NY - Search for escaped convicted killers, David Sweat & Richard Matt, Dannemora #6

[GGE]

They might be following the railway and power line, here is what they look like, were built a long time ago, 1930's.

The one that goes down through Old Forge is still used as a historic railroad passenger train, I've ridden it several times. So that particular line at least wouldn't be abandoned tracks (just FWIW) and there are quite a number of lakes all over and every railroad goes over quite a number of bridges IMO which would be tricky business. This is a place where rocks are boulders, hills are mountains, and criminals are cop-killers... everything is exaggerated thanks to mother nature and being left wild.. I think they're going ot be foudn still within a certain radius of the prison JMO. Not traveling but in a cabin hiding out like a scared dog in a thunderstorm wedged under your bed. (ETA well hopefully not under YOUR bed, I claim the coffee defense! As in, I need some!)

JMO. :coffee:

http://adirondackrr.com/thendara.html

"Our train adventures offer many different scenic excursions departing from Utica's Union Station, Thendara Station near Old Forge, Saranac Lake Union Depot and Lake Placid Station in the beautiful Olympic Village of Lake Placid, New York. There are also many "Special Trains" which include fabulous productions such as magic trains, clown trains, train robberies, and of course a magical trip with Santa Claus to the North Pole on The POLAR EXPRESS™ train. "

 

[GGE]

May be difficult to get new info on the case today, given the terrorist attack in France. All the news outlets are devoting their air time to that. Will take a big time break in the case to bring it back into the headlines -- at least today.

I will have TWCNews (local) on my television today and will post any updates. They're pretty good about doing a new story every day even if they do then replay it all day long on a loop (alternating with sports, weather, and The Capital / politics segments plus other local news) if there's nothing else new. That's only because today is Friday though, once about 7pm tonight comes I won't have anything new on this front either until about 7am Monday probably. They usually take a page from HLN and other places that just run television programs on the weekend as if news doesn't still happen. bah.

 

[GGE]

That one doesn't even have a hat.
Idk.. I just feel like if he drew the hat a particular way on the sticky note then he's going to draw the hat pretty much the same on everything else. JMO

Oh yeah the etching is definitely not connected IMO, nor is the graffiti in Binghamton IMO, based on the DNA up in the cabin etc.

all JMO.

He left off the hat and the buck teeth both.

Which one is the big Family Guy fan? I mean, it's an exact copy of the note in that one episode, and everyone is still reading into it like they were making a racist statement, but it was only just Family Guy who was making any "statement" at all JMO and anyway they were just copying the look of that cartoon I grew up with and so many others surely did here, I think it was a Loony Toons one? With the bucktoothed asian bumblebee? But like all old cartoons that one was also banned. Just like the entire Speedy Gonzolas show. Too racist to show in the USofA. They removed the confederate flag episodes of Bugs Bunny too in case children were unduly influenced by that stuff. My husbad said the other day "well the kids can still look up at the flags flying in the SC capital and see them there, so why bother banning bugs bunny?" I said "good argument for removing the flag" and he said "what? I just want to be able to watch Bugs Bunny again." LOL

 

[GGE]

As to note this area is where I reside. The railroad has been closed for many years but is used for trails for atv, snowmobiles etc. My father in law is the President of The Wilder Farm. Last year they had just added on and had a school house built on the property. Back to the searching part for these 2 inmates, there are 3 prisons in our area also. One which is maximum. I was never afraid to live in the area with these prisons but however after this I have to say I am. I will try to post some pics if I am allowed too. The Police presence is unbelievable

Allowed and encouraged, just no pics of children/innocent people allowed but otherwise should be good AFAIK. I usually have tried to blur out license plates and addresses in the past where applicable but I generally don't share photos here so.. yeah.

Is it silly that I'm a little excited at your connection to the Wilder farm? My dad died when I was 4 but I grew up with Little House and came to look to Pa for sound advice (who didn't?), and I've always felt a kinship to the show and the family (I was one of those kids who actually read the books as well and then bought them in "easy reader" form for her own kids, then the regular versions when they got older, LOL).

Anyway photos would be amazing JMO.

 

[monkey222]

Quickly, can someone here tell me how it came to be that tools were put in grounf beef..then frozen..then was the frozen pile given to convicts? I am missing some parts on story. Did this woman buy tools..open the fridge in prison..breakroom? and then how did this lump get to convicts? They cook?!! Or did she bring a pre loaded tool loaf log from Aldis like Lucy smuggled the cheese from Paris on plane? Did she bring the meat to cook herself and..voila..banged out a few tools for them..picnic? Any details would be appreciated Thx.

 

[GGE]

They might be following the railway and power line, here is what they look like, were built a long time ago, 1930's.

Wait a minute. http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=77117&d=1435298698

That one there.. there's a certain line off to the right where you can find Owl's Head and follow the line up to Malone and then up to.. Constable. Where Israel Keyes' cottage is located, who buried caches of supplies all over state land and who told LE after capture the rough location/number of them and whose caches are known to have NOT all been recovered as of the time he killed himself in prison.

I've brought that up since literally the day they went missing.

