OH OH - Brian Shaffer, 27, Columbus, 1 April 2006 - #2

[PrinceofPop]

According to this Mer Clint never tried his cell phone - that is just bizarre guys

what is the first thing two friends would doif they got separated in a bar??

They also sure did not wait around along --10 minutes is really short amount of time

She got that wrong. Check the comments. Police have the voicemail and the video watching Merridith make the call to Brian’s cell just outside the bar as they said

 

[Satch]

This is the most likely outcome. What we need to learn for sure are exactly where one got into the construction area and if there was a freight elevator down to the area. That is not confirmed and would go a long way. For what it is worth police say the dogs became more interested in the construction area but did not actually fully hit

Than why didn't or why can't LE go in there and do a more extensive search of the construction site? As others have said, it can take multiple attempts to search for evidence. How big is the construction site zone. Brian's disappearance seems to boil down to one of three theories:

1.) Death in a mugging or some other fight. in the bar or on the way home.
2.) A fight involving a dispute over money, girls, or drugs at Brian's apartment.
3.) An accident in the building or on the way home, likely induced by Brian's intoxicated state.

One thing on which most agree. LE did not take this case as seriously as they should have, ranging from the pursuing of leads, suspects, or evidence collecting. The fact of it being April Fools Day and a bunch of college kids, did not really bring about the kind of concern or empathy that it should have from LE that you would see in similar missing persons' cases.

Satch

 

[neesaki]

Has it ever been reported anywhere that the construction at the time involved pouring of concrete! I guess I had the impression that the actual foundation was already there. I could be wrong, just asking. TIA

 

[Deleted member 192280]

What about the gruesome possibility that he was put through the trash grinder in the back of the bar, which I quoted earlier?

Carissa A. Thrush8 months ago
I know a girl who worked at the Ugly Tuna Saloona (Regarding the Brian Schaeffer case), and she said all the workers over the years since his disappearance have the common belief that he was put through the trash grinder in the back of the bar, which is why he is never shown leaving that bar on the camera. I guess this bar is set up strangely, and the trash grinder is not only huge, but is in its own special area of the bar, by itself, behind a door. I thought this was interesting

It's a comment at youtube "5 Unexplained Disappearances Caught On Camera & Spotted In Real Life!"

 

[PrinceofPop]

Than why didn't or why can't LE go in there and do a more extensive search of the construction site? As others have said, it can take multiple attempts to search for evidence. How big is the construction site zone. Brian's disappearance seems to boil down to one of three theories:

1.) Death in a mugging or some other fight. in the bar or on the way home.
2.) A fight involving a dispute over money, girls, or drugs at Brian's apartment.
3.) An accident in the building or on the way home, likely induced by Brian's intoxicated state.

One thing on which most agree. LE did not take this case as seriously as they should have, ranging from the pursuing of leads, suspects, or evidence collecting. The fact of it being April Fools Day and a bunch of college kids, did not really bring about the kind of concern or empathy that it should have from LE that you would see in similar missing persons' cases.

Satch

I do not think he is still in there. In fact, I have no theory because given the public evidence I see no way to even have one. If he was in the construction area he either got out of it (possible but unlikely) and got into a car right there where there are no cameras. He fell or was disposed of in that area and then removed in the next 2 days before Brian's dad and the police started looking.

At this point, we cannot get him out of the bar and there is no reason to speculate further until we can. Anything about a bar fight (why did no one else see in a crowded bar?) or especially about him walking home should not even be considered as options until there is any evidence he left the bar. It muddies the waters.

 

[PrinceofPop]

What about the gruesome possibility that he was put through the trash grinder in the back of the bar, which I quoted earlier?



It's a comment at youtube "5 Unexplained Disappearances Caught On Camera & Spotted In Real Life!"

Just sounds like a college town urban myth. We can speculate all we want but there is no evidence for it. Cadaver dogs a couple days later should have picked that up. No answer as to why that would happen either.

