NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #5

[CoolJ]

No doubt the desire was to kill as many as possible but from what I'm reading they weren't all set up and ready to shoot.

If the desire was to kill as many as possible... why did he stop?

 

[kittythehare]

No I question a lot more, including why he used his real name. There are a ton of questions.

You are right to question everything.
Sometimes we dont see what is in front of us when we get too close to a case. Why indeed did he need so very many guns.. I really wanna know if he could have done it with less or more powerful.. or why he chose guns and not a bomb?
I'm interested in the psychology of gun ownership..
Was he trying to prove something about the power of guns?

 

[bestill]

If the desire was to kill as many as possible... why did he stop?

Right, he could have kept on shooting until LE found him but he didn't.

 

[Jennifer17]

If the desire was to kill as many as possible... why did he stop?

He may have just become tired,

 

[kittythehare]

Very helpful, thanks! It does look like the inner pane is tempered glass and the outer lane is annealed with a deco reflective film. Again, thickness matters, but I don’t think it was all that simple to break both panes, especially the tempered pane, in such a large surface area the way he did. JMO

ETA I’d love to ask my boss his opinion, but he thinks that the massacre was orchestrated by anti gun lobbyists sooo yeah, not trying to get into that convo. Maybe I’ll ask one of the other glaziers their thoughts tomorrow though!

I dont think its so simple to break tempered with a hatchet/hammer either...
And is there not generally a vacuum between both panes which would have provided more resistance?
I saw no reports of glass cutters among his stuff..
was he an extremely strong man physically?
Might be more here..
Looking forward to hearing back from your glazier...

 

[bestill]

He may have just become tired,

I don't think so. He had all those weapons and ammo. I do question his physical ability to do what he did but not that he suddenly got tired. You can't put the brakes on the adrenaline.

 

[bears10]

I dont think its so simple to break tempered with a hatchet/hammer either...
And is there not generally a vacuum between both panes which would have provided more resistance?
I saw no reports of glass cutters among his stuff..
was he an extremely strong man physically?
Might be more here..
Looking forward to hearing back from your glazier...

Yes more or less a vacuum seal. If your windows at home look foggy and no amount of cleaning will help, it’s bc the seal inside broke and moisture got in. Anyway, insulated glass units are strong. It wouldn’t be the most outlandish theory if he had a glass cutter. Once glass is tempered, it can’t be cut to a different size. It will just shatter if you try to cut it.

I’ve only been in the glass industry for a year, and we mainly do commercial, but we do get a lot of residential customers who need their units replaced. I personally have never come across a unit that has both panes broken, no matter how the break happened.

 

[kittythehare]

Yes more or less a vacuum seal. If your windows at home look foggy and no amount of cleaning will help, it’s bc the seal inside broke and moisture got in. Anyway, insulated glass units are strong. It wouldn’t be the most outlandish theory if he had a glass cutter. Once glass is tempered, it can’t be cut to a different size. It will just shatter if you try to cut it.

I’ve only been in the glass industry for a year, and we mainly do commercial, but we do get a lot of residential customers who need their units replaced. I personally have never come across a unit that has both panes broken, no matter how the break happened.

Could he perhaps used some of his tannerite to bust the sealed area first and then hammered it? I dont even know if thats possible..

 

[mpnola]

If the desire was to kill as many as possible... why did he stop?

Maybe it was too smoky. Maybe it was hurting him with all of the bullet casings ejecting. Maybe the guns were burning his hands. Maybe his energy was zapped from going back and forth. Maybe the rush wasn't as big as it was the first 2 minutes, so he decided he was done. Maybe he knew that bigger back up would be there soon because he had already seen 2 people and shot at them. Maybe he didn't have everything he needed to use them all set up before he was interrupted by the security guard and had to start sooner than he planned. But, ultimately, the reason is because he wanted to be in charge of the moment his life ended. He did not want the police to have that control. That's my opinion.

What reason do you think he stopped? I have seen it asked several times.

 

[canadiangirl]

House was already searched prior to the break in. Unless whoever broke in figured how to go back in time, they couldn't have planted fake evidence.

Was the house searched and the scene cleared and released?

