OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #55

[Dudly]

I just thought of a unlikely but interesting possibility. What if CRsr got money from the Ws to expand their joint business and he bought that house instead. That would have caused some hard feelings. They didn’t get more business and they lost a chance to complain about living conditions to get custody.
Just my opinion on a possibility.

 

[IType]

Something about the days prior to and that night that I'm puzzled about. It's been stated by LE that there was an altercation between one or more Rhoden and one or more Wagner days or weeks before. It's been speculated the Rhodens knew there would be another encounter. Why were they caught off guard? My theory is the Rhodens did not expect a cowardice dead of night assassination. IMO

In all honesty, I don't recall anyone in law enforcement ever stating that there had been an altercation between any Rhoden family members and any Wagner family members. There were only rumors that went around about an altercation but nothing from LE was ever said about it to confirm it. Maybe that is why you were asked for a link. Said altercation was just confirmed by a mainstream media source less than two weeks ago when BW appeared in court.

And to answer your question about the Rhodens and HG being caught off guard--Of course they didn't expect to be assassinated in the middle of the night. Ordinary people don't get assassinated over the custody of a child. Ordinary people handle the matter on their own in a civilized manner; and if that doesn't work, they follow the proper legal course to have the matter resolved in court.

The Rhodens and HG, ordinary people, tried to take care of things on their own. As ordinary people, there is no doubt in my mind that their next step would have been to seek some form of legal advice about formalizing custody of SW with the court system. However, the extremely un-ordinary W4 decided they would just take all their lives instead of doing it legally in court. IMO, the W4 couldn't stand being told they couldn't have what they wanted and the monsters also knew that there was no way they would be able to win custody of SW from HR because the Rhodens and HG held the almighty trump card--the ace of spades--JW was guilty as sin of statutory rape because HG was only 15 and JW was legally an adult when SW was conceived.

My answer to your question is all my honest opinion.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

In all honesty, I don't recall anyone in law enforcement ever stating that there had been an altercation between any Rhoden family members and any Wagner family members. There were only rumors that went around about an altercation but nothing from LE was ever said about it to confirm it. Maybe that is why you were asked for a link. Said altercation was just confirmed by a mainstream media source less than two weeks ago when BW appeared in court.

And to answer your question about the Rhodens and HG being caught off guard--Of course they didn't expect to be assassinated in the middle of the night. Ordinary people don't get assassinated over the custody of a child. Ordinary people handle the matter on their own in a civilized manner; and if that doesn't work, they follow the proper legal course to have the matter resolved in court.

The Rhodens and HG, ordinary people, tried to take care of things on their own. As ordinary people, there is no doubt in my mind that their next step would have been to seek some form of legal advice about formalizing custody of SW with the court system. However, the extremely un-ordinary W4 decided they would just take all their lives instead of doing it legally in court. IMO, the W4 couldn't stand being told they couldn't have what they wanted and the monsters also knew that there was no way they would be able to win custody of SW from HR because the Rhodens and HG held the almighty trump card--the ace of spades--JW was guilty as sin of statutory rape because HG was only 15 and JW was legally an adult when SW was conceived.

My answer to your question is all my honest opinion.

imo the r's were far from your average person who lives in a big city. they were not ones who ran to LE often. I know I will catch some flack for this but the r's were somewhat aggressive. I am not victim bashing as there is ample proof of this. remember the guy who's dentures were broken? the statement chris jr had on his FB or shirt or something "I won't back up and I won't back down, I was taught to stand my ground" they fought their own battles without bringing in LE with good reason. they were growing mj and selling it. billy might look and act like a big bad boy but I have the feeling he was anything but and he found that out when he went toe to toe with chris.

I think of the r's as a family who would fight at the drop of a hat and they would drop the hat themselves. they don't have a large trust of LE so they tend not to call them in.

​

nothing wrong with that, a lot could be contributed to the area they lived in, Appalachians are known for handling their own problems themselves. a lot like us pistol packing Okies.

jmo

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

We are at Thread #55. That's approximately 55,000+ posts. Not all members can remember every single detail of every single post. When someone politely asks for a link, please just politely provide a link. Quite simple.

Discussing other members, whether individually or collectively, or dissing WS is not allowed. Members are entitled to Report a post that is in violation of TOS. Doing so does not make them some kind of outcast and we welcome such Reports because that is what keeps Websleuths civil and responsible. It has worked well for WS for many, many years and members agree to operate within those guidelines when they join.

As for Reports, we review each report and, using our experience, judgment and discretion, we act accordingly. Posts don't get removed just because one member does not agree with another. Do not accuse others of tattling or being a snitch or you will find yourself on the outside looking in. We welcome members letting us know when there is a problem. It helps keep the board respectful and credible.

Please get back to discussing the case itself without all the drama.

Thank you.

 

[Cool Cats]

@sillybilly Thankx for keeping this thread open..

Justice is taking too long and then the virus is making it take longer. Been 4 years and 2 1/2 months. Been extremely stressful with the Sheriff's arrest and then Canepa left the case but thank goodness came back again.

