NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #10

[Gooddeeds]

Of course. From your link:

https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime...ing-floor-associated-with-las-vegas-shooting/

>>>snip

...The 43-story building had an unorthodox floor numbering system even before the shooting. Mandalay Bay elevators stopped at floors 1 through 34 and 60 through 63. There was no 40 through 59...

...The Mandalay elevators will now indicate floors 1 through 30 and 56 through 63. Four Seasons will keep 35 through 39...

<<<snip

I'm dizzy.

What happened to closing that area off completely, as they mentioned was in the process of being done in October? Something like by choice that wing would not be made functional again...

 

[Gooddeeds]

SNIPPED FROM:
http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/02/...-autopsy-not-released-dr-michael-baden-reacts

Forensic pathologist Dr. Michael Baden said he can't think of a reason why the autopsies of 58 victims were released due to a court order, but*Paddock's was not.

 

[cujenn81]

SNIPPED FROM:
http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/02/...-autopsy-not-released-dr-michael-baden-reacts

Forensic pathologist Dr. Michael Baden said he can't think of a reason why the autopsies of 58 victims were released due to a court order, but*Paddock's was not.

I tend to agree with him... especially when you consider that his body has already been cremated.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[PrairieWind]

SNIPPED FROM:
http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/02/...-autopsy-not-released-dr-michael-baden-reacts

Forensic pathologist Dr. Michael Baden said he can't think of a reason why the autopsies of 58 victims were released due to a court order, but*Paddock's was not.

I'm an attorney and I deal with officials like coroners often. I usually give them the benefit of the doubt on things. They have difficult jobs and often get more wrapped up in their direct work and disregard their public disclosure duties. Its a bit understandable though frustrating and sometimes requires some threats or force to get info. But this case is just getting to ridiculous levels. I can understand some delay due to the number of deaths that day. But obviously Paddock's autopsy was the highest priority. He is dead, the story is that he was the sole person involved. I can see no reason why his full autopsy report isn't released.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

What happened to closing that area off completely, as they mentioned was in the process of being done in October? Something like by choice that wing would not be made functional again...

Well, it's not being made functional again. The 32nd floor has ceased to exist. It is now the 57th floor, where nothing ever happened.

Duh!!! Lol.

 

[watergirl62]

Also from this link:

https://lasvegassun.com/news/2018/f...-oct-1-shooting-autopsi/#.WnkDWadpwBM.twitter

...Attorneys for media including The Associated Press argue that once personal identifiers are redacted, claims to privacy no longer apply...

Once a person dies claims to privacy no longer apply, Mr. Media Attorneys. The dead do not enjoy rights. Redacting personal identifiers has no effect on a non-existent right. This is a (ohwhatdoyoucallitkind of argument) non-argument, a logical fallacy. A disjunct. Something. And it's trying to trick your thinking. It might succeed, too, because death is a hard thing to think about, and many will avoid doing so.

This issue is about the feelings and sensitivities of the living, and should be framed in those terms. "Attorneys for the media including the Associated Press" = blowing smoke up our skirts = false news.

We have become such an entitled lot, eh?
#firstworldproblems

That being said, I would not want my son's autopsy in the public record. No way, no how. He did not die via a homegrown terrorist's bullet, but still... as a parent? that goes far beyond invasion of privacy. Period. Like this event hasn't destroyed enough of their lives when their loved ones were taken from them too soon. [emoji171]

IMO Any sense of entitlement to full disclosure is secondary to respect for these families losses. MOO

I am intrigued by the ballistics aspect, and would love to analyze the data, of course, but am not going to feel scandalized if I don't see these released.

I get the impression after seeing the $32K media fines charged to the ME that the stonewalling may go on for a bit, and possibly forever regarding SP's report. Those court decisions resemble a tennis match, and at the end of the day, it is resolved by $$. LOL Shocking. [emoji57]

 

[Gooddeeds]

Well, it's not being made functional again. The 32nd floor has ceased to exist. It is now the 57th floor, where nothing ever happened.

