German LE are desperate to identify interiors of where CB has been is they expect to find a body nearby one particular interior of interest.

 

[Kiranerys]

If a drug of some sort were used, how would it be administered to a sleeping child? Something like chloroform would have surely left traces in the room, wouldn't it? I'm not really familiar with that field but if drugging was possible, it definitely makes the whole abduction easier to carry out. Just wondering how the abductor might have done it.

I still wonder if maybe the children had been given something help them sleep,especially given reports that M asked KM why she didnt come the night before when she was crying.
I know that the twins were apparently tested later to see if they had been given sedatives by their parents,but I'm not sure if these tests included anti histamine medication, lots of parents give these to children for flying etc,my sister used to give her little boy with ADHD phenergan every night to make him sleep.
I am not accusing the parents of drugging their children with sleeping pills or whatever,just speculating that a harmless anti histamine to make them drowsy could make sense,and as it has been suggested here that KM speculated the children could have been drugged by the abductor I wonder if she was getting that point out there without admitting they had given them something?

 

[Dlk79]

It was all reported earlier in the media

That CB told him how he disposed of the body? Have you got a link?

 

[Kikixxxx]

Yes. I heard....don't know what to think of that....I always ask myself why would people lie..or tell this...or whatever....He could have been drunk and bragging, or telling his deepest secrets....but the rape of the elderly lady back in 2005 has "come true"....what to think of Maddie? Doubts here.

Can you tell me what he supposedly said in the bar please? - I’m at work and can’t watch the video. X

Edit: @Dlk79 had just updated. Thanks!

 

[Owlpellet]

Just from a quick search, it takes appx 15-20 mins for rohypnol to take effect.
Administering it to a small baby imo would have bound to have woken them.
Also as it takes so long to take effect I doubt the perp would have used a higher dose as that could have proved fatal imo.
I just think all 3 kids were exhausted as KM said herself they were out within seconds.
My kids would have slept through a nuclear explosion when they were small!

Possibly. But they even stayed asleep when picked up by their friends and taken to their apartments. Just thinking that it would have made everything easier for the abduction if all 3 were drugged. KM said she put her hand on their back at one point to check they were still breathing! She also said MM had a brown stain on her pj top the previous morning that she had wondered about, thinking it was possibly a tea stain. But suppose he had tried the night before and been interrupted, but got as far as giving MM a drink? Coke or something with Rohypnal. MM was so tired she had to be carried home after the creche in the afternoon.

 

[Bit of hope]

It was all reported earlier in the media

I know....but this seems somehow more trustworthy....I don't know....For me it depends totally how and by who things are stated in the media.

 

[BellMat]

It says nothing imo, In a situation like this, it seems to me that you are restless and keep checking that everything is okay with your other childern. A lot of thoughts go through your mind and at the time, time seems to stand still.I lost my daughter ,out of sight, once on the beach, in a second she was gone and I never felt so sick.
Fortunately I found her back, but I was so scared..
And I used to check too, if they were breathing at nights, when my kids were about that age. Just like most kids, they were deep sleepers too, they slept through New Year's night while fireworks were set off.

I was babysitting two of my friend’s kids in a park once. I couldn’t find them for 10 minutes.

That was one of the most stressful 10 minutes of my life. Complete, utter panic.

People who nitpick every tiny response that night have no idea ...

That’s why the cool heads and smart responses of LE are so important. And it was really lacking in the crucial first hours with MM.

 

[sleuth-d-]

It says nothing imo, In a situation like this, it seems to me that you are restless and keep checking that everything is okay with your other childern. A lot of thoughts go through your mind and at the time, time seems to stand still.I lost my daughter ,out of sight, once on the beach, in a second she was gone and I never felt so sick.
Fortunately I found her back, but I was so scared..
And I used to check too, if they were breathing at nights, when my kids were about that age. Just like most kids, they were deep sleepers too, they slept through New Year's night while fireworks were set off.

i was quoting, and talking about it from FP's perspective.
she was an Anaesthetist, who at the time also had 2 small children, and she thought it was weird.

 

[Schlumpfchen]

Vandalised exterior offices on Pickhuben Hamburg belonging Editorial Stock Photo - Stock Image | Shutterstock

Vandalised exterior offices on Pickhuben Hamburg belonging Editorial Stock Photo - Stock Image | Shutterstock

the offices of the new lawyers representing CB have been vandalized, smashed windows and graffiti etc

And, sadly enough, that was the kind of stuff I was talking about earlier, why we do have that strict privacy laws in Germany. How should the suspect expect a fair trial, if attorneys are too afraif to take his case?