Now 2 of them want bond and Miss Geneva and her son Tony sit patiently at every hearing, only to have the hearing end quickly with the defense complaining they don't have all the evidence, even after 1 year and 8 months of motions and hearings and behind the scenes meetings!

To remember why we are here we can watch the court gallery behind the prosecution. We can be respectful to each other out of respect to the 3 families.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

@sillybilly Thankx for keeping this thread open..

Justice is taking too long and then the virus is making it take longer. Been 4 years and 2 1/2 months. Been extremely stressful with the Sheriff's arrest and then Canepa left the case but thank goodness came back again.

Now 2 of them want bond and Miss Geneva and her son Tony sit patiently at every hearing, only to have the hearing end quickly with the defense complaining they don't have all the evidence, even after 1 year and 8 months of motions and hearings and behind the scenes meetings!

To remember why we are here we can watch the court gallery behind the prosecution. We can be respectful to each other out of respect to the 3 families.

For me to still be here, all I have to do is think of the little ones with no parents, and my blood starts to boil all over again.

Justice can't come soon enough for each and every victim, and every loved one left behind to relive this horrific nightmare each and every day. Big hugs to all.

 

[Loudestbough]

imo the r's were far from your average person who lives in a big city. they were not ones who ran to LE often. I know I will catch some flack for this but the r's were somewhat aggressive. I am not victim bashing as there is ample proof of this. remember the guy who's dentures were broken? the statement chris jr had on his FB or shirt or something "I won't back up and I won't back down, I was taught to stand my ground" they fought their own battles without bringing in LE with good reason. they were growing mj and selling it. billy might look and act like a big bad boy but I have the feeling he was anything but and he found that out when he went toe to toe with chris.

I think of the r's as a family who would fight at the drop of a hat and they would drop the hat themselves. they don't have a large trust of LE so they tend not to call them in.

​

nothing wrong with that, a lot could be contributed to the area they lived in, Appalachians are known for handling their own problems themselves. a lot like us pistol packing Okies.

While I agree with everything you said, there are a few things that are required to go through authorities. Property and vehicle titles, child custody, contract enforcement... We aren't talking about something that CAN be handled the old fashioned way, because if you don't have the paperwork to back yourself up, the cops are just going to give the car/land/kid/whatever back to whoever can verify their claim to it. Nobody wants to go through courts, but some things there is no other way. Unless you just kill everyone, and we see how well that worked.
My opinion only of course.

 

[Berrybell]

one too many black eyes.

many commented how sad she looked during baby shower. a second long look at that pic convinced me she didn't look sad......she looked terrified.

jmo

I haven't seen the picture. That poor girl.

 

[Puzzles8]

I would think they would have known, not to bring their cell phones. IIRC, there were some 2-way radios in Discovery.

I'm also assuming they used the Excursion to get around. Is there any built in GPS system in that vehicle, maybe even On-Star? Satellite radio - Sirius XM capability?

Feel better

ETA - Interesting if the Excursion was model year 2001-2005, there is a site that advertises - Black Box Recovery
Ford — Black Box Recovery | Independent Crash-Data Laut web

Also remember, the silence and location of the W4's cell phones will also speak volumes.

 

[Dudly]

In all honesty, I don't recall anyone in law enforcement ever stating that there had been an altercation between any Rhoden family members and any Wagner family members. There were only rumors that went around about an altercation but nothing from LE was ever said about it to confirm it. Maybe that is why you were asked for a link. Said altercation was just confirmed by a mainstream media source less than two weeks ago when BW appeared in court.

And to answer your question about the Rhodens and HG being caught off guard--Of course they didn't expect to be assassinated in the middle of the night. Ordinary people don't get assassinated over the custody of a child. Ordinary people handle the matter on their own in a civilized manner; and if that doesn't work, they follow the proper legal course to have the matter resolved in court.

The Rhodens and HG, ordinary people, tried to take care of things on their own. As ordinary people, there is no doubt in my mind that their next step would have been to seek some form of legal advice about formalizing custody of SW with the court system. However, the extremely un-ordinary W4 decided they would just take all their lives instead of doing it legally in court. IMO, the W4 couldn't stand being told they couldn't have what they wanted and the monsters also knew that there was no way they would be able to win custody of SW from HR because the Rhodens and HG held the almighty trump card--the ace of spades--JW was guilty as sin of statutory rape because HG was only 15 and JW was legally an adult when SW was conceived.

My answer to your question is all my honest opinion.

You are right about the altercation between CRsr and GWIII. I didn’t think it was more than rumor until it was mentioned in that motion to deny bail. Even then there was no mention of LE knowing or involved. It said messages from victims to others mentioned it happening.
Makes you wonder what all they discovered in messages to and from both families...

 

[Dudly]

Also remember, the silence and location of the W4's cell phones will also speak volumes.

If there are cell towers near the murder scenes any cell phones near by would ping off them unless the battery was removed as I understand it. Records will tell if any W owned cell phones were near by that night and what time they were.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Also remember, the silence and location of the W4's cell phones will also speak volumes.