Duh!!! Lol.

There ya go! That’s the way to fix it. Deny it existed and cover it up with a new number. Sort of the way they are going about most everything.

 

[Gooddeeds]

We have become such an entitled lot, eh?
#firstworldproblems

That being said, I would not want my son's autopsy in the public record. No way, no how. He did not die via a homegrown terrorist's bullet, but still... as a parent? that goes far beyond invasion of privacy. Period. Like this event hasn't destroyed enough of their lives when their loved ones were taken from them too soon. [emoji171]

IMO Any sense of entitlement to full disclosure is secondary to respect for these families losses. MOO

I am intrigued by the ballistics aspect, and would love to analyze the data, of course, but am not going to feel scandalized if I don't see these released.

I get the impression after seeing the $32K media fines charged to the ME that the stonewalling may go on for a bit, and possibly forever regarding SP's report. Those court decisions resemble a tennis match, and at the end of the day, it is resolved by $$. LOL Shocking. [emoji57]

I understand and respect the victims privacy.

Regarding SP there is no comparison or an excuse for his autopsy not to have been made public by now.

They have it backwards. ‘Show this, but don’t show that.’

 

[coastal]

We have become such an entitled lot, eh?
#firstworldproblems

That being said, I would not want my son's autopsy in the public record. No way, no how. He did not die via a homegrown terrorist's bullet, but still... as a parent? that goes far beyond invasion of privacy. Period. Like this event hasn't destroyed enough of their lives when their loved ones were taken from them too soon. [emoji171]

IMO Any sense of entitlement to full disclosure is secondary to respect for these families losses. MOO

I am intrigued by the ballistics aspect, and would love to analyze the data, of course, but am not going to feel scandalized if I don't see these released.

I get the impression after seeing the $32K media fines charged to the ME that the stonewalling may go on for a bit, and possibly forever regarding SP's report. Those court decisions resemble a tennis match, and at the end of the day, it is resolved by $$. LOL Shocking. [emoji57]

I agree. My father died recently, of natural causes, at the age of 88. I would not want his autopsy made available to the public, simply as a show of respect for this man I loved so much - and still love, even though he is gone from this world. He asked us to celebrate the good life he lived, instead of mourning his death, and I'm trying, but it isn't always easy. I can't imagine how much harder it would be if the details of his dying were published to satisfy the curiosity of the public.

If there are details in those autopsies that clarify the official narrative of October 1, those details should be made available, perhaps in the form of a report that explains those details - bullet trajectories, toolmarks, descriptions of wounds, etc., without offending the dignity of specific victims by name. Such a report could inform and instruct LE and the public in ways that might reduce future risk, and, IMO, would foster the greatest good.

FWIW, I think this is what the "media attorneys" were trying to say.

Paddock, IMO, forfeited his right to any privacy or respect when he fired the first bullet, long before he died.

 

[kittythehare]

Also from your link



So, LE has the bullet fragments to make it FIT in their story. The coroner already released the names of victims and the FIT report identified them all again and included 2 maps pinpointing their location as well as the hospital they were taken to.

If early reports showed none of the victims were killed in close range, where is the analysis and trajectory detail to make that assessment?

Sorry but lE have bullet fragments because many people were murdered, not to make them fit into a report.
The trajectory details have not been released, they may be or they may not be.

Innocent lives were lost.
They died horribly and many suffered horribly before they died.
Paddock murdered them
There is no evidence of a second shooter or anything resembling the effects of a second shooter.
Whereas I completely agree the information outflow is being handled extraordinarily badly and apparently incompetently, lets just prioritise the victims here.
I agree with watergirl.. its none of our business whether they were pissed as noots, stoned as crows or tripping out of their minds when they were all killed in cold blood.
None of it would have made their deaths any easier and it disrespects them to make this information public gossip fodder.

