Found Deceased Malaysia - Nora Quoirin, 15, from UK, special needs, missing on vacation, Seremban, 4 Aug 2019 #2

[katydid23]

If Nora had walked there would not the tracker dogs picked up her scent.

Maybe, but maybe not. Over all of the cases I have followed here, there have been a handful where the tracking dogs were incorrect.

One case that really stood out to me, about the difficulty totally relying upon scent tracking dogs, was that of Sierra LaMar , in Morgan Hill, Ca.

A 15 yr old girl, who left her home to walk a short distance to the school bus stop. She never made it on to the bus, but no one knew where she went missing.

Scent tracking dogs picked up her scent leaving her front door, but lost it at the end of the driveway. We all thought she was picked up in a car, in front of her house.

But later we found out that she walked to the bus stop and was abducted there, by someone who had been watching her for awhile. Noticed her waiting at that stop before.

So, even though the dogs lost the scent, she still may have walked to the falls. People and dogs make mistakes.

Suspect car ID'd in Sierra Lamar abduction case - KSBW.com

https://www.ksbw.com/article/suspect-car-id-d-in-sierra-lamar-abduction.../1049562
Suspect car ID'd in Sierra Lamar abduction case ... ... Tracking dogs lost Sierra's scent at the end of her driveway.

 

[Officer Dibble]

Reporter on Radio 4 just said "the body was near a palm oil plantation."

 

[jamjim]

Reporter on Radio 4 just said "the body was near a palm oil plantation."

If that's true it must be this one. Interestingly back in 2018 some bones were found there and it wasn't known if they were human or animal:

https://www.nst.com.my/news/crime-courts/2018/02/333105/bone-fragments-found-oil-palm-plantation

 

[margarita25]

We do know the attraction to water that autistic kids have....maybe this is similar?

 

[HayLouise]

Ooi Beng Cheang‏ @luxentX

Replying to @AinOpines

Supposed to be 5, now most likely later in the evening. They are trying to confirm if IGP or Deputy IGP will be holding it. Police need to confirm a few more things also before meeting the press.

Ooi Beng Cheang on Twitter

 

[MsFacetious]

Also in Blaze's case. They searched that park several times with dogs. It wasn't until it rained that they finally spotted something and found him. That was awful.

Body Of Missing College Student Found At Borrego Park

 

[Coach]

What? Surely if you knew that, it would be the first place to suggest looking?

I agree, surely if they knew that N was excited about seeing a waterfall or any other area of the resort for that matter then that is the first place they would look. There is something troubling - it has been said that she would never have left on her own, it has also been said that her father said or was overheard saying a crime had been committed. If N left on her own and walked a mile or so to swimming or to look at something and it resulted in an accidental death then what her parents said that she would never leave on her own then that is really odd as they will know her better than anyone. Something does not seem right, sorry for saying this but it just all seems a bit odd.

 

[Sarahlou]

I think it is very wishful thinking to think she walked there. Don't get me wrong though, I would love that to be the case.

 

[Blamhappy]

This is so very sad news but relieved that they at least found her. It was said that N would never have gone off on her own so if she did leave the cabin on her own, is it not really strange after it being said that she would never have done this?

A little, but people do act out of character sometimes, don’t they? It doesn’t make it unlikely, in my opinion; just unusual, you know?

 

[jamjim]

These two articles are from 2018 and regarding Seremban, sounds like a bit of a grizzly area known for gangs. Not saying it's relevant to this case directly, but just some info:

https://www.nst.com.my/news/crime-c...nection-discovery-skeletal-remains-5-seremban

https://www.nst.com.my/news/crime-c...her-unmarked-grave-murder-investigation-nsttv - this one was near a palm oil plantation

 

[David M]

So sad Nora wasnt found alive and yes looks like he might know more

 

[MsFacetious]

If that's true it must be this one. Interestingly back in 2018 some bones were found there and it wasn't known if they were human or animal:

https://www.nst.com.my/news/crime-courts/2018/02/333105/bone-fragments-found-oil-palm-plantation

I don't think this is close to the waterfall though? I'm seeing it as much further away though I don't have an exact location for the plantation. I'm not seeing any palm oil plantations less than about 30 minutes drive from the waterfall.

