PA PA - District Attorney Ray Gricar Mysteriously Disappeared - Bellefonte 15 April 2005 #18

[Betty P]

From this, there was one latent fingerprint that was unidentified and was registered with the Unsolved Latent Print data base.

wonder if it has ever shown up?

I think it ended up being Patty's, but will keep searching.

 

[Betty P]

It would be interesting to know who first mentioned his laptop computer, that he had it on the trip. Who first insisted on finding it? Was there a big focus on finding the laptop in the early days?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

It would be interesting to know who first mentioned his laptop computer, that he had it on the trip. Who first insisted on finding it? Was there a big focus on finding the laptop in the early days?

On the evening of 4/17, LE went to the house to collect the desktop. They ask if he had any other computers. PEF said that he had a laptop, went to get it, and discovered it was gone. It is on the timeline.

 

[Betty P]

On the evening of 4/17, LE went to the house to collect the desktop. They ask if he had any other computers. PEF said that he had a laptop, went to get it, and discovered it was gone. It is on the timeline.

Thanks! After reading this and the informant's story, the focus on the laptop seems curious

The hunt for Ray Gricar: 15 years of clues, theories and the search for answers

Could an informant hold the key to solving the mystery of the missing Centre County district attorney?

www.pennlive.com

If he was killed by the drug gang affiliated guys, was the laptop really important to them or their "clients"?

It might explain why the AG was reluctant to pursue an investigation into Ray's disappearance. He probably thought he was next.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

It was good they found the car right away and local LE made the connection. It's the kind of effort and cooperation you'd expect when a DA goes missing.

But, JMO, the wheels fell off when they jumped to the conclusion that he took off with a woman. IDK, really dumb. He was a DA, a professional with a good reputation. According to his peers and co-workers, he took his job very seriously. It seems unlikely he would go shack up with a woman, not come home and not bother to call and tell anyone where he was. Missed opportunities.

I also find it odd they didn't keep much evidence. Fingerprints, dog search info, and, of course, the laptop and hard drive they obsessed about. Did they ever release copies of his cell phone records, or records of any other phone he might have been using?

The car probably would have been found in several days.

I think it was logical to initially suspect that RFG was with another woman, since two witnesses reported seeing him with a woman. They also knew that he had taken off while married to EG, without telling he, or anyone where.

After the first several days, suicide came to the forefront.

RK has the cell records on her site. They may have been posted before.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Thanks! After reading this and the informant's story, the focus on the laptop seems curious

The hunt for Ray Gricar: 15 years of clues, theories and the search for answers

Could an informant hold the key to solving the mystery of the missing Centre County district attorney?

www.pennlive.com

If he was killed by the drug gang affiliated guys, was the laptop really important to them or their "clients"?

It might explain why the AG was reluctant to pursue an investigation into Ray's disappearance. He probably thought he was next.

How would anybody, other than RFG, know what was on the laptop?

How would anybody, other than RFG, know if there were copies of whatever was on the laptop. Even in 2005, you had backup computers (which RFG did), floppy disks, CD, flash drives, and separate drives, not to mention paper copies.

 

[Black Diamond]

why play hooky two days early? Why be so casually out in public - hours after he was reported as a missing person?

Very good questions. I personally don’t buy in to the 4/16 sightings and think they are either not credible or an intentional misdirection, aka red herring. The only scenario they fit with is walkway, and just as you pointed out, they don’t really fit with that either.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Very good questions. I personally don’t buy in to the 4/16 sightings and think they are either not credible or an intentional misdirection, aka red herring. The only scenario they fit with is walkway, and just as you pointed out, they don’t really fit with that either.

Well, we do have multiple witnesses, two of which are independent. Bennett is the owner of the SoS and a respected business owner; he is well educated.

For me, I would like more independent witnesses and something that would tie RFG to the Mini on Saturday morning.

It fits with voluntary departure and some foul play scenarios. He could have spent the night with a lover (who was involved with his death).

 

[CuriousCricket]

Well, we do have multiple witnesses, two of which are independent. Bennett is the owner of the SoS and a respected business owner; he is well educated.