It is good practice to make bullet fragments available to LE because these must be assessed and matched with the guns and ammunition Paddock was using.

The victims are dead and they did nothing to contribute to their own deaths.

 

[CoolJ]

Sorry but lE have bullet fragments because many people were murdered, not to make them fit into a report.
The trajectory details have not been released, they may be or they may not be.

Innocent lives were lost.
They died horribly and many suffered horribly before they died.
Paddock murdered them
There is no evidence of a second shooter or anything resembling the effects of a second shooter.
Whereas I completely agree the information outflow is being handled extraordinarily badly and apparently incompetently, lets just prioritise the victims here.
I agree with watergirl.. its none of our business whether they were pissed as noots, stoned as crows or tripping out of their minds when they were all killed in cold blood.
None of it would have made their deaths any easier and it disrespects them to make this information public gossip fodder.

It is good practice to make bullet fragments available to LE because these must be assessed and matched with the guns and ammunition Paddock was using.

The victims are dead and they did nothing to contribute to their own deaths.

Some of us are interested in the truth. There was absolutely nothing wrong with kdg411's questions.
The main question being..... "where is the analysis and trajectory detail to make that assessment?" while speaking of the assumption of all victims being shot at close range.

No evidence of a second shooter? Where is the evidence "Paddock murdered them"?

Make no assumptions in this case. JMO

 

[watergirl62]

Also from your link



So, LE has the bullet fragments to make it FIT in their story. The coroner already released the names of victims and the FIT report identified them all again and included 2 maps pinpointing their location as well as the hospital they were taken to.

If early reports showed none of the victims were killed in close range, where is the analysis and trajectory detail to make that assessment?

I thought I read in the FIT report that a full ballistics report was forthcoming? wait... p. 45

Ammunition
Several types of ammunition were located within rooms 32-135 and 32-134 loaded into rifle magazines for both the AR-15 and AR-10 style rifles. The AR-15 .223/5.56 rifle magazines were
loaded with hollow point and polymer tipped hollow point ammunition. The AR-10 .308/7.62 rifle magazines and the bolt action rifle were loaded with Tracer, Frangible Incendiary, Armor Piercing and Armor Piercing Incendiary ammunition. A complete breakdown of the ammunition types loaded in the firearms, rifle magazines and expended cartridge casings will be documented in the final report.


Mmmkay, guess that's not quite the same as trajectory detail... not that anyone is getting any warm-fuzzies from the FIT report at this point, but it is what it is. I think if they could summarize the pertinent information (like they did with the maps and the names) respectfully without releasing any full-blown autopsies, that would be a suitable compromise. You know, walk the line....

Expectation management... CHECK.

 

[CARIIS]

sorry if mentioned regarding being under oath already

i had heard about a claim that they saw him kill himself . I did not realize that it was under oath.

pg 41 ( I think timewise this is the first statement)

Lombardos lie about engaging the subject is in there 302 in the morning of the shooting



Isn't that called PERJURY?

I also did catch that two officers then disputed that

so

one way or the other that could be two counts of perjury??

anyone heard about any perjury charges one way or another>

both cant be correct now can they!

William brewer and Kenneth Mead both say he was dead when they entered pg 18 pg 20

its cut copy pasted statements

another two narratives -- the appear cut and paste eeeeee !

DNA Stuff crime scene photos looks like one of the beds in small room was slept in but have no pic of master bedroom bed

no suitcases in small room ??

one would think one would use the master bedroom

it fits that he would not make a bed based on attire tendency.

there is dna all over they have an eyelash forks spoons all dna its been months i would think dna results are back no mention of dna in this "report" one would think dna might be expedited in a mass murder??

in the report there was some comments about he wanted the other side of the hotel?? He then went downstairs and complained about the room they put him ??

