Nancy Cooper, 34, of Cary, N.C. #20

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This is the question many of us have.
Why did he go there? She hadn't driven, because her car was at home. She jogged with only a stick of gum, no ID or cell, so why would she carry her LTF card?

If it's easy to get information about a member...BC could have called to ask. If he was denied information when he called, then he might have gone to the desk to prove who he was. But he didn't say he called 1st and was denied the information.

He says he spoke to the lady at the desk. What did he ask? He knows NC couldn't get in without an ID.

I don't have any idea where NC or BC kept their cards for LTF. My thing is this comes back to the purse in the car. It all ties in. From the beginning I said the purse is a red flag.

I don't know if he had NC card for LTF or where it was when he went to LFT, but he was in a panic and could easily messed up.

He said she only carried a stick of gum with her so he must have known she didn't have her LTF card with her. AND, if her card was somehow picked up by him as he rushed out of the house (or taken out of her purse or gym bag) then he KNEW she didn't have that card with her. So either way, it makes no sense to go looking at LTF (and certainly looking THERE ahead of going straight to Carey's townhouse community or along the paths?). Makes even less sense. His actions/movements that morning do not make sense.

In my mind there are 2 red flags so far (big flags)

1. Possible HT visit earlier than 6am.

2. Purse in car.

And the LTF visit is a red flag but not as big as #1 if #1 occurred.

We know for sure #2 is true. We don't yet know for sure (sure=info released by LE) that #1 is true.

If #1 is true, goose=cooked. That, to me, is a bigger red flag than #2.
 
See, if he hung around to make phone calls, then he wouldn't be 'out of the house' and it sounds like he did not want JA coming over. So from a 'maximizing the search' standpoint it doesn't make any sense to run around Cary willy-nilly looking (esp. with 2 little kids in tow in their car seats)...but from a "get outta the house so no one comes over" standpoint, it makes perfect sense cause any excuse to get out and stay out is 'good enough' to keep nosy friends away.

The other thing I thought of is if the neighbor across the street from his house (DD?) happened to witness him leaving the house with the kids and putting the kids in the car and if that phone call with JA...the one in which he said the kids "were already in their seats in the car" occurred and THEN he was seen getting the kids out the door and in the car...well THAT would prove he was lying to JA. I was thinking how perfect it would be if JA just happened to call DD at that precise moment, telling her that he said he already had the kids in the car, ready to go, so no thanks, don't need you to come over to watch them...and THEN if DD witnessed him hustling the kids out of the house...

Oh man, that would be an excellent 'gotcha!'

Bolding is mine, according to JA #9 he was "putting the girls in the car." According to her, he did not say they were already in their seats in the car.
 
Fran,

If you would answer this one question. And anybody else that wants to play feel free. If you are sitting on a jury right now and the evidence presented right now is what it is, do you find him guilty?

I mean he had a horrible marriage and his friends say he didn't give her enough money and he didn't offer a reward do you find him guilty?

The problem is WE don't have evidence against him - other than what other have said what Nancy told him - and assumptions made regarding visits to the grocery store ...

I know that "statistics" are that he probably did it - but the thing that keeps me from completely thinking he did is that fact that there are many on this board that grasp any little piece of info and try to turn it into "evidence" against him ...

I've always thought the affidavits of her friends were odd ... mostly because they were consistent to an extent in their stories and the tone they were told with - as though they all met together the night before and "got their stories straight" ... that to me was kind of telling... as though there is more to their stories - but it involves THEM (the friends) and they don't want to share whatever that is.
 
He said she only carried a stick of gum with her so he must have known she didn't have her LTF card with her. AND, if her card was somehow picked up by him as he rushed out of the house (or taken out of her purse or gym bag) then he KNEW she didn't have that card with her. So either way, it makes no sense to go looking at LTF (and certainly looking THERE ahead of going straight to Carey's townhouse community or along the paths?). Makes even less sense. His actions/movements that morning do not make sense.

In my mind there are 2 red flags so far (big flags)

1. Possible HT visit earlier than 6am.

2. Purse in car.

And the LTF visit is a red flag but not as big as #1 if #1 occurred.

We know for sure #2 is true. We don't yet know for sure (sure=info released by LE) that #1 is true.

If #1 is true, goose=cooked. That, to me, is a bigger red flag than #2.

#2 is not a red flag for me. A purse in a locked car means what ?
She was estranged from her controlling husband. Why would she leave her purse out for him on the counter ?

After Brad offered it, the cops took it as it could offer evidence of her plans or associations.....address directory, phone numbers, appointment book, diary, notes, photos, ect.
 
#2 is not a red flag for me. A purse in a locked car means what ?
She was estranged from her controlling husband. Why would she leave her purse out for him on the counter ?

After Brad offered it, the cops took it as it could offer evidence of her plans or associations.....address directory, phone numbers, appointment book, diary, notes, photos, ect.

Yeah, the purse in the car doesn't do it for me, either.
 
IMO, I believe the people who live in that area are saying the purse in the car is a red flag for them because there's apparently been a rash of car burglaries in the area and residents have been advised not to keep valuables in their cars.