For me, I would like more independent witnesses and something that would tie RFG to the Mini on Saturday morning.

It fits with voluntary departure and some foul play scenarios. He could have spent the night with a lover (who was involved with his death).

Since you've indicated he may have had money stashed away, the foul play would work if he was accessing the funds from Lewisburg. Or even I suppose if he and said lover got to Vermont and slid across the border. Which might account for a body never being discovered.

The only thing I've come up with yet that makes the Saturday sightings remotely explainable is documentation for a new ID. In his business, over the decades he had learned about people who provided new identification paperwork. He had made it a point to know who could be trusted and who not. That was not something he could do easily in a new location without his DA clout.

Because he already had the unusual bank account, I've thought he had everything in order. However, having the cushion of an extra persona to step into, or to wire money to . . . . I don't know enough how things work anymore to be sure what he needed. But he was waiting on something and I'm going to think that pushing his departure ahead several months created the necessity of waiting. OR he decided suddenly he wanted paperwork for someone completely new. He stepped from his real self, into ID #1. Then when all the money was arranged and he was ready to settle in permanently, he had another one ready. He'd be much harder to trace.

His not going back home when he realized the wait would be necessary doesn't make sense. Unless, perhaps, he had given a "wink and a nod" to someone in authority -- which might also account for the desultory search for him afterward.

ETA It has just occurred to me that perhaps the wait was not for documentation for himself but for a second person who had abruptly decided to join him?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Since you've indicated he may have had money stashed away, the foul play would work if he was accessing the funds from Lewisburg. Or even I suppose if he and said lover got to Vermont and slid across the border. Which might account for a body never being discovered.

Snipping just to use as a reference.

I have better foul play scenario:

RFG could have been involved another woman. She could have been married, a defendant, witness, or a close relation to a defendant. Somehow, he became involved, leading to his distraction from mid March.

On 4/15, he was going to spend the weekend with her, outside of Lewisburg, possibly a vacation cottage/cabin type place, secluded. He will meet her for supper. Lewisburg is out of the J/A/SC media market, so it is unlikely he will run into anyone he would know.

RFG wanted, for a long time, to get the data off the laptop. He was going to drop it in Raystown Lake, but he ran into someone who knew him. He thought he would drop it in the Susquehanna. So, on 4/15/05, RFG gets to Lewisburg, around noon. He removes the drive, perhaps after using cleaning software on it, and tosses it. He can take care of getting rid of the laptop and is romantic encounter on the same day.

Later in the day, she shows up and before dinner, they take a stroll through the SoS, where at least two witnesses see them. They eat, go to the cottage, in her car, and spend the night. Using her car explains why there is no scent of RFG outside of lot. She is a smoker and leaned into the Mimi, getting the smoke into the Mini.

The next morning, they go out, possibly for lunch or for her to buy something. RFG checks the Mini and waits for her.
They go back to the cottage.

Sometime that night, one of two things happens:

A. They get into a heated argument and in a fit of rage, and possibly without intent, she kills RFG. (2nd degree murder or possibly voluntary manslaughter.)

B. RFG has a health crisis, he has a massive heart attack, or an accident, e.g. he slips in the shower and breaks his neck. (This includes a Nelson Rockefeller scenario.)

In either event, the woman, who could be married or with some shady ties, or both, may not want to explain why there is a dead DA in her cottage. It is remote, so she can hide the body, possibly burying it. That would be the crime of Abuse of Corpse.

This would be the most likely murder scenario, but there are some problems:

1. Mel Wiley would have to be a coincidence.
2. 20/20 Vision would have to be a coincidence.
3. The bank account would have to be a coincidence; so would putting the Mini Cooper in PEF's name.
4. Disposing of the laptop would have to be a coincidence; he just happened to do it on the weekend he died.
5. Calling PEF from the Brush Valley would have to be a coincidence; it led the searchers to initially look at Route 192.

I would add that the change in demeanor is a bit weak as well.

This is probably the strongest murder scenario there is, though RFG could have been murdered at some point after walking away.

 

[CuriousCricket]

Snipping just to use as a reference.

I have better foul play scenario:

RFG could have been involved another woman. She could have been married, a defendant, witness, or a close relation to a defendant. Somehow, he became involved, leading to his distraction from mid March.