I didn't realize one of the railroad beds tied together the towns of Owl's Head, Malone, and Constable all in one straight shot just prior to ending at the Canadian border until now.

 

[Abigail]

The one that goes down through Old Forge is still used as a historic railroad passenger train, I've ridden it several times. So that particular line at least wouldn't be abandoned tracks (just FWIW) and there are quite a number of lakes all over and every railroad goes over quite a number of bridges IMO which would be tricky business. This is a place where rocks are boulders, hills are mountains, and criminals are cop-killers... everything is exaggerated thanks to mother nature and being left wild.. I think they're going ot be foudn still within a certain radius of the prison JMO. Not traveling but in a cabin hiding out like a scared dog in a thunderstorm wedged under your bed. (ETA well hopefully not under YOUR bed, I claim the coffee defense! As in, I need some!)

JMO. :coffee:

http://adirondackrr.com/thendara.html

"Our train adventures offer many different scenic excursions departing from Utica's Union Station, Thendara Station near Old Forge, Saranac Lake Union Depot and Lake Placid Station in the beautiful Olympic Village of Lake Placid, New York. There are also many "Special Trains" which include fabulous productions such as magic trains, clown trains, train robberies, and of course a magical trip with Santa Claus to the North Pole on The POLAR EXPRESS™ train. "

That Old Forge passenger line goes as far north as Lake Clear, which is about 30 miles from Owls Head. And, as you said, a passenger train, so hard to jump. It would be easier to hop the freight line in Plattsburgh. But...it seems they're sort of just wandering around in the area of the prison, as you mentioned. They must not know about the train line over by Lake Placid -- or maybe they were heading that way (remember that cluster of sightings in the first week?) and things got too hot, so they followed the power lines west, and into more of a wilderness area (there's hardly any roads in that area from the bottom of Lake Chazy going over to the east). You may be right about hiding out in a cabin, but I hope not. I hope they're hunkered down in the woods somewhere, cold and wet and hungry.

 

[GGE]

Quickly, can someone here tell me how it came to be that tools were put in grounf beef..then frozen..then was the frozen pile given to convicts? I am missing some parts on story. Did this woman buy tools..open the fridge in prison..breakroom? and then how did this lump get to convicts? They cook?!! Or did she bring a pre loaded tool loaf log from Aldis like Lucy smuggled the cheese from Paris on plane? Did she bring the meat to cook herself and..voila..banged out a few tools for them..picnic? Any details would be appreciated Thx.

She bought raw ground beef, took it home, embedded tools in it, put it into styrofoam and wrapped it in saran wrap and froze it, then slipped it into a green cloth sack and brought it into the prison with her and placed it into the freezer in the tailor shop, then asked Palmer to retrieve it and bring it to Matt/Sweat, which he did. Matt/Sweat being on the honor block each had mini fridges and hot plates in their cells and regularly cooked for themselves.

 

[GGE]

That train line also offers murder-mystery train rides. If this was a movie they'd work that in somehow.

 

[Abigail]

Wait a minute. http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=77117&d=1435298698

That one there.. there's a certain line off to the right where you can find Owl's Head and follow the line up to Malone and then up to.. Constable. Where Israel Keyes' cottage is located, who buried caches of supplies all over state land and who told LE after capture the rough location/number of them and whose caches are known to have NOT all been recovered as of the time he killed himself in prison.

I've brought that up since literally the day they went missing.

I didn't realize one of the railroad beds tied together the towns of Owl's Head, Malone, and Constable all in one straight shot just prior to ending at the Canadian border until now.

i think that's the line that the locals are saying doesn't run anymore -- but they could certainly follow the rail bed

 

[GGE]

Quickly, can someone here tell me how it came to be that tools were put in grounf beef..then frozen..then was the frozen pile given to convicts? I am missing some parts on story. Did this woman buy tools..open the fridge in prison..breakroom? and then how did this lump get to convicts? They cook?!! Or did she bring a pre loaded tool loaf log from Aldis like Lucy smuggled the cheese from Paris on plane? Did she bring the meat to cook herself and..voila..banged out a few tools for them..picnic? Any details would be appreciated Thx.

"He is also accused of giving the two convicted killers frozen hamburger meat that had tools hidden inside it by another prison employee, Joyce E. Mitchell, who developed personal relationships with the escapees and allegedly agreed to help them. Palmer told investigators he didn't know the meat contained the tools."

<snip>

"Palmer also told investigators that on May 30, Mitchell, who worked in the prison tailor shop with the former inmates, asked him to bring Matt a package of frozen hamburger. Police said Mitchell, arrested June 12 for allegedly aiding the escape, hid tools in the meat.

"The beef was packaged with a white piece of styrofoam and plastic saran wrap," Palmer's statement says. "The plastic wrap did not have a price sticker on it. Along with the beef were two tubes of paint and one small, green cloth item. ... I went to the freezer located in Tailor Shop #1 and retrieved the green, cloth bag. I then approached Richard Matt, who was locked in his cell and passed the hamburger meat to him, through the cell. The remaining items in the bag were also given to Matt.""

http://www.timesunion.com/news/article/Gene-Palmer-guard-arrested-in-connection-with-6348445.php

"Matt and Sweat were housed in the prison’s “honor block,” a special section for inmates who’d gone years without significant disciplinary action.