In addition, Nancy knew that Brad had a key to her car and could get anything out of their whenever he wanted to. That's how he got the kid's passports. Nancy used to keep them in her car and while they were at a park or some activity, he went back to the car and took them. (can't remember where, but I read that, IIRC, from one of Nancy's friends)

I'm not saying the purse in the car is a red flag for me, just explaining the mind-set of some others for this being odd.

JMHO
fran
 
IMO, I believe the people who live in that area are saying the purse in the car is a red flag for them because there's apparently been a rash of car burglaries in the area and residents have been advised not to keep valuables in their cars.

In addition, Nancy knew that Brad had a key to her car and could get anything out of their whenever he wanted to. That's how he got the kid's passports. Nancy used to keep them in her car and while they were at a park or some activity, he went back to the car and took them. (can't remember where, but I read that, IIRC, from one of Nancy's friends)

I'm not saying the purse in the car is a red flag for me, just explaining the mind-set of some others for this being odd.

JMHO
fran

I understand, but what would Brad gain by planting her purse in her car :waitasec:
Did he want the cops to think she was ready to drive to the park at 7am and was abducted from the driveway ? If that was his story, he would have heard about it.
 
There is not proof of a lie there. According to his entry, it was his first run/ride in 5 months. You don't know whether he continued training after that first session unless you were training with him. SH affidavit #14 says "Brad relaxed his efforts to train for a triathalon..." You don't know to what period he was referring. If he could only run/ride once or twice a week, he may not consider that training. I certainly wouldn't. Or do you consider *any* exercise bewteen January and July to be training?



So you never broke a publicly announced New Year's resolution? You never announced a project you were going to do and never finished it or even started it?

At the time of his announcement, his goal may have been to do the Lake Placid event. But is there proof of him actually registering? Is there proof of him training after his 10 Jan entry?

Here's what I see:

85-90% of the affidavits in support of the Rentz's motion are hearsay; "Nancy said Brad did..." There are a few incidents that were personally witnessed but not nearly enough to convince me she was abused.

80-90% of the affidavits in support of Brad are either observations by the affiant, or can be verified by records. Several of those affidavits are by those who would know first-hand if some of the hearsay were true or not; e.g. the preschool teachers say they have never witnessed anything the Rentz affidavits claim nor that BC's behavior/actions are different than most fathers. Certainly if one of them had witnessed the screaming/crying incident claimed in the Rentz affidavits, they would not have assented to an affidavit in support of BC.

If it was a different teacher that witnessed the screaming/crying incident, where is the affidavit from that teacher stating he/she personally witnessed the event?

MM's affidavit in support of BC is essentially cross-examination. He states a lot of hearsay in the one in support of the Rentz's. in the BF affidavit, he states that he did not personally witness *any* of what was claimed in his affidavit for the Rentz's.

If you put the Rentz's affiants on the stand, just about every single statement would be objected to and sustained as hearsay. For those statements that were objected to and overruled, there would be cross-examination that looked like MM's second affidavit.

So I'm on the not-enough-evidence-to-convict side of this debate; SO FAR.

I agree that he is suspect #1 and is most likely the perp. But that is opinion.
Show me the facts that prove that he did it and I'll say "Hang him!":behindbar

But the circumstances of his marriage are not proof of murder.

P.S. Has anybody done an OCR scan of the legal documents so they can be searched easier?


You need to do more reading if you don't see the lies. If you don't think he was lying - so be it. His words not mne.
 
I understand, but what would Brad gain by planting her purse in her car :waitasec:
Did he want the cops to think she was ready to drive to the park at 7am and was abducted from the driveway ? If that was his story, he would have heard about it.

So he had an excuse for not hearing her cell phone ring might be one reason.
 
#2 is not a red flag for me. A purse in a locked car means what ?
She was estranged from her controlling husband. Why would she leave her purse out for him on the counter ?

After Brad offered it, the cops took it as it could offer evidence of her plans or associations.....address directory, phone numbers, appointment book, diary, notes, photos, ect.


Wonder why Brad didn't think of that - he was looking for a phone number for Carey, he also knew where she lived but not what condo - perhaps all of that information could have been found in an address book in Nancy's purse as you say, quite possible. Quess he only went through her things when it actually suited his purposes.
 
True, but do we know from reports the cell was in the purse ?

Not sure of that - JA indicates the purse was in the car and the phone is "there" - whatever that means. But if the phone is in the house - what reason can he give for not answering it - especially after a phone conversation with JA about Nancy's whereabouts ? JA says she called Nancy's cell. No reports of where the phone was other than "there" that I am aware of and JA's reference is open for discussion and how one views it.

I do see the purse as a red flag since her car was in the drive and there had been several break ins of vehicles prior to her going missing. Also Brad was looking for answers to her possible whereabouts, and how to contact a possible running partner - instead of placing calls there is a very good possiblity the answers were very close at hand. If it was Nancy's habit to locke the purse in the car - he knew it - seems odd he didn't bother with it in his search for phone numbers.
 
