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Does ROA mean Report of Autopsy? Could you please explain to this dinosaur, lol? TIA
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You're right - I've been cropping to avoid posting an unnecessarily disturbing picture.
The one I've attached is more complete and I chose not to have it appear within the post but rather as an attachment only.
For those who do not wish to view an autopsy picture, please avoid.
The picture also shows the only area in which the ligature slipped upward, but the starting point was at the level of the thyroid cartilage - well above the cricoid. The slippage was upward toward the knot which was just below the right ear and is well described in the autopsy report.
The mystery mark on the left side is unrelated to the ligature which was formed into a noose.
The location of the ligature furrow on the front of the neck is illustrated below.
Thank you Cynic for this really helpful illustration and also posting the picture with a warning. I believe that all those here on this thread respect RZ and the picture goes to further illustrate this tragedy and horrific nature of her death. Im sure we all understand it is posted to help us theorize the injury path, and I sincerely hope it will do that. Thanks again for the time and trouble in helping us to understand the autopsy details better.
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Okay, so we see the injury to the left, omg, there is another on the right where her arm/shoulder meets with her neck?
:gaah: It looks like a true forrow hwow:
Thank you cynic
Thank you Cynic for this really helpful illustration and also posting the picture with a warning. I believe that all those here on this thread respect RZ and the picture goes to further illustrate this tragedy and horrific nature of her death. Im sure we all understand it is posted to help us theorize the injury path, and I sincerely hope it will do that. Thanks again for the time and trouble in helping us to understand the autopsy details better.
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Re your ETA - are you sure about this? cynic stated the knot was below her right ear which seems to agree with your first impressions, that the first injury under discussion is on her left side and the other injury is on her right side.I scrolled through the rest of the posts after yours, Screecher, and didn't see it mentioned.
I have the same question you do. There's the wound we were discussing yesterday, on her left side, but there also appears to be another significant wound on the right side farther out on her shoulder. WTH?
Guess I'll re-read the ARs sometime today.
ETA: The wound I identified on her "left side" is actually on her right side and our left looking at the photo. The significant wound I noted on the right side is actually on her left shoulder area, our right as we look at the photo. Sorry for the confusion. Need more coffee.
:wave: ROA = register of actions
The website for the civil suit court documents.
https://roa.sdcourt.ca.gov/roa/
Lezah, I think I know where you are going with the pictures and I tend to agree with you. I think the guest house played a very large role in Rebecca's murder. I think the main house was where she was accosted, chased (she yelled help), and subdued. I think the guest house is where the action actually happened. Then, she was drug to the grass below the balcony while Adam went upstairs and staged the rope tying and wrote the message. All my opinion, of course.
Can anyone show me on the diagram which part of the throat is missing?
Lezah, I think I know where you are going with the pictures and I tend to agree with you. I think the guest house played a very large role in Rebecca's murder. I think the main house was where she was accosted, chased (she yelled help), and subdued. I think the guest house is where the action actually happened. Then, she was drug to the grass below the balcony while Adam went upstairs and staged the rope tying and wrote the message. All my opinion, of course.
Can anyone show me on the diagram which part of the throat is missing?
I completely agree. And by Adam’s own admission on the 911 call, Rebecca was hanging IN the guest house. How he could mistake the balcony of the main house for the guest house is beyond me. I just can’t fathom that this was just a panicked slip of the tongue that meant nothing.
Lezah’s reminder that Adam avoided mentioning the storage room in his testimony is significant IMO. The door leading from the hallway is so obvious, I can’t imagine he never looked to see where it went. And how convenient that there is a pipe running across the ceiling...ideal for hanging. I hate writing that.
You're right - I've been cropping to avoid posting an unnecessarily disturbing picture.
The one I've attached is more complete and I chose not to have it appear within the post but rather as an attachment only.
For those who do not wish to view an autopsy picture, please avoid.
The picture also shows the only area in which the ligature slipped upward, but the starting point was at the level of the thyroid cartilage - well above the cricoid. The slippage was upward toward the knot which was just below the right ear and is well described in the autopsy report.
The mystery mark on the left side is unrelated to the ligature which was formed into a noose.
The location of the ligature furrow on the front of the neck is illustrated below.
Guest house Storage room (below ground floor - note rectangular window to top right which is floor level at ground)
Question - is this the same rectangular portal as shown in the hallway image I posted previously - so it this an image of the storage room below the guesthouse that appears on the plans?
(If you look outside the entryway, you can see the foot of the stairwell that takes you up to the hallway of the guesthouse)
(I was attracted to this factor by a ‘sensitivity’ in AS testimony - he described the guesthouse layout in particular detail, but used words to the effect of “...and that’s all I know about...” at the end of the description. I posted then, that it caught my attention.
I was in court, so I’m not sure if it is as apparent on the video, but it peaked my interest and stood out.
I looked into if there were any other rooms in the guesthouse, as I felt this was’ sensitive’ to him in his testimony. The plans revealed a storage room, which AS omitted from his description of the layout... I think this is the room where RZ was kept (after she screamed out)
What are your thoughts, and what about the room, if anything is significant to hanging and to /or any potential causes of the additional injuries to RZ?
I welcome your ideas and comments....
EDITED TO ADD - just occurred to me...did someone post that the gloves were found in a ‘storage area under stairs’?(!) Could this be that area?
Just my opinion....
I recall someone recently brought up the marks on RZ’s back that were puzzling since some were underneath her tied arms and wrists. In the pic of the storage room can anyone tell if the surface on the floor is smooth or rough? Rough enough to leave abrasion marks if someone were dragged across it?
Its hard to tell because apparently the photo was taken after the mansion was remodeled IIRC. Do we know what the floor looked like at the time of Rebeccas murder? Even some carpet could leave abrasions on some people (rug burn).
Interesting speculation but I have no doubt the hanging occurred from the murder room with the outdoor balcony. The murderer knew the intricate details of the Spreckels mansion and knew the precise lengths s/he had to cut the noose and wrist and ankle binds because the murderer has been there numerous times before, and due to her/his psychopathology had indeed envisioned how s/he would murder either Rebecca and/or Jonah solo or both together numerous times in the past, the fantasy continued in the murderer's insane delusional mind for YEARS. Yes, that is what I believe.