Retrial for Sentencing of Jodi Arias #4

[janx]

Yes, the killer's own personally prepared motion will be heard by another judge, whom Judge Stephens named. Judge Stephens refused to hear it or accept it. That failure occurred October 7, to launch the day's proceedings.

Could this motion have had something to do with the jail rather than the trial? There was something in Nurmi's most recent motion about jail searches.

 

[Tuba]

The Arias allocution was not cross examined nor under oath. She described the murder as the worst mistake she'd made in her life & the "worst thing I've ever done." But she also said, "To this day, I can hardly believe I was capable of such violence." It has always seemed to me that she is revisiting the act she committed, in this statement. We know she claims not to remember what she did but I think she is remembering the murder, not simply commenting on the graphic photos and descriptions she saw & heard in court. "Such violence": she is summoning the frenzy, the thrusts and all of her actions. She didn't say she could hardly believe she was the one who did this (meaning the evidence).

 

[Tuba]

Arias testimony about Travis banging his head on the wall during the afternoon of June 4, 2008 had already been delivered. She was now being questioned by the jurors. Take in her statement on why she did not fear Travis that day. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV8wja7wTps She wasn't afraid because he had never been physical with her, save for grabbing her wrist at the convention. Yes, she actually says that here and what could undermine her tales about his attacks with greater damage?

 

[krkrjx]

I have Borderline Personality Disorder, and it's been hard to read the last few pages if I'm honest. CMJA may have Borderline Personality but I'm pretty sure she is a sociopath too. Borderline personality is a hard condition to live with but I'll try and explain it for non-sufferers as best I can. Imagine you are a carpenter and you have a tool box with all the tools that you need to do your job. Only when you open it there is no hammer in there, there is no saw in there, there is no screwdriver in there. With someone who is Borderline their emotional development is stunted usually at a point in teenage years. So they don't have the emotional coping tools in their toolbox to live a balanced adult life. If you think back to when you were an emotional, hormonal teenager I'm sure you can remember the turmoil at times, the way you would think that your parents didn't know what you were up to and how you would manipulate things to try and get your own way. Borderline people are stuck at that emotional stage. They are terrified of losing people and so they can cling on to them, obscuring boundaries that adults with no emotional developmental delays easily recognise. They do manipulate people and situations but it's not for greed or to try and hurt people, it's to hang onto them. Borderline people have a terrible self worth. They are empty. The feel that they deserve to be alone. They self harm (and not like JA, with her small scratches but repeatedly and severely). They make credible suicide attempts (again not like JA's pathetic attempt which was nothing more than attention seeking). Over 10% of Borderlines successfully suicide. Borderline Personality sufferers are not usually bad people, their self loathing is usually directed inwards. Not always but a lot of times. Something with CMJA just doesn't sit right with me when I think of her as Borderline.

BBM: That's because Arias has a lot of other stuff going on.

I see also Narcissist and Antisocial Personality Disorders in Arias. Her inability to allow people to walk away, her obsessions with holding on even after others exercise their right to leave, and some other behaviors that I see in her speak of BPD. However, I think she has felt perhaps even since childhood that the world revolves around her (or it should!) and that her needs and wants trump those of all everyone else. That speaks of NPD. She also exhibits inability to accept boundaries that are set by society--laws--evidenced not only by the fact that she vandalized cars and stalked TA, but by her numerous infractions in jail. And then there is psychopathy that makes her just not give a damn who suffers what for whatever reason, as long as it is not her.

Arias has shown that she can kill and feel no remorse. She attempted to keep Travis in her life to the point of stalking him after he tried to call it quits. She just would not give up no matter what he did or said to get her to leave him alone--she was obsessed. But once she killed him she was able to walk away and does not even miss him. Arias has not exhibited one single regret over this killing even though with it she completely eliminated from the rest of her life the man that until then she could not live without. It is a contradiction that tops all contradictions. And she is not even sorry it happened. The only thing she regrets is getting caught. Going to trial and being convicted is so far just a huge inconvenience for Arias, one that she is no doubt convinced will be righted one day and then she will be set free.

There are varying degrees of mental illness and personality disorders. Some people are affected more in some ways than others with the same disorder. I do not believe BPD is the cause of all Arias's troubles and not for a minute do I think it made her kill. Nope...this crime as well as other wrongdoings throughout the killer's life stem from a combination of many issues that come together to form her particular brand of psychopathy. The most devastating personality disorders affecting Arias are, in my opinion, NPD and APD. That is the combination that makes her most dangerous (also in my opinion).

 

[Nali87]

Hmm. Y'all see disorders.. All I see is evilness.

 

[krkrjx]

True.

But we are trying to find an explanation for the evilness. IDK, maybe it might help us feel less uneasy if we can blame it on something other than...well, you know...

 

[jbc]

True.

But we are trying to find an explanation for the evilness. IDK, maybe it might help us feel less uneasy if we can blame it on something other than...well, you know...

There seem to be clinical psychologists and psychiatrists in our group.
If so, would one comment on whether they think it is possible that JA was in a dissociative state during the murder? thanks.

