Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #5

[Val1]

I wrote to Sony. The Sony DSC H9 camera is not capable of taking stills while videoing or while reviewing an already taken video. To do this requires PlayMemoriesHome software

The Spybot hits were explained by Martinez as virus (vlob Trojan actually) activity, not user.

IMO Travis and Jodi took pics June 4, like they discussed on the phone. The EXIF data was created when the shutter was pressed preserving the date and time. She then lured him into her trap in the shower, took pictures, created more EXIF data, even taking an accidental pic of her standing over his bleeding body.
LE has confirmed all of this years ago.

According to the specific Handbook for this model, as I referenced above, "In this case, you can import images directly using “Picture Motion Browser”. JA had her laptop with her and was quite capable of installing the software to enable her to save and edit whatever was on the camera, or the memory stick in it.

 

[pocketaccent]

To contineously talk about how Travis was an addict of some sort frankly disgusts me. I know some will respond by posting some nudes of him and a video of his sister saying JA was his choice of drug, then say -see? he was addicted!- , but I wish people will remember he is the victim in this case and his 'addiction' had nothing to do with his death. So why keep concentrating on Travis' weaknesses only? For days now. I have heard enough trash talking by Nurmi, Wilmott, ALV, & Fonseca on how TA and JA's relationship was toxic and that TA couldn't let JA go in peace.

In my mind their relationship was toxic because of JA and Travis just didn't know how to deal with it effectively. He did try though to end the cycle towards the end of his life. I give him a lot of credit for trying his best. No, I don't believe he still was addicted to the toxic relationship or to JA on June 4th, welcomed JA when she showed up and had a sex party.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

TA's bicycle found on the floor of the garage, as if he had just returned from his biking exercise (timeline June 4), nothing out of place, not so much a box of oatmeal on the counter, everything completely clean in the kitchen (timeline June 4, credibility).

TA's credit card found out of his wallet, on his desk (the office door was closed); one of his business cards on the closet floor (she went through his wallet); enough of a mess on the floor of T's closet that friends stepped over and around ( activity)

TA told Mimi directly that the had/was stalking him (add her to the list in a tightly knit community in which gossip was common)- Regan, Michelle, Taylor, Chris and Sky)

New information. Ain't it grand. Thank you, BK.

Wow, that's deep. Looks like the not only murdered Travis, she helped herself to whatever money he had in his wallet. GRRR. I wonder if anything was charged on his CC after he was deceased? I suppose not, but just more questions that pop up with this additional info. Sure wish we knew everything that was not allowed in as evidence.

 

[TexMex]

According to the specific Handbook for this model, as I referenced above, "In this case, you can import images directly using “Picture Motion Browser”. JA had her laptop with her and was quite capable of installing the software to enable her to save and edit whatever was on the camera, or the memory stick in it.

Her putting pictures on her laptop would not affect the EXIF data on Travis's camera. It's created when the shutter is pressed.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

To contineously talk about how Travis was an addict of some sort frankly disgusts me. I know some will respond by posting some nudes of him and a video of his sister saying JA was his choice of drug, then say -see? he was addicted!- , but I wish people will remember he is the victim in this case and his 'addiction' had nothing to do with his death. So why keep concentrating on Travis' weaknesses only? For days now. I have heard enough trash talking by Nurmi, Wilmott, ALV, & Fonseca on how TA and JA's relationship was toxic and that TA couldn't let JA go in peace.

In my mind their relationship was toxic because of JA and Travis just didn't know how to deal with it effectively. He did try though to end the cycle towards the end of his life. I give him a lot of credit for trying his best. No, I don't believe he still was addicted to the toxic relationship or to JA on June 4th, welcomed JA when she showed up and had a sex party.

BAM, good post!!

 

[geevee]

Juan destroyed Neumeister on cross. He's the one who claimed it was user access June 4 but not on June 10 (while Travis was dead and Jodi gone) same activity.

"Pseudo Mr. Smith' also elaborated on the Spybot file when questioned by JM during the hard drive hearings, Mr. Smith tried to explain what Spybot is and does but it was extremely clear he's never used it nor researched it after finding that file activation in the hard drive (Autopsy) printout. It was there, and it's meaningful, esp. in relation to the nude photographs, no matter how much anyone likes or dislikes that simple fact.

