Shannan Gilbert: Baden Releases Autopsy Results 02.12.2016

[bessie]

Craigslist escort Shannan Gilbert may have been tortured before death: autopsy
Posted 2:29 PM, February 12, 2016, by Mary Murphy, Updated at 05:52pm, February 12, 2016
PIX 11

[...]

"Almost all of the skeletal bones were recovered and appeared normal. There was no evidence of trauma. However, the larynx was missing and only the body of the hyoid bone was found; the two greater horns of that neck bone were missing. These structures, the larynx and the hyoid bone, are often fractured during homicidal manual strangulation. My examination of the recovered body of the hyoid bone, after it had been anthropologically de-fleshed, showed a roughness at the margins where the separated bones had been attached."

Baden found no evidence to support the theory that drugs might have caused her to fall into the water.

Baden concluded, "There is insufficient information to determine a definite cause of death, but the autopsy findings are consistent with strangulation."

New Shannan Gilbert autopsy reveals ‘disturbing’ findings in Gilgo Beach case, medical examiner says
Posted 11:59 AM, February 12, 2016, by Jeremy Tanner, Updated at 02:39pm, February 12, 2016
PIX 11

[...]

“There is no evidence whatsoever that Shannan Gilbert died a natural death,” former New York City medical examiner Michael Baden wrote in the report. “There is no evidence whatsoever that Shannan Gilbert died from a drug overdose, and there is no evidence whatsoever that Shannan Gilbert died from drowning.”

[...]

“I know there’s a lot of coverups I don’t know who’s involved . . . I believe it’s all connected,” said Stevie Smith, one of Gilbert’s sisters. “I’m angry at the cop who took so long to get to the scene, I’m angry at the residents of the gated community, I’m angry at the driver who was hired to protect her and I’m angry at anyone who knows the truth and isn’t saying anything.”

 

[minazoe]

Ok so there is zero evidence of hypothermia.

 

[Momoffourboys]

All I can think about while reading Baden's findings is how horribly Shannan must have suffered. I hope I'm wrong.

 

[marble]

Ok so there is zero evidence of hypothermia.

Apologies in advance for not having time yet to look at all of the details of the press conference/new info (as well as not researching the answer myself):
but is this so, and like drowning can hypothermia be deduced by markers found during autopsy? I ask because the only way Shannon's death could be considered likely accidental given her clothing was removed is if she'd removed them herself as people suffering from hypothermia have been known to do. If it's unlikely she died of hypothermia then that changes everything imo.

 

[LindsayLohan6]

I'm really interested to hear what evidence Ray has gathered from the depositions. It sounds like Ray thinks the killer is Hackett or an Oak Beach Resident. I'm really interested in what Ray has learned about the drifter and what he has to say about that.

 

[marble]

Apologies in advance for not having time yet to look at all of the details of the press conference/new info (as well as not researching the answer myself):
but is this so, and like drowning can hypothermia be deduced by markers found during autopsy? I ask because the only way Shannon's death could be considered likely accidental given her clothing was removed is if she'd removed them herself as people suffering from hypothermia have been known to do. If it's unlikely she died of hypothermia then that changes everything imo.

I'm going to answer my own question here after some research:
No, hypothermia can't be ruled out at all based on Baden's conclusions. It's very difficult to determine hypothermia as COD forensically and given the state of decomposition when Shannan was found, the most crucial marker (purple blotches on the skin) and the other external signs wouldn't be available.
Here's an overview on this:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/260371558_Postmortem_diagnosis_of_hypothermia

I'm now split 75/25 on strangulation/hypothermia since the latter can't be ruled out and would explain why she might have removed her jeans. It's looking like the "drowning" scenario which most of us found beggared belief given where her clothes were found in relation to her body can finally be put pretty much to rest though.

 

[deedee21]

PC Sini said Dr. Badens autopsy report on SG does not provide any additional information. The SC medical E. never said their findings are consistent with homicidal strangulation. Thats the additional information. I guess he would also say SG sounded calm on the 911 call to police. Good luck to the Gilbert family. They are going to need it.

 

[deedee21]

When will the men of the SCPD stop kowtowing and grow some balz? The cover ups and wire tapping ( in case they hear something else that needs to be covered up) needs to stop. Do the job you are getting paid for. And is there OT for attending sex parties on the clock?

 

[LindsayLohan6]

What I don't understand at all is SCPD said Shannan drowned in the marsh before she was found? Didn't they search the marsh and not find her?

 

[deedee21]

What I don't understand at all is SCPD said Shannan drowned in the marsh before she was found? Didn't they search the marsh and not find her?

I dont think they wanted to get their feet wet.

