Read this - Post from another hiker- details about GMH a bit..

[panglossian]

Thanks for the warm welcome, panglossian and Native New Yorker! Having lurked - man, that sounds creepy - on these boards for so long, it's nice to have finally registered and to be able to share space with such wonderful sleuths.

I wish there were some way to force Hilton to tell them everything he's done and knows, especially the location of John Bryant's body because I can't imagine anything worse than losing a loved one and never being able to locate the body. Personally, I would need it for complete closure.

Animal lover or not, I wonder what happened to his previous dogs - if he had any, that is. It wouldn't help this case at all, but I do wonder if they simply died of old age or if he conveniently got rid of them until he found Dandy, the dog who was able to "get it right" (i.e., help him lure victims). I also wonder if the dog belongs to one of the many victims we still don't know about; I'm having a hard time seeing him put in the time to train the dog when he had so much to do.

I know we are all thinking the same thing-give him an injection of the truth serum like in the movies. Oh, well.

 

[Alex]

I saw an article, which I am pretty sure was a link on one of the posts on this forum, which had Hilton beating Dandy so savagely that a passer-by actually called 911 on his cell. As I recall, Hilton jumped in his van, enraged, and tried to run over the guy's wife. Dandy was described here or elsewhere, as having been so well "trained" by these beatings that he wouldn't even eat unless Hilton gave him a command to. Not only that, but when Hilton left the area for some reason, Dandy would stop eating. For what it's worth to evaluating Hilton's psychology, I'd have to say this sort of scene was enacted by him as a representation of how he himself was "disciplined" in childhood... if he had one.

 

[Truly]

Alex, I remember that story, too; it was either in the ajc or on wsb. The incident happened at Murphey-Candler. Sorry, I don't have the link either. Also, his 20 solicitation counts involved illegally handing out posters for Insulated Wall Systems with a photo of his dog on the flyer. I wonder who his family are? I recall reading that they had not seen him in years and did not want to have anything to do with him. Wish they'd warned the rest of us.

 

[Alex]

Truly, ---Me, I wish law enforcement had made arrangements to warn the hikers. Did any one hear anything about this Winton fellow, owner of the store, passing along the hikers' complaints to LE? To me, creeps are more important than bears and rattlesnakes to warn folks of. A notice on the trailhead bulletin board could have said, "There have been complaints about ragged homeless folks harrassing hikers in the area. Remember that law enforcement is miles away and that there is no cell phone signal on the mountain."

Just kidding. But seriously, I'm not too happy about the way this creep was handled by all concerned. I know that LE can roll you up for even raising your voice when talking to them--"Ah! 'disorderly conduct'! You're under arrest! Come with me!" I've seen that with my own two eyes. To think Hilton was up there harrassing hikers for nine months and they couldn't think of a WAY to rack him up?! More likely they couldn't find the WILL to do the paperwork!

eachandevery, It would be out of order for me to welcome you, since I just got here myself! But, the more the merrier! Hi!...You said something I want to second wholeheartedly. This tragedy of Meredith has burned through me like a forest fire! Not the least because it happened in my own backyard, so to speak. I hope none of us get too far down the flurried scraps of the days-to-come that we ever for a minute forget what that poor young woman went through! This is just the worst thing I have had to hear of in decades! The unfairness is galling, suffocating! I, for one, intend never to rest till I ferret out every aspect of it!

PS: Talking to Hilton wouldn't have been as congenial as one might think! Witnesses say he stank like a landfill.

 

[Tallytowngirl]

Alex, I remember that story, too; it was either in the ajc or on wsb. The incident happened at Murphey-Candler. Sorry, I don't have the link either. .

Police reports link Hilton to violence (Tallahassee Democrat)
recounts the incident of Hilton beating a dog in a park, and then trying to run over the wife of the guy who reported him. It also says the guy pressed charges about the dog, but not about the wife. (why not both? I don't know...)

 

[Pure Maple Syrup]

Truly, ---Me, I wish law enforcement had made arrangements to warn the hikers. Did any one hear anything about this Winton fellow, owner of the store, passing along the hikers' complaints to LE? To me, creeps are more important than bears and rattlesnakes to warn folks of. A notice on the trailhead bulletin board could have said, "There have been complaints about ragged homeless folks harrassing hikers in the area. Remember that law enforcement is miles away and that there is no cell phone signal on the mountain."

For anyone who isn't familiar with who Winton is, he is the owner of Walasi-yi (aka Mountain Crossings) the outfitter store there at Neel's Gap. It's only about 1/4 mile from where Meredith parked.

