My thoughts

[cami]

Cami, I appreciate your help in trying to help me understand this case. As I said earlier I am from the UK, where this case doesn't really have a profile at all. I'm not sure that many people would know of it.

I am trying to understand it as much as I can. I have no reason to be for or against Darlie Routier. I just started looking at the case after I found this site and it's fascinated me. I felt that the trial transcripts were the best place to try and start to get the facts of the case. But I'm just starting at the beginning, I guess I have a lot of reading to do.

I don't know if you have any sources you can recommend to me to help me further understand this case.

Well I'm from Canada and you can be assured we never ever had any news on this case in Canada. That's why I bristle whenever anyone suggests that the media has influenced me or the jury. Many of us are intelligent enough to separate the wheat from the chaff, we know the media goes for sensationalism only...and ratings..it's the nature of the competitive beast.

I became aware of this case in 1998 when I was flipping around channels looking for tennis, most likely. I don't watch mainstream american tv, news or otherwise. I do watch the cable networks once in a while. I believed her to be innocent but at the time, I didn't know I was being lied to and manipulated by the family. Once I read those transcripts however, I could see how I was being lied to and manipulated.

The trial transcripts are the one true record of this crime. The trial transcripts bust the allegations by the family and those death penalty organizations, like Anne Good. For instance, many many times the family and lawyers lie that the jury did not see the photos of Darlie's bruises, they were hidden by the prosecution. The transcripts prove the photos of the bruises were discussed with the medical team and then handed to the jury for their perusal.

Another false allegation: The necklace was embedded in Darlie's neck wound and had to be removed by surgery. Absolutely false and the trial transcripts prove it.

Yes the transcripts are long and boring but it is the only way to learn this case..unless you read back in the threads here and in the archives where we have discussed everything and tore everything apart.

If you can't read all of them, read the medical staff's testimony, Cron, Linch, Darlie and Darin, read the coroner's reports on the autopsies they performed. Read Bevel and DiMaio although Bevel is the blood expert and DiMaio is a coroner. If you want to join our facebook page, we have some people from the UK there. BTW, my mother was a war bride from Mancester so I still have strong ties to England. We have the crime scene photos on the site, we have broken down the blood evidence and listed it point by point. Read Barb Davis's book Precious Angels. Oh she has pubically changed her stance since her book came out but she gives a very credible and logical explanation for the bruises and how the crime went down. Until she retracts her book and re prints it with an update, it stands.

Here's the link for the facebook page.

http://www.facebook.com/groups/350356998348134/permalink/389995364384297/

 

[cami]

Another great post by Cami who I think should have been on the prosecution team!!

aaaaahahahahahahahahahahahaha I just read that's all, LOL In fact, I failed the test they had on the a&e website about what you should do when you first arrive at the scene, if you're a homicide detective that is, LOl.

Because I started with the MacDonald case and was very interested in the Diane Downs case, I can see how you'd do anything to make it look as if you were not involved, even to cutting your own neck. Let's face it, Darlie was in no danger of dying that night despite the constant refrain the knife missed her carotid artery by 2 mms. Yeah her wound was serious but not life threatening. She says she was cut and stabbed whilst sleeping on the couch yet all the blood is at the kitchen sink. It doesn't take a genius to believe she cut her neck at the kitchen sink.

Thanks for the kudos.

 

[cami]

I am in the same boat; also discovered this case a few months ago and have been hooked ever since. As I live in South Africa, the intruder story seemed more likely to me. Sadly, here it is not that far-fetched for armed intruders to enter a home at night and sometimes they do harm the occupants. That being said, most often the motive is robbery or rape. If murder does occur, overkill does not happen. I do believe this case is a rage killing. Even though the evidence is pretty damning (I did read the trial scripts), I still have a lingering and nagging feeling that maybe, just maybe, there could be another explanation.

For example, here I have heard of cases where an odourless gas is sprayed into a window to drug the occupants. They sleep so deeply that they are unaware of being robbed. They have a sore throat the next morning but no recollection of anything that happened. This is an example of an alternative explanation that makes me go, hmmmm.....