 

[fred&edna]

I'm going to answer my own question here after some research:
No, hypothermia can't be ruled out at all based on Baden's conclusions. It's very difficult to determine hypothermia as COD forensically and given the state of decomposition when Shannan was found, the most crucial marker (purple blotches on the skin) and the other external signs wouldn't be available.
Here's an overview on this:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/260371558_Postmortem_diagnosis_of_hypothermia

I'm now split 75/25 on strangulation/hypothermia since the latter can't be ruled out and would explain why she might have removed her jeans. It's looking like the "drowning" scenario which most of us found beggared belief given where her clothes were found in relation to her body can finally be put pretty much to rest though.

FWIW

I know it's Ray doing the talking here, not Dr Baden, and Ray does use the word "may", but listening/watching on video, it seems (imo) this statement suggests hypothermia wasn't a factor:

"An independent autopsy commissioned by the family of Craigslist escort Shannan Gilbert revealed that a hole may have been drilled in the hyoid bone near her throat, according to lawyer John Ray"

http://www.aol.com/article/2016/02/...annan-gilbert-may-have-been-torture/21312206/

 

[Aleph]

FWIW

I know it's Ray doing the talking here, not Dr Baden, and Ray does use the word "may", but listening/watching on video, it seems (imo) this statement suggests hypothermia wasn't a factor:

"An independent autopsy commissioned by the family of Craigslist escort Shannan Gilbert revealed that a hole may have been drilled in the hyoid bone near her throat, according to lawyer John Ray"

http://www.aol.com/article/2016/02/...annan-gilbert-may-have-been-torture/21312206/

What on earth does that mean? Or could that mean?

It occurred to me the other day that perhaps LE does not want to consider homicide in SG's case because they would somehow be liable. Like, if someone's running around screaming that they're about to be murdered and then they are (after a 23-minute 911 call), does that equal a lawsuit? Like a bigger, badder lawsuit than the John Ray one (which I pray will be effective anyway)? Or does it trigger some kind of investigation that LE does not want? Or just embarrassment?

 

[fred&edna]

What on earth does that mean? Or could that mean?

It occurred to me the other day that perhaps LE does not want to consider homicide in SG's case because they would somehow be liable. Like, if someone's running around screaming that they're about to be murdered and then they are (after a 23-minute 911 call), does that equal a lawsuit? Like a bigger, badder lawsuit than the John Ray one (which I pray will be effective anyway)? Or does it trigger some kind of investigation that LE does not want? Or just embarrassment?

All good questions you have!

I don't know. It seems to suggest torture... which is horrifying.

I don't know about the liability factor either. IIRC, SCPD always blamed any delay in their arrival to OB on the victim saying she couldn't tell them her location.

 

[deedee21]

John Ray said Dr. Badens findings are consistent with homicidal strangulation. Does anybody on this board remember him say a hole may have been drilled into the hyoid bone? I dont believe he did. This is what the article in the link above states.

 

[bessie]

John Ray said Dr. Badens findings are consistent with homicidal strangulation. Does anybody on this board remember him say a hole may have been drilled into the hyoid bone? I dont believe he did. This is what the article in the link above states.

Ray describes it at about 1:00 in the video at this link.

http://pix11.com/2016/02/12/craigsl...-may-have-been-tortured-before-death-autopsy/

From Baden's report:

"Almost all of the skeletal bones were recovered and appeared normal. There was no evidence of trauma. However, the larynx was missing and only the body of the hyoid bone was found; the two greater horns of that neck bone were missing. These structures, the larynx and the hyoid bone, are often fractured during homicidal manual strangulation. My examination of the recovered body of the hyoid bone, after it had been anthropologically de-fleshed, showed a roughness at the margins where the separated bones had been attached."

The full report hasn't been released afaik, but I believe the above is part of the finding referenced by Ray.

 

[LindsayLohan6]

Yes he said it. You can see him say it on the Mary Murphy FB page. He describes it as a hole that may have been drilled or made with a sharp tool. Sounds pretty crazy

 

[deedee21]

Lindsay, I listened to JR on the WPIX. I cant post what Im thinking. I would get banned.

 

[EmmaliLucia]

I was of the impression that they didn't find enough of Shannan to give a probable cause of death.

But honestly, go Baden! I was astounded about how shoddy the investigation was from the beginning. Hopefully this gets the job done and at the very least helps the family feel like they're finally being listened to.

 

[LindsayLohan6]

Lindsay, I listened to JR on the WPIX. I cant post what Im thinking. I would get banned.

what does that mean?

 

[giagreen]

Im surprised SG hyoid bone was found with her remains. Her remains were in the marsh during hurricane Irene.

Wait!! What did I miss. I have a lot of catching up to do. They did find her hyoid bone? I thought that was the one bone they didn't find?

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