Not sure of that - JA indicates the purse was in the car and the phone is "there" - whatever that means. But if the phone is in the house - what reason can he give for not answering it - especially after a phone conversation with JA about Nancy's whereabouts ? JA says she called Nancy's cell. No reports of where the phone was other than "there" that I am aware of and JA's reference is open for discussion and how one views it.

I do see the purse as a red flag since her car was in the drive and there had been several break ins of vehicles prior to her going missing. Also Brad was looking for answers to her possible whereabouts, and how to contact a possible running partner - instead of placing calls there is a very good possiblity the answers were very close at hand. If it was Nancy's habit to locke the purse in the car - he knew it - seems odd he didn't bother with it in his search for phone numbers.

RC:

Later in the 911 tape, AFTER JA said the "cell phone was there", JA said the cell phone was in the car. So she saw it. NC's cell phone was in the car.

ALSO: What if the real reason BC went to LTF was to cancel his tennis time?
That would give him "cover" for having asked about NC, and it wouldn't show as a call made to LTF which could be verified by cell phone log or TW records. For instance: "I need to cancel my tennis time, and oh, by the way, have you seen my wife?" made to a random employee. "I don't know who it was, don't even remember if it was male or female now".
 
RC:

Later in the 911 tape, AFTER JA said the "cell phone was there", JA said the cell phone was in the car. So she saw it. NC's cell phone was in the car.

ALSO: What if the real reason BC went to LTF was to cancel his tennis time?
That would give him "cover" for having asked about NC, and it wouldn't show as a call made to LTF which could be verified by cell phone log or TW records. For instance: "I need to cancel my tennis time, and oh, by the way, have you seen my wife?" made to a random employee. "I don't know who it was, don't even remember if it was male or female now".

My opinion is she was speaking of 'there' as the car or house.
It was never said, but i can't imagine she walked up to the car and peered in while he was right there in the house.
 
Was Brad going to play tennis at the Lochmere Swim & Tennis Club, or the Lifetime Fitness Ctr.? (Assuming there's even a tennis facility at LTF.) IF there is a tennis facility @ LTF, then he could have taken the children with him if he wanted to, assuming the child care facility there was open on Saturdays.
 
My opinion is she was speaking of 'there' as the car or house.
It was never said, but i can't imagine she walked up to the car and peered in while he was right there in the house.

There was another friend with JA when she called 911 and the 'friend' was freaking out in the background. Perhaps it was the 'friend' who went over to the car in the drive-way AFTER she'd called and Brad said Nancy was out having coffee. THEN she went to JA's and things went from there.

Just an idea,
fran

PS....ANOTHER Red Flag is Brad told two different people TWO different stories on where Nancy was. Jessica - Nancy's out running with Carey. Another friend - Nancy's out having coffee....fran
 
Was Brad going to play tennis at the Lochmere Swim & Tennis Club, or the Lifetime Fitness Ctr.? (Assuming there's even a tennis facility at LTF.) IF there is a tennis facility @ LTF, then he could have taken the children with him if he wanted to, assuming the child care facility there was open on Saturdays.

No tennis at Lifetime Fitness
 
I understand, but what would Brad gain by planting her purse in her car :waitasec:
Did he want the cops to think she was ready to drive to the park at 7am and was abducted from the driveway ? If that was his story, he would have heard about it.

PERHAPS he was HOPING LE would take off on that, she was ready to leave and someone abducted her from there.

The ploy 'she drove off with some guy' has already been used by Craig Stebic, so he was trying a 'new approach?'

Just an idea,
IMHO
fran
 
RC:

Later in the 911 tape, AFTER JA said the "cell phone was there", JA said the cell phone was in the car. So she saw it. NC's cell phone was in the car.

ALSO: What if the real reason BC went to LTF was to cancel his tennis time?
That would give him "cover" for having asked about NC, and it wouldn't show as a call made to LTF which could be verified by cell phone log or TW records. For instance: "I need to cancel my tennis time, and oh, by the way, have you seen my wife?" made to a random employee. "I don't know who it was, don't even remember if it was male or female now".

I believe in the affidavits he indicates his tennis match was in the morning 9:30 I think - he reports in his affidavit he first postponed it then canceled it. If it was at 9:30 - no need to pop in to lifetime after 1 pm. I will go look - I recall he referenced the time for the tennis match as being in the morning. Will find it.


ETA - Line 176 of Brad's affidavit - he says he has a tennis match for 9:30 - he called to postpone it and at 9:15 to cancel it. No location given or person with whom he was to play with. ( Bet LE knows - funny he is concerned about his tennis match but not concerned his wife has not returned in time to care for the kids aye?).
 
There was another friend with JA when she called 911 and the 'friend' was freaking out in the background. Perhaps it was the 'friend' who went over to the car in the drive-way AFTER she'd called and Brad said Nancy was out having coffee. THEN she went to JA's and things went from there.

Just an idea,
fran

PS....ANOTHER Red Flag is Brad told two different people TWO different stories on where Nancy was. Jessica - Nancy's out running with Carey. Another friend - Nancy's out having coffee....fran

Now now - brad does not lie...:doh:
 
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