On 4/15, he was going to spend the weekend with her, outside of Lewisburg, possibly a vacation cottage/cabin type place, secluded. He will meet her for supper. Lewisburg is out of the J/A/SC media market, so it is unlikely he will run into anyone he would know.

RFG wanted, for a long time, to get the data off the laptop. He was going to drop it in Raystown Lake, but he ran into someone who knew him. He thought he would drop it in the Susquehanna. So, on 4/15/05, RFG gets to Lewisburg, around noon. He removes the drive, perhaps after using cleaning software on it, and tosses it. He can take care of getting rid of the laptop and is romantic encounter on the same day.

Later in the day, she shows up and before dinner, they take a stroll through the SoS, where at least two witnesses see them. They eat, go to the cottage, in her car, and spend the night. Using her car explains why there is no scent of RFG outside of lot. She is a smoker and leaned into the Mimi, getting the smoke into the Mini.

The next morning, they go out, possibly for lunch or for her to buy something. RFG checks the Mini and waits for her.
They go back to the cottage.

Sometime that night, one of two things happens:

A. They get into a heated argument and in a fit of rage, and possibly without intent, she kills RFG. (2nd degree murder or possibly voluntary manslaughter.)

B. RFG has a health crisis, he has a massive heart attack, or an accident, e.g. he slips in the shower and breaks his neck. (This includes a Nelson Rockefeller scenario.)

In either event, the woman, who could be married or with some shady ties, or both, may not want to explain why there is a dead DA in her cottage. It is remote, so she can hide the body, possibly burying it. That would be the crime of Abuse of Corpse.

This would be the most likely murder scenario, but there are some problems:

1. Mel Wiley would have to be a coincidence.
2. 20/20 Vision would have to be a coincidence.
3. The bank account would have to be a coincidence; so would putting the Mini Cooper in PEF's name.
4. Disposing of the laptop would have to be a coincidence; he just happened to do it on the weekend he died.
5. Calling PEF from the Brush Valley would have to be a coincidence; it led the searchers to initially look at Route 192.

I would add that the change in demeanor is a bit weak as well.

This is probably the strongest murder scenario there is, though RFG could have been murdered at some point after walking away.

Thanks for the Nelson Rockefeller reference. I had to refresh my memory. Very, very interesting. And actually quite plausible - either or both. But leaves his money lying around unclaimed somewhere. The existence of the bank account doesn't bother me as a coincidence. It could still be him planning for after retirement. It was just unfortunate he died before retirement.

Please refresh my memory on:
1. Mel Wiley would have to be a coincidence.
2. 20/20 Vision would have to be a coincidence.

Yes, if that was what happened, he certainly had his mind on a lot of different "housecleaning" projects for a romantic weekend.

Oh, and I'm sure you've realized that on the phone call it appears he lied to PEF. From the timeline, he was not yet on 192 at the time he told her he was. Just a fib as he was headed that way.

 

[minazoe]

I like my scenario, they were breaking up and he was leaving her. He actually went home and was killed by PF in a fit of passion , someone returned the mini to Lewisburg and cleaned up the car. PF called her brother to tell him she killed Ray and the whole thing is a cover up.

added..I wonder if they ever did forensics on the house.
mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I like my scenario, they were breaking up and he was leaving her. He actually went home and was killed by PF in a fit of passion , someone returned the mini to Lewisburg and cleaned up the car. PF called her brother to tell him she killed Ray and the whole thing is a cover up.

mOO

The problem are:

1. PEF was at the gym and was calling his cell from the house phone after that. We know where she was.

2. Somebody would have to drive the Mini to Lewisburg and then get back to Bellefonte. There is no public transportation and there was no evidence of anyone else driving. You would need 2 drivers and a second car.

3. Then you would have to have some fourth person, at least, hide the body and possibly help clean up, because PEF is on the phone.

4. Then you have to have everyone doing this flawlessly, without planning, in less than six hours. It just does not work.

