NY NY - Alice Parsons: Heiress, Long Island, 1937

[Marilynilpa]

Okay, I had a little chat and here's the theory my friend has come up with;

Early 20s, Czechoslavakia was a liberal democracy but with strong support among some groups for communism too. If Anna stopped there on her way out of Russia, and her father really was within the Czar's (distant) close circle, and her husband was in the military, the Czech government might have found her useful in weeding out the communists in their midst. They would likely have been in regular contact with their Russian counterparts.

After being refused entry to the US in '24, Anna might have made a special plea for herself. My friend has pointed out that communist-party members were regularly being attacked and their meetings broken up at this time, in the US.

She might have offered her Russian expertise as a reason for letting her in in '25, in the US fight against 'reds under the bed'. Her references would have been in Czechoslavakia; hence the reason for the US running a check on her there.

My friend has also said it's highly likely she would have been called upon in the run-up and during WW2, if that was the case, and she could have asked favours in return.

He said to ask if anyone has any files of Anna's that have come back with censored or blacked-out names/lines. Or anything very obviously missing. (Not that he's a retired spy or anything).*

So, have they?

Yes, some of Anna's records in the National Archive have been redacted. As time was limited on my last visit, I did not have time to review or photograph any of those documents. I was focusing on Alice, William and Alice's disappearance.

So it is possible that Anna was either cooperating with, or being closely monitored by, the U.S. Government.

In March I am making another trip to the Archives to finish going through the boxes of documents - I'll have unlimited time on this trip, so I'll be able to review everything.

FWIW, none of the documents I reviewed at the Suffolk County PD regarding Anna were redacted. But few of their documents pertained to her directly.

 

[Pink Panther]

I know someone with extensive knowledge of Czech history so I'm going to ask if they have any idea about this.

Do you have any photos of Roy as an adult? Especially any colour ones. I would have thought it would be possible to tell from his skin colour if he was half indian. If his father was an anglo-indian, his skin colour wouldn't necessarily give any clue at all, of course.

To be honest, Anna seems to have invented her history as she went along, to suit the circumstances. I wouldn't put it past her to have been less than honest about the father of her child, would you?

I have not found a single photo of Roy as an adult and I have looked quite a bit!

I waver back and forth regarding Roy's father. I've questioned whether or not William could possibly have been his biological father (given his travel dates to England) and also considered that he (William) might actually have been sterile, given that neither Alice nor Anna had any legitimate children by him. Having a child with him after Alice's disappearance would have certainly cinched the deal for Anna, wouldn't it?

I'm not so convinced that Anna was lying about who she was and her past...I think there may just be some truth to her provenance; regardless, it was irrelevant in the US.

 

[Pink Panther]

Just thought, is there public access to wills in the US? Anna will surely have made sure William left everything to her. And perhaps in turn, she left something to Roy? Perhaps it would be possible to trace her that way?

Oh...Birds of a feather! I've looked for William's will and have not found it. It must be out there! I have no legal expertise to offer on this matter and I am quite confused as to why sometimes (not always) probates are published in newspapers???

 

[Pink Panther]

Okay, I had a little chat and here's the theory my friend has come up with;

Early 20s, Czechoslavakia was a liberal democracy but with strong support among some groups for communism too. If Anna stopped there on her way out of Russia, and her father really was within the Czar's (distant) close circle, and her husband was in the military, the Czech government might have found her useful in weeding out the communists in their midst. They would likely have been in regular contact with their Russian counterparts.

After being refused entry to the US in '24, Anna might have made a special plea for herself. My friend has pointed out that communist-party members were regularly being attacked and their meetings broken up at this time, in the US.

She might have offered her Russian expertise as a reason for letting her in in '25, in the US fight against 'reds under the bed'. Her references would have been in Czechoslavakia; hence the reason for the US running a check on her there.

My friend has also said it's highly likely she would have been called upon in the run-up and during WW2, if that was the case, and she could have asked favours in return.