 

[krkrjx]

There seem to be clinical psychologists and psychiatrists in our group.
If so, would one comment on whether they think it is possible that JA was in a dissociative state during the murder? thanks.

Excellent question.

I am not one, but even so I would say no, she was not in a dissociative state. Or as some want to call it, a fog. Too much pre- and post-planning tells me the killer knew what was to go down, that she meant to do it, and then deliberately lied to cover up. And then there is her blackmail attempt to get a plea deal for a lesser charge. That came from her knowing full well that she did not have a defense for her actions.

 

[krkrjx]

Sorry all...I know I am posting too often. Surely do not mean to hijack...

 

[blefuscu]

There seem to be clinical psychologists and psychiatrists in our group.
If so, would one comment on whether they think it is possible that JA was in a dissociative state during the murder? thanks.

Not a chance imo. I have had periods of dissociation and it in no way presents in the way she described it. She went too far, calling it a fog that lasted for hours. Secondly it has been a one off experience. She's never said it's happened again. Yet she's sat through a trial that has had details which should have triggered her, I know that songs I've heard, smells and even TV adverts have triggered me into a dissociative state and yet she sits through all the gory details of the trial. I think she's lying. She's probably read vaguely about people having a period where they dissociate and used it as a way to try and say she can't remember what happened. But she was describing it all wrong. Too neat and simple.

 

[atthelake]

There seem to be clinical psychologists and psychiatrists in our group.
If so, would one comment on whether they think it is possible that JA was in a dissociative state during the murder? thanks.

Dunno but that question sounds like one which defense team would ask in a focus group to develop strategy ...big time

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2

 

[janx]

Sorry all...I know I am posting too often. Surely do not mean to hijack...

I like your posts! Post away! :seeya:

 

[janx]

Dunno but that question sounds like one which defense team would ask in a focus group to develop strategy ...big time

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2

Remember Richard Samuels? :facepalm:

 

[rose222]

Hmm. Y'all see disorders.. All I see is evilness.

Me too. This isn't a case of a spoiled brat or a girl who is simply too needy or too immature.

Arias hit her brother with a baseball bat when she was very young. She has, according to Juan, abused animals. She murdered Travis in the most horrific way possible. She was seemingly prepared to kill again when she was arrested. I don't think medications can help, never mind cure her. It's a simplistic way of putting it I guess but I just see someone who is stone-cold evil, completely devoid of conscience. She will 'blossom' to her full potential as a serial killer if given the opportunity. Thankfully, hopefully, she will never be given that chance.

 

[rose222]

This was a very interesting thread we had last year. Armchair Psych discussion of Arias. Perhaps I can learn a thing or two psychologically speaking. I'm off to read it again.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?198356-Armchair-Psych-discussion-of-Jodi-Arias

 

[SweetT]

Who was next on jodis list? It does seem she was getting prepared for some more killing or something.. Knives hidden in books.. Didn't they find a gun under the hood or something?

 

[LinasK]

Who was next on jodis list? It does seem she was getting prepared for some more killing or something.. Knives hidden in books.. Didn't they find a gun under the hood or something?

Both. Probably Mimi or the Hughes's.

 

[Cleej]

Me too. This isn't a case of a spoiled brat or a girl who is simply too needy or too immature.

Arias hit her brother with a baseball bat when she was very young. She has, according to Juan, abused animals. She murdered Travis in the most horrific way possible. She was seemingly prepared to kill again when she was arrested. I don't think medications can help, never mind cure her. It's a simplistic way of putting it I guess but I just see someone who is stone-cold evil, completely devoid of conscience. She will 'blossom' to her full potential as a serial killer if given the opportunity. Thankfully, hopefully, she will never be given that chance.

I must have missed something. You say that she seemingly prepared to kill again. Who do you think that she was going to kill, and why?

 

[bsk]

Me too. This isn't a case of a spoiled brat or a girl who is simply too needy or too immature.

Arias hit her brother with a baseball bat when she was very young. She has, according to Juan, abused animals. She murdered Travis in the most horrific way possible. She was seemingly prepared to kill again when she was arrested. I don't think medications can help, never mind cure her. It's a simplistic way of putting it I guess but I just see someone who is stone-cold evil, completely devoid of conscience. She will 'blossom' to her full potential as a serial killer if given the opportunity. Thankfully, hopefully, she will never be given that chance.

Can you imagine how creeped out the prosecution witnesses had to be when testifying? In addition to having to suffer through their friend/relative being butchered, they had to go through the grinder of a bunch of obnoxious and in some cases perverted questions, and the whole time they are being stared down by a psycho who would have had no qualms about killing them if she'd had the chance - and might look to do so if she is released.

 

[blefuscu]

Can you imagine how creeped out the prosecution witnesses had to be when testifying? In addition to having to suffer through their friend/relative being butchered, they had to go through the grinder of a bunch of obnoxious and in some cases perverted questions, and the whole time they are being stared down by a psycho who would have had no qualms about killing them if she'd had the chance - and might look to do so if she is released.

I think all the witnesses whether called by the prosecution or defense were brave to testify. CMJA is a very intimidating person and it must have been scary to think that something you said could damage her chances of being found not guilty. Well done to them all.