I looked at PEF first and came up with all these problems. I can come up with a scenario where #2 is not applicable, but everything else is.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Mel Wiley

Mel Wiley was the police chief of Hinckley Township, Ohio. Hinkley is in a different county from Cleveland, and while RFG was there, Wiley was with the Medina County Sheriff's Office, and ran their identification division. It is doubtful that the two ever met or worked together.

In 1982, Wiley became the police chief and around 7/28/85, he vanished without a trace. Police investigating determined that he simply was dissatisfied with his life and left. The story briefly received national attention and included a story in Time.

Here is the timeline:

July, 1979 RFG moves to Centre County, then wife Barbara gets a position at PSU.

December, 1980 RFG begins working at the Centre County District Attorney's Office (becomes a member of the PA Bar in mid-1981, maintains Ohio Bar membership.)

May, 1985 RFG wins the Republican nomination for DA. (Elected over Amos Goodall in November, sworn in in January, 1986.)

7/30/85 Wiley's car found near Lake Erie. In mid August, police determine he left voluntarily. News stories appear in mid-August.

4/28/88 JKA starts working at the DA's Office.

May, 1991 SPS starts working at the DA's Office. Laid off (budgetary) in October 1991, returns in early 1993.

4/15/05 RFG disappears.

September, October, 2006 J. J. in Phila asked about people in responsible positions who voluntarily leave. He cites two, Wiley and Jay Carsey, a college president who left voluntarily in 1982, and subject of the 1989 book, Exit the Rainmaker.

July 2007 JKA notes, in her "Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury," that she thought she heard people in the office referencing Mel Wiley.

1/9/08 CDT reporter asks SPS if RFG ever was interested Wiley; he says yes, but not recently.

Note that neither JKA nor SPS were in the office while the Wiley disappearance was in the news. It is definite that RFG talked about after May 1991, and probably after March 1993.

Wiley had absolutely no ties to Centre County.

In other words, RFG had an interest in the Wiley disappearance well after it was in the news. While Carsey was better known, the subject of a best selling book, RFG was interested in Wiley.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

20/20 Vision

In the late 1980's, novelist Pamela West (Kraske) was working at PSU. She was interested in writing a nonfiction book on the November 1969 Betsy Aardsma murder in Pattee Library (the "Murder in the Stacks"). She contacted RFG, who had jurisdiction. RFG could not give her too much information, but encouraged her to write it.

[The Aardsma murder remains officially unsolved. Some researchers have made the case it was Richard Haefner, then a grad student.]

West was worried about the possibility of being sued if she attempted to identify a killer. So, she wrote a science fiction/detective story titled 20/20 Vision. It is based on the geography of the Penn State Campus, and the surrounding area; the place names in particular are fictionalized. The action in the book takes place on the same day over three different years, 1995, 2020, and 2040. It is a time travel story.

That singular day is 4/15 of those years. That is, of course, the same date RFG disappeared. The lead character is a detective approaching retirement, and the antagonist fakes his own death.

Other than the date, I will note one additional parallel. The book includes a car trip to the east from the university town. The description of landscape closely matches the area just outside of Centre Hall from where the call was made. West actually based her description on the same mountain, but about 3-5 miles south (not that anyone could tell exactly from text).

Late 1980's West contacts RFG about writing about the Aardsma murder. She later decides to write a fictional story based on it.

August, 1990 20/20 Vision published.

August-December, 1990 RFG borrows a copy of 20/20 Vision from a PSP trooper. When RFG does not return it, trooper buys another copy.


April 15, 2005 Gricar disappears

c. 2007 West reads accounts of RFG's appearance on the Internet, and notices the date.

January-March, 2008 Story published about 20/20 Vision. West is unsure if RFG ever had a copy. Now retired PSP trooper relates that RFG had borrowed his copy. 20/20 Vision is not found in RFG's property.

 

[CuriousCricket]

The problem are:

1. PEF was at the gym and was calling his cell from the house phone after that. We know where she was.

2. Somebody would have to drive the Mini to Lewisburg and then get back to Bellefonte. There is no public transportation and there was no evidence of anyone else driving. You would need 2 drivers and a second car.

3. Then you would have to have some fourth person, at least, hide the body and possibly help clean up, because PEF is on the phone.