He said to ask if anyone has any files of Anna's that have come back with censored or blacked-out names/lines. Or anything very obviously missing. (Not that he's a retired spy or anything).*

So, have they?

She tried to come into the US and was deported in 1924. There are no records of her travelling back into the States until 1930. The documents where she is being investigated with reference to Czechoslavakia occur in 1925. There are two things that are curious about this. One, that there is no record of her attempting to enter in 1925 and two, that there is mention of Czechoslavakia. (Anna was Russian/Yugoslavian).

I don't believe that PD can "redact" information that is released??? I think that is something only the FBI can do???

 

[zwiebel]

I know the UK Government can redact just about anything they please, but I'm presuming it's a little more controlled in the US. I really don't know though. Pink Panther, do you know anything about a slew of classified records recently(past couple of years) released in the UK? It is ringing a bell but I can't recall the details. I doubt they'd be online, anyway, but I do have friends in London who could research and copy documents for us, if there might be anything about Anna.

It seems entirely possible Anna may have stopped off in Czechoslavakia at some point, but then I'd have thought there would be records of her entry and exit. I've tried to make enquiries with a Czech aquaintance, and all I did was offend them by saying Czechoslavakia instead of the Czech Republic. Whoops! I'm still trying to get a little opinion from someone who might be in a position to know though.

 

[Pink Panther]

zwiebel - I don't know anything about the classified records you mention. Can you shed some light?

 

[Robin Hood]

Zwiebel, are you referring to the disclosure of info in the National archives in Kew ? If you are, there's quite a lot of searchable records online. I've found some interesting stuff lately as part of something else I'm looking at.

 

[Odyssey]

Oh...Birds of a feather! I've looked for William's will and have not found it. It must be out there! I have no legal expertise to offer on this matter and I am quite confused as to why sometimes (not always) probates are published in newspapers???

Wills are usually available to the public from the county recorder, but rarely online. I remember when my dad passed, we had to file a probate notice in a local newspaper in order to give any possible creditors the chance to make a claim on the estate. Many people publish these in small neighborhood newspapers that are less expensive to publish in. my dad did not have a will, though - I dont believe probate comes into play unless there is no will - please correct me if I'm wrong?

ETA: where did they live when William died? I might be able to locate some property records if he owned property.

 

[Pink Panther]

I think that they were in California when William died.

 

[Odyssey]

I think that they were in California when William died.

Does anyone know what city or county, by chance? I think I remember reading about him having a farm in Atherton, and being married to Anna in Hollister - I'm assuming they married first in Hollister then settled in Atherton?

I will look and see what I can find for San Mateo county (Atherton).

Thanks!

 

[Odyssey]

Does anyone know what city or county, by chance? I think I remember reading about him having a farm in Atherton, and being married to Anna in Hollister - I'm assuming they married first in Hollister then settled in Atherton?

I will look and see what I can find for San Mateo county (Atherton).

Thanks!

After looking at the California death index, it shows he died in Monterey County in 1962 According to the city directory listing from 1957 posted by Pink Panther, he was in Pacific Grove in Monterey County at that time as well.

It sounds as though they married in Hollister in 1940, moved north to Atherton for the time that Roy was in high school/college. (It was mentioned that he went to Menlo College post-navy, which is near Atherton), then moved back south to Pacific Grove.

Pacific Grove is now a golf community, their golf course hosts several invitationals with Tiger Woods, etc. Not sure what it was like in the 50's and 60's.

I'm curious about the 1960's letter that pointed to a burial location. Was it postmarked from California?

 

[Pink Panther]

After looking at the California death index, it shows he died in Monterey County in 1962 According to the city directory listing from 1957 posted by Pink Panther, he was in Pacific Grove in Monterey County at that time as well.

It sounds as though they married in Hollister in 1940, moved north to Atherton for the time that Roy was in high school/college. (It was mentioned that he went to Menlo College post-navy, which is near Atherton), then moved back south to Pacific Grove.

Pacific Grove is now a golf community, their golf course hosts several invitationals with Tiger Woods, etc. Not sure what it was like in the 50's and 60's.

