Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. #2

[nugzter]

Yes, dates get blurred and grief-stricken people think through a fog; however, when the phone calls were made, MG was not grief-stricken. She was looking for her daughter. Specifics such as "a drug rehabilitation resources" in Oak Beach do not usually insert their uniqueness upon the mind of a concerned mother who may or may not be remembering things accurately. Understandably, times and dates can get confused. Places. Generalities. Not specifics.

I understand and agree. But the big question(s) are the dates and times. No doubt he made the calls. But when? Let hope the 48 hours will show some phone records of these calls. Other wise it is still her word against his.

 

[Adler]

As an additional hint, look up, what Ecstasy, crack with alcohol and some other drug combinations do to the body's temperature control. Because some of those can raise the probability of paradoxical undressing from 33% to over 60%. Those here, who are a bit older maybe remember still the Raver parties of the late 90s? Remember those guys, who suddenly danced around half-naked or in the process to throw their clothes in all directions. Usually those were the same ones, who would later show up in emergency rooms.

LOL! Peter, I think you and your logic might benefit from a Burning Man excursion. (i say that in jest, okay? as in ha ha ha.)

 

[BKS]

Read Hackett's letters to 48Hours regarding the phone calls. http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/48_hours_gilbert.pdf?tag=contentMain;contentBody

Also, Mari has said many times LE has her phone records that prove Hackett called.

 

[truthspider]

Other wise it is still her word against his.

and we know how credible his words are don't we....

cph is the biggest liar since Baron Munchausen.

"I never called the family" - cph

"I did not have sexual relations with that girl" -bill

"Iraq has weapons of mass destruction" - george

"it's your baby" - chris rock

 

[nugzter]

and we know how credible his words are don't we....

cph is the biggest liar since Baron Munchausen.

"I never called the family" - cph

"I did not have sexual relations with that girl" -bill

"Iraq has weapons of mass destruction" - george

"it's your baby" - chris rock

May be. But if being a liar makes you a SK, then the prisons would be jam packed full.
BTW, what time does the 48 hours show air tonight o n the east coast? I'm in Germany and I want to try to catch it on line some how. Thanks...

 

[Peter Brendt]

The paradoxical undressing and burrowing is fascinating and worth googling. Check out the accounts from those who survived those conditions, too. It's all worthy of a good study.

Worthy science; all five, I am sure. Perhaps more. If the members of this WS thread comprised the jury panel for CPH, I am sure we'd all acquit, Peter, due to lack of evidence. On the other hand, if you queried the same jury members following such a trial, you'd probably find many individuals claiming that they thought the dude was nevertheless guilty as hell albeit solely on circumstantial grounds.

There is no debate here, Peter.

The reason MG would have to take the stand, you realize, is that it's her word against our hypothetical suspect, CPH. She remembers the phone calls. She knows what was said. In short, it's her word against his.

(It goes without saying, Peter, I do not think MG is lyingp. Conversely, CPH is a proven liar.)

So, yes, on a purely circumstantial basis, I add it up and see one gah party.

I have to admit, I'm not sure where are you going with this. First of all, there are witness statements. So it's not only MG's word, there is more. Pak saw JB, Pak didn't see CPH. Coletti saw Pak, Coletti didn't CPH. So the only thing are those phone calls. The worst, one can accuse CPH of, based on those calls, is a clumsy attempt to cover things up, if not just trying to get some attention. Fine.
The real point here is JB. SG went to JB's house. JB answered the question, whether he had intentions to have sex with SG with "no" and the lie detector didn't alarm. JB had also the drifter in the house. So, his intention was not to have sex, but watch the drifter having sex with SG. No biggie in that. But the interesting question is, what did JB offer in party supplies? SG showed later paranoid behavior, which appears, at least to me, drug induced. We don't know about the drifter. Of course, when the police months later searched JB's house, no drugs were found. Speaking of a little late here. But all we know, points out that there were drugs in that house the night SG died. So whose drugs would that be? The drifter's? Hardly, if he would have the money to finance a little drug party, he probably would keep it for himself. Drifters don't know too well when they will get the next money. So SG's drugs then? Unlikely! Aside of having no reason to bring her stash to a client, her later paranoia shows, she wasn't on her normal mix. That leaves us with JB.
So, to pin JB (and not CPH), one would need to find the person, JB bought from. That would be circumstantial evidence that JB supplied the party and by that, would give him some legal responsibility. But of course, we can libel a moron, and that is what CPH was in this story, till all eternity, thus diminishing the chances to make a case against the real culprit.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Anyone who is being threatened, chased, hunted, or stalked can and likely will be in a high state of agitation. There can be changes in their voice (shaky,rapid, whispering, screaming, etc) and their body (sweating/body odor, shaking/trembling of the hands and or entire body...tripping over things and general clumsiness) all of which can describe SG's state on May 1, 2010.

But all of those symptoms will also occur with drug induced paranoia, because the whole point in paranoia is to feel threatened, chased and hunted. Which, as you correctly state, fits SG's state in that night.

 

[Peter Brendt]

LOL! Peter, I think you and your logic might benefit from a Burning Man excursion. (i say that in jest, okay? as in ha ha ha.)

Hey, I didn't say, I had a boring youth. I even didn't say, I had a boring adult life :floorlaugh: So, it's not, similar events are unknown in Europe. But to me partying anyway doesn't mean, I have to smoke, swallow, sniff or inject everything, that's offered. I don't know, does that make my life boring? :floorlaugh:

 

[Samantha Spade]

BKS,
That is horrifying! I'm so sorry.
You are a voice for the victims who no longer have one.