Well you can be assured that didn't happen in this case. No one was raped, no one was robbed, only two little boys lost their lives in a brutal manner. Neither Darin nor Darlie were knocked out, they didn't have sore throats the next morning.

WE all have lingering nagging feelings of doubt because we cannot accept that a mother would brutally kill her own children like Darlie did. But the evidence tell us she did, regardless of how we feel. She's alive and her boys are dead. If you have truth on your side, then there is no need for all the lies. Darlie has lied and lied and lied and innocent people don't do that.

What alternative explanation could there be? Some man came in there, killed the boys, cut Darlie's neck and then left? What's his motive? Gold jewellery and cash sitting right out there for the taking yet nothing's touched.

 

[cami]

Well I'm from Canada and you can be assured we never ever had any news on this case in Canada. That's why I bristle whenever anyone suggests that the media has influenced me or the jury. Many of us are intelligent enough to separate the wheat from the chaff, we know the media goes for sensationalism only...and ratings..it's the nature of the competitive beast.

I became aware of this case in 1998 when I was flipping around channels looking for tennis, most likely. I don't watch mainstream american tv, news or otherwise. I do watch the cable networks once in a while. I believed her to be innocent but at the time, I didn't know I was being lied to and manipulated by the family. Once I read those transcripts however, I could see how I was being lied to and manipulated.

The trial transcripts are the one true record of this crime. The trial transcripts bust the allegations by the family and those death penalty organizations, like Anne Good. For instance, many many times the family and lawyers lie that the jury did not see the photos of Darlie's bruises, they were hidden by the prosecution. The transcripts prove the photos of the bruises were discussed with the medical team and then handed to the jury for their perusal.

Another false allegation: The necklace was embedded in Darlie's neck wound and had to be removed by surgery. Absolutely false and the trial transcripts prove it.

Yes the transcripts are long and boring but it is the only way to learn this case..unless you read back in the threads here and in the archives where we have discussed everything and tore everything apart.

If you can't read all of them, read the medical staff's testimony, Cron, Linch, Darlie and Darin, read the coroner's reports on the autopsies they performed. Read Bevel and DiMaio although Bevel is the blood expert and DiMaio is a coroner. If you want to join our facebook page, we have some people from the UK there. BTW, my mother was a war bride from Mancester so I still have strong ties to England. We have the crime scene photos on the site, we have broken down the blood evidence and listed it point by point. Read Barb Davis's book Precious Angels. Oh she has pubically changed her stance since her book came out but she gives a very credible and logical explanation for the bruises and how the crime went down. Until she retracts her book and re prints it with an update, it stands.

Here's the link for the facebook page.

http://www.facebook.com/groups/350356998348134/permalink/389995364384297/

I would also like to suggest you read the Bond Hearing. Darin paints a dismal picture of their finances so he can bond Darlie out. Yet in his trial testimony he completely reverses himself and says they had no financial problems.

I would suggest the arrest warrant as well. It's in either one of these that your learn Darin was the first suspect. I don't know where you will find the arrest warrant online. It is in Don Davis's book Hush Little Babies. I have it on scanned on my computer but I wouldn't have a clue how to put it on here and I'm not sure it's allowed anyway.

 

[LeanaSA]

Well you can be assured that didn't happen in this case. No one was raped, no one was robbed, only two little boys lost their lives in a brutal manner. Neither Darin nor Darlie were knocked out, they didn't have sore throats the next morning.

WE all have lingering nagging feelings of doubt because we cannot accept that a mother would brutally kill her own children like Darlie did. But the evidence tell us she did, regardless of how we feel. She's alive and her boys are dead. If you have truth on your side, then there is no need for all the lies. Darlie has lied and lied and lied and innocent people don't do that.

What alternative explanation could there be? Some man came in there, killed the boys, cut Darlie's neck and then left? What's his motive? Gold jewellery and cash sitting right out there for the taking yet nothing's touched.