 

[CoolJ]

I dont think the autopsy on him would matter much unless there IS a chest shot

I dunno CARIIS, i think there could be quite a bit we could learn from his autopsy. Chest shot being number one. Next i would want to learn more about those bilateral calf injuries. Odd to say the least.
But other things that could have meaning would be of course any other wounds/'injuries, tattoos (such as having or not having an MS-13 tattoo on his neck), toxicology (such as showing positive for the latest mk-ultra serum)

But most importantly, could an autopsy reveal if that was really him or not? Or are we to believe the body autopsied was in fact Stephen Paddock but he shrunk 3 inches and eyes changed colour like a chameleon.

IMO, the biggest conspiracy theory of them all is that a 64 year old down on his luck professional video poker player brought 2 dozen automatic guns all by himself into a hotel room to .... well, you know the story

 

[CoolJ]

I'm an attorney and I deal with officials like coroners often. I usually give them the benefit of the doubt on things. They have difficult jobs and often get more wrapped up in their direct work and disregard their public disclosure duties. Its a bit understandable though frustrating and sometimes requires some threats or force to get info. But this case is just getting to ridiculous levels. I can understand some delay due to the number of deaths that day. But obviously Paddock's autopsy was the highest priority. He is dead, the story is that he was the sole person involved. I can see no reason why his full autopsy report isn't released.

BBM
Once i factor in all of the other shenanigans in this case, I can see plenty of reasons why the full report hasn't been released.

 

[CARIIS]

I dunno CARIIS, i think there could be quite a bit we could learn from his autopsy. Chest shot being number one. Next i would want to learn more about those bilateral calf injuries. Odd to say the least.
But other things that could have meaning would be of course any other wounds/'injuries, tattoos (such as having or not having an MS-13 tattoo on his neck), toxicology (such as showing positive for the latest mk-ultra serum)

But most importantly, could an autopsy reveal if that was really him or not? Or are we to believe the body autopsied was in fact Stephen Paddock but he shrunk 3 inches and eyes changed colour like a chameleon.

IMO, the biggest conspiracy theory of them all is that a 64 year old down on his luck professional video poker player brought 2 dozen automatic guns all by himself into a hotel room to .... well, you know the story

We sure do! And i the notion that some senior citizen who allegedly spent the last three decades of existence sitting on bar stools in the dark , who is out of shape can fire and reload machine guns with acumen of the best snipers our three letter agencies produce !!

Since this happened I have watched videos of those things firing. There mean machines and require muscle tone!!

For a senior citizen with profound respiratory problems swirling around in hot smoke filled rooms while holding a machine gun and an oxygen supply thing in his other hand when visualized takes you beyond ludicrous!! Takes you directly to the bullsh@@ dept! Visualize it

So now we have a senior citizen who supposedly gambled all night drilling wiring up everything, through in heat, smoke , superman strength to shatter cat 5 hurricane panes of glass with a kids sledge hammer and still be vital enough to do what the rest is alleged furthers being in BS land.

That night was preceded by getting a mini army arsonal up in unpacked loaded placed -- he sure is superman huh !!

One hell of a 64 year old. He does however have a radiant skin color indicating vibrant blood ANEMA!! A picture of health!! And go knows how old the one pic we have of him is !!!!

Cool stop it everyones eye color changes upon death -- you did not know that!

It is also a well known fact that people grow as they age!

I was 5 11 in my 20's now I tower at 6 5 -- its not happening for you !! Thats funny

I found consistency in ordering meals for two all the time logical as well!

If one person needs two beds it would make sense that one person always orders for two! Maybe he was a multi personality??

I found the second bedroom having someone sleeping in one of the beds new and more than interesting!! I had never noticed the difference between the two beds before!

I also never knew about the meds being in the master bedroom ( logical) . What person would not sleep in the master bedroom ? Makes no sense like any of this!

I also never noticed the sandals in the second bedroom either. For someone who proudly boasts in a depo for being fond wearing one pair of sandals always it is interesting (report said he had sandals on) despite being suicidal he had two pairs this visit!