 

[Crazy Mama]

Sad to know that this might be N. I do hope that she did not suffer.

 

[jamjim]

I don't think this is close to the waterfall though? I'm seeing it as much further away though I don't have an exact location for the plantation. I'm not seeing any palm oil plantations less than about 30 minutes drive from the waterfall.

True, the reporter on BBC Radio 4 who stated that the body was found near a palm oil plantation could have been mistaken. There's so much info going around at the minute, it's easy for things to get muddled.

 

[Jax49]

If that's true it must be this one. Interestingly back in 2018 some bones were found there and it wasn't known if they were human or animal:

https://www.nst.com.my/news/crime-courts/2018/02/333105/bone-fragments-found-oil-palm-plantation

Not sure that can be the right plantation. Google maps shows it is 20 miles from the resort. Or my maps skilled have totally failed (won't be the first time).

 

[jamjim]

Not sure that can be the right plantation. Google maps shows it is 20 miles from the resort. Or my maps skilled have totally failed (won't be the first time).

I didn't actually check so thanks for looking! I imagine there's probably quite a large number of plant oil plantations in the area due to the type of land around.

 

[MsFacetious]

https://www.nst.com.my/news/crime-c...her-unmarked-grave-murder-investigation-nsttv - this one was near a palm oil plantation

Okay now THIS one is close to the area we are talking about. In fact if you put that first area listed in the article into google maps, it takes you to the Dunsun.

THIS must be the palm oil plantation the body was found near. Although I'm still confused, it makes sense as it is right there near the waterfall as well. Very disturbing though if it's previously been a dumping ground for murder victims.

 

[MsBetsy]

Imo the implication is that the description of Nora's disabilities given in the family statement may be at her worst, rather than what she may be able to achieve on an average day or at her best. Therefore she may be able to move much more freely and independently than we may have thought. Imo

I would think they would have given as accurate a description as possible.
It was a general description so it's hard to say exactly what she's capable of. I think what is important is that Nora is not independent and does not have the skills to survive, even if she were lost in an urban area with lots of people around.

Rather than a description from a disability form, I would think the information would have been taken directly from the parents and would more likely based on her progress and records at school. There would be a team of specialists who have evaluated the child extensively, including physical and occupational therapists, psychologists, teachers, doctors and any other professional working with the child.
At least that's how it is in the US.
They work together with the parents to put together the IEP (Individualized Education Plan) which is unique to each child. .

There is a detailed, accurate and professional assessment of the child's needs, which is how the short and long term goals are established.

I would think the description would be based off that rather than the paperwork for disability, which might not be as detailed or accurate if it is required to make it sound worse than it is. Imo

 

[InVinoVeritas]

Presumably someone can clarify if this exact area had been searched before.

These are the plausible scenarios in my mind:

1. Nora left the holiday house of her own accord, whether intrigued by noises, disorientated or sleep walking, and walked into the jungle. No third party involved.

2. As above, but someone took Nora once she was outside of the holiday house and kept her elsewhere until depositing the body where it was found today.

3. As 2 but Nora has been in this place for some time and gone unfound by the search teams.

4. Someone abducted Nora from the holiday house and took her into the jungle before leaving her body at the waterfall.

5. Someone Nora knew enticed her out of the holiday home with the idea of an adventure seeing the waterfall, and she fell in a tragic accident.

I don’t think we can read too much into her fathers screams of “a crime has happened”, because we don’t know how we respond/react in these circumstances. Think of a Kate McCann and “someone has taken her”. It was seemingly inconceivable to her parents that Nora would’ve left alone and of her own volition.

 

[Jax49]

Okay now THIS one is close to the area we are talking about. In fact if you put that first area listed in the article into google maps, it takes you to the Dunsun.

THIS must be the palm oil plantation the body was found near. Although I'm still confused, it makes sense as it is right there near the waterfall as well. Very disturbing though if it's previously been a dumping ground for murder victims.

Help. I'm still seeing it as over twenty miles from the waterfall.