I'm curious about the 1960's letter that pointed to a burial location. Was it postmarked from California?

Here is the article about the "burial location":

http://fultonhistory.com/newspaper ...961 a PDF/Utica NY Observer 1961 a - 0447.pdf

The article says it was mailed from Massena, New York.

 

[scrambledeggs]

I've spent the last couple of days reading through this one - quite amazing stuff!

How's the book coming along Marilynilpa? Looking forward to reading your theories.

Something that was mentioned quite a few pages back that I wanted to ask about. There was a lot of talk about how Alice could have been persuaded to change her will and if she was normally so easilly led etc. Is is possible that the new will was forged?

 

[SophieRose]

Spefically, this is the public listing:

U.S. City Directories, 1821-1989 (Beta)

Name: Wm H Parsons
Gender: M (Male)
Residence Year: 1957
Street Address: 322a
Residence Place: Monterey; Pacific Grove, California
Occupation: Box
Spouse: Anna S Parsons
Publication Title: Polk's Monterey - Pacific Grove (Monterey County, Calif.) City Directory

No more K for Kupryanova! Back to S for this listing!

Oh and...If one clicks the ancestry link, Roy is still there with them at the same address and he's 31.

Roy married Allyn in 1954. His address was Hollywood and he was already divorced. His first wife's name was Sylvia Henriette Vigeveno and they were married in Los Angeles in 1949 while Roy was a student at UCLA.

 

[fred&edna]

I hope the book will be forthcoming SOON

 

[SophieRose]

After looking at the California death index, it shows he died in Monterey County in 1962 According to the city directory listing from 1957 posted by Pink Panther, he was in Pacific Grove in Monterey County at that time as well.

It sounds as though they married in Hollister in 1940, moved north to Atherton for the time that Roy was in high school/college. (It was mentioned that he went to Menlo College post-navy, which is near Atherton), then moved back south to Pacific Grove.

Pacific Grove is now a golf community, their golf course hosts several invitationals with Tiger Woods, etc. Not sure what it was like in the 50's and 60's.

I'm curious about the 1960's letter that pointed to a burial location. Was it postmarked from California?

Although they married in Hollister (San Benito County) in 1940, William and Anna were residents of Carmel in Monterey County.

Menlo College, which is in Atherton, is now a 4-year college. It used to be a private high school and junior college. It was considered a feeder school to nearby Stanford University. It seems Roy used some of his inheritence for a good education.

 

[SophieRose]

I thought I read that Wm Parsons worked for the US military (Navy?) in some capacity while living in California with Anna.

He worked in a civilian capacity for the army. probably at Fort Ord, which closed in 1994.

 

[SophieRose]

I really don't know what happened to this little branch of Parsons. It's surprising given their family history but none of the children really seemed to have accomplished anything of acclaim. They all lived at home well into adulthood. Only William and his brother Oliver seem to have married - both of them doing so late in life. William didn't have any children and only one other sibling had a child so everything kind of ends there. Surely, there was some money from the family but nothing outstanding.

The Parsons family also had a home in Florida. Did you find anything on William's two sisters (I think they were both married)?

 

[SophieRose]

Photographs from 1937, including pictures of William, Alice, and the house.

http://www.tribunephotos.com/s?defaultSearchTextValue=Search&Action=submit&searchKeywords=AT-8511-BS

 

[SophieRose]

Roy was born in England and was 4 years old before coming to the U.S. He is not William Parson's son.

Anna had a series of jobs prior to working for Alice and William Parsons. Her son lived with her.

Alice and William intended to adopt Roy, which is a weird situation if you ask me. As for why Alice supposedly suggested that Anna change her last name to Parsons, I can't figure that one out. Unless after the adoption, they were all going to live together as one big happy family??

About the bloody axe - you're right, it was determined to be non-human blood.

So Anna would give up her legal right as mother of Roy to Alice, but continue to live with them as friend/business partner?

There was an article in the SF Chronicle in Dec 1937 about William's intent to shortly adopt Roy in SF.