 

[neesaki]

Just re-reading this article printed just last year on the anniversary of Brian's disappearance, interesting comments and analysis by detective Hurst.

[FONT=&amp]Hurst is quite aware of the many theories and opinions the public has offered in what is still an open investigation. But he believes in following only the facts when trying to prove or disprove theories in the case.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]He answers the questions he has received most over the years based on what the investigation has produced:[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Is Brian alive?“There is a possibility he is alive, but if you look at the probabilities that he isn’t alive, those are just as great.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Was he murdered? “There is nothing we have been able to recover that shows he succumbed to foul play, so again, the probability of that isn’t as great as he just walked away.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Did he take his own life? “Most people who commit suicide want to be found; I would say that is probably in the lower category.”[/FONT]

 

[neesaki]

From the same article, Derek:

“I didn’t know Clint very well, but I always thought something was off with him,” says Derek. “The way he talked about my brother after he went missing — kind of in a negative way. I wouldn’t expect that from someone whose friend vanished.

And Lori Davis:

Somebody, somewhere, she says, knows what happened: “I feel that one or more of the people out with Brian on the night of his disappearance hold the answers. I pray every single night that the guilt will become overbearing.

 

[neesaki]

Well, the immunity is not the only thing that makes Clint fishy. He spent 6 hours in Brian's home after Brian disappeared (before being reported missing). How would you explain that?

It also sounds like detective Hurst considered him a possible POI but didn't have enough evidence, at least according to this, which was back when Clint was at Vanderbilt in Tennessee. It's about the 8th post down. http://community.pearljam.com/discussion/6392/columbus-area-pearl-jam-fan-gone-missing/p28

Dear Detective Mark Hallman: I am a board certified investigator from Columbus, Ohio attempting to locate missing Ohio State University Medical Student Brian Shaffer. Please review the attached documents concerning missing Ohio State University Medical Student Brian Shaffer. Brian Shaffer was last seen on the OSU campus on April 1, 2006 (see attached case summary and missing flyer's) with his close friend William "Clint" Florence who is now a Research Fellow in the Vanderbilt University Department of Microbiology & Immunology as a Post Doctoral trainee. William "Clint" Florence has refused to take a polygraph for the Columbus, Ohio Police or the Ohio State University Police, has hired a criminal defense attorney, moved to Vanderbilt and has been less then cooperative with the police and this investigator. Florence behavior has been described as indifferent and unusual since the disappearance of Brian Shaffer. Florence may be considered a person of interest in this matter but there is currently a lack of evidence to identify him as a suspect. This case has received national media attention and Brian Shaffer's father Randy Shaffer was recently killed in a tragic accident where a tree fell on him in his back yard. Clint Florence photograph and personal data can be found on page 2 & 3 of the case file (document attached). I would appreciate you posting the attached flyer's around campus and at Microbiology Center, forwarding the attached data to your campus newspaper, and providing any information available. I can be reached at 614-565-7189 or contact Detective Sergeant John Hurst at the Columbus, Ohio Police Department 614-645-4670. Please contact me with any question.

 

[neesaki]

:bump: for Brian

 

[neesaki]

Here's a thought, remember that one of the few statements by Clint was that he claimed that (paraphrased) Brian might have ran his mouth too much? How about this scenario, Brian said something to Clint that set him off. Could explain Clints odd comment, as well as why he was in Brian's apartment all that time. I wonder if they were already at odds in the bar, which is why Brian left without saying anything to Clint, snuck out somehow. Even to the point of turning off his phone. He was avoiding Clint. Why? Also remember he told Alexis he was going to tell the guys about her that night. Geez, I seriously have a bad feeling about Clint. Something's not right with him, IMO.

 

[neesaki]

Now I'm wondering if LE checked out Clints car and apartment. Please tell me they did.