Winton is an extremely well-respected part of the AT community, he is legend in the tremendous help he gives thru-hikers. His shop is the very first "stop" for thru-hikers and Winton spends hours with folks, helping them trim down the pack weight, shipping stuff home for them, etc. I have little doubt that if Hilton really were as worrisome as the media claims Winton said, Winton WAS giving hikers the head's up. Obviously, Meredith didn't stop at Walasi for anything prior to starting her hike (that would have been reported in the news), otherwise, who knows, maybe she would have heard a warning.

As far a sign, yeah I see you were kidding Alex, but really, no one had any authority to do anything like that and besides, Hilton would have just torn down any signs or notices.

Unfortunately, there are tons of weird people all over the AT, it's just a part of Trail life. Word spreads quickly up and down the trail, hikers stop and share info, it's literally a buzz of info and gossip when you are thru-hiking. If Meredith had been a thru hiker, she may indeed have heard of Hilton within a few hours of starting her hike from Springer. But sadly, as a dayhiker, she wasn't as in the loop of hiker chatter.

 

[Pure Maple Syrup]

A notice on the trailhead bulletin board could have said, "There have been complaints about ragged homeless folks harrassing hikers in the area.

Ah, one other point I'd like to make, is that most ragged homeless people don't have nice $5,000 Astrovans, wear hiker clothing and go dayhiking with their dogs. Even had Meredith been told this, she might not have associated Hilton with the warning, he was probably charming and acted just like all the other day hikers.

 

[panglossian]

Truly, ---Me, I wish law enforcement had made arrangements to warn the hikers. Did any one hear anything about this Winton fellow, owner of the store, passing along the hikers' complaints to LE? To me, creeps are more important than bears and rattlesnakes to warn folks of. A notice on the trailhead bulletin board could have said, "There have been complaints about ragged homeless folks harrassing hikers in the area. Remember that law enforcement is miles away and that there is no cell phone signal on the mountain."

Just kidding. But seriously, I'm not too happy about the way this creep was handled by all concerned. I know that LE can roll you up for even raising your voice when talking to them--"Ah! 'disorderly conduct'! You're under arrest! Come with me!" I've seen that with my own two eyes. To think Hilton was up there harrassing hikers for nine months and they couldn't think of a WAY to rack him up?! More likely they couldn't find the WILL to do the paperwork!

eachandevery, It would be out of order for me to welcome you, since I just got here myself! But, the more the merrier! Hi!...You said something I want to second wholeheartedly. This tragedy of Meredith has burned through me like a forest fire! Not the least because it happened in my own backyard, so to speak. I hope none of us get too far down the flurried scraps of the days-to-come that we ever for a minute forget what that poor young woman went through! This is just the worst thing I have had to hear of in decades! The unfairness is galling, suffocating! I, for one, intend never to rest till I ferret out every aspect of it!

PS: Talking to Hilton wouldn't have been as congenial as one might think! Witnesses say he stank like a landfill.

LOL about the bulletin board! ROFL about the landfill!!
Not many homeless drive a 2006 Astra van and walk a purebred dog, tho. Combine that with those teeth and his whole deal appeared conflicting and confusing.
It has been nearly a month now and I wonder if LE/Rangers are doing things any different now since Meredith's fatal encounter with that guy. Maybe it's just "Let the Hiker Beware" like "caveat emptor" . They may think they got the bad guy off the trail and that's that. I'd love to know if there is an increased LE trail presence.

 

[panglossian]

Ah, one other point I'd like to make, is that most ragged homeless people don't have nice $5,000 Astrovans, wear hiker clothing and go dayhiking with their dogs. Even had Meredith been told this, she might not have associated Hilton with the warning, he was probably charming and acted just like all the other day hikers.

Great minds think alike, Pure Maple Syrup! I didn't see your post- server busy notice for minutes.

 

[AlohaGal]

A quick note from work.
http://www.truthinjustice.org/Darrell-Rice.htm

Has any of these names popped up in relation to Hilton?
"Rice, 36, of Columbia, Md., is charged with two counts of capital murder in the deaths of Williams, 24, of Burlington, Vt., and Winans, 26, of Unity, Maine. The two women were killed in the Shenandoah National Park in 1996. Prosecutors claim Rice killed them - slitting their throats - because they were lesbians."

"CHARLOTTESVILLE - The FBI has changed its interpretation of critical evidence found where two Shenandoah National Park campers were killed, and all physical evidence in the case will be re-analyzed as a result."