 

[TrialWatcher]

Nope, not a single person.


TrialWatcher: “what was Travis addicted to if not the sex?”

TrialWatcher: “Travis made that tape with her because he was sexually addicted.”

kmp3: (…) “ It’s the totality of the circumstances that suggest Travis's addiction is sexual in nature. If we look at the gchat itself…...it gradually takes on a sexual tone. IF the addiction TA is referring to is NOT sexual, then what is it? (….) There is plenty of circumstantial evidence to support his addiction was sexual in nature. I'll spare everyone from posting the quotes and links, etc. because they would be numerous.”

kmp3: “If TA was not addicted to her sexually, why would he equate with her Satan and end up in bed with her June 4?”

Salberg7: “It’s safe for me to say he was addicted to sex with her as there is plenty of evidence to support it.”

Tex Mex: “(…) a close friend of TA’s says that Travis became addicted to sex with (). (Friend says) anyone who thinks sex can’t be adductive is nuts….”

TexMex: He’s also likely been schooled on possible sex addiction after meeting with the bishop and elders for a repeat offense with (the ).

Kmp3:…you can’t really fault TexMex for his interpretation that Travis was addicted to sex, an opinion I share…”

ETC.

Did you answer the question put to you by me? Context is something you recently highlighted to TexMex. It's something those disagreeing with you take seriously. Travis said he was addicted in the G-Chat, did he not? Addicted to Jodi. Please answer what exactly you think he was addicted to and why he didn't correct Arias about the addicting nature of the sex?

No one has claimed Travis was a sex addict in the 'clinical' sense some might catagorise. Those disagreeing with your opinion base it on the evidence and Travis' own words:

From G-Chat:

“Travis - Because I am addicted

Travis - You are ruining my life but I’m addicted

Travis - I am in partial addiction to you

Travis - I’ m addicted to it

Travis - Yet I am addicted to it

Travis - I’m addicted”

G-Chat above. The wider context also needs to be taken into account. Juan Martinez offered proof they had sex and he won a conviction using photographs of sexual interaction on that day. That may not tally with your theories or research but in my opinion it is the version that makes most sense. Any evidence put forward as counter argument seems extremely weak or non existent.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Message for Hope


Do I need to renew my BK? Is she going to release anymore "new" tidbits? if so, I will gladly ante up. :great:

 

[Hope4More]

Addicted to JODI. His relationship with JODI involved SEX, not much more. I don't think he was a sex addict as in: *advertiser censored*, prostitutes, etc.
He states he's addicted to her, his friends and family do too. I agree with Travis, his family and friends.

Poor Travis. He plays off the 's use of the word addicted, 2 hours into a FU conversation that many believe made her to decide to kill him-- that's how much he didn't express any "addiction" to her--and he does so almost certainly in one last attempt to get her to come clean, but fails.

It's the only time he ever uses that word, but now it is used to reduce all his conflicted feelings for and about her, all of his struggle to extricate himself from her BPD and sociopathic madness without (in his mind) causing her to commit suicide, and without violating his chosen religion's absolute commandment to forgive, to find Christ-qualities in everyone, even the worst of sinners, and without violating his personal, soul-felt credo, that everyone is capable of changing themselves for the better...all of that reduced to the vacuous and ill-fitting term "addiction."

He didn't initiate contact with her between May 22 and June 4, not once, and almost certainly didn't respond to June 3 calls to him.

His stalker with gun and knife surprised him in his own home, after he had made it clear to her he was done, and there is ZERO evidence saying he welcomed her, wasn't scared, wasn't trying to get her out of there in any way he could, nothing except photos of each being naked that may or may not have been taken that day, and which in any case depict nothing whatsoever of his emotional state, other than he was not smiling, and in fact looked like he just woke up.

There is no evidence whatsoever that he gave her permission to take photos of him in the shower, that he was OK with it, or that until he turned to the camera, that he even knew she was there.

And yet.....that word addiction keeps getting slapped on him, up to his last minutes before being slaughtered.