 

[Satch]

Here's a thought, remember that one of the few statements by Clint was that he claimed that (paraphrased) Brian might have ran his mouth too much? How about this scenario, Brian said something to Clint that set him off. Could explain Clints odd comment, as well as why he was in Brian's apartment all that time. I wonder if they were already at odds in the bar, which is why Brian left without saying anything to Clint, snuck out somehow. Even to the point of turning off his phone. He was avoiding Clint. Why? Also remember he told Alexis he was going to tell the guys about her that night. Geez, I seriously have a bad feeling about Clint. Something's not right with him, IMO.

I forgot about that statement from Clint, "Brian may have ran his mouth too much." Or words to that affect. It's like he is trying not to tell people something. That statement just adds more fuel to the fire, along with his apathetic attitude, cold demeanor, and refusing to participate in the search for Brian. He knows something.

Satch

 

[neesaki]

I forgot about that statement from Clint, "Brian may have ran his mouth too much." Or words to that affect. It's like he is trying not to tell people something. That statement just adds more fuel to the fire, along with his apathetic attitude, cold demeanor, and refusing to participate in the search for Brian. He knows something.

Satch

https://www.thelantern.com/2009/04/is-brian-shaffer-alive/#comments

As soon as the detective started getting involved, that’s when he pretty much had no contact with anybody,” Derek Shaffer said. “I’ve always thought he definitely knows something – just won’t come forward with it.

Shaffer’s girlfriend at the time, Alexis Waggoner, also thinks Florence knows something he doesn’t want to tell.

Alexis Waggoner’s father, Tom Waggoner, participated in the search for Shaffer in 2006. During that period he became acquainted with Florence.
“The gist of my perspective on Clint Florence is that I think that basically all roads to making any progress on the case on Brian Shaffer lead through Clint Florence,” Tom Waggoner said.

 

[Brainy]

Yes, you folks are right. To make a comment that your supposedly close friend "ran his mouth too much" when all the cops in town and the entire community is looking for him is odd, and that is an understatement. Naturally, you would expect one's friend in a similar situation advocating for search efforts, calling out for people to stay alert and hopeful and asking for their help. I mean, no one... no reasonable human being would come and just say that their friend ran his mouth too much when asked about the possibility of what happened to him. I am not sure how exactly Clint is involved, what happened between them or what motive could there have been for murder. Whatever there is to think about why he would want Brian gone was probably between him and Brian. LE has never said anything about Clint as a suspect or ever searching his belongings, his residence or his car. Like I mentioned before, I do not believe that he was considered a person of interest early on due to LE's preconceptions of what might have happened to Brian.
At least, they have not shared anything that would inform the public of any development regarding Clint as a possible suspect. The guy lawyered up pretty much right away. If they didn't have anything on him, the chances would be slim they could ever just "talk" to him about the matter. I think Clint realized that if he is pushed into a corner and asked further questions, the possibility of him coming off as odd and suspicious would increase exponentially. But then again, why distance yourself so overtly from Brian's disappearance? If would have just put on a caring face and convince the public what a good friend he is if he truly wanted to cast off the suspicion.
Yes, he knows something. He definitely does.


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[Brainy]

Things that worked against Brian...
1. He was an adult male
2. It was spring break
3. No evidence was found (at least that's known publically) that could indicate foul play, except that he never seen on camera leaving the bar
4. He was reported missing at least two full days after he was last seen.
5. Crappy police preconceptions that could have influenced which course to take in the investigation


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[CARIIS]

Things that worked against Brian...
1. He was an adult male
2. It was spring break
3. No evidence was found (at least that's known publically) that could indicate foul play, except that he never seen on camera leaving the bar
4. He was reported missing at least two full days after he was last seen.
5. Crappy police preconceptions that could have influenced which course to take in the investigation


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This was in the last two or three weeks . But I suddenly this thought that realistically the cops claiming that they matched up every single person with who went in and out defies capacities .