"The FBI lab also inaccurately reported initially that the hair found on glove liners at the crime scene belonged to one of the victims. Further testing showed it did not belong to either victim or to Rice, according to the court papers."

"The killer subdued both women and sliced their throats without Winans’ dog—which wasn’t harmed—creating a commotion."

 

[Truly]

For anyone who isn't familiar with who Winton is, he is the owner of Walasi-yi (aka Mountain Crossings) the outfitter store there at Neel's Gap. It's only about 1/4 mile from where Meredith parked.

Winton is an extremely well-respected part of the AT community, he is legend in the tremendous help he gives thru-hikers.

As far a sign, yeah I see you were kidding Alex, but really, no one had any authority to do anything like that and besides, Hilton would have just torn down any signs or notices.

Unfortunately, there are tons of weird people all over the AT, it's just a part of Trail life. Word spreads quickly up and down the trail, hikers stop and share info, it's literally a buzz of info and gossip when you are thru-hiking. quote]



Agreed. Haha, and it is a curious dilemna on the Trail about who looks raggedy. Thru hikers typically hike for days before stopping to shower, so the legitimate hikers have scraggly beards and are notoriously stinky! Plus, many of them are technically 'homeless' in that they've let go of their apartments and put their belongings in storage in order to hike the whole Trail. Then, I guess there are the Trustafarians and Drainbows who just live in the National Forests. Some good, some bad, just like anywhere, I suppose. I still have faith that most people who are hiking are really good people. Got to focus on the light, not the darkness, as Meredith's mom said.

 

[Alex]

Debbie Gilbert of the Gainesville Times graciously answered my email about Pure Maple Syrup's catch on the date of Hilton's capture. She sends you her compliments and offers her apology for the erratum. The parenthetical material was hers, she says, and she feels that her informant was indeed referring to sighting Hilton on the Saturday before New Year's Day. Great going!

If gardenmom has any help she can offer on operating this vB code, I'll be glad to copy and paste Ms. Gilbert's whole email.

 

[Alex]

AlohaGal, I am intrigued by your info. I have thought about that Shenadoah case many times in all the years in between. There was also a case of fatal stabbings in Poplar Stomp on the Georgia AT which I think only slightly pre-dated them. The girls' dog running loose was so eerie then, and now, as you have reminded us.

 

[Alex]

I still don't buy the picture. Maybe I'm prejudiced, but the guy I saw in the orange jump suit wouldn't have been able to blow any smoke up my sleeve! I guess I'm just a downer, huh?

I still want to know whether Winton Porter consulted with LE about the hiker complaints and what LE said in response. Did any deputies visit Hilton at Gooch Gap? Did any of them NOT think to run the bad tag on his van there?

Winton's store is 0.5 miles from the entrance to Reece Loop. I measured it on Google Earth, and that figure matches what I had in my trail notes. That steep stretch of the busy US 129 would make for an uncomfortable roadside hike with a jumpy pup on a leash, but a witness puts her returning towards the store, with Hilton following some distance behind her with his baton in his hand. Which raises the question, where was her leash and his baton found? Was it between US 129 and her car or between her car and the AT access trail's terminus at the parking lot. It looked like to me, in the TV shot I saw, that her car was parked beyond the AT access trail about half the way out towards US 129.

I'm reluctant to go all Benson & Stabler Dispute with you all, but I confess I am just not so positive a person as you all seem to be. (Lord knows the world needs angels, so I'm not criticizing you, It's just me and my nature, sorry.) I just don't have the evidence yet to picture Meredith meeting HIlton's baton with a trusting smile on her face. I continue to wonder whether the end was not a panicky rush towards her car and then the unfathomably brutal assault.

The few Candler-Murphy park witnesses who allowed that he could sometimes be pleasant, nevertheless noted that he could change in an instant and turn ugly. Focusing on his sore spot about lack of discipline in dogs (documented), one scenario could have him losing his temper when Ella ran off with Dandy, perhaps abruptly cutting loose with a vicious outburst which might have been the last straw in Meredith's tolerance of him. After that, getting away to a public place could have been her first priority.

Of course, in the interest of complete objectivity, the news report from "a clerk at the store" could have been referring to an off-duty clerk who just happened to be hiking the trail him/herself that day and "toward the store" could have been a reporter's interpolated inference. Fact is, I need more facts, before I say case closed.

 

[Native New Yorker]

Alex, your description is pretty much the way I pictured the sad events transpiring...the slight difference is that I think he was able to keep her talking to him for awhile, while the dogs frolicked, then I think she realized she was in danger, and tried to get to her car, with him fast behind her....she may have even run ahead of Ella, just to get away....
truly, truly awful...