As if he had not finally come to understand who she was, recoiled, told her over 2 hours she was evil, a liar to the core, that he hated her and knew she hated him. As if he didn't refuse to submit to her manipulations after May 22. As if he didn't gather up all his courage to confront her square on, and succeed. As if how he felt in early May and before, his enmeshment in her sociopathy, was immutable.

I feel nothing but sadness for Travis that he didn't break with her for so long, that it took him until May 22 to do so, which left less than 2 weeks to have cleared his mind and heart of her poison.

But in equal measure, I'm awed by his personal strength and honesty, that as destroyed as he felt by her, he confronted her on May 26, told her who she was, and never backed down. Not that day, and IMO, never again.

 

[Hope4More]

Message for Hope


Do I need to renew my BK? Is she going to release anymore "new" tidbits? if so, I will gladly ante up. :great:

I've retired from doing anymore real lifting from there to here, so sorry, won't be summarizing them here.

There's a fair amount more detail in the new docs I didn't mention (including psychological insights into TA and his texts by friends, even). Best of all, BK is clearly still trying- and succeeding- in obtaining new info, even though so much is now sealed....though how much more and when, dunno.

 

[TrialWatcher]

To contineously talk about how Travis was an addict of some sort frankly disgusts me. I know some will respond by posting some nudes of him and a video of his sister saying JA was his choice of drug, then say -see? he was addicted!- , but I wish people will remember he is the victim in this case and his 'addiction' had nothing to do with his death. So why keep concentrating on Travis' weaknesses only? For days now. I have heard enough trash talking by Nurmi, Wilmott, ALV, & Fonseca on how TA and JA's relationship was toxic and that TA couldn't let JA go in peace.

In my mind their relationship was toxic because of JA and Travis just didn't know how to deal with it effectively. He did try though to end the cycle towards the end of his life. I give him a lot of credit for trying his best. No, I don't believe he still was addicted to the toxic relationship or to JA on June 4th, welcomed JA when she showed up and had a sex party.

Travis disgusts you? His family and friends using terms relating to addiction disgust you? Travis used the word addict in the context of the G-Chat. I find it 'disgusting' that some claim without evidence that Travis was raped. How is that respectful to the victim? Didn't he suffer enough? As another poster highlighted, it is not cool to blame the victim.

“Travis - Because I am addicted

Travis - You are ruining my life but I’m addicted

Travis - I am in partial addiction to you

Travis - I’ m addicted to it

Travis - Yet I am addicted to it

Travis - I’m addicted”


None of those reflecting Travis' own words judge Travis. Nor has anyone suggested he was a sex addict sleeping around. Putting words in the mouths of those making well argued and evidence based points deflects instead of addressing. Arias would have killed Travis, sex or no sex, I believe.

Juan Martinez ensured she was convicted by showing the very same nudes you talk about. By proving from those photographs that she was there and he took the photos. Does Martinez not care for the victim every bit as much as those disagreeing with you do? Did Juan focus on Travis being aroused from some kind of salacious perspective? Of course not. Arias' ability to manipulate him carried through to June 4. The only reason this is being discussed is several people on this forum keep stating that there was no sex on June 4. People ask for proof. Not a jot has been put forward that isn't weak or easily refutable.

 

[TrialWatcher]

Her putting pictures on her laptop would not affect the EXIF data on Travis's camera. It's created when the shutter is pressed.

This has been stated and restated so many times now. The expert witness was clear about this and the timestamped evidence was accepted by the defense. Did the jury ask questions disputing the timestamps? Either jury? I can't remember any, can anyone?

 

[geevee]

Poor Travis. He plays off the 's use of the word addicted, 2 hours into a FU conversation that many believe made her to decide to kill him-- that's how much he didn't express any "addiction" to her--and he does so almost certainly in one last attempt to get her to come clean, but fails.

It's the only time he ever uses that word, but now it is used to reduce all his conflicted feelings for and about her, all of his struggle to extricate himself from her BPD and sociopathic madness without (in his mind) causing her to commit suicide, and without violating his chosen religion's absolute commandment to forgive, to find Christ-qualities in everyone, even the worst of sinners, and without violating his personal, soul-felt credo, that everyone is capable of changing themselves for the better...all of that reduced to the vacuous and ill-fitting term "addiction."