4. Then you have to have everyone doing this flawlessly, without planning, in less than six hours. It just does not work.

I looked at PEF first and came up with all these problems. I can come up with a scenario where #2 is not applicable, but everything else is.

Then, everyone involved has to keep their mouths shut.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Yes, if that was what happened, he certainly had his mind on a lot of different "housecleaning" projects for a romantic weekend.

Oh, and I'm sure you've realized that on the phone call it appears he lied to PEF. From the timeline, he was not yet on 192 at the time he told her he was. Just a fib as he was headed that way.

Snipped for brevity.

Well, killing two birds with one stone, as it were, if he tossed the laptop/drive before meeting the woman.

A couple of possibilities:

1. RFG said some like "I'm going to Lewisburg on 192," meaning he would be doing that and PEF took it to mean that is where he was.
2. PEF misheard or misremembered what RFG said.

3. RFG fibbed, because he didn't wait around to let the dog out.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Then, everyone involved has to keep their mouths shut.

Yes. On another site, we had a guy who kept on coming up with conspiracy theories. At one point I said, "We're up to 15. SELL."

 

[Black Diamond]

I like my scenario, they were breaking up and he was leaving her. He actually went home and was killed by PF in a fit of passion , someone returned the mini to Lewisburg and cleaned up the car. PF called her brother to tell him she killed Ray and the whole thing is a cover up.

added..I wonder if they ever did forensics on the house.
mOO

Most of the time someone goes missing, look at their lover.

 

[CuriousCricket]

20/20 Vision

In the late 1980's, novelist Pamela West (Kraske) was working at PSU. She was interested in writing a nonfiction book on the November 1969 Betsy Aardsma murder in Pattee Library (the "Murder in the Stacks"). She contacted RFG, who had jurisdiction. RFG could not give her too much information, but encouraged her to write it.

[The Aardsma murder remains officially unsolved. Some researchers have made the case it was Richard Haefner, then a grad student.]

West was worried about the possibility of being sued if she attempted to identify a killer. So, she wrote a science fiction/detective story titled 20/20 Vision. It is based on the geography of the Penn State Campus, and the surrounding area; the place names in particular are fictionalized. The action in the book takes place on the same day over three different years, 1995, 2020, and 2040. It is a time travel story.

That singular day is 4/15 of those years. That is, of course, the same date RFG disappeared. The lead character is a detective approaching retirement, and the antagonist fakes his own death.

Other than the date, I will note one additional parallel. The book includes a car trip to the east from the university town. The description of landscape closely matches the area just outside of Centre Hall from where the call was made. West actually based her description on the same mountain, but about 3-5 miles south (not that anyone could tell exactly from text).

Late 1980's West contacts RFG about writing about the Aardsma murder. She later decides to write a fictional story based on it.

August, 1990 20/20 Vision published.

August-December, 1990 RFG borrows a copy of 20/20 Vision from a PSP trooper. When RFG does not return it, trooper buys another copy.


April 15, 2005 Gricar disappears

c. 2007 West reads accounts of RFG's appearance on the Internet, and notices the date.

January-March, 2008 Story published about 20/20 Vision. West is unsure if RFG ever had a copy. Now retired PSP trooper relates that RFG had borrowed his copy. 20/20 Vision is not found in RFG's property.

Well, there sure were a lot of coincidences if RFG was NOT messing with people. Would that have fit his personality?
He disappeared on April 15, the day in the book 20/20 Vision and 20 years after another DA seems to have voluntarily walked away. He was interested in that case enough to talk about it long after the event.
I've gotta ask: In this country, how many District Attorneys disappear? It seems it would be an unusual event. Of course, the first could have inspired the second -- as often seems to happen with suicides.

Your scenario of a secret rendezvous, secluded cabin and heart attack is an extremely elegant solution. Doesn't it fall apart, though, with the next-day sightings? You've pointed out how credible the witnesses were.

It won't be too long before the 20th year of RFG's disappearance rolls around. Wouldn't it be fun if he came strolling back into public view or even if he had a message held to be sent on the 20th anniversary?

I've found a copy of West's 20/20 Vision. Think I'll order it and just see . . .