I become more wary of people the older I get...I do feel that most people are ok....but how to tell them apart from the dangerous ones, that is the problem....

 

[Truly]

Alex, does the "clerk at the store' story refer to the ex-cop who found the baton and leash between Meredith's car and the trail head, and then turned them in at Winton's, or is there a story I missed that Meredith tried to run to the store? However this creep tricked her, I'm positive that she saw through it and fought back. It took me until last Sunday to go out hiking again, something I usually do often. I am more alert, but there is such goodness out in the beautiful silence of the river and the mountains, I just can't let one creepy old man destroy that for me. Peace.

 

[concernedperson]

Alex, does the "clerk at the store' story refer to the ex-cop who found the baton and leash between Meredith's car and the trail head, and then turned them in at Winton's, or is there a story I missed that Meredith tried to run to the store? However this creep tricked her, I'm positive that she saw through it and fought back. It took me until last Sunday to go out hiking again, something I usually do often. I am more alert, but there is such goodness out in the beautiful silence of the river and the mountains, I just can't let one creepy old man destroy that for me. Peace.

I think that important but please be aware.Not all have good intentions and they always don't look creepy. Some have been good looking college students. Think Bundy. Even Ann Rule didn't recognize his behavior and she is pretty good. Some go under the guise of LE....think Drew Peterson. You need to trust your internal guide what will never fail you only if you fail to recognize it.

 

[Pure Maple Syrup]

Alex, thanks so much for following up with the reporter, glad she is fixing her mistakes. I do wish these people would be more careful with their reporting.

That steep stretch of the busy US 129 would make for an uncomfortable roadside hike with a jumpy pup on a leash, but a witness puts her returning towards the store, with Hilton following some distance behind her with his baton in his hand.

I'm not following this. I never heard anything about her hiking or being spotted on any roads. She parked at the Reece trailhead on Route 19 (not 129) about 1/4 mile NORTH of Walasi-yi and hiked into the woods from there up to Blood Mtn and back. Hilton got her ON THE TRAIL as she was headed back to her car. Her water bottles, dog leash, treats, mittens AND the baton were found on the trail, not the road.

I'm sorry if I've missed something, but where did this sudden info that she was hiking along a road come from?

 

[Pure Maple Syrup]

Alex, does the "clerk at the store' story refer to the ex-cop who found the baton and leash between Meredith's car and the trail head, and then turned them in at Winton's

Yes, I'm wondering about that too. Maybe his testimony is so critical to the case that he cannot/will not talk to the press, nor will we know who he is until the trial.

 

[Alex]

Truly, My description of the "clerk at the store" and his/her observation was not referencing the material about the ex-cop. It was from a separate story. I am almost certain it was in a TV story very close to the event, otherwise I would have saved a link. Most likely wsbtv.com...but their search engine has never been the best, and I have so far been unable to find it. Please try, if you have time. To the best of my recollection the ex-cop found, and at some point turned in, a water bottle and "a pair of men's (sic) sunglasses", both of which I remember seeing her roommate JK identify on camera as Meredith's. I assume maybe Meredith was wearing her boyfriend's sunglasses because she couldn't find her own? Was Meredith's dropping these things an indication that she was scared and hurrying? I heard that the ex-cop turned them in "at the store" which could suggest that the store was open New Year's Day, but I also heard that he returned the next day to help investigators by providing his observations. Doubtful he would have kept the items with him at his home overnight unless the store wasn't open when he got there New Years Day. WAS the store open? Did it close early because of the holiday? Did he turn the items into the store the next day when it opened, before he had discovered the investigators were on the scene, and only then stepping forward to greet them? No info.

Some stories said that two water bottles were found, both identified as Meredith's, but not clear where the second one was found. I know for sure that the baton and Ella's leash were found "in the parking area", but it was not specified exactly where.

Native New Yorker, I do see her running ahead of him at the last--possibly unleashing Ella so Ella could get away. I know I would love my dog that much.

To all, I found that book by Gavin de Becker(?), The Gift of Fear, very helpful with pointers about sensing when to flee. I will never be able to give up travel in the wilderness, either. It's just too beautiful to leave behind. But I must say that I suspect the movement into the forests by the homeless will turn out to be a trend. There have always been plenty of good reasons to hike with a buddy or two or three. A poncey bear up at Spaniard's Knob on the AT changed my opinion of solo hiking forever. After that, loving the wilds has always included loving a friend. "All things beautiful are as difficult as they are rare."