GUILTY SC - Grace Carlson-SantaCruz, 5 mos, Myrtle Beach, 3 Nov 2015

[cvaldez1975]

i'm sorry, but i'm more concerned with defenseless babies than their addicted mothers. yes, addiction is a disease but when a baby is wantonly killed, my sympathy ends.

While I will not and am not making excuses for this mother, the judgement being passed here never ceases to amaze me. The mother clearly has an addiction problem.

Until we start treating addiction as a real and legitimate health crisis and start getting people the help they need without jail time, we are going to continue to see cases like this.

It is easy to say "oh as a parent she should never be doing drugs. I would never do that". But if you are an addict, you don't stop being an addict simply because you give birth. It doesn't work that way. It also is ludicrous to think that an addict is thinking clearly enough to not get pregnant in the first place. That just isn't reality. Until you really have been there or understand the brain chemistry behind addiction, you just won't understand and it is insane to pass judgement without offering real solutions.

 

[cvaldez1975]

im liberal and I don't agree w that poster at all. I am all for consequences for poor choices.

BBM
Shame the addict was thinking clearly enough to become an addict in the first place. Unless the person was forced to take their first hit of the addictive substance they made that conscious decision. Life is a series of choices - make a bad one & it's your responsibility, no-one else's. IMO the wishy-washy liberal "it's not their fault, you don't understand" thinking is half the problem these days - people need to be responsible for their actions. And if those actions include getting addicted to drugs & getting pregnant then they should be held accountable - tying tubes would be a good start too.

There are too many people who want, but can't have, children. There are also too many people who are addicts & having and then neglecting or killing their precious children. This is unforgivable & avoidable IMO

(Not a personal attack on you btw Sunflowerchick, just another point of view)

 

[stillwatersc]

http://www.wmbfnews.com/story/30473984/father-of-baby-grace-releases-statement-on-loss-of-daughter

The statement by Patrick Olberg was released to the media through the Maguire Law Firm, and reads:
I am heartbroken over the devastating loss of my daughter, Grace. I feel pain and sadness that I never imagined existed. I only hope and pray that Grace will not be forgotten.

...more at link

 

[stillwatersc]

http://www.wmbfnews.com/story/30448728/baby-graces-mother-charged-with-homicide-by-child-abuse

Update today:

On Monday, police stated the unlawful conduct toward a child charge was dropped and upgraded to homicide by child abuse, which carries a sentence of 20 years to life in prison, according to Lt. Denis. The arrest warrant states that Toney did cause the death of the child, and the death "occurs under circumstances manifesting an extreme indifference to human life."

 

[EllieBee]

Just a big ole WTF. Abortion is legal. At least for now. Killing your babies after they are born is not. Baby Grace, Baby Chance, Baby Bella, so many others....I really hate these people and am determined to not "understand" their sickness. i am team "babies" and eff all to team "murderer parents".

I am in a bad mood tonight. Dead babies have that effect on me.

 

[EllieBee]

i'm sorry, but i'm more concerned with defenseless babies than their addicted mothers. yes, addiction is a disease but when a baby is wantonly killed, my sympathy ends.

Yep. I should have read back through the thread before posting, I am awfully liberal, but I will always support the rights of children over the rights of ahole loser parents.

 

[U2forever]

Just a big ole WTF. Abortion is legal. At least for now. Killing your babies after they are born is not. Baby Grace, Baby Chance, Baby Bella, so many others....I really hate these people and am determined to not "understand" their sickness. i am team "babies" and eff all to team "murderer parents".

I am in a bad mood tonight. Dead babies have that effect on me.

EllueBee, I feel your pain.
I'm still sniffing 'round for the xxxcursing
thread. I don't know where it's hidden.
[emoji485][emoji485]Maybe a glass o wine will help...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Rayemonde]

Meth psychosis sounds like a definite possibility.

People who use methamphetamine long-term may experience anxiety, confusion, insomnia, and mood disturbances and display violent behavior. They may also show symptoms of psychosis, such as paranoia, visual and auditory hallucinations, and delusions (for example, the sensation of insects crawling under the skin).

Chronic methamphetamine use is accompanied by chemical and molecular changes in the brain. Imaging studies have shown changes in the activity of the dopamine system that are associated with reduced motor skills and impaired verbal learning. In studies of chronic methamphetamine users, severe structural and functional changes have been found in areas of the brain associated with emotion and memory, which may account for many of the emotional and cognitive problems observed in these individuals.

http://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/methamphetamine

 

[EllieBee]

EllueBee, I feel your pain.
I'm still sniffing 'round for the xxxcursing
thread. I don't know where it's hidden.
[emoji485][emoji485]Maybe a glass o wine will help...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bless you, and lol- doesn't a glass of wine always help one to simmer down a bit? Although tonight it might put me in a coma! I might benefit more from an espresso!

Gotta love menopause insomnia! :lol:

 

[ClaireNC]

http://www.wmbfnews.com/story/30473984/father-of-baby-grace-releases-statement-on-loss-of-daughter

...more at link

So why is Baby Grace's name listed as Grace Jennifer Carlson-SantaCruz? http://www.myrtlebeachonline.com/news/local/community/article24901741.html

 

[ClaireNC]

Yep. I should have read back through the thread before posting, I am awfully liberal, but I will always support the rights of children over the rights of ahole loser parents.