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[m00c0w]

thats an excellent point. never even thought of it.. but i will now..
Please gun experts, sorry for another nag but realistically how many guns would he, should he have actually needed to carry out his act and do you have any theories regarding the surplus??
Could he have achieved his goal with just 10 guns fitted with bumps and one or two without or not?

23 was definitely excessive. It all depends on his ultimate goal. If he was actually trained, he wouldn’t have needed more than 3-4. Maybe a fifth for the road.

 

[bears10]

Could he perhaps used some of his tannerite to bust the sealed area first and then hammered it? I dont even know if thats possible..

I don’t know anything about tannerite but I am guessing it would have been loud if he did that, so if he was going to make noise, why not just shoot out the glass. I’d think it’d be easier to shoot than use tannerite but again, I don’t know crap about tannerite

 

[Jennifer17]

Was the house searched and the scene cleared and released?

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You would imagine so.

 

[fred&edna]

Maybe it was too smoky. Maybe it was hurting him with all of the bullet casings ejecting. Maybe the guns were burning his hands. Maybe his energy was zapped from going back and forth. Maybe the rush wasn't as big as it was the first 2 minutes, so he decided he was done. Maybe he knew that bigger back up would be there soon because he had already seen 2 people and shot at them. Maybe he didn't have everything he needed to use them all set up before he was interrupted by the security guard and had to start sooner than he planned. But, ultimately, the reason is because he wanted to be in charge of the moment his life ended. He did not want the police to have that control. That's my opinion.

What reason do you think he stopped? I have seen it asked several times.

And, I'll add... his shots at the jet fuel tanks failed to cause them to explode. Had to be a "downer" for his narcissistic/calculating mind.

 

[CoolJ]

Maybe it was too smoky. Maybe it was hurting him with all of the bullet casings ejecting. Maybe the guns were burning his hands. Maybe his energy was zapped from going back and forth. Maybe the rush wasn't as big as it was the first 2 minutes, so he decided he was done. Maybe he knew that bigger back up would be there soon because he had already seen 2 people and shot at them. Maybe he didn't have everything he needed to use them all set up before he was interrupted by the security guard and had to start sooner than he planned. But, ultimately, the reason is because he wanted to be in charge of the moment his life ended. He did not want the police to have that control. That's my opinion.

What reason do you think he stopped? I have seen it asked several times.

I don't know why he stopped. I don't like to make assumptions. I just question things when they don't add up.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

I work for a glazing contractor... from my experience it’s hard to tell what force would be needed without knowing the makeup of the unit. Idk what the building codes stated when MB was built 20 years ago so I can’t tell you if it’s annealed, tempered, lami, or a combination of two in the makeup of the units. The thicknesses would also have an effect on the difficulty in breaking thru.

ETA - I do accounting and am not a glazier, but if someone has a close up pic of the broken window(s) maybe I can give more insight. I’ve only seen pics from a distance.

I'm wondering if one of those simple "hammer" tools designed to keep in your car in case you are ever going under water and need to break the windows would work. I used to have one in my glove compartment.

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[bears10]

And, I'll add... his shots at the jet fuel tanks failed to cause them to explode. Had to be a "downer" for his narcissistic/calculating mind.

Yeah he could have started to freak out that things weren’t going according to plan. This is all speculation and is just me throwing around an idea; I have no links to back it up bc it’s just a thought. First the security guard made him start earlier than planned, possibly unprepared to an extent, then the tanks didn’t explode- problem number two. He gets hit by a ricocheted bullet and is hurt, maybe not fatal, but enough to prohibit him from continuing he massacre. So he ends it on his own terms.

I could be a lifetime movie writer lol

 

[m00c0w]

I don’t know anything about tannerite but I am guessing it would have been loud if he did that, so if he was going to make noise, why not just shoot out the glass. I’d think it’d be easier to shoot than use tannerite but again, I don’t know crap about tannerite

I believe that tannerite would be immensely impractical for that application.

 

[bears10]

I believe that tannerite would be immensely impractical for that application.

I agree but I don’t know anything about it other than it being used for gender reveal parties. Ha. So I don’t want to make statements on things I am not knowledgeable about.

 

[bears10]

I'm wondering if one of those simple "hammer" tools designed to keep in your car in case you are ever going under water and need to break the windows would work. I used to have one in my glove compartment.

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Very doubtful one of those could break thru a double pane insulated glass unit, especially considering the large amount of surface area that is broken