Being in the honor block gave inmates privileges such as going outside every day, having hot plates and refrigerators in their cells, and congregating for hours in a central gallery area each evening with fellow inmates, according to a longtime prison employee."

http://fox2now.com/2015/06/26/was-s...ison-where-killers-broke-out/#thumbnail-modal

 

[screecher]

As to note this area is where I reside. The railroad has been closed for many years but is used for trails for atv, snowmobiles etc. My father in law is the President of The Wilder Farm. Last year they had just added on and had a school house built on the property. Back to the searching part for these 2 inmates, there are 3 prisons in our area also. One which is maximum. I was never afraid to live in the area with these prisons but however after this I have to say I am. I will try to post some pics if I am allowed too. The Police presence is unbelievable

The inmates at Upstate (super max) are in their cells 24 hrs. They sleep, eat, shower and get their 1 hour outside, a few times a week (each cell has its own fenced 'balcony'). However, Bare Hill and Franklin (both medium) are no-where near as secure as Upstate. In fact, imo, both Bare Hill and Franklin are run more like the 'minimums' and 'camps' were, before Cuomo shut them down. Those two are pretty scary.

 

[Abigail]

She bought raw ground beef, took it home, embedded tools in it, put it into styrofoam and wrapped it in saran wrap and froze it, then slipped it into a green cloth sack and brought it into the prison with her and placed it into the freezer in the tailor shop, then asked Palmer to retrieve it and bring it to Matt/Sweat, which he did. Matt/Sweat being on the honor block each had mini fridges and hot plates in their cells and regularly cooked for themselves.

Probably of no consequence, but I find myself wondering why there is a freezer in the tailor shop?

 

[GGE]

Someone was asking yesterday where exactly the manhol was in relation to Palmer's house/ the subway - this image from FOX shows the location of the manhole.

source - http://fox2now.com/2015/06/26/was-s...ison-where-killers-broke-out/#thumbnail-modal
---

also from above link:

"Access to the catwalks was not unusual for prisoners, a former maintenance supervisor at Clinton told CNN.

The correctional facility used inmates to do plumbing and electric work that sometimes involved them entering the catwalk area, said the former supervisor, who worked at the prison for 35 years.

Inmates would fill in those positions, especially when the maintenance department was understaffed, he said.'

<snip>

"Correction officers were also understaffed at times, and they wouldn’t always be with the inmate plumbers and electricians as they would repair things, said the former supervisor, who left the facility six years ago.

He said inmates worked unplugging toilets, changing lights, fixing leaks and repairing wiring. Their work took them inside cells and to the catwalks behind the cell walls for major pipe repairs."

 

[Hatfield]

Quickly, can someone here tell me how it came to be that tools were put in grounf beef..then frozen..then was the frozen pile given to convicts? I am missing some parts on story. Did this woman buy tools..open the fridge in prison..breakroom? and then how did this lump get to convicts? They cook?!! Or did she bring a pre loaded tool loaf log from Aldis like Lucy smuggled the cheese from Paris on plane? Did she bring the meat to cook herself and..voila..banged out a few tools for them..picnic? Any details would be appreciated Thx.

Yes, all indications is that Tilly prepared the hamburger meat herself and put the tools inside the hamburger and then wrapped it up and put it in the freezer at the prison and then told Palmer to hand-deliver it to Matt directly in his cell.

It is just crazy and you will enjoy reading all the past craziness this thread has covered.

Its just amazing. CNN reporting on TV (no link) this morning that guard(s) may have been literally sleeping on their shifts too. Its hard to watch the prisoners when sleeping. LOL

It keeps getting worse by the day. Each day its something worse.

 

[Dreamwanderer]

Yeah, the manhole is several blocks away from the Subway/Palmer.

 

[Abigail]

Accdg to twitter, helicopter searches and ATV on the old railroad bed in recent hours -- I guess that's the one that goes through Owl's Head.

 

[monster12]

Glad you joined - this is fascinating!

Thanks. Thank goodness for all my movie and TV watching. I also found the fact that Mitchell suddenly got "cold feet" and didn't show up to be the escape driver quite odd. She didn't seem to get cold feet or have fear of being caught while helping them on the inside. I feel that was a set up on her part but maybe she was truly afraid of being seen on the outside with them or where she would end up if caught. Where was she going to take them exactly?

I'm beginning to think they are probably in Canada by now if not another country. If they can escape a prison using tools I wouldn't find it hard to believe they made their way across the border.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[bestill]

Good morning. Still think that the bloody sock and other items in the cabin were a diversion. I remember saying that on Sunday or Monday that I thought it was a distraction from the other search on the PA/NY border and how coincidental that it happened as the info was coming out about Palmer. What a roller coaster ride this search is.

 

[screecher]

i think that's the line that the locals are saying doesn't run anymore -- but they could certainly follow the rail bed

Correct. And the one from SL to LP and back again is, for lack of a better term, a 'tourist' train, a very small one at that. Runs for the few summer months.