In addition, wearing sandals while breaking out massive windows and being surrounded by red hot shell cases makes sense!

An old guy running around all over glass ,bullets, machine guns, a 15 foot vacuum hose all over the place, furniture moved all over, clips, magazines, sledgehammer on floor, telescope stand things in the middle of the room , food carts , computer wires all over the floor in smoke, in some flaps also makes sense!

Guys in the 60 minute segment who are fit described the room as difficult to navigate and they had boots on !!

Very very creative, informative with much food for thought from someone who presents in an educated and informed manner. What a cute idea!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0tXblR5KvA

humm the Haig stuff is a complaint so a grand jury is still going

dont really care much about him tho!! in terms of this whole mess


it actually seems he was clueless that what he was doing was actual illegal - he just flat out said i sold him this type of ammo if he knew it was illigal i dont think he would just volunteer he was let out without bail or anything so he really is no big deal

but it was online sales so there are probably other people invoved who really have nothing to do with this as does this IMO

Some of us are interested in the truth. There was absolutely nothing wrong with kdg411's questions.
The main question being..... "where is the analysis and trajectory detail to make that assessment?" while speaking of the assumption of all victims being shot at close range.

No evidence of a second shooter? Where is the evidence "Paddock murdered them"?

Make no assumptions in this case. JMO

Trajectory is vital in mass shootings. Used and released all the time unless of course (music) it does not fit the fairytale.............

I understand and respect the victims privacy.

Regarding SP there is no comparison or an excuse for his autopsy not to have been made public by now.

They have it backwards. ‘Show this, but don’t show that.’

I dont think the autopsy on him would matter much unless there IS a chest shot

 

[CARIIS]

I passed my edit time to include in my past post but took the time to write it :

QUOTE=kittythehare;13915489]Medical examiners often are able to determine how a bullet struck a person and the path it made through his or her body. Some reports of the Oct. 1 victims noted that the wounds showed &#8220;no evidence of close-range firing.&#8221;

Many of the reports also reveal whether victims had drugs or alcohol in their systems at the time of death. They do not detail the location of death or note whether victims were transported to hospitals. Many of the victims&#8217; bodies showed signs of medical intervention, such as those left by intravascular catheters in their arms.

https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime...eports-of-58-victims-from-las-vegas-shooting/[/QUOTE]

Important word in this allegation

no

none of the victims

has far more meaning !!

not said ----pick and chose narrative

This ME like sheriff has a history of corruption.

He started wanting to hide his offices work from the public before this -- that is a character trait!

I wish some of the victims families would do independent second opinions -- all it takes is one defrauded one to open up stuff.

Interesting that no superstar forensic folks have not been heralded as being asked to participate

Kinda wondering if his refusal to do what the law says is protecting his staff. You would lose your license to practice if you were found falifing to do honest evaluations.

Closing a public to the public for half a month is also worth a ponder here or there.

Pulse ME did not need to go on shutdown and have cops guarded the building for half a month.

There were specific areas wherein eyewitness folks reported shooting other than at MB remain guarded and closed down for quite some time. One of them was tropicana parking lot.


Go do like a google map thing and play around from high up the roof of the valet awning at MB, it is like a mall parking lot with a step down to get into a massive parking lot .

Ideal and easy for some snipers to do their thing , stoll over to that parking lot and depart unnoticed in the commotion

Noone has come up with a suggestion about three black sedans racing to the airport about two hours later, per a trained police officer call into dispatch.

What color cars do three letter agencies like> There was urgency in the cops dispatch.

Another poster confirmed hearing it too. Amazingly cant find it any longer?? THe report was there in real time broadcasting .

Self driving car (Luxer hotel possible bomb report) driving around a city in mass chaos does not really sound all that credible to me! Rather dangerous IMO. Dont know if they do well with people running all over highways ? Stop go stop go every two feet in order to avoid fleeing concert goers running all over highways . _ the people are not going to cross walks and waiting for the little light to change while machine guns are firing all over the place.