Yeppers. I don't know if anyone here is following the case out in Idaho (JJ Vallow and Tylee Ryan) missing and found deceased after 9 months, but cell phone pings was the key to discovering their bodies. The mothers brother had taken his cell phone to the location of burial, which shockingly "***sarcasm noted***" was the mother's 5th hubby's property.

HOPEFULLY okay to link:

Found Deceased - ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #47

 

[Dudly]

For me to still be here, all I have to do is think of the little ones with no parents, and my blood starts to boil all over again.

Justice can't come soon enough for each and every victim, and every loved one left behind to relive this horrific nightmare each and every day. Big hugs to all.

I had hoped the Ws were not involved for a long time because I couldn’t believe they would do what they did to those little kids. Hopefully the older one will not have memories of it. They will eventually learn about it. That is bad enough.

 

[Puzzles8]

@sillybilly Thankx for keeping this thread open..

Justice is taking too long and then the virus is making it take longer. Been 4 years and 2 1/2 months. Been extremely stressful with the Sheriff's arrest and then Canepa left the case but thank goodness came back again.

Now 2 of them want bond and Miss Geneva and her son Tony sit patiently at every hearing, only to have the hearing end quickly with the defense complaining they don't have all the evidence, even after 1 year and 8 months of motions and hearings and behind the scenes meetings!

To remember why we are here we can watch the court gallery behind the prosecution. We can be respectful to each other out of respect to the 3 families.

You put that beautifully.

IMO, their justice won't be fully seen on this earth...

Oh Lord................

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Jake had two I Phones! Here is the proof, remember rumor was he lost one right before his first interview?

 

[Betty P]

For those needing a link to the recent news story verifying that Billy Wagner and Christ Rhoden, Sr. were involved in a fight in the weeks before the murders, please refer to this link:

AG withdraws from Rhoden case, new details about Wagner-Rhoden relationship revealed

The information about the physical altercation was mentioned in Billy's last pre-trial hearing by prosecutor Angela Canepa.

I'll continue to post this link every few pages and encourage others to do the same.

I'll also add this link and info to the timeline and will post it at the beginning of the next thread for future reference.

Here it is again, just in case anyone missed it:


AG withdraws from Rhoden case, new details about Wagner-Rhoden relationship revealed

Members here also usually post the links to YouTube videos of the pre-trial hearings of the accused, as well as the dates and times of same. If you're dropping in occasionally, check those videos to refresh your memory of what's going on with the case.

ETA: Also, feel free to refresh you memory about case facts by visiting the timeline that's posted at or near the beginning of each thread. You'll find a link there to a May 2017 article that mentions Leonard Manley told the news media of a major disagreement between the Wagners and Rhodens in the weeks before the murders when the Wagners tried to get HMR to sign custody papers.

Billy Wagner to answer to charges for Rhoden, Gilley murders in Pike County

I'd like to oblige you with more helpful links, but my computer mouse's right click button is getting worn out and isn't working. I've ordered a new one.

TIA

 

[Betty P]

While I agree with everything you said, there are a few things that are required to go through authorities. Property and vehicle titles, child custody, contract enforcement... We aren't talking about something that CAN be handled the old fashioned way, because if you don't have the paperwork to back yourself up, the cops are just going to give the car/land/kid/whatever back to whoever can verify their claim to it. Nobody wants to go through courts, but some things there is no other way. Unless you just kill everyone, and we see how well that worked.
My opinion only of course.

Pretty sure the physical altercation was related to the Wagners becoming angry and violent when they went to HMR's home to compel her to sign custody papers. See links in my previous post. My speculation is that the Wagners started that fight and CR1 was protecting his daughter. JMO. Had he called an attorney, it probably would have taken them a while to get there.

It goes without saying the Rhodens were up against the wealthiest and most powerful family in the county. They weren't rich people by any means, they worked for a living, Dana had been working a double shift at a nursing home the night she was murdered. Paying money for an attorney was something that had to be carefully considered. Unfortunately, the Wagners never gave them a chance to do that. JMO

 

[NotHammerToed]

Safe to assume Dana was referring the the Wagners as the evil ones she needed protection from.

 

[IType]

Pretty sure the physical altercation was related to the Wagners becoming angry and violent when they went to HMR's home to compel her to sign custody papers. See links in my previous post. My speculation is that the Wagners started that fight and CR1 was protecting his daughter. JMO. Had he called an attorney, it probably would have taken them a while to get there.

It goes without saying the Rhodens were up against the wealthiest and most powerful family in the county. They weren't rich people by any means, they worked for a living, Dana had been working a double shift at a nursing home the night she was murdered. Paying money for an attorney was something that had to be carefully considered. Unfortunately, the Wagners never gave them a chance to do that. JMO

Another possibility could have been free or income based legal assistance but again, HR and her family were never given the chance.

Another possible reason JW didn't want custody established in court is if joint custody was not approved by the judge, he would have had to pay child support. iMO

 

[countrygirl12]

I just want to thank everyone for continuously posting about this case and getting to hear your opinions. I rarely get time to post anything but I check daily for your updates and new info to research. Can't wait for the victims and their families to get justice!