Another liberal here and I agree.

 

[borndem]

Yep. I should have read back through the thread before posting, I am awfully liberal, but I will always support the rights of children over the rights of ahole loser parents.

Bless your heart, EllieBee -- I'm right there with you on that liberal bus. Sometimes this stuff just stops makin' sense. How can a human being...

Just dammit.

 

[1&2&3]

There are no excuses! Addicted mothers are not up to caring for their children at any age.

There is another daughter, 9 years old. I can't imagine the life she has lived. This horrible incident has hopefully saved this other child and she will be placed in a loving home where she will receive counseling.

 

[Hoosgirl]

So why is Baby Grace's name listed as Grace Jennifer Carlson-SantaCruz? http://www.myrtlebeachonline.com/news/local/community/article24901741.html

I know, it's probably neither here nor there, but I wonder about all the name changes ... Carlson, Toney, Santacruz.

 

[Hoosgirl]

Update today:

Another new (at least to me) bit from that article: first she claimed she took Grace in the water because she was crying, then it was because she was "trying to find God".

The police report also states she exhibited behavior associated with meth.

 

[MsMarple]

"There's a major difference between a child maybe just crawling around in a yard and slips in a ditch versus a mother apparently walking into the water and the child is released in the water," Horry County Coroner Robert Edge said of the determination.
...
During the bond hearing, Toney was visibly upset with the media's presence.

She started covering her face with her hair when the media first walked into the courtroom. She then tried moving to another side of the bench she was sitting on to face the other direction. An Horry County Sheriff's Office corrections officer asked Toney if she needed to leave, to which Toney responded yes.

The corrections officer took Toney to an adjacent waiting room. During her time in there, Toney explained why she didn't want to go back into the room.

"There's freakin' media in there and they're making me out to be this *expletive* psycho," she said.

http://www.wave3.com/story/30448728...rged-with-homicide-by-child-abuse-bond-denied

Sigh. Once again we have a parent sooo concerned about what strangers think of them even while they are emotionally flat and evasive when talking about their dead child. Toney's first reason for taking baby Grace into the creek was because she was crying and then she switched to "looking for God," whatever the heck that means. I'm waiting for the "I'm a good mother" statement...

 

[U2forever]

"There's a major difference between a child maybe just crawling around in a yard and slips in a ditch versus a mother apparently walking into the water and the child is released in the water," Horry County Coroner Robert Edge said of the determination.
...
During the bond hearing, Toney was visibly upset with the media's presence.

She started covering her face with her hair when the media first walked into the courtroom. She then tried moving to another side of the bench she was sitting on to face the other direction. An Horry County Sheriff's Office corrections officer asked Toney if she needed to leave, to which Toney responded yes.

The corrections officer took Toney to an adjacent waiting room. During her time in there, Toney explained why she didn't want to go back into the room.

"There's freakin' media in there and they're making me out to be this *expletive* psycho," she said.

http://www.wave3.com/story/30448728...rged-with-homicide-by-child-abuse-bond-denied

Sigh. Once again we have a parent sooo concerned about what strangers think of them even while they are emotionally flat and evasive when talking about their dead child. Toney's first reason for taking baby Grace into the creek was because she was crying and then she switched to "looking for God," whatever the heck that means. I'm waiting for the "I'm a good mother" statement...

Oh come on, we all know she was baptizing lil Grace. She was looking for God, no?

my hell await.

 

[cvaldez1975]

true but im not wanting this to become a legit defense for this bullshottery.

Meth psychosis sounds like a definite possibility.


http://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/methamphetamine

 

[cvaldez1975]

dad and mom were prob split up at the time of birth so mom named her what she wanted.

I know, it's probably neither here nor there, but I wonder about all the name changes ... Carlson, Toney, Santacruz.

 

[cvaldez1975]

yea right... im waiting for the "the baby was possessed" crap. and what other than a flippin psycho takes her baby into a muddy slough during a rainy flood?

"There's a major difference between a child maybe just crawling around in a yard and slips in a ditch versus a mother apparently walking into the water and the child is released in the water," Horry County Coroner Robert Edge said of the determination.
...
During the bond hearing, Toney was visibly upset with the media's presence.

She started covering her face with her hair when the media first walked into the courtroom. She then tried moving to another side of the bench she was sitting on to face the other direction. An Horry County Sheriff's Office corrections officer asked Toney if she needed to leave, to which Toney responded yes.

The corrections officer took Toney to an adjacent waiting room. During her time in there, Toney explained why she didn't want to go back into the room.

"There's freakin' media in there and they're making me out to be this *expletive* psycho," she said.

http://www.wave3.com/story/30448728...rged-with-homicide-by-child-abuse-bond-denied

Sigh. Once again we have a parent sooo concerned about what strangers think of them even while they are emotionally flat and evasive when talking about their dead child. Toney's first reason for taking baby Grace into the creek was because she was crying and then she switched to "looking for God," whatever the heck that means. I'm waiting for the "I'm a good mother" statement...