 

[BKS]

BKS,
That is horrifying! I'm so sorry.
You are a voice for the victims who no longer have one.

Thank you Samantha, it was horrifying, but I survived. What happened to me changed my life forever. I guess that is why I have so much empathy for the victims in this case. The horror of what these girls went through is so very sad.

 

[Seaslug44]

Read Hackett's letters to 48Hours regarding the phone calls. http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/48_hours_gilbert.pdf?tag=contentMain;contentBody

Also, Mari has said many times LE has her phone records that prove Hackett called.

Actually Mari originally claimed she had phone records that proved that CPH called her the day after SG went missing but then shortly after CPH challenged her by saying to give those records to the police, she changed her story and stopped claiming that she had phone records for the day after.

This suggests to me that she could have gone back to look at her phone records and discovered that with all of the anxiety, anguish and other emotions associated with losing SG again (and possibly forever this time), her perception was off and the phone records actually matched the calls mentioned by CPH in his letters exactly to the date and time.

 

[BKS]

Actually Mari originally claimed she had phone records that proved that CPH called her the day after SG went missing but then shortly after CPH challenged her by saying to give those records to the police, she changed her story and stopped claiming that she had phone records for the day after.

This suggests to me that she could have gone back to look at her phone records and discovered that with all of the anxiety, anguish and other emotions associated with losing SG again (and possibly forever this time), her perception was off and the phone records actually matched the calls mentioned by CPH in his letters exactly to the date and time.

That's right. She claimed he called. He said he didn't call and then changed his story. There probably was confusion as to the exact date. She probably remembered that as being the first that she had heard Shannan was missing and thought that was the day after she went missing. The whole story is so odd. Alex and Pak asking him to call, I found that weird.

 

[Redbird]

Actually Mari originally claimed she had phone records that proved that CPH called her the day after SG went missing but then shortly after CPH challenged her by saying to give those records to the police, she changed her story and stopped claiming that she had phone records for the day after.

This suggests to me that she could have gone back to look at her phone records and discovered that with all of the anxiety, anguish and other emotions associated with losing SG again (and possibly forever this time), her perception was off and the phone records actually matched the calls mentioned by CPH in his letters exactly to the date and time.

How do you know that Mari "changed her story after CPH challenged her by saying to give those records to the police?" I have never read that she changed her story at all. If she gave her records to the police, do you expect that they would have released that information or would they have told her to not reveal any more about the calls to protect their investigation. Unless you have inside information I don't see how you could know whether the records from her phone exist or not, as she claims.

 

[Adler]

I understand and agree. But the big question(s) are the dates and times. No doubt he made the calls. But when? Let hope the 48 hours will show some phone records of these calls. Other wise it is still her word against his.

I disagree. I think the big question has less to do with the dates, which are irrelevant, and more to do with the content. What was communicated in those phone messages?

Did MG misunderstand the intent of the phone calls? How, oh, how, did she get the idea that drug rehabilitation resources were available through a neighbor of CPH, or in his vicinity, at all? She must be pretty darn psychic to glean that information from CPH during a phone conversation if he in fact did not utter it. After all, before those phone calls were made, only CPH knew that one of his neighbors is a successful drug rehab specialist. After those phone calls were made, they both knew. How did that happen?

 

[Adler]

Actually Mari originally claimed she had phone records that proved that CPH called her the day after SG went missing but then shortly after CPH challenged her by saying to give those records to the police, she changed her story and stopped claiming that she had phone records for the day after.

This suggests to me that she could have gone back to look at her phone records and discovered that with all of the anxiety, anguish and other emotions associated with losing SG again (and possibly forever this time), her perception was off and the phone records actually matched the calls mentioned by CPH in his letters exactly to the date and time.

CPH could have driven into the City and placed a phone call from an anonymous line.

 

[Peter Brendt]

I disagree. I think the big question has less to do with the dates, which are irrelevant, and more to do with the content. What was communicated in those phone messages?

Did MG misunderstand the intent of the phone calls? How, oh, how, did she get the idea that drug rehabilitation resources were available through a neighbor of CPH, or in his vicinity, at all? She must be pretty darn psychic to glean that information from CPH during a phone conversation if he in fact did not utter it. After all, before those phone calls were made, only CPH knew that one of his neighbors is a successful drug rehab specialist. After those phone calls were made, they both knew. How did that happen?

In fact, we all heard about Shannan and Mari and JB and CPH, about phone calls and that there was something wrong not earlier than about 6 months after Shannan disappeared. So technically the content had half a year time to mingle with other results of MG's research.

 

[Peter Brendt]

CPH could have driven into the City and placed a phone call from an anonymous line.

He could, but would the police then found the calls in the phone records? I think not.

 

[Tugela]

How do you know that Mari "changed her story after CPH challenged her by saying to give those records to the police?" I have never read that she changed her story at all. If she gave her records to the police, do you expect that they would have released that information or would they have told her to not reveal any more about the calls to protect their investigation. Unless you have inside information I don't see how you could know whether the records from her phone exist or not, as she claims.

She has records? How did she get those? Phone bills usually don't list who calls you.

 

[Redbird]

Ever heard of caller ID?

 

[Tugela]

I know what caller ID is. My service provider only supplies details of long distance outgoing calls, the ones you have to pay for, in the bill. They don't include incoming or local calls.