I am 95% convinced the right person is in jail for this crime. But I am wondering if it could have been a hit ordered by Darin, or a revenge killing by someone who was double-crossed by Darin. That would explain why nothing was stolen. He must have had some criminal connections, considering that he previously arranged for his car to be stolen...

 

[LeanaSA]

The problem with this theory is that someone would not go to the trouble of using knockout gas to murder two sleeping children, steal nothing, and leave the only adult witness awake and alive.

I understand what you are saying. But what if the motive was not robbery, but revenge? I agree, it is very unlikely that Darlie would be left alive then. Unless the perpetrator allowed himself a fixed period of time in the house and his time was up. Or maybe he was alerted by a partner to get out (I recall there was a neighbour that worked night shift and got home just before the alarm was sounded).

I find it hard to believe what I just wrote, but I am practising my critical thining skills, ha!

 

[cami]

I understand what you are saying. But what if the motive was not robbery, but revenge? I agree, it is very unlikely that Darlie would be left alive then. Unless the perpetrator allowed himself a fixed period of time in the house and his time was up. Or maybe he was alerted by a partner to get out (I recall there was a neighbour that worked night shift and got home just before the alarm was sounded).

I find it hard to believe what I just wrote, but I am practising my critical thining skills, ha!

I find it hard to believe too. Do you completely ignore physical evidence in critical thinking skills? Do you ignore the fact that gold jewellery and a wallet full of cash was sitting right there for the taking? Do you ignore the blood evidence of a clean up at the kitchen sink? Do you ignore all the lies told by Darlie? I'm just curious that's all. I don't know why anyone believes this was a robbery gone bad, there was no robbery, the alleged intruder murdered two little boys, then left.

Revenge on two little boys? What motive would someone have to murder two sleeping boys? Did they ride their bikes too close to his lawn or something? Or blaming it on neighbours!!!!! Where is the physical evidence any of these people were in the Routier home committing murder?

I agree these murders are revenge...but it's revenge on Darin committed by his wife Darlie. Are you aware they had a big huge fight that night? Were you aware the marriage was on the rocks and Darin was fliring with Darlie's younger sister. Were you aware they were losing everything? The beautiful big home, the business, the money, the boat, the spa...all of it gone? Were you aware of the lies they told whilst sitting up there in the witness box? If you're innocent and you have truth on your side, there is no reason to lie. You cannot believe what any of them say. They built this family up to mythical proportions when just a tiny look inside tells you how dsyfunctional they were. The battle was between Darlie and Darin and the two innocent boys got caught in the middle.

I'll never ever stop speaking out for two little innocent boys who fell asleep in their own home,never dreaming they would not see tomorrow. They are the victims.

 

[cami]

I am 95% convinced the right person is in jail for this crime. But I am wondering if it could have been a hit ordered by Darin, or a revenge killing by someone who was double-crossed by Darin. That would explain why nothing was stolen. He must have had some criminal connections, considering that he previously arranged for his car to be stolen...

He never arranged for anything. Darin does not have criminal connections at all. That's all lies designed to raise reasonable doubt in Darlie's appeals. Darin was closely investigated by the cops, he was the first suspect in this crime. His saying "I don't care if someone steals it" is not arranging for someone to steal it.

If it was a hit, why were the two boys murdered? Why is Darlie alive and why did she have only minor injuries compared to her boys? Why is their blood on the shoulders of her nightshirt in cast off patterns? Why was the blood cleaned up at the kitchen sink? Why isn't there any of her blood on the couch where she says she was stabbed? Why is there screen debris and a polyglass fibre from the screen found on Darlie's bread knife?

Here is the link to the appeals courts decision...you will clearly see from them, this robbery business is not true.

http://www.routiertranscripts.com/transcripts/rfrancis-final.php

Evidence Regarding Insurance Scam

63. Applicant has attached to her Application affidavits from Darin Routier, Richard Reyna, and Robbie Kee stating that Darin tried to find someone to burglarize his house prior to the murders there. (Application at 19-20; Applicant’s Writ Exhibits 13, 12, 6).