Maybe if it was a ground floor with large exit enter door maybe. But a bunch of buzzed kids crunched up - waiting to go down a tiny escalator , with super crappy CCTV quality I do not think it would be that hard to miss him going down the escalator.

Think how time intensive it would be to go through all night ins and outs --- that would be hours and hours and apparently it was cool enough out for people to have layered clothes on.

All it would really take is some tall person to step on the escalator right after him and he would be blocked .

After dancing people would shed shirts and come out with what was under when they went in - that is a heck of a lot of figuring out to do !!
jmo

 

[Brainy]

Brian isn't alive. Well, I don't know that for a fact... that's just what I sense intuitively.

It's so incredibly sad how he just vanished without a trace, just disappeared. How can this be? How do people who loved him and were close to him look back and fill the emptiness with a good memory when Brian was suddenly no more? This is a type of loss that has perpetually hanging pain about it, and I can't fathom how his loved ones grieved through this to go through their loss. It's been more than a decade with absolutely no new development. It's maddening and tragic.


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[neesaki]

Brian isn't alive. Well, I don't know that for a fact... that's just what I sense intuitively.

It's so incredibly sad how he just vanished without a trace, just disappeared. How can this be? How do people who loved him and were close to him look back and fill the emptiness with a good memory when Brian was suddenly no more? This is a type of loss that has perpetually hanging pain about it, and I can't fathom how his loved ones grieved through this to go through their loss. It's been more than a decade with absolutely no new development. It's maddening and tragic.


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I sadly doubt that he's alive either. So what can we do to facilitate? It seems we should be able to do something. But what? Is there any way we could ask LE if they might investigate Clint further? I hate letting go of my belief that he has something to do with Brian's disappearance. I believe he does have something to do with it. But what does that mean to LE? Probably nothing, I would guess. Yet, if they don't investigate him further, I don't believe they will ever solve this case. It has to be done. Is there any way to help move this forward ? We need some help from someone, someone with some connections. I believe that is the key.

 

[Brainy]

I sadly doubt that he's alive either. So what can we do to facilitate? It seems we should be able to do something. But what? Is there any way we could ask LE if they might investigate Clint further? I hate letting go of my belief that he has something to do with Brian's disappearance. I believe he does have something to do with it. But what does that mean to LE? Probably nothing, I would guess. Yet, if they don't investigate him further, I don't believe they will ever solve this case. It has to be done. Is there any way to help move this forward ? We need some help from someone, someone with some connections. I believe that is the key.

I don't really know if we can do anything. It's been a long time... Clint has lawyered up and chances of him ever saying anything about this are practically nonexistent. LE has nothing on him (or else I would assume they would question him through his lawyer?)

I encourage everyone to contact Columbus PD about this. I have personally contacted them a few and have never heard back. It doesn't matter though, it's good to keep trying. One of the questions that I asked them was, "What can the public do to help with Brian's case?", which I thought was highly appropriate. I sense that the LE has lost hope in this and does not see possibilities of closure. I am sure they have enough crimes and unsolved cases to solve and perhaps focus their efforts on more recent ones that are rather straightforward and promise closure.

I believe that LE lost precious time during the early hours of investigation by aimlessly looking for Brian. They did not have a focused effort in the investigation to question those who last saw Brian, including Clint. This gave time those involved, including potential witnesses, to distance themselves or perhaps never even come forward. Clint had time to think about it, get a lawyer and choose to never talk about it again.

In my earlier post, I mentioned how there were a few factors that caused slow response and affected how the search for Brian was conducted. Do you think that if Brian was a pretty young woman LE would be more given into getting closure? Probably. I think had it not been spring break but another instance of going out and never returning home might have prompted a different response. I am not saying that the search effort was not enough or faulty, you just get the sense that it was treated casually in the beginning until it was finally realized that Brian is not coming home, and this isn't a clever prank.

I would love to help any way that I can. I don't see how. It seems like a dead end with more dead ends to consider. I remain hopeful, however, that there may be a way to bring peace and closure.