Only presser in a quarter of a year and our FBI lead has vanished . All other times he stood so close he was violating normative boundaries as it relates to proximity comfort social norms. Our FBI guy lead was there every presser for WEEKS PUlse.

There were dozens of FBI guys burying evidence of days -- nothing is attributed to any other agency but LVMPD> Not how it works. We all know the FBI capabilities far exceed a police dept that cant find their SWAT team for the biggest shooting in nations history.

Why is there no mention of DNA regarding their rooms? Nor has there been any mention of DNA data is forthcoming. Dna can easily determine the people in and out of the room.

WHy did the nature of COmpus wounds remained clouded for months? And then wrong.

In the top secret escape to the medic clinic ( what a joke -- they do flu shots not gunshots - that would be a criminal charge)! Common courtesy the day of Campus interviews , would be someone stepping into the next room 12 feet away and saying he needs some medical attn and are leaving. Can you imagine them coming out of their little huddle to discover the participants have absconded into space? Not to be found for ages!

I have two eyewitnesses to a slaughter and I don't reveal the engineer for weeks. They obviously knew his involvement before they even breached the room. Secrecy general indicates hiding concealing manipulating. On 60 minutes not one of the 4 breachers mentioned the engineer. Dozens talked to him. His calls were heard easily telling them where he was. He was 22 feet away/

The words "You Tube do not = CT)

I have not seen one MSM entity questioning the same things we are here. What is up with the helicopter back wash on the hidden CCTV that came out by accident? You need to be pretty close to the ground for that happen. The helicopter was hovering for quite some time. Why is a helicopter hovering in ONE place.

I think most of us have been watching on YT the live real time eyewitness cell phone live broadcasts in (its a physical impossibility to be photoshopping the hundreds of hours of eyewitness video while running or bleeding in middle of the event:

• Originally Posted by kittythehare
  If its legitimate, verifiable and from the correct source.. same with everything..
  I , personally cannot be bothered researching rumors from known fake media or conspiracy sites. I will not put time into them.​

 

[coastal]

CARIIS. Man! Reading you is like hooking directly in to a stream of the collective unconscious, full blast: exhausting, exciting, chaotic, compelling, disturbing, and so honest, it hurts.

I hope you never change.

 

[watergirl62]

CARIIS. Man! Reading you is like hooking directly in to a stream of the collective unconscious, full blast: exhausting, exciting, chaotic, compelling, disturbing, and so honest, it hurts.

I hope you never change.

[emoji171] This!!
Faulkner-esque, but with a double shot of espresso and a jigger full of moonshine. I must sip from a wee tiny cup or it makes me feel kind of giddy, like I just rode the back end of the Texas Rattler four times in a row and ran like the wind to get back in line. [emoji125]

 

[Gooddeeds]

SNIP From CARIIS Quote:


“I also never noticed the sandals in the second bedroom either. For someone who proudly boasts in a depo for being fond wearing one pair of sandals always it is interesting (report said he had sandals on) despite being suicidal he had two pairs this visit!

In addition, wearing sandals while breaking out massive windows and being surrounded by red hot shell cases makes sense!

An old guy running around all over glass ,bullets, machine guns, a 15 foot vacuum hose all over the place, furniture moved all over, clips, magazines, sledgehammer on floor, telescope stand things in the middle of the room , food carts , computer wires all over the floor in smoke, in some flaps also makes sense!

Guys in the 60 minute segment who are fit described the room as difficult to navigate and they had boots on !!

Very very creative, informative with much food for thought from someone who presents in an educated and informed manner. What a cute idea!! Quote]


-I recently noticed those neatly placed sandals. They are in the area between the end of the bed and I believe...an orange desk chair?

My first reaction was they were like flip flop types worn in and out of the Hotel guest Spa.