64. The Court finds that Darin vigorously disputed the State’s evidence that the family was in financial difficulty, but admitted that his business had slowed, he was behind on his taxes, he was behind on his office rent, and he had large credit card debts. (RR.42: 4248-57; 4354-56; 4364; R.43: 4445).

65. The Court finds that the State presented expert testimony at trial from FBI Special Agent Alan Brantley that the crime was inconsistent with a property crime but consistent with a murder committed by a person close to the children. (RR.40: 3655-97).

66. The Court finds that readily visible valuable items like jewelry were left undisturbed during the crime. (SX. 15 E & 15 F).

67. The Court finds that Applicant has adduced no evidence nor pointed to evidence in the record that demonstrates that the crime was an attempted burglary or robbery rather than a murder.

68. The Court finds that Applicant has failed to prove by a preponderance of the evidence that Darin Routier’s Affidavit, Richard Reyna’s Affidavit, or Bobbie Kee’s Affidavit prove that anyone other than Applicant was responsible for or involved in the murders.

69. The Court finds that the affidavits are not affirmative evidence of Applicant’s innocence.

 

[cami]

IMO I just can't see Darlie killing the boys in such a "messy" way.IMO IF she wanted to kill the boys to hurt Darin or just be rid of the responsibility she could have suffocated the babies.I also don't think she would have cut her own throat,leaving a big UGLY scar.Darlie,no way!Someone was RAGING.I don't think there was an intruder either.
The only person with a reason to rage was Darin if Darlie told him she was leaving him.
JMO

Oh well you have to follow the physical evidence and it all points to her not Darin. Darin was the first suspect, Darin's statement of his movements has not changed yet Darlie's changed every time she was made aware of evidence against her. The statements from her friend and her friend's mother, who were both in the home that day, speak of Darlie's anger not Darin's.

I don't think these murders were rage committed, they appear to be more deliberate injuries by someone who aimed for the heart and the internal organs.

I know it's hard to believe she did it but she did and she's paying for it regardless of her cut neck.

But don't get me wrong, I think Darin is a vile creep but he did not murder those boys. He's been thoroughly investigated.

 

[justiceBserved]

This case is truly confounding. I do not view Darin as a likely culprit in any way, but I do see this as a revenge crime - Darlie's revenge on Darin. From a financial angle, it does make more sense for her to have killed Darin, BUT this may have been too obvious. Perhaps she thought they could solve their problems with insurance money from the boys, and maybe their deaths would bring her and Darin closer together if he viewed her as a victim as well. Still, even with blaming Darin for financial and material losses, the financial angle still does not jive. Revenge on Darin certainly does. After all, we have seen the Medea scenario played out time and again... but why leave Drake alive? The whole crime scene screams impulsive. If this was actually planned out (I am sure it was premeditated, but not carefully planned), why leave Drake alive? I believe this was a crime of rage, and the rage was Darlie reaching the boiling point of "I'll show Darin. I'll get my way." I think attention and trying to hang onto what she had, even though she failed at it, was the bottom line here. Remember, Darin stood by her until they recently mutually agreed to divorce, and the only reasons for standing by her an supporting her were a) guilt for his own role in this tragedy (financial and material losses, flirting with litle sis, etc.; Darlie's request for separation seems to me just a form of manipulation), and b) perhaps not wanting to believe or admit a mother could do such a thing, even if somewhere in the back of his mind, Darin knows the truth.

I cannot say that Darlie's claim of an intruder is 100% false, but I have read the differing versions of her story, as well as looked at the evidence. None of it jives... as for post partum depression and hormones, no way. That's just psychobabble for a defense strategy. Those things alone do not turn one into a raging, child-killing psychopath. However, a woman who is dead set on keeping up appearance, as opposed to being a top-notch mommy, would qualify for the sociopath medal. And given the number of similar cases prior to this one, it is no wonder where Darlie got her idea. I do hesitate to compare Darlie to Diane Downs, however, as I cannot say I am 100% convinced of Downs' guilt yet.