He didn't initiate contact with her between May 22 and June 4, not once, and almost certainly didn't respond to June 3 calls to him.

His stalker with gun and knife surprised him in his own home, after he had made it clear to her he was done, and there is ZERO evidence saying he welcomed her, wasn't scared, wasn't trying to get her out of there in any way he could, nothing except photos of each being naked that may or may not have been taken that day, and which in any case depict nothing whatsoever of his emotional state, other than he was not smiling, and in fact looked like he just woke up.

There is no evidence whatsoever that he gave her permission to take photos of him in the shower, that he was OK with it, or that until he turned to the camera, that he even knew she was there.

And yet.....that word addiction keeps getting slapped on him, up to his last minutes before being slaughtered.

As if he had not finally come to understand who she was, recoiled, told her over 2 hours she was evil, a liar to the core, that he hated her and knew she hated him. As if he didn't refuse to submit to her manipulations after May 22. As if he didn't gather up all his courage to confront her square on, and succeed. As if how he felt in early May and before, his enmeshment in her sociopathy, was immutable.

I feel nothing but sadness for Travis that he didn't break with her for so long, that it took him until May 22 to do so, which left less than 2 weeks to have cleared his mind and heart of her poison.

But in equal measure, I'm awed by his personal strength and honesty, that as destroyed as he felt by her, he confronted her on May 26, told her who she was, and never backed down. Not that day, and IMO, never again.

That was as beautiful as it was painful Hope, and I couldn't agree more.

--

My personal feeling has been that - as he used the word several times in one session, not having used it ever before, that he was being sarcastic, he had broken the pattern that had set in, he knew he had and he was begging for her to once and for all, come clean so he could close the book forever. She wouldn't give him that because she had already planned to close the book in her own way, and she did so as heartlessly as she had treated him all along, in his words - killing him from the inside out.

 

[Val1]

Her putting pictures on her laptop would not affect the EXIF data on Travis's camera. It's created when the shutter is pressed.

True, but then a video was never recovered, just a few stills with gaps between some of them, making it appear that JA deliberately shot each and every pic, even though some are spaced at pretty even intervals. That makes me wonder if only the stills she captured from playing back a video were all that was left. I find it very difficult to believe that she could not capture stills while pausing the video in playback mode ....

https://docs.sony.com/release//DSC-H7_H9_Handbook.pdf#I5.1.1023602

"2 Select an image with b/B on the control button.

Movie:
Press z to playback a movie. (Press z again to stop playback.)
Press B to fast forward, b to rewind. (Press z to return to normal playback.)
Press V to display the volume control screen, then press b/B to adjust the volume.
• Movies with the image size [320] are displayed a size smaller.
• By turning the wheel dial, you can also easily view the next/previous image.
-/+ To view an enlarged image (playback zoom)
Press + while displaying a still image.
To undo the zoom, press - .
Adjust the position: v/V/b/B
Cancel playback zoom: z
•To store enlarged images: [Trimming] (page 66)"

https://docs.sony.com/release//DSC-H7_H9_Handbook.pdf#I5.1.1023602

 

[Hope4More]

Travis disgusts you? His family and friends using terms relating to addiction disgust you? Travis used the word addict in the context of the G-Chat. I find it 'disgusting' that some claim without evidence that Travis was raped. How is that respectful to the victim? Didn't he suffer enough? As another poster highlighted, it is not cool to blame the victim.

“Travis - Because I am addicted

Travis - You are ruining my life but I’m addicted

Travis - I am in partial addiction to you

Travis - I’ m addicted to it

Travis - Yet I am addicted to it

Travis - I’m addicted”


None of those reflecting Travis' own words judge Travis. Nor has anyone suggested he was a sex addict sleeping around. Putting words in the mouths of those making well argued and evidence based points deflects instead of addressing. Arias would have killed Travis, sex or no sex, I believe.

Juan Martinez ensured she was convicted by showing the very same nudes you talk about. By proving from those photographs that she was there and he took the photos. Does Martinez not care for the victim every bit as much as those disagreeing with you do? Did Juan focus on Travis being aroused from some kind of salacious perspective? Of course not. Arias' ability to manipulate him carried through to June 4. The only reason this is being discussed is several people on this forum keep stating that there was no sex on June 4. People ask for proof. Not a jot has been put forward that isn't weak or easily refutable.

I'm clear why I've discussed the "addiction" lines from May 26, and it does not have to do with being "several people on this forum" not believing TA had sex with her that day.

I'm interested in the totality of the chat and the context of what came before and after, though, and not so much in the endless regurgitation of a few out of context lines plucked out of over 2 hours of chat.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

I've retired from doing anymore real lifting from there to here, so sorry, won't be summarizing them here.

There's a fair amount more detail in the new docs I didn't mention (including psychological insights into TA and his texts by friends, even). Best of all, BK is clearly still trying- and succeeding- in obtaining new info, even though so much is now sealed....though how much more and when, dunno.

I understand Hope, and I will renew my subscription. Thanks for all you have done. :loveyou:

 

[TrialWatcher]

(...)
And yet.....that word addiction keeps getting slapped on him, up to his last minutes before being slaughtered.

People here are discussing the word addiction because they disagree with your opinion on the G-Chat. In that chat, Travis repeatedly used the word addiction.

From G-Chat:

“Travis - Because I am addicted

Travis - You are ruining my life but I’m addicted

Travis - I am in partial addiction to you

Travis - I’ m addicted to it

Travis - Yet I am addicted to it

Travis - I’m addicted”

I also strongly disagree with your conclusion that May 26 was the end in terms of Travis interacting with Arias. He replied to texts - regardless of how many words - and spoke to her several times totalling around an hour. Do I think he realised how horrifically destructive she was - yes. He tells her that she is ruining his life and despite that he is addicted. My view is that he was finished with her in any romantic or meaningful friendship terms but the sexual manipulation drew him back one last time.

You word the quote above to suggest those acknowledging the sexual interaction and pull are somehow harming Travis. Did Juan Martinez slap Travis? Did you when you changed your mind to state that they did have sex that day? Do those that support the evidence presented by Juan Martinez slap Travis? No, the only harm done to Travis was by a psychotic murderer.

You put forward rape as another theory recently without proof to counter the arguments put forward by Juan Martinez that there was consensual sexual interaction. Not once did he suggest anything else. If you have evidence of any sort, please produce it. Otherwise, let's not 'slap' further pain on Travis please.

 

[Hope4More]

That was as beautiful as it was painful Hope, and I couldn't agree more.

--

My personal feeling has been that - as he used the word several times in one session, not having used it ever before, that he was being sarcastic, he had broken the pattern that had set in, he knew he had and he was begging for her to once and for all, come clean so he could close the book forever. She wouldn't give him that because she had already planned to close the book in her own way, and she did so as heartlessly as she had treated him all along, in his words - killing him from the inside out.

He needed closure, which is commonplace for victims of sociopaths, and something they of course never succeed in obtaining. Sociopaths don't concede they've been caught in lies.

Yes, I do believe he was being mightily sarcastic at that point. Hence the right? right? Right? Right? Right? Right? 's which followed his telling her it should be liberating to tell the truth.

I'm not gonna go hunt it down, but the essence of what he said on May 26 was a repeat of what he told MariaM - who he knew to be the killer- on May 21.

He told her (paraphrased) I would have been your friend. You didn't have to do this. I care about you because you are a child of God. But your lying cannot be tolerated. You need to come clean. For yourself.

And instead....AFTER confessing--some part of that one lie to him--she texts him again as MariaM, and then hacks into his FB.

Yep, sarcasm.

 

[freudianslip]

This is exactly my understanding. Thank you for putting it so well.
(back to lurking )

ETA: oops, I was refering to Hope4more's post #1089

 

[TexMex]

I tried to stay away this time.
But you called
And you made sure I heard your voice
U knew that would be enough
Not how many infractions
You just kill me
Every time
And I keep taking you back
I have come to terms with it
I am in partial addicted to you
The positives
If all you were is positive
Or your good facad that is in fact an act
I'm addicted to it
But it is bullshiz
Yet I'm addicted to it
And you know it
And you know I will take you back
You always know
You know I'll get pissed but I'll take you back


Not sarcastic at all IMO. Very self aware. Baring his soul. It's